Please Scroll Down to See Forums Below cdownie927
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The Terminator said:
hey Term, do I go right into clomid from my once a week hcg shoot, or for my last 2weeks before clomid run hcg 500iu ed on top of once a week.
Help with proper dose to prevent atrophy and cycle critique
- Thread starter cdownie927
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hey Term, do I go right into clomid from my once a week hcg shoot, or for my last 2weeks before clomid run hcg 500iu ed on top of once a week.
AleaveR do you take 500iu's e3d throughout your cycle plus 500iu's ed for 3 weeks for post cycle. So for a 10 week cycle with 3 weeks post cycle you would take 44 injections for a total of 22,000iu? Damn that's alot of HCG!
What's your recovery like? I mean how long until you notice a difference post cycle?
What's your recovery like? I mean how long until you notice a difference post cycle?
AleaveR
New member
R77M,
I actually will take it throughout my cycle, and 1 week after my last injection. After that, I want my body to begin producing its own testosterone naturally. SInce you have used the HCG throughout the cycle to prevent atrophy, there is no use for it after the cycle because there is no atrophy to fix. By using HCG post cycle, without any atrophy, you are actually slowing down recovery.
What happens is that you are stimulating the leydig cells to proiduce testsoterone through HCG, which acts like LH. The testosterone you produce with HCG goes up to the pituitary and the hypothalumus and inhibits the production of LH to produce more testosterone because the body thinks that there is already plenty of testosterone...
Since you want your body to produce its own testosterone, you dont want to send this false inhibtory response to the pituitary and hypothalumus. You want them to know that there is no test and that they better get busy producing LH which will stimulate test release from the gonads...
I actually will take it throughout my cycle, and 1 week after my last injection. After that, I want my body to begin producing its own testosterone naturally. SInce you have used the HCG throughout the cycle to prevent atrophy, there is no use for it after the cycle because there is no atrophy to fix. By using HCG post cycle, without any atrophy, you are actually slowing down recovery.
What happens is that you are stimulating the leydig cells to proiduce testsoterone through HCG, which acts like LH. The testosterone you produce with HCG goes up to the pituitary and the hypothalumus and inhibits the production of LH to produce more testosterone because the body thinks that there is already plenty of testosterone...
Since you want your body to produce its own testosterone, you dont want to send this false inhibtory response to the pituitary and hypothalumus. You want them to know that there is no test and that they better get busy producing LH which will stimulate test release from the gonads...
cdownie927
New member
AleaveR said:
AleaveR, can you post an example of how you incorporate that
Im not sure if I got it Ex. 500iu e3d then last week before clomid is 500iu ed, then start clomid and nolva for pct.
cdownie927 said:
More than likely you won't need any HCG for post cycle, as there will be little to not atrophy to correct...I don't use any unless there is existing atrophy post cycle, but when running once or twice weekly hcg throughout the chances of that are really reduced...
AleaveR
New member
I am taking it throughout the cycle at 500IU e3d. Then, after my last shot, I will continue to follow the same tecnique for one more week.
The reason that I do this is because after that last shot, specifically if it is a long acting ester (test/deca), test levels soar up once again, and you are technically on. It is not until test levels start to drop off, 1-2 weeks after the last shot, that I will consider myself as being off.
At this point, I would stop HCG use completely (I have already made sure I didnt let any atrophy set in), and begin regular PCT shortly after....
The reason that I do this is because after that last shot, specifically if it is a long acting ester (test/deca), test levels soar up once again, and you are technically on. It is not until test levels start to drop off, 1-2 weeks after the last shot, that I will consider myself as being off.
At this point, I would stop HCG use completely (I have already made sure I didnt let any atrophy set in), and begin regular PCT shortly after....
AleaveR
What about desensitization of the Leydig? Have you had any problems with post cycle due to desensitization? Couldn't that much HCG cause irreversable effects, which even clomid and nolva could not fix?
I am only asking because your strategy sounds very good and I would like to incorporate it into my own cycle. But I have read to many studies that say the possibility of desensitization is there. You have personal experience with long term use which could discredit some of my concerns.
What about desensitization of the Leydig? Have you had any problems with post cycle due to desensitization? Couldn't that much HCG cause irreversable effects, which even clomid and nolva could not fix?
I am only asking because your strategy sounds very good and I would like to incorporate it into my own cycle. But I have read to many studies that say the possibility of desensitization is there. You have personal experience with long term use which could discredit some of my concerns.
AleaveR
New member
From what I understand, the toxic effect is dose dependant. The following was from an article that Swale wrote:
"Any more than 500IU of HCG per day causes too much aromatase activity. Some feel aromatase is actually toxic to the Leydig cells of the testes"
"If 250IU or 500IU on two days each week isn’t enough to stave off testicular atrophy, then I recommend using it more days each week (as opposed to taking larger doses). In fact, I wouldn’t mind having a guy use 250IU per day ALL THROUGH the cycle. "
Check out allthingsmale.com, he is very knowledgeable down to earth guy and he has really helped me out a lot. You might even want to drop him an email...
"Any more than 500IU of HCG per day causes too much aromatase activity. Some feel aromatase is actually toxic to the Leydig cells of the testes"
"If 250IU or 500IU on two days each week isn’t enough to stave off testicular atrophy, then I recommend using it more days each week (as opposed to taking larger doses). In fact, I wouldn’t mind having a guy use 250IU per day ALL THROUGH the cycle. "
Check out allthingsmale.com, he is very knowledgeable down to earth guy and he has really helped me out a lot. You might even want to drop him an email...
