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Banned
If your bulking its fine to use muscle milk as your last meal,I would definetly not use it pwo,your only asking to put on excess fat.Your pwo should always be fat free.rocky_road said:
PWO Shake Question
- Thread starter Killerpak
- Start date
rocky_road
New member
gymratforlife said:If your bulking its fine to use muscle milk as your last meal,I would definetly not use it pwo,your only asking to put on excess fat.Your pwo should always be fat free.
Even AT NIGHT? Isn't it good to take fats at night, even if post-workout?
I don't see how this puts on excess fat--I need calories post workout and it's a good source of protein. Their are more protein grams in it than fat...
alex2678
New member
Usually you don't want to consume fats post workout because they slow the absorbtion of proteins and carbs, but if it's your last meal of the day before bed then you should be fine. As long as you're not going above your daily maintenence calories you shouldn't gain fat. Try to have some proteins and carbs 1/2 -1 hour before your workout if you're not doing so already. A lot of people are getting better workouts doing this. 
gymratforlife
Banned
The theory behind having a high sugar,high protein no fat meal is that the muscles are like a sponge after you train and will take in what ever you give it more readily than any other time in the day.If you feed it a high fat shake like muscle the insulin spike will drive all the fat directly into your fat cells along with the protein and carbs,if you dont mind gaining a little fat its fine but if your trying to stay lean there are much better choices pwo.Now before bed time if its not pwo you can have a efa/protein meal as the efa will slow down the digestion of the proteins.rocky_road said:
rocky_road
New member
gymratforlife said:The theory behind having a high sugar,high protein no fat meal is that the muscles are like a sponge after you train and will take in what ever you give it more readily than any other time in the day.If you feed it a high fat shake like muscle the insulin spike will drive all the fat directly into your fat cells along with the protein and carbs,if you dont mind gaining a little fat its fine but if your trying to stay lean there are much better choices pwo.Now before bed time if its not pwo you can have a efa/protein meal as the efa will slow down the digestion of the proteins.
OK. so what about pwo if it happens to be the last meal of the day?
gymratforlife
Banned
Take a Pwo shake consisting of dextrose/maltodextrin and protein.I usually just take 16 ounces of gatorade and add 2 scoops of protein powder and mix it in my trusty protein shaker bottle from bodybuilding.com.I like practical and convenient over good taste.rocky_road said:
SgtSlaughter
New member
rocky_road said:
I also train at night and I'm also using Muscle Milk right now... it tastes so damn good, but after I finish it I'm going to create my own protein/carb PWO drink using separate ingredients.... I say why not use it up?
I go by trial and error ALOT... and this is "ok" PWO... but i'm realizing it's not lately... i need way more carbs cuz i lightheaded mid workout today
also finally tallying my damn macros, ect.... so...PWO is your last meal? Try making it a During workout shake.... i do that too sometimes depending on what time i hit the gym so i fit in another meal after. If you do that add some simple carbs to the muscle milk.
alex2678
New member
I'll be starting my workout in around 15 minutes (one of those 24 hr. gyms. Love this work schedule. ) Had a pound of grilled chicken and brown rice an hour ago and my post workout final meal should be at around 12:35 with Conan O'Brien. 3 scoops of whey, carb countdown skim milk and some maple & brown sugar oats. Cheers! 
) Had a pound of grilled chicken and brown rice an hour ago and my post workout final meal should be at around 12:35 with Conan O'Brien. 3 scoops of whey, carb countdown skim milk and some maple & brown sugar oats. Cheers! 
JKurz1
Banned
It just doesn't matter.
Either will work!
The key, however, is with high GI, the prolong absorbation rate could keep insul levels elevated with we all know when insulin is elevated the ability to burn fat is halted and could lead to a greater chance of adipose storage than with low GI CHO sources.
Jentjens R, Jeukendrup A.
Human Performance Laboratory, School of Sport and Exercise Sciences, University of Birmingham, Edgbaston, Birmingham, UK.
The pattern of muscle glycogen synthesis following glycogen-depleting exercise occurs in two phases. Initially, there is a period of rapid synthesis of muscle glycogen that does not require the presence of insulin and lasts about 30-60 minutes. This rapid phase of muscle glycogen synthesis is characterised by an exercise-induced translocation of glucose transporter carrier protein-4 to the cell surface, leading to an increased permeability of the muscle membrane to glucose. Following this rapid phase of glycogen synthesis, muscle glycogen synthesis occurs at a much slower rate and this phase can last for several hours. Both muscle contraction and insulin have been shown to increase the activity of glycogen synthase, the rate-limiting enzyme in glycogen synthesis. Furthermore, it has been shown that muscle glycogen concentration is a potent regulator of glycogen synthase. Low muscle glycogen concentrations following exercise are associated with an increased rate of glucose transport and an increased capacity to convert glucose into glycogen.The highest muscle glycogen synthesis rates have been reported when large amounts of carbohydrate (1.0-1.85 g/kg/h) are consumed immediately post-exercise and at 15-60 minute intervals thereafter, for up to 5 hours post-exercise. When carbohydrate ingestion is delayed by several hours, this may lead to ~50% lower rates of muscle glycogen synthesis. The addition of certain amino acids and/or proteins to a carbohydrate supplement can increase muscle glycogen synthesis rates, most probably because of an enhanced insulin response. However, when carbohydrate intake is high (>/=1.2 g/kg/h) and provided at regular intervals, a further increase in insulin concentrations by additional supplementation of protein and/or amino acids does not further increase the rate of muscle glycogen synthesis. Thus, when carbohydrate intake is insufficient (<1.2 g/kg/h), the addition of certain amino acids and/or proteins may be beneficial for muscle glycogen synthesis. Furthermore, ingestion of insulinotropic protein and/or amino acid mixtures might stimulate post-exercise net muscle protein anabolism. Suggestions have been made that carbohydrate availability is the main limiting factor for glycogen synthesis. A large part of the ingested glucose that enters the bloodstream appears to be extracted by tissues other than the exercise muscle (i.e. liver, other muscle groups or fat tissue) and may therefore limit the amount of glucose available to maximise muscle glycogen synthesis rates. Furthermore, intestinal glucose absorption may also be a rate-limiting factor for muscle glycogen synthesis when large quantities (>1 g/min) of glucose are ingested following exercise.
