Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it ain't

[mrsocal]

Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it ain't

I posted about 5 days how I was coughing and had shortness of breath. The fear was having injected Test Depot a heavy oil time released Test into a blood vessel in my delts.

In the delt, I rarely aspirated cos it was such a hassle 4 me with 1 hand.

Those of u who said that it probably wasn't cos I shot Test into my veins by accident were right because the coughing happened 1-3 days after my delt injection w/o aspirating. These symptoms (shortness of breath & a dry cough) usually happens immediately after such an injection into the vein.

Went to the ER of a hospital 3 days ago.

Did a full-test, including blood work & EKG. At 40 years old, my liver function is only a tad (hardly noticeable) in the bad column. This is impressive as I've taken 40 mgs of oral D-bol blue hearts during my last cycle and 250 mgs/week of Test Depot in the good ole beefy shoulder delt region.

I guess drinking on average 2 liters of water a day, taking Liv.52 (prescription strength liver protectant), and milk thistle really helped counter any harmful effects to my liver.

The doctor gave me the usual crap about how I should take so much grams of protein and creatine and how bad steroids were. He pointed to the acne in my chin.

PLEASE...!!! ACNE i can deal with... no problem...acne goes away.

Doctor dude was skinny and bookish and probably resolved or satisfied to live a life as a skinny eye-glass wearing dude with an equally boring eye-glass wearing, skinny no-butt wife.

He hadn't been through the crap of being bullied at a young age or have had to seen my self-confidence destroyed at a young age by a nasty over-bearing s.o.b. father like the father I had.

I'm a hard gainer, light-boned ectomorph--- steroids are the hard-gainer's tool and salvation.

The nurse a young hot blonde who equally and probably more talked negatively about juice was kind of bitchy, but I turned a negative into a positive and asked her out to take her off her pedastal.

She claimed that she was a former fitness model and she impressed me with her knowledge on juice.

She said that the reason why I bruised and black and blued so easily and often was cos the liver didn't have time to CLOT or heal bumps and bruises because it was TOO BUSY WORKING ON THE ROIDS IN MY BLOOD STREAM.

For the uninitated, novice, 1 of the big Sides of using juice is that you black and blue often and easily--lots of times in big ass proportion to the bump you get. I once had a big black and blue mark on my chest during this last heavy cycle for only resting the olympic barbell on my chest for a couple of seconds on a bench press

This former fitness model, nurse also said that the heart gets real muscular which makes it hard for the heart to pump blood. Arythmia or some other crap. If you ever saw the episode of that blond dude in the gym who was takin roids and had a heart attack, this is what I guess she was talking about.

After all, the heart IS a muscle...and after all JUICE does make all muscles of the body stronger, and more muscular or toned.

In the case of the heart, according to her, the heart is a muscle that did not need to be more muscular or toned. If it did, it would be too stiff to sufficiently pump blood throughout the body and a heart attack would follow.

Strange how the consensus is the medical community is that since the heart is a muscle, it does benefit from jogging or cardio to keep it in shape. Hmmmm. OXYMORON there....

She then started sayin something like juice hurts the kidneys and that i might need Dialysis. Weekly dialysis machine treatments to, I guess, clean out the stuff the kidneys clean out own their own.

Funny how uneventful to my health, my last heavvy duty cycle was...cos I did 6 months already this year of 30-50 mgs d-bol oral tabs/day, doing 6 weeks on, 4 wks off; the last cycle was a heavy dbol 8 WEEEK cycle of 5 wks at 50 mgs/dbol per day, then tapering down TO 40 then 30 then 15 the last 3 wks.

Funny how my urine was NOT DARK, nor did it hurt, nor stung, when I pissed, nor did the left side of my stomach hurt (where the liver is). Nor did I piss blood.

Funny how alcoholics drink for years and years at least 10-15 years of hard ass liquor that can easily be used as a low-grade gasoline or fire starter for a summertime barbeque and these alcoholics get a stinging, sharp pain in their gut only 1 year after drinking the heavy heavy fuel, yet they can go on another 15 yrs of this heavy duty fuel lifestyle until they see the 1st signs of cerossis or however u spell that liver disease!

then she said, u start to lose all the muscle when ur off the juice. not true... u DO lose SOME not all muscle gains.

the juice is like what FDR said about the Russians during WW2 when he needed their help to fight the Germans: "sometimes u have to hold hands with the devil to cross the bridge."

the juice can get u over the hump (past any sticking points) and increase ur self confidence, thus allowing u to continue bodybuilding--even to continue it naturally!

i started to think that this nurse felt she was on a high-horse and that she might work for a non-juice supplement company, but she didn't pitch me an alternative.

cos u know what....like Sinead O'Connor said/sang in that 80's song "Nothing compares...nothing compares to you--(juice)"

don't believe the hype.

drink lots of water each day at least 2 liters...often if u can, 1 gallon,

take milk thistle vitamins.

take liv.52 liver protectant,

add primordial liver juice if u want to for extra liver protection.

be real nice to everyone no matter what to protect against roid rage.

smile often, even if it might make u look gay...to offset or prevent roid rage...cos roid rage is the worst, you won't be able to bodybuild save for pushups at a mental health ward or a county jail if ur sent there for roid rage.

the moral of the story...keep on keepin on...the juice is the hard-gainer's savior...

if u had a silver spoon in ur mouth like that pretty blonde nurse/former fitness model or that skinny rich eye-glass wearing doctor, then you don't know how helpful the juice can be!

ALSO REMEMBER JOHN Q. DOCTOR PRESCRIBES TEST FOR PAT (WHO WANTS TO GROW FACIAL HAIR AND HAVE A DEEPER VOICE) TO TURN INTO PATRICK AND WHO WANTS TO COMPETE WITH THE ALREADY LIMITED SUPPLY OF HOT WOMEN OUT THERE.

