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SteelWeaver
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Could this wreck your leg workout? Y'know, squats, blah de blah. what about studying for tests? A brief (10 minute) period of high stress directly pre-workout? Any of these slam your numbers?
Heavy abs day before legs ...
- Thread starter SteelWeaver
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newgirl-chargeback
New member
Bad day at the office really makes for a bad workout at the gym. Mind over matter for me...cannot get my head together enough to do what is usually not a strain.
Not sure about an ab workout ruining it but studying for exams ABSOLUTELY -- you have to know when under the gun, the precious sleep goes out the window.
Not sure about an ab workout ruining it but studying for exams ABSOLUTELY -- you have to know when under the gun, the precious sleep goes out the window.
I just read about this the other day. I always thought working abs before a leg workout would be a bad idea but this guy thought differently. What are your thoughts?
Myth #5: You Shouldn't Train Abs Before Legs
Didn’t know this one was a myth? Good! However, let’s discuss it anyway since I think this is an erroneous piece of fiction that my soon gain mythical status within the circle of infallibility known as the accredited personal training associations.
Credit Strength Coach Ian King for being the first one to really shed light on this one being a fallacy. At first glance, the theory holds water; if your abdominals are fatigued then they won't be able to stabilize the body or the spine, therefore leaving yourself open to possible injury, or at the very least weakness, during leg training.
But incorrectly assuming that the abs are one unit is the governing body behind this misnomer. The core of the body can be divided into two distinct groups of musculature; the outer unit, and the inner unit. The outer unit is made up of what you can see in the mirror, i.e. the rectus abdominus, external obliques, and spinal erectors. Traditional abdominal exercises such as curl-ups, knee raises etc. target the outer unit musculature almost exclusively.
The inner unit is made up of the transversus abdominus, the multifidus, the diaphragm, and the pelvic floor muscles. Spinal stabilization is provided almost entirely by the inner unit musculature, therefore any ab exercises done before a leg workout will cause no significant impairment of form or function. One should, however, avoid excessive inner unit work to the point of fatigue before a workout for said reasons. Inner unit work would include any woodchop type exercise, forward or transverse ball-rolls, or most stability drills, etc.
I'm sure some of you out there are saying "...but when I do abs before legs, I feel weaker, so now what do you have to say, you pickle kisser"? This very well could be the case, but that is due to your nervous system’s inability to preferentially activate your inner unit musculature during stabilization needs, and an over-reliance on using the outer unit muscles to perform this function. This is a problem that needs to be addressed!
Referred to as "Sensory-Motor-Amnesia" (Chek, P. 1998, Scientific Core Conditioning. Correspondence Course. Paul Chek Seminars), this dysfunctional inner unit can come from heightened tension due to hypertonic muscles, from an overreliance on external apparatus (see myth #3), or from a series of musclular imbalances that can be determined through postural analysis and other soft tissue testing.
In other words, get your core in order, dude! Learn to activate your inner unit musculature with control drills and exercises designed to hit those deep muscles. Then, when training outer unit musculature, you won’t be fatiguing your inner unit. In addition, you wont impair the function of the inner unit for stabilization purposes. Whether you choose to do abs before squatting or not, it’s important to recognize how the abdominal muscles are arranged and how to use the arrangement to your training advantage.
The rest of the article is here....
http://www.johnberardi.com/updates/jan312003/na_myths.htm
Myth #5: You Shouldn't Train Abs Before Legs
Didn’t know this one was a myth? Good! However, let’s discuss it anyway since I think this is an erroneous piece of fiction that my soon gain mythical status within the circle of infallibility known as the accredited personal training associations.
Credit Strength Coach Ian King for being the first one to really shed light on this one being a fallacy. At first glance, the theory holds water; if your abdominals are fatigued then they won't be able to stabilize the body or the spine, therefore leaving yourself open to possible injury, or at the very least weakness, during leg training.
But incorrectly assuming that the abs are one unit is the governing body behind this misnomer. The core of the body can be divided into two distinct groups of musculature; the outer unit, and the inner unit. The outer unit is made up of what you can see in the mirror, i.e. the rectus abdominus, external obliques, and spinal erectors. Traditional abdominal exercises such as curl-ups, knee raises etc. target the outer unit musculature almost exclusively.
