1ad + As?

[Spectre]

Hello all.. Long time board lurker (1 year) but I had allot to learn and nothing to add so I had no reason to post. This board has taken me to the next level and I will be forever thankful!

I am in week 6 of 12 week 1AD/4AD run, I have gained about 15lbs. (230lb over 6/2 frame) I can't attribute it all to 1AD/4AD as I dialed up the protein and routine at the same time. I have never done AS, but I am educating myself on the board. I am no where near my genetic potential..

My question is would it be resonable to dial in some AS for the remainder of the 4-6 weeks? I am not limiting my selection, but I had envisioned something with a short half life and quit cold and roll onto the clomid. Am I getting ahead of the future cycle I am building up to?

I am totally down with the anti-e's, diet and clomid.

Spectre

 

[Spectre]

Aw c'mon!!!!

Somebody must have something to say?

Spectre

 

[Fortes]

Let us know your current dosages of 1-AD and 4-AD . . .

I feel that with these two you've got all your bases covered. It's kinda like a Test + Tren cycle.

And how are you taking the 4-AD? Oral? Transdermal? What brand/type?

If you're going oral, I hope you're using at least 1 gram of 4-AD daily, divided into 4 doses. If you're going transdermal, the same dosage should apply. Anything less is worthless IMO.

IMO, if you want to do some AS, do a cycle of real gear a couple months later from now so you can figure out how the legal stuff compares. My guess is that 1-AD is about 1/8th as powerful miligram per miligram as Dbol (due to its conversion rate), and that its conversion product (1-testosterone) is about as strong as Trenbolone (assuming you injected esterfied 1-test into your bloodstream). And 4-AD, though it's touted as being 95% as strong as Test, is not so great unless you inject it.

It's not uncommon for novice users to gain 30 lbs. in 6 weeks off of Dbol alone at 40mg/day. So I'd say wait till your done with the PH's so you can see the difference between gear and the legal stuff.

 

[voodoo]

Gotta agree with Fortes, and enjoy your results. Worry about whats next when your done with this one and have taken time off

 

[Spectre]

Thanks...

Voodoo and Fortes,

I figured I was jumping ahead of myself, I'll play it cool 'til that first cycle. After rereading my post, I noticed that I included enough stats to be mildly annoying. Here it goes again.

= 6 orals each of the 1ad + 4ad split up x3. I believe the 1ad's are 100mg each, not sure of the 4ad, I don't have the bottle handy. The 1ad is by Ergopharm, not sure about the 4 at this momment.

Let me do some more research and I'll take your suggested dose into consideration.

It's hard to say conclusively that the PH's "added x amount LBM" as I chose at the same time to really up (230 x 1.5grams) my protien over my 6 meals. ( I have alway done 6). At the same time I really stepped up the routine a notch by adding front squats, DLs, SDLs, bent over rows and grips. My routine and gains had become stale. If I have noticed anything it has been about 2 more reps at roughly 10% more weight (ie 275 x 6 to 315 x 8 bench). Could their be a placebo effect, yup, but I'll take the gains!

Thanks again

Spectre

 

[pa1ad]

Let us know your current dosages of 1-AD and 4-AD . . .

I feel that with these two you've got all your bases covered. It's kinda like a Test + Tren cycle.

And how are you taking the 4-AD? Oral? Transdermal? What brand/type?

If you're going oral, I hope you're using at least 1 gram of 4-AD daily, divided into 4 doses. If you're going transdermal, the same dosage should apply. Anything less is worthless IMO.

IMO, if you want to do some AS, do a cycle of real gear a couple months later from now so you can figure out how the legal stuff compares. My guess is that 1-AD is about 1/8th as powerful miligram per miligram as Dbol (due to its conversion rate),

So you think that 400mg a day of 1-AD is equivalent to 50mg a day of d-bol?

 

[Fortes]

You nailed me Pat.

If 1-AD has a 15% conversion rate, and 1-testosterone is really 6-7 times as myotrophic as Testosterone, than taking 1-AD @ 400mg/day is like getting 60 mg/day of an unesterfied androgen into the bloodstream daily.

But . . . BUT . . . this is really not a great comparison to Dbol. Why?

First of all, we don't know exactly WHAT the conversion rate of 1-AD is exactly. 15% is simply an assumption. It could be more, it could be less.

Second and MORE IMPORTANTLY, Dbol is 17-aa, so (correct me if I'm wrong) any dose of Dbol will stick around MUCH longer in the system than a dose of "base" androgen. This makes Dbol much more potent.

Third, Dbol AROMATIZES. This means that much of the water weight that people put on with dbol (I'm guessing around 1/4 to 1/3 of the total weight gain) will disappear post cycle in the absence of arimidex or a comparable anti-estrogen while on. Retaining water from estrogen gives muscle a fuller, bigger look, too, which presents an illusion in terms of the amount of actual muscle protein gained.

Pat, I've heard that Dbol is 17aa Boldenone. Is that true? If so, it makes sense, because Boldenone is reputed for lasting, solid-high quality gains whereas Dbol is reputed for gains of a similar nature, except it works faster and more powerfully.

In which case, we might be better of saying that 1-AD is 1/8th as powerful, miligram per miligram, as Boldenone (which is often injected at around 400-600 mg weekly as the "base" in a totally synthetic stack or as the only androgen).

But again, I'm not the expert here . . . I just read the crap on the 'net. Whadda you think, Pat?

 

[pa1ad]

Re: You nailed me Pat.

If 1-AD has a 15% conversion rate, and 1-testosterone is really 6-7 times as myotrophic as Testosterone, than taking 1-AD @ 400mg/day is like getting 60 mg/day of an unesterfied androgen into the bloodstream daily.

But . . . BUT . . . this is really not a great comparison to Dbol. Why?

First of all, we don't know exactly WHAT the conversion rate of 1-AD is exactly. 15% is simply an assumption. It could be more, it could be less.

Second and MORE IMPORTANTLY, Dbol is 17-aa, so (correct me if I'm wrong) any dose of Dbol will stick around MUCH longer in the system than a dose of "base" androgen. This makes Dbol much more potent.

Third, Dbol AROMATIZES. This means that much of the water weight that people put on with dbol (I'm guessing around 1/4 to 1/3 of the total weight gain) will disappear post cycle in the absence of arimidex or a comparable anti-estrogen while on. Retaining water from estrogen gives muscle a fuller, bigger look, too, which presents an illusion in terms of the amount of actual muscle protein gained.

Pat, I've heard that Dbol is 17aa Boldenone. Is that true? If so, it makes sense, because Boldenone is reputed for lasting, solid-high quality gains whereas Dbol is reputed for gains of a similar nature, except it works faster and more powerfully.

In which case, we might be better of saying that 1-AD is 1/8th as powerful, miligram per miligram, as Boldenone (which is often injected at around 400-600 mg weekly as the "base" in a totally synthetic stack or as the only androgen).

But again, I'm not the expert here . . . I just read the crap on the 'net. Whadda you think, Pat?

WE can speculate until the cows come home but there is no way we can nail this down to a specific number. And I am getting a headache just thinking about it