IF IT'S GOOD ENOUGH FOR A DOC TO PRESCRIBE TEST INJECTIONS FOR SUCH QUESTIONABLE PEOPLE (TO PUT IT NICELY), THEN IT SHOULD BE GOOD ENOUGH FOR THE HARD GAINER OVER 21 YEARS OF AGE WHO HAS HAD A HARD LIFE OF BEING BULLIED AND BORN WITH LAME ASS GENETICS!

be healthy, bros!! ...AND DON'T BELIEVE THE HYPE!

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Addition/clarification..."episode"...as in t.v. Episode of "1000's ways to die", where blond guy working out at a gym suffered an arythmia or irrgeular breathing and had a heart attack.

 

[tha_Waco_kid]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Some good points, but I wouldn't be so quickly dismissive of what the docs say. You may have expertise that they don't have regarding gear, but they also have plenty of knowledge that you don't have regarding a healthy human body, and warning signs.

For me, it is a give and take with the medical community. I am open and honest with my doc, and I do take into consideration everything he tells me. I may not follow all his advice, but I do consider it and weigh the alternatives.

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

doctors don't know shit about juicing, no different than the general population. they never studied it and they never learned about nutrition and diet in med school.

the bruising thing is NOT normal though.. there is definately an underlying problem that you have.. may even be from poor injection technique.

 

[Zyglamail]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

the bruising thing is NOT normal though.. there is definately an underlying problem that you have.. may even be from poor injection technique.

Yep, never had an issue with bruising either. Lots of possible causes for excessive bruising but simple AAS use isnt one of them. It may exacerbate the problem but in and of itself shouldnt be causing it.

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Just a quick note and a side observation....... Your gonna wanna take that 2 litres of water a day and up that to 4.

 

[digit0x]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Just a quick note and a side observation....... Your gonna wanna take that 2 litres of water a day and up that to 4.

Yes. And whats up with bruising? Never had that problem.

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

thanks for ur further advice & encouragement guys...if u google excessive black and blue bruising & steroids (& vice versa), you'll see that as a side effect of steroids--both anabolic and anti-inflammatory steroids. If you ever seen an alcoholic, he or she also has lots of bruising marks and easily bruises. I think this may even be a symptom of hepatitis. But, Im in the clear, my hearts ok (EKG reading was fine) and an elaborate blood work would've revealed Hepatitis or liver toxicity which, thankfully, it didn't.


Im not taking more than 30 mgs d-bol tabs/day during ANY cycle. I was taking 40 mgs/day d-bol blue hearts for 5 weeks during 1 cycle this year, and a heavy cycle of 50 mgs/day d-bol blue hearts for 5 weeks during my last cycle, an 8 week cycle which ended 3 days ago.

 

[Massroid1020]

Bruising shouldn't be taken as normal. The liver is responsible for producing clotting factors. If your liver is damaged then you may have excessive and easy bruising. But it shouldn't be confused with something that would expect leave a bruise like bumping into the squat rack with your shin while walking by or something

 

[Headholio]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

After all, the heart IS a muscle...and after all JUICE does make all muscles of the body stronger, and more muscular or toned.

In the case of the heart, according to her, the heart is a muscle that did not need to be more muscular or toned. If it did, it would be too stiff to sufficiently pump blood throughout the body and a heart attack would follow.

Strange how the consensus is the medical community is that since the heart is a muscle, it does benefit from jogging or cardio to keep it in shape. Hmmmm. OXYMORON there....

That's some faulty logic bro. Exercise induced changes to the heart are not equivalent to changes caused by steroid abuse. And enlargement and wall thickening can happen due to exercise or due to disease. The consequences are not the same.


The cardiac toxicity of anabolic steroids.

Consequent alterations of cellular pathology and organ physiology are similar to those seen with heart failure and cardiomyopathy. Hypertension, ventricular remodeling, myocardial ischemia, and sudden cardiac death have each been temporally and causally associated with anabolic steroid use in humans. These effects persist long after use has been discontinued and have significant impact on subsequent morbidity and mortality.

The cardiac toxicity of anabolic... [Prog Cardiovasc Dis. 1998 Jul-Aug] - PubMed - NCBI

 

[Voijn]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

If the doctors scan the heart and see ventricular hypertrophy or high bloodpressure those there are signials that you might go alittle bit to the safer side...

please stop being fucking ignorent about the doctors words, yeah they might not know totally about your body.. Atleast these people arent STUPID enough to use medicine they dont need... In other words people that dont do doses higher then 500mg of test are rightaway retarded.. You cant grow on 3x your own testosteron level?? Man u got a problem son, and it aint the juice..

This is the reason that people experience side effects, not growing from high-ENOUGH does and go even higher.. Im actually saying that those of us who do steroids are in some way aittle tarded, i have done it? Yes
Would i do it again? Yes as lame as it sounds

im waiting for my LVH to return to normal and to see if all my values are returned to normal cholesterol, liver, and my left ventricle hypertrophy that is 12mm right now. normal is 11mm

 

[Headholio]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

im waiting for my LVH to return to normal and to see if all my values are returned to normal cholesterol, liver, and my left ventricle hypertrophy that is 12mm right now. normal is 11mm

Did the doc say your ventricle wall could go back to normal? Hypertrophy can happen from resistance training alone, without juice. I figured the change was permanent.

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Again with the bruising I will say that bro...its not normal. I don't care what doc or article says its normal....its not. I have been here 11 years and never remember a single thread about bruising and believe me, people come out with some of the dumbest most outlandish shit here. I would have remembered bruising. In fact I have read tons of shit over the last 15 years on effects, positive and negative on AAS.....and I cannot remember even reading about it.
I'm not busting your chops here bro. Just saying you might wanna look into that further.