Either will work!
The key, however, is with high GI, the prolong absorbation rate could keep insul levels elevated with we all know when insulin is elevated the ability to burn fat is halted and could lead to a greater chance of adipose storage than with low GI CHO sources.
Jentjens R, Jeukendrup A.
Human Performance Laboratory, School of Sport and Exercise Sciences, University of Birmingham, Edgbaston, Birmingham, UK.
The pattern of muscle glycogen synthesis following glycogen-depleting exercise occurs in two phases. Initially, there is a period of rapid synthesis of muscle glycogen that does not require the presence of insulin and lasts about 30-60 minutes. This rapid phase of muscle glycogen synthesis is characterised by an exercise-induced translocation of glucose transporter carrier protein-4 to the cell surface, leading to an increased permeability of the muscle membrane to glucose. Following this rapid phase of glycogen synthesis, muscle glycogen synthesis occurs at a much slower rate and this phase can last for several hours. Both muscle contraction and insulin have been shown to increase the activity of glycogen synthase, the rate-limiting enzyme in glycogen synthesis. Furthermore, it has been shown that muscle glycogen concentration is a potent regulator of glycogen synthase. Low muscle glycogen concentrations following exercise are associated with an increased rate of glucose transport and an increased capacity to convert glucose into glycogen.The highest muscle glycogen synthesis rates have been reported when large amounts of carbohydrate (1.0-1.85 g/kg/h) are consumed immediately post-exercise and at 15-60 minute intervals thereafter, for up to 5 hours post-exercise. When carbohydrate ingestion is delayed by several hours, this may lead to ~50% lower rates of muscle glycogen synthesis. The addition of certain amino acids and/or proteins to a carbohydrate supplement can increase muscle glycogen synthesis rates, most probably because of an enhanced insulin response. However, when carbohydrate intake is high (>/=1.2 g/kg/h) and provided at regular intervals, a further increase in insulin concentrations by additional supplementation of protein and/or amino acids does not further increase the rate of muscle glycogen synthesis. Thus, when carbohydrate intake is insufficient (<1.2 g/kg/h), the addition of certain amino acids and/or proteins may be beneficial for muscle glycogen synthesis. Furthermore, ingestion of insulinotropic protein and/or amino acid mixtures might stimulate post-exercise net muscle protein anabolism. Suggestions have been made that carbohydrate availability is the main limiting factor for glycogen synthesis. A large part of the ingested glucose that enters the bloodstream appears to be extracted by tissues other than the exercise muscle (i.e. liver, other muscle groups or fat tissue) and may therefore limit the amount of glucose available to maximise muscle glycogen synthesis rates. Furthermore, intestinal glucose absorption may also be a rate-limiting factor for muscle glycogen synthesis when large quantities (>1 g/min) of glucose are ingested following exercise.
JKurz1
Banned
Costill DL.
The role of dietary carbohydrates (CHO) in the resynthesis of muscle and liver glycogen after prolonged, exhaustive exercise has been clearly demonstrated. The mechanisms responsible for optimal glycogen storage are linked to the activation of glycogen synthetase by depletion of glycogen and the subsequent intake of CHO. Although diets rich in CHO may increase the muscle glycogen stores and enhance endurance exercise performance when consumed in the days before the activity, they also increase the rate of CHO oxidation and the use of muscle glycogen. When consumed in the last hour before exercise, the insulin stimulated-uptake of glucose from blood often results in hypoglycemia, greater dependence on muscle glycogen, and an earlier onset of exhaustion than when no CHO is fed. Ingesting CHO during exercise appears to be of minimal value to performance except in events lasting 2 h or longer. The form of CHO (i.e., glucose, fructose, sucrose) ingested may produce different blood glucose and insulin responses, but the rate of muscle glycogen resynthesis is about the same regardless of the structure.
The role of dietary carbohydrates (CHO) in the resynthesis of muscle and liver glycogen after prolonged, exhaustive exercise has been clearly demonstrated. The mechanisms responsible for optimal glycogen storage are linked to the activation of glycogen synthetase by depletion of glycogen and the subsequent intake of CHO. Although diets rich in CHO may increase the muscle glycogen stores and enhance endurance exercise performance when consumed in the days before the activity, they also increase the rate of CHO oxidation and the use of muscle glycogen. When consumed in the last hour before exercise, the insulin stimulated-uptake of glucose from blood often results in hypoglycemia, greater dependence on muscle glycogen, and an earlier onset of exhaustion than when no CHO is fed. Ingesting CHO during exercise appears to be of minimal value to performance except in events lasting 2 h or longer. The form of CHO (i.e., glucose, fructose, sucrose) ingested may produce different blood glucose and insulin responses, but the rate of muscle glycogen resynthesis is about the same regardless of the structure.
