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does skim milk have any place in a strict diet?
- Thread starter nimbus
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cobracock1979
Member
juggy54 said:
I cut milk dude - it causes bloat as all thecarbs sugars. use it if your not concerned about cutting, otherwise drop it
Milk elicits a high insulin response. Its sugars are 1/2 glucose; 1/2 galactose. Altough the latter is first processed by the liver, it is able to enter the glucose/muscle pathway. Therefore, the milk sugars are preferable to fruit and vegetable sugars, which are predominantly fructose and sucrose respectively.
The proteins are of the highest quality (with eggs) and it contains useful insulin growth factors, and the calcium assists in fat loss.
Given this milk is a double edge sword - it is good pre/post workout, but should be avoided at other times b/c of its insulin effect.
Curiously, Layne Norton consumes like a litre pre-bed - so much for insulin blunting GH
The proteins are of the highest quality (with eggs) and it contains useful insulin growth factors, and the calcium assists in fat loss.
Given this milk is a double edge sword - it is good pre/post workout, but should be avoided at other times b/c of its insulin effect.
Curiously, Layne Norton consumes like a litre pre-bed - so much for insulin blunting GH
Tatyana
Elite Mentor
I think milk has gotten a bad rap in BBing, one of those 'internet myths'.
Yes milk is insulinogenic, but if your bodyfat to muscle ratio is good, meaning you have more muscle, insulin is awesome, it is one of the most anabolic hormones in the body.
Low bodyfat means that it is going to drive more nutrients into muscle, not fat.
I also recently saw a paper that stated that milk triggers IGF-1 release.
I grow like a weed when dairy is in my diet.
Yes milk is insulinogenic, but if your bodyfat to muscle ratio is good, meaning you have more muscle, insulin is awesome, it is one of the most anabolic hormones in the body.
Low bodyfat means that it is going to drive more nutrients into muscle, not fat.
I also recently saw a paper that stated that milk triggers IGF-1 release.
I grow like a weed when dairy is in my diet.
there is some decent evidense that the histidine that is in milk is not actually a 'dead' amino after all, but triggers a rapid teeter-totter turn to glucogon upregulation... a VERY good thing for accessing lipids as energy. I know a bunch of nasty food nerds that do a small activia yogurt prior to killing it specifically to get the quick insulin pop from the milk sugars AND to send that spike over the dam with the glucogon uptick.
Now, skim milk? why? WHOLE MILK and whole milk products. Dont fear the fat, mon, embrace it.
Now, skim milk? why? WHOLE MILK and whole milk products. Dont fear the fat, mon, embrace it.
Well there are studies showing that milk greatly increases fat oxidiation, beyond the effects of calcium.
I always assumed this was possibly because of casein protein, which for some one who diets by just 3 meals per day (which presumably was the case for the individuals in the study), casein's long lasting anti-catabolic effect would mean greater retention of LBM for "normal 3 meal per day" dieters, but this would be not significant for 5-6 meal per day bodybuilding diets.
But interesting study! Thanks!
I always assumed this was possibly because of casein protein, which for some one who diets by just 3 meals per day (which presumably was the case for the individuals in the study), casein's long lasting anti-catabolic effect would mean greater retention of LBM for "normal 3 meal per day" dieters, but this would be not significant for 5-6 meal per day bodybuilding diets.
But interesting study! Thanks!
ChefWide said:
nimbus said:
you're welcome, I know, I'm the bomb.
I'm secretly LB's alter don't tell anybody!
Tatyana
Elite Mentor
nimbus said:
Saturated fat is really ok with some people.
Cholesterol gets a bad rap as well, but it is the precursor to all steroid sex hormones and vitamin D.
Funny things happen to some people when they cut out a lot of saturated animal fats, it actually increases the cholesterol in their bloodstream, and often not the 'good' one or HDL.
Fat is also one of the macronutrients that allows for greater satiety.
It does depend on your metabolism, google metabolic profiling.
Have you had cholesterol levels done before after manipulating your diet?
Tatyana
Elite Mentor
snorkles said:
Milk in a PWO shake is ideal.
Unless you experience symptoms of lactose intolerance, like serious bloating, diarrhoea, upset tummy, there really is no reason to cut out milk.
I prefer organic when it is possible, just because there are a lot of anti-biotics used in the production of 'normal' milk, but how much of an impact those anti-biotics have, I haven't seen any accurate data yet.
I would read this entire thread (or read it again) for why milk is good.
If you are still unclear about it, then please feel free to post any questions you have.
Personally, I think macros for whole milk are not best (http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts-C00001-01c2018.html)
28% C, 22% P, 50% Fat.
The fat contains only Vit D and A, but the latter is very easily obtained in veggies, and the former is supplemented anyway or obtained through sun for those in warmer climates.
Also, my concern with whole milk is that its a fat/carb insulin combo - isn't this meant to be avoided? I am aware of studies showing that whole milk > skim for increases in LBM though PWO, even calorie controlled
28% C, 22% P, 50% Fat.
The fat contains only Vit D and A, but the latter is very easily obtained in veggies, and the former is supplemented anyway or obtained through sun for those in warmer climates.
Also, my concern with whole milk is that its a fat/carb insulin combo - isn't this meant to be avoided? I am aware of studies showing that whole milk > skim for increases in LBM though PWO, even calorie controlled
Tatyana
Elite Mentor
Sim882 said:
I think if you are lean, not a big deal.
If you have a high percentage of bodyfat, and you have been eating a lot of processed foods, then it may be better to go for the diet that avoids insulin spikes.
This is the thing I have been reading. Not everyone has the same metabolism.
Some people do really well eating a lot of animal fats, saturated fat, fewer carbs and a lot of meat.
Some people do really well on complex carbs, veggies, leaner protein sources.
Some can eat a combo of the two, and I think that this is really oversimplifying things.
There is no 'cookie cutter' diet, we really do have such a high degree of biochemical individuality.
I think it is a good idea to experiment with different combinations of macro ratios of whole natural foods and see what works for you.
I know I LOVE whole milk, but it doesn't really work all that well for me if I drink it all the time to have a lean physique.
Lower fat milk does. But that doesn't mean it will be the same for everyone.