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

That's some faulty logic bro. Exercise induced changes to the heart are not equivalent to changes caused by steroid abuse. And enlargement and wall thickening can happen due to exercise or due to disease. The consequences are not the same.


The cardiac toxicity of anabolic steroids.

Consequent alterations of cellular pathology and organ physiology are similar to those seen with heart failure and cardiomyopathy. Hypertension, ventricular remodeling, myocardial ischemia, and sudden cardiac death have each been temporally and causally associated with anabolic steroid use in humans. These effects persist long after use has been discontinued and have significant impact on subsequent morbidity and mortality.

The cardiac toxicity of anabolic... [Prog Cardiovasc Dis. 1998 Jul-Aug] - PubMed - NCBI

so as i seem to infer. anabolic steroid use should be well-planned out, monitored..., and most importantly--TEMPORARY.

you also have to know when to finally draw the line and quit them forever which is hard to do, but not impossible.

interesting how u cite that A.A.S. can cause permanent AND IRREVERSIBLE damage to the heart--even when they are discontinued.

what do u suggest if a dude is having cardiac arrest cos of the juice?

know the tell-tale signs of a heart attack--like aa tingling sensation down the left arm?

have an aspirin on you like Bayer aspirin & take it to lessen the effects of the heart attack?

THAT'S A Whole different interesting subject--heart attacks caused by steroids and what to do if you have one.

I think proper diet (no steaks, just lean chicken breasts, low-fat foods) and a proper relaxed "rage-less" even "goofy-happy" mind-set are 2 VERY GOOD THINGS TO DO to lessen the chances of high blood pressure and it's DIRTY HALF BROTHER--a heart attacK--while on a cycle...

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Again with the bruising I will say that bro...its not normal. I don't care what doc or article says its normal....its not. I have been here 11 years and never remember a single thread about bruising and believe me, people come out with some of the dumbest most outlandish shit here. I would have remembered bruising. In fact I have read tons of shit over the last 15 years on effects, positive and negative on AAS.....and I cannot remember even reading about it.
I'm not busting your chops here bro. Just saying you might wanna look into that further.

MY BLACK AND BLUE MARKS WILL GO AWAY WHEN I STOP FOR 2 MONTHS (8 WKS). I MIGHT EVEN START UP AGAIN IN 2 AND HALF MONTHS OR EVEN 3 MONTHS TO FULLY DE-TOX.

THE REGISTERED NURSE IF YOU RECALL IN MY ORIGINAL POST WHO USED TO BE A FITNESS MODEL SAID THAT THE LIVER IS BUSY WORKING ON DE-TOXING THE JUICE IN MY BODY, THAT'S WHY IT DIDN'T HAVE TIME TO CLOT THE BLACK AND BLUE MARKS.

I can't think of a better MORE AUTHORITATIVE source of info. besides a medical doctor than a registered nurse.

black and blue marks show that the liver is busy trying to filter out Juice.

1 simple google of "steroids and bruising" will ENLIGHTEN U.

just cause u have never heard of it doesn't mean, it doesn't exist.

have u ever taken 40-50 mgs of dbol a day for 6 weeks, along with Test?

dbol is very liver toxic...so i can understand why i black & blued so often and so easily.

nO OFFENSE. UR not busting my chops. this is the free exchange of ideas to improve...

can't think of anything more American than that

 

[Massroid1020]

MY BLACK AND BLUE MARKS WILL GO AWAY WHEN I STOP FOR 2 MONTHS (8 WKS). I MIGHT EVEN START UP AGAIN IN 2 AND HALF MONTHS OR EVEN 3 MONTHS TO FULLY DE-TOX.

THE REGISTERED NURSE IF YOU RECALL IN MY ORIGINAL POST WHO USED TO BE A FITNESS MODEL SAID THAT THE LIVER IS BUSY WORKING ON DE-TOXING THE JUICE IN MY BODY, THAT'S WHY IT DIDN'T HAVE TIME TO CLOT THE BLACK AND BLUE MARKS.

I can't think of a better MORE AUTHORITATIVE source of info. besides a medical doctor than a registered nurse.

black and blue marks show that the liver is busy trying to filter out Juice.

1 simple google of "steroids and bruising" will ENLIGHTEN U.

just cause u have never heard of it doesn't mean, it doesn't exist.

have u ever taken 40-50 mgs of dbol a day for 6 weeks, along with Test?

dbol is very liver toxic...so i can understand why i black & blued so often and so easily.

nO OFFENSE. UR not busting my chops. this is the free exchange of ideas to improve...

can't think of anything more American than that

Bro I'm in RN school at the moment only have one semester left and I can tell you that your liver doesn't prioritize it's actions. It functions to metabolize anything and everything in your body, it's doesn't think that metabolizing the juice takes priority over clotting. The reason you bruise easily is indeed because you have the liver toxic substance in your body, which makes your liver function less efficiently. The liver can regenerate but only to a certain extent. The smart thing to do would be stay clean for a couple months get bloods done a complete work up, CBC CMP lipid profile and liver enzymes. That will tell you if it's nothing to worry about

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Bro I'm in RN school at the moment only have one semester left and I can tell you that your liver doesn't prioritize it's actions. It functions to metabolize anything and everything in your body, it's doesn't think that metabolizing the juice takes priority over clotting. The reason you bruise easily is indeed because you have the liver toxic substance in your body, which makes your liver function less efficiently. The liver can regenerate but only to a certain extent. The smart thing to do would be stay clean for a couple months get bloods done a complete work up, CBC CMP lipid profile and liver enzymes. That will tell you if it's nothing to worry about

I would be extremely alarmed if I suddenly started bruising easily. I dunno about anyone else.

