The ultimate insulin thread

[juve]

i thought insulin interfered with the release of GH?

that would be true but only in a very limited timefame.
cortisol is antagonistic to GH, and given that your body has not recovered (suppressed corticoids) from stressful excercise due to lack of nutrients (for purpose of argument let's say glucose) the GH response will be delayed. In fact, one study pointed that in a restricted dietary regimen, with no glucose PW GH secretion was delayed by 13 hours after excercise=bad. Cortisol levels are rampant! At the same time long periods of hypoinsulenamia have a negative impact upon hormonal production - T(test), T3(thyroid hormone), TSH(T4>T3 conversion), Leptin(peptide protein responsible for fat loss) delcine, all the while NPY (hunger) and SHBG (Test inhibiting hormone) rise. Hence the concept of refeed on CKD or carb meal PW.

 

[Babyfaced Assassin]

Ohashi posted some good articles there

It's pretty much explained in the first one

it's not all about an insulin spike and growing
it's about shuttleing nutrients, recovery and cortisol control too

 

[chewyxrage]

^

 

[CPA02]

this is probably one of the most important posts ive read in a while. Good job guys explaining how important post workout recovery really is..

 

[SoreArms]

Re: Re: The ultimate insulin thread

A minimal amount of insulin is necessary for aminoacid transport: MINIMUM!!!!!!! In fact so minimum that ingested protein itself induces enough of an insulin surge (very small, but nontheless) to be assimilated.
As a matter of fact concuming dextrose only causes a prmature spike - your protein has not even began the process of being digested (protein>peptide>aminoacid) while your blood sugar is rampant.
And cortisol antagonizing properties - once again minimum insulin; as soon as your body shifts to a process of being 'fed' cortisol production ceases and insulin itself suppresses the rest.

So far, every article I've read on this subject (since this post) promotes simple carb comsumption (maltodextrim & dextrose) post work out.

I think your point is interesting, care to elaborate and/or provide links to validate your point.

 

[Jandy]

Great read! Now I'm going to be up all night reading all those damn articles....

anyways.. I found this part of the article referring to necessary vitamins post workout very interesting:

However, as long as increased intakes of antioxidant vitamins and minerals are taken, antioxidant defenses can be strengthened to a point that more than makes up for the damage incurred during workouts. Vitamins C and E are especially helpful.

 

[bran987]

Yeah Jandy I know.. went out and spent $30 on C & E vits the day I read that

along with.. *sigh creatine and

*sigh chromium and

*sigh part of my retirement savings by the time I got to the register

 

[juve]

Re: Re: Re: The ultimate insulin thread

I think your point is interesting, care to elaborate and/or provide links to validate your point.

Oh my, please refer to post#16.

As far as vitamins C & E - their application purely derives from their ability to reduce serum cortisol levels, and to an extent reduce oxidative species produced from energy metabolisys. However r-ALA is a much more potent anti-oxidant, and should/could be used in conjunction with the two aforementioned.

 

[SoreArms]

Also, I want to make a distinction:
You might have got an idea that I advocate no glucose PW. If you reread my post you would see that I was simply rejecting the fallacious premiss that the reason for sugar PW is to shuttle aminos or blunt cortisol. Very much of your nutrition including PW depends on type of training, type of dieting, desired results (cosmetic, strength, endurance, speed)

So we are stuck with conclusion?

Great, that means I am going to have to do a lot of reading to figure this out several months from now.

Thanks though

 

[bran987]

well, I'm going to try a PWO shake purely protein/glutamine with C&E.. then 30 minutes later have just a little dextrose.. only while bulking. while cutting, no carbs till my first meal after working out. as to whether that's the right thing to do? I'm at a loss.

Juve said he could post links to tons of places with evidence that PWO carbs aren't necessary, but he doesn't seem to want to actually post them (which is his prerogative, of course).. soo.. I dunno. maybe we are stuck sorearms. I don't know how and where to find all the scientific articles these chem wizzes find.