The inner unit is made up of the transversus abdominus, the multifidus, the diaphragm, and the pelvic floor muscles. Spinal stabilization is provided almost entirely by the inner unit musculature, therefore any ab exercises done before a leg workout will cause no significant impairment of form or function. One should, however, avoid excessive inner unit work to the point of fatigue before a workout for said reasons. Inner unit work would include any woodchop type exercise, forward or transverse ball-rolls, or most stability drills, etc.
I'm sure some of you out there are saying "...but when I do abs before legs, I feel weaker, so now what do you have to say, you pickle kisser"? This very well could be the case, but that is due to your nervous system’s inability to preferentially activate your inner unit musculature during stabilization needs, and an over-reliance on using the outer unit muscles to perform this function. This is a problem that needs to be addressed!
Referred to as "Sensory-Motor-Amnesia" (Chek, P. 1998, Scientific Core Conditioning. Correspondence Course. Paul Chek Seminars), this dysfunctional inner unit can come from heightened tension due to hypertonic muscles, from an overreliance on external apparatus (see myth #3), or from a series of musclular imbalances that can be determined through postural analysis and other soft tissue testing.
In other words, get your core in order, dude! Learn to activate your inner unit musculature with control drills and exercises designed to hit those deep muscles. Then, when training outer unit musculature, you won’t be fatiguing your inner unit. In addition, you wont impair the function of the inner unit for stabilization purposes. Whether you choose to do abs before squatting or not, it’s important to recognize how the abdominal muscles are arranged and how to use the arrangement to your training advantage.
The rest of the article is here....
http://www.johnberardi.com/updates/jan312003/na_myths.htm
SteelWeaver
New member
wilson6 said:
LOL! No no, that's not what I meant - 2 separate things. Believe me - I have no problems spending hours and hours studying. I just had some stress beore I was meant to hit the gym.
I'm just wondering about the ab thing, because my lifts seem to be so erratic. The way most folks describe it, improvement is practically linear on a weekly basis, whereas mine fluctuates all over the place. I'll have GREAT lifts one week, with all sorts of PR's, then the next week I'll be worse even than 2 weeks previously, then it swings back to the same as 2 weeks previously, then maybe improves a bit the next week - you get the picture ... The jumps have been a bit bigger than usual lately, but still the same annoyingly erratic and unreadable pattern.
I think I'm going to use my new graphing skills to plot this lot.
"I'll have GREAT lifts one week, with all sorts of PR's, then the next week I'll be worse even than 2 weeks previously,"
And that young lady is why I train heavy every other week. Perhaps even really heavy only once a month. There is no way you can go all out on a bodypart, then try and hit it again at the same maximal intensity level the next week.
I've been working with clients for almost 7 years now along with my own experiences, and hitting it really hard once every two weeks is more than enough.
Do powerlifters try for PRs everyweek? Why not?
That's the problem and most limiting factor with regard to muscle mass gains in bodybuilders. Many of them have no concept of recovery. If they trained with BB routines, but applied periodization concepts to those routines, they'd be a lot bigger than they are now, with or without juice.
W6
And that young lady is why I train heavy every other week. Perhaps even really heavy only once a month. There is no way you can go all out on a bodypart, then try and hit it again at the same maximal intensity level the next week.
I've been working with clients for almost 7 years now along with my own experiences, and hitting it really hard once every two weeks is more than enough.
Do powerlifters try for PRs everyweek? Why not?
That's the problem and most limiting factor with regard to muscle mass gains in bodybuilders. Many of them have no concept of recovery. If they trained with BB routines, but applied periodization concepts to those routines, they'd be a lot bigger than they are now, with or without juice.
W6
SteelWeaver
New member
Ah, back to first principles. It's so easy to get off track and then be asking, what's going on? I just figured, since I cut out all the intensity enhancing special effects, that lifting heavy to concentric failure would be just right - well, it WAS just right, for a good 5 or so weeks.
Next up - conjugate periodisation
Next up - conjugate periodisation
SteelWeaver said:
Next up - conjugate periodisation
I understood this thread just fine until you threw that in.
You keep all that studying to yourself missy. I got enough of that over here too. I hate midterms.