 

[moya]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

2 LITERS of water?... thats a major problem right there... try more like 2 galons bro... i get at least a gallon just when at the gym...

water is the most important thing to the human body... i would suspect that 75% of juicer problems can be fixed with just drinking more water...

might be related to the bruising... not enough water while on?...

ive taken a lot of shit (50mg dbol for 6 weeks ive done) and i find that i bruise LESS than before...

 

[jerome simpson]

With regards to the bruising- Your enlightened fitness model nurse might have told you something you took as sacrosanct, but perhaps she was just talking out of her ass based on her limited knowledge? So she's a nurse, so what. She probably learns something new every day like you and me and locks her keys in her car like the rest of us schmucks. The liver was too busy to get rid of the bruise? Wtf? Seems like a dumbed down scare tactic to just stop you from taking steroids, which might not be a bad idea. You went into the ER crying about steroids. Stop. You've kinda presented yourself as an idiot from the two threads I've read. Bruising like you are describing is not normal, is not common, and you should have a qualified blood Dr examine you. Could be many things, iron deficiency, platelet imbalance, I don't know but you can't just chalk it up as normal for being on gear BECAUSE AN RN WHO WAS A MODEL SAID SO!!#!

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using EliteFitness

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

thanks Massroid that's real good advice. i have a lab report the nurse showed me & gave me to take home, showing that i was not in any danger. Next week i have an appt w/ my regular family Dr. and i've written down those tests you mentioned to make sure if more tests would be preferable/more thorough. thanx again!

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

With regards to the bruising- Your enlightened fitness model nurse might have told you something you took as sacrosanct, but perhaps she was just talking out of her ass based on her limited knowledge? So she's a nurse, so what. She probably learns something new every day like you and me and locks her keys in her car like the rest of us schmucks. The liver was too busy to get rid of the bruise? Wtf? Seems like a dumbed down scare tactic to just stop you from taking steroids, which might not be a bad idea. You went into the ER crying about steroids. Stop. You've kinda presented yourself as an idiot from the two threads I've read. Bruising like you are describing is not normal, is not common, and you should have a qualified blood Dr examine you. Could be many things, iron deficiency, platelet imbalance, I don't know but you can't just chalk it up as normal for being on gear BECAUSE AN RN WHO WAS A MODEL SAID SO!!#!

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using EliteFitness

calm down...im an idiot for going to the ER and trying to figure out what happened and an idiot for caring about my health?!

ur the idiot who can't communicate like a civilized human being.
that's how YOU presented urself.

GO BACK AND READ MY ADVICE ON ROID RAGE...U CAN DO ONLY PUSHUPS AND MAYBE IF UR LUCKY TRICEPS DIPS ON A CHAIR IF YOU'RE LOCKED UP IN JAIL OR A MENTAL WARD FOR ACTING LIKE A MONKEY ASS THE WAY U ACTED NOW.

-pun k

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

alright everyone lets calm down

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

I wonder if you have iron issues which is causing you to bruise easier. i agree with the above poster that nurse is just talking out of her ass, she probably just read that somewhere but I've never had any such issues. the only bruising i ever got was from a bad injection where i hit a vein and it bled like crazy. and the area bruised on the inside. so it wasn't AAS related, just a bad injection.

the google searches come up with a lot of guys who say they have bruising from injections from AAS. and the other people say they get them from cortico's which I'm assuming you aren't taking correct?

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

i agree with the above poster that nurse is just talking out of her ass, she probably just read that somewhere but I've never had any such issues. the only bruising i ever got was from a bad injection where i hit a vein and it bled like crazy.

This ^^^^^



Kinda of like the doc years ago that told me I was assaulting my body with poison and would have a heart attack or stroke for sure if I didnt stop.
Steve, you know this all too well as do many of us...90% of the medical profession from LPN's up to Specialists (and especially general practicioner family docs) are FUCKING MORONS!!!!

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

^^^ I know it all too well believe me. I play a poker home game with a bunch of docs and they are no different than the general population when it comes to fitness knowledge, much less AAS knowledge. i would say one dude I play with is pretty good with fitness, he works out with me at the gym.. but the others don't know the difference between a bench press and a bench pad.

 

[Headholio]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Bruising is common with corticosteroids, not AAS.
The nurse might have been right that the bruising is a side effect of your liver being over worked, but that doesn't mean its a normal side effect. It could mean your liver is seriously screwed up.

This one episode of intervention (love that show), this alchoholic had scirrosis so bad he had bruises all over his body. Black and blue everywhere. He died, IIRC.

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Bruising is common with corticosteroids, not AAS.
The nurse might have been right that the bruising is a side effect of your liver being over worked, but that doesn't mean its a normal side effect. It could mean your liver is seriously screwed up.

This one episode of intervention (love that show), this alchoholic had scirrosis so bad he had bruises all over his body. Black and blue everywhere. He died, IIRC.

thanks for trying to help, but please choose ur words better. does that dont choose their words carefully ended up scaring a fellow juicer.

my liver isn't serioiusly fuckd I don't get bruises from farting or just a strong wind bumping into me.

something has to make contact with my bod or I make contact with it. the contact leading to the size of the bruise is however small

plus, if my liver was Fd up, I would have other liver fkdup probs like yellowing of the whites of my eyes, plus a sharp, stinging pain on the left side of my stomach where the liver is located.

if it was serioiusly fd up, i would've left the ER room feeling real down and out after the nurse went over my blood work.

 

[Voijn]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Ive researched LVH alot! 50% of natural bodybuilders do get it at some point.
100% of people that choice do have LVH in some degree..

I had my heart tested and from first test to last test its gone down from 13mm to 12mm and 11mm is the normal.
Meaning some how my heart has decreased in the abnormal LVH, i still lift heavy if not heavyer non cycleing
It could also be a wrong judgement from either test,i cant tell.. but its still 1mm

I also spoke to a professional bodybuilder that had a very worse degree of LVH, he stopped juiceing and after awhile his heart returned to normal. He will never use again

By LVH i understand you develop it because of the strain you put on your heart when lifting, i am not totally sure but in my opinion the heart strikes alot harder when whe lift heavy compunds instead of sending steams of blood supply "high heart rate" the heart instead under a hard lift Flushes a big wave instead.

This in some way trains the heart and the muscle becomes bigger, the bigger the muscle the more blood can be pressed harder.. This condion might help us while we lift, but when our heart returns to normal beat it might not be that great

Like a biceps that is trained and suddenly is not, it will return back again. I think that the same goes for the heart! LVH is not dangerous when its under the limit, but if goes above i dont really know

I would really like an expert on this LVH subject since i really dont know much about it, other then my own statements that ive imagined can be the reason for it to develop.

 

[Headholio]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Ive researched LVH alot! 50% of natural bodybuilders do get it at some point.
100% of people that choice do have LVH in some degree..

I had my heart tested and from first test to last test its gone down from 13mm to 12mm and 11mm is the normal.
Meaning some how my heart has decreased in the abnormal LVH, i still lift heavy if not heavyer non cycleing
It could also be a wrong judgement from either test,i cant tell.. but its still 1mm

I also spoke to a professional bodybuilder that had a very worse degree of LVH, he stopped juiceing and after awhile his heart returned to normal. He will never use again

By LVH i understand you develop it because of the strain you put on your heart when lifting, i am not totally sure but in my opinion the heart strikes alot harder when whe lift heavy compunds instead of sending steams of blood supply "high heart rate" the heart instead under a hard lift Flushes a big wave instead.

This in some way trains the heart and the muscle becomes bigger, the bigger the muscle the more blood can be pressed harder.. This condion might help us while we lift, but when our heart returns to normal beat it might not be that great

Like a biceps that is trained and suddenly is not, it will return back again. I think that the same goes for the heart! LVH is not dangerous when its under the limit, but if goes above i dont really know

I would really like an expert on this LVH subject since i really dont know much about it, other then my own statements that ive imagined can be the reason for it to develop.

I think its the heart contraction against higher blood pressure that occurs during heavy lifting that contributes to LVH. Then with AAS, you have more blood pressure increase and an anabolic state to encourage muscle growth.

But some studies show that LVH caused by resistance training is not the same as LVH caused by high blood pressure alone. If LVH results in reduced ventricular cavity size, like it does in a disease state, ejection fraction and cardiac output go down. but with resistance training, cavity size stays the same, and ejection fraction can actually increase.

So, I think that mild LVH is not anything to worry about in weight lifters. It isn't the same as unhealthy people with high blood pressure.

Here I just found this which differentiates healthy from unhealthy LVH pretty well.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1729776/bin/00537.f1.jpg

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

as i said earlier I would get your iron checked man. I had an X who would get bruised all the time from bumping into things.. turns out she had low iron.. she started to take iron pills and eating more green veggies and the problem got much better. surprised the doc didn't suggest it.

google low iron and bruising and you will get a lot of good info about it. its something that can be corrected with a simple diet change

 

[mrsocal]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

as i said earlier I would get your iron checked man. I had an X who would get bruised all the time from bumping into things.. turns out she had low iron.. she started to take iron pills and eating more green veggies and the problem got much better. surprised the doc didn't suggest it.

google low iron and bruising and you will get a lot of good info about it. its something that can be corrected with a simple diet change

that's a good idea. SIMPLY MAKES A LOT OF SENSE! i will eat more Veggies & buy some Iron vit's & minerals.

been eating lean chicken breasts and sauteed with onions, but need more veggie variety

was scared into bumping up my doctor appointment. my primary care physician/primary doctor confirmed that my liver levels are good.

NO LIVER DAMAGE.

she said the initial ER blood test was Thorough in that it did a liver enzyme test, a CBC, etc., EXACTLY WHAT RN STUDENT USERNAME, "MASSROID" suggested here.

I'm in the clear!

Never taking more than 30 mgs/dianabol/per day again--not a good idea,

IMAGINE if I was NOT taking Liv.52 (prescription strength liver protectant) and milk thistle?!

ThOSE 2 must really work! I'm REAL glad I took those 2 to lessen liver toxicity.

Thanks again, MassRoid, like I said I wrote down what u suggested the blood work include and it turned out it already was done at the Initial Emergency Room visit 5 days ago.

Doc also said my cough and shortness of breath, is probably the oil-based Test Depot time-released Test has inflammed the bronchial tubes cos I might have shot it in a vessel, or nicked the vessel and it entered my system.

ALWAYS ASPIRATING FROM NOW ON--IN FACT, I WILL BE PAYING A FRIEND TO INJECT ME IN FRONT DELTS AND ASPIRATE.

the heavy oil based Test will slowly get flushed out the system and lungs should return to normal and airways won't be INFLAMMED.

Here are my liver stats (IN CASE YOU WANTED TO KNOW):

ALK PHOS: 60
ALT: 49
AST: 51 H

hERE'S MY clotting factors:

PT: 12.1
INR 1.1@
PTT 26@
D-Dimer: <150@

 

[Headholio]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

I wonder what that H means next to your AST number?

 

[Massroid1020]

This ^^^^^



Kinda of like the doc years ago that told me I was assaulting my body with poison and would have a heart attack or stroke for sure if I didnt stop.
Steve, you know this all too well as do many of us...90% of the medical profession from LPN's up to Specialists (and especially general practicioner family docs) are FUCKING MORONS!!!!

I think it's a far stretch to say they are morons. Everything we are taught in school is to keep a persons body in a natural state of health and homeostasis. Whether or not you want to believe it, putting synthesized hormones into your body throws your endocrine system way out of wack, and your entire endocrine system works as a negative feedback loop. One thing goes up, that causes another to go down which causes something else to do something else and so on and so on. That's why people cycle. All I'm trying to say is the 'healthiest' option is to not do it at all. I'm not saying its not possible to do it and not have any negative effects. But most docs are only looking out for your 100% best interest, not 90% of it

 

[moya]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

yup docs use scare tactics just like supp companies do to get you to buy support supps... i know many a juicer irl who all get regular blood work... most dont run any pct and recover fine... the human body strives for homostasis...

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

I think it's a far stretch to say they are morons. Everything we are taught in school is to keep a persons body in a natural state of health and homeostasis. Whether or not you want to believe it, putting synthesized hormones into your body throws your endocrine system way out of wack, and your entire endocrine system works as a negative feedback loop. One thing goes up, that causes another to go down which causes something else to do something else and so on and so on. That's why people cycle. All I'm trying to say is the 'healthiest' option is to not do it at all. I'm not saying its not possible to do it and not have any negative effects. But most docs are only looking out for your 100% best interest, not 90% of it

Bro I was actually referring to just those people in general not their knowledge of aas. I find most docs and medical professionals sub par at best. Not that they all are but most of them are. Most of them seem to be more worried about not getting sued over aggressively treating something. I feel very fortunate to have found a competant family doc who isn't afraid to be aggressive. A muscoskeletal doc for prolotherapy and joint/tendon problems who loves what he does and a PT (when I need him) that understands BBr's and atheletes. It's only taken 15 years of sifting through shit doctors.

 

[Massroid1020]

Bro I was actually referring to just those people in general not their knowledge of aas. I find most docs and medical professionals sub par at best. Not that they all are but most of them are. Most of them seem to be more worried about not getting sued over aggressively treating something. I feel very fortunate to have found a competant family doc who isn't afraid to be aggressive. A muscoskeletal doc for prolotherapy and joint/tendon problems who loves what he does and a PT (when I need him) that understands BBr's and atheletes. It's only taken 15 years of sifting through shit doctors.

I could understand that some people would have that opinion. I have felt that way about some docs also. In my opinion it's more of their people skills, and some do seem to be straight dumbasses. Most of them to me have great intentions but you are right, some of them do seem like they could give a shit less about you or anyone else.

 

[Voijn]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Headholio your right, LVH can occour from weight training alone, but can also come form heart disease or high bloodpressure. I know alot of guys use preworkout products, maybe the question is if these have a part in the rule to develop LVH?? They do increase heart beat maybe bloodpressure while training?

One thing that i still dont understand, is it the chamber that get more narrow due to LVH meaning less blood can be pumped around Or is it the muscle that contracts the chamber growing bigger, away form the chamber not making it more narrow?

 

[Voijn]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Im not trying to be all knowing or sound like a fool, but i encourage you guys to look at bodybuilding from another perspektiv. Taking high doses of steroids combined with different kinds for longer periods of time, is plain old stupid, think about your health, friends, familie, children and the rest of your life.

I my self am obsessed with bodybuilding, its apart of my life. One thing that ive changed in my life is includeing cardiovascular training, before i was walking around like a freaking monster with a fat% at 15.. I was big but it dident look that attrative for women.. maybe for some guys -- lol.

My plan is to cut down below 10% with my cardio training, ive set a goal to run a half marathon. This should keep me motivated to keep eating cleaner and doing my cardiovascular training for my looks but also for my health.. All in all when i reach and finish my goal, i might jump back at a maximum dose of 250mg testosteron. 10+kg on a very low fat% body thats going to look extremely good and more healthy then bloating up on 500mg test, 400eq, 50mg ed wins, ect. = shit if u cant grow on 250mg ermm...

This was a choice that i made to make my bodybuilding more healthy, and hopefully it will pay off bodybuilding wise and health wise..

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

I could understand that some people would have that opinion. I have felt that way about some docs also. In my opinion it's more of their people skills, and some do seem to be straight dumbasses. Most of them to me have great intentions but you are right, some of them do seem like they could give a shit less about you or anyone else.

are you a doctor?

we used to have a guy on here named footdoc who was very upfront and down to earth and he would say his fellow docs are just plain moronic.. he was a very humble guy and admitted he did not know much about AAS and was very willing to learn from here.

anyway my issues with docs not to hijack the thread but in my life I have had ailments and its been frustrating going to them and being a guinea pig, given a drug, and being told to come back in 2 weeks. then going back not feeling better and being put on another drug. and they cycle continues. I visited a nursing home and i was shocked how many drugs these old people are on.. one guy had to take 9 pills a day 2X per day. lets face it, the old man has no idea what he is taking, he just takes what the doc gives him..

quick example: i had bronchitis and it was a bacterial infection in my chest.. i was coughing up brown shit.. I knew what i had, but after sitting in a urgent care clinic for 4 hours the doctor diagnosed me with a flu. and did not give me anti-biotics.. now maybe i did have the flu (i mean is it POSSIBLE that i had the bronchitis then picked up the flu at the same time?) , my bronchitis had been going on for 3 weeks and she refused to listen to me. finally I ordered anti-biotics online and 3 days later i felt much better. all she wanted to do was have me come back so she can charge another office visit, so i can pay for her kids ivy league college bill.

now had i trusted that doc my bronchitis would have kept getting worse and worse and i would of had to visit 8 doctors to get properly diagnosed. the bottom line is the problem with docs is that they spend 2 minutes with you, and throw a dart and guess what is wrong when i can google myself and properly diagnose myself better. thankfully we have online pharmacies in India and i can self medicate. funny after running those anti-biotics then running pro biotics after i have not had the problem come back and have been 100% healthy since.

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Im not trying to be all knowing or sound like a fool, but i encourage you guys to look at bodybuilding from another perspektiv. Taking high doses of steroids combined with different kinds for longer periods of time, is plain old stupid, think about your health, friends, familie, children and the rest of your life.

I my self am obsessed with bodybuilding, its apart of my life. One thing that ive changed in my life is includeing cardiovascular training, before i was walking around like a freaking monster with a fat% at 15.. I was big but it dident look that attrative for women.. maybe for some guys -- lol.

My plan is to cut down below 10% with my cardio training, ive set a goal to run a half marathon. This should keep me motivated to keep eating cleaner and doing my cardiovascular training for my looks but also for my health.. All in all when i reach and finish my goal, i might jump back at a maximum dose of 250mg testosteron. 10+kg on a very low fat% body thats going to look extremely good and more healthy then bloating up on 500mg test, 400eq, 50mg ed wins, ect. = shit if u cant grow on 250mg ermm...

This was a choice that i made to make my bodybuilding more healthy, and hopefully it will pay off bodybuilding wise and health wise..

I used to run 45 miles a week. I was in amazing shape and it felt great. now as a bodybuilder you are right, sometimes I feel worn down and it sucks being hungry all the time and having to eat like a pregnat women. its not the healthiest lifestyle I don't disagree. and yes it does put a strain on your organs carrying around so much muscle. BUT I love it and will continue cycling CONSERVATIVE doses and making sure i spend plenty of time off cycle for the body to get relief. I have always enjoyed lifting weights more than cardio and feel with my body structure being short and stocky bodybuilding is the perfect fit for me.

I have mentioned before running does take a toll on the body as well.. my ankles, shins, and feet took a beating .. the 10th mile of a half marathon running on hard surface my ankles hurt so bad that they go numb.

 

[Massroid1020]

are you a doctor?

we used to have a guy on here named footdoc who was very upfront and down to earth and he would say his fellow docs are just plain moronic.. he was a very humble guy and admitted he did not know much about AAS and was very willing to learn from here.

anyway my issues with docs not to hijack the thread but in my life I have had ailments and its been frustrating going to them and being a guinea pig, given a drug, and being told to come back in 2 weeks. then going back not feeling better and being put on another drug. and they cycle continues. I visited a nursing home and i was shocked how many drugs these old people are on.. one guy had to take 9 pills a day 2X per day. lets face it, the old man has no idea what he is taking, he just takes what the doc gives him..

quick example: i had bronchitis and it was a bacterial infection in my chest.. i was coughing up brown shit.. I knew what i had, but after sitting in a urgent care clinic for 4 hours the doctor diagnosed me with a flu. and did not give me anti-biotics.. now maybe i did have the flu (i mean is it POSSIBLE that i had the bronchitis then picked up the flu at the same time?) , my bronchitis had been going on for 3 weeks and she refused to listen to me. finally I ordered anti-biotics online and 3 days later i felt much better. all she wanted to do was have me come back so she can charge another office visit, so i can pay for her kids ivy league college bill.

now had i trusted that doc my bronchitis would have kept getting worse and worse and i would of had to visit 8 doctors to get properly diagnosed. the bottom line is the problem with docs is that they spend 2 minutes with you, and throw a dart and guess what is wrong when i can google myself and properly diagnose myself better. thankfully we have online pharmacies in India and i can self medicate. funny after running those anti-biotics then running pro biotics after i have not had the problem come back and have been 100% healthy since.

No I'm not a doctor im a nursing student. I also said that I agree some of them are dumbasses. I just didn't agree with most of them in general being morons. There is no doubt some of them shouldn't even be doctors. But hey, maybe I'm just lucky to have never had these sorts of problems with doctors.

 

[Headholio]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

One thing that i still dont understand, is it the chamber that get more narrow due to LVH meaning less blood can be pumped around Or is it the muscle that contracts the chamber growing bigger, away form the chamber not making it more narrow?

It can happen either way. Look up the difference between concentric LVH and Eccentric LVH.

Here is a good study, but on rats, saying resistance exercise causes wall thickening with no decrease in cavity size:

Effects of Resistance Training on Ventricular Function and Hypertrophy in a Rat Model

Here is an abstract of a study that says that AAS causes more LVH and reduction of cavity size compared to clean lifters:

Left ventricular size and function in elite... [Clin J Sport Med. 1997] - PubMed - NCBI

How all this effects cardiac function is another story, and seems pretty complicated.

 

[stevesmi]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

No I'm not a doctor im a nursing student. I also said that I agree some of them are dumbasses. I just didn't agree with most of them in general being morons. There is no doubt some of them shouldn't even be doctors. But hey, maybe I'm just lucky to have never had these sorts of problems with doctors.

since you are in the medical field you can obviously gonna get much better treatment since you have the connections.

but try being in my shoes as someone with no insurance, the only docs I can see are the ones that are bottom of the barrell, the ones that work in walk in clinics for example. the top doctors won't even see you for months UNLESS you know them or have connections to get in.

the sad thing about it is that I know people with cancer who get stuck with bad doctors and end up dieing, while someone rich or who has connections can see a good doctor and get treatment. it happens man. my bro in law right now had his mom in the hospital dieing from cancer and in pain.. the doctor did nothing for her.. he finally decided to move her to a non profit hospital and they treat her so good and she is getting the necessary help and feels much better. its all about MONEY .. with 99% of them atleast

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Im not trying to be all knowing or sound like a fool, but i encourage you guys to look at bodybuilding from another perspektiv. Taking high doses of steroids combined with different kinds for longer periods of time, is plain old stupid, think about your health, friends, familie, children and the rest of your life.

I my self am obsessed with bodybuilding, its apart of my life. One thing that ive changed in my life is includeing cardiovascular training, before i was walking around like a freaking monster with a fat% at 15.. I was big but it dident look that attrative for women.. maybe for some guys -- lol.

My plan is to cut down below 10% with my cardio training, ive set a goal to run a half marathon. This should keep me motivated to keep eating cleaner and doing my cardiovascular training for my looks but also for my health.. All in all when i reach and finish my goal, i might jump back at a maximum dose of 250mg testosteron. 10+kg on a very low fat% body thats going to look extremely good and more healthy then bloating up on 500mg test, 400eq, 50mg ed wins, ect. = shit if u cant grow on 250mg ermm...

This was a choice that i made to make my bodybuilding more healthy, and hopefully it will pay off bodybuilding wise and health wise..

Long term use...high doses ect... obviously isnt the healthy option. Referring to pro BBr's, most pro wrestlers, ect...lots of NFL players... Certainly 500mg wk+ of test all year round is not good.
I've never had any issues with women though. They either look at you and are scared by you and your size(and your not their type), which is hilarious to see, or they look at you with this excited curiosity while knowing your still not their type or they love the way you look. Either way it doesnt matter for me a) I'm married and b) I didnt get into this for women.
I will admit watching guys/punks who think they are hot shit have their own dick crawl right up their own ass when a huge guy walks in the room and usurps all the awsomeness in the room (all the while being humble and not a show off) is just pure awsomeness.
I will admit though I would rather be a 275 lb monster at 15% than a 200 lb fitness model at 6%. And ofcourse trying to achieve the 275 lb at 6% is where the serious unhealthy practice comes into play.

 

[Voijn]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

It can happen either way. Look up the difference between concentric LVH and Eccentric LVH.

Here is a good study, but on rats, saying resistance exercise causes wall thickening with no decrease in cavity size:

Effects of Resistance Training on Ventricular Function and Hypertrophy in a Rat Model

Here is an abstract of a study that says that AAS causes more LVH and reduction of cavity size compared to clean lifters:

Left ventricular size and function in elite... [Clin J Sport Med. 1997] - PubMed - NCBI

How all this effects cardiac function is another story, and seems pretty complicated.

Thanks bro! good studies that you respond with, ill look them up after my training today. Aint really sure what kind of LVH that ive got..

 

[Massroid1020]

since you are in the medical field you can obviously gonna get much better treatment since you have the connections.

but try being in my shoes as someone with no insurance, the only docs I can see are the ones that are bottom of the barrell, the ones that work in walk in clinics for example. the top doctors won't even see you for months UNLESS you know them or have connections to get in.

the sad thing about it is that I know people with cancer who get stuck with bad doctors and end up dieing, while someone rich or who has connections can see a good doctor and get treatment. it happens man. my bro in law right now had his mom in the hospital dieing from cancer and in pain.. the doctor did nothing for her.. he finally decided to move her to a non profit hospital and they treat her so good and she is getting the necessary help and feels much better. its all about MONEY .. with 99% of them atleast

Since you don't have insurance I completely understand now, I've never witnessed it or had to deal with that but I have heard horror stories about it. I'm sorry to hear about your bro in laws mom man. It's a shame that money rules the world but you are right about that. And honestly, a non profit hospital is much better because those docs are paid by the government which means they are of higher caliper than a normal family clinic doc. But I definitely see how someone in your shoes could have that view and problems with doctors.

 

[moya]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

how hard is it to find a job with insurance?!! thats a pretty big deal to look for in a job if you ask me... almost every union 'man' job offers great benefits, and pays great too... and you would not have to worry about cardio as much...

 

[Johnnnyjohnnny2]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Seriously, the most moronic meathead thread I have read since I stopped reading meathead threads in 2005 and quit posting on boards except for on a rare occasion. And Stevesmi I think I posted to you a couple years ago about clot formation and plaque rupture and high bloodpressure. I could be wrong but I dont think I am, just a diff handle.

THe whole premise of this thread is idiotic, b/c it was made by an idiot as far as I can tell by attempting to decipher it.

Hot nurse, crying he might be dying and know one kisses his booboo enough, she says he's stupid, he asks her out, she says his liver might be failing b/c he is bruising, he thinks she's actually referring to his liver, she's being cheeky saying, you dont get it dickhead, youre bruising b/c I am turning your meathead ass down for the date.
OH MY LIVER MY LIVER, must take supplements dumbass walks away thinking.

If you are in severe end stage liver disease, which Ive seen, and get DIC deep intravenous coagulapathy and look like you've got end stage ebola virus and bleed from your eyes, ears, anus pores etc... Then you have a liver problem, you got turned down and down again changing from the date question to you are an idiot and I can go out with you b/c the moon is going to crash into the earth and your liver is exploding.

And no, its not true that doctors dont know about anabolic steroids, they do, they just dont care much. They are trained in algorhythmic interpretation of symptoms, history of a bellcurve of a normal person. Outside of the normal bellcurve, ie those who choose a certain path, they dont judge, but certainly arent going to climb the himalayas to figure out what is wrong with someone introducing substances that have no evidence based medicine to rely upon to give proper medical advice. Ive got 2 guys in another room with s-t elevation infarcts (heart attacks) and I got some douchebag thinking he's got a pulmonary embolism 3 days after injecting oil into his delt and he's hitting on the nurse. Hmmm, let me triage this... idiot gets the boot

Now as far as LVH or left ventricular hypertrophy, I AM an expert on it and it is as varied as how many ways you can make a pizza. In general, it's an independent risk factor for early mortality and morbidity.
Its not proven why yet and there has been, at least for the last 15 years studying it, no conclusive scientific research to specifically isolate the mechanism.
But the speculation is pretty much coming to a consensus. That left ventricular hypertrophy, or a large heart muscle is like lifting weights for the heart. It is a sign that the heart has to pump against a higher "AFTERLOAD".
The afterload is high circulatory pressure which is a big culprit in stroke and heart attack as it is a sheer mechanical force against the arterial system walls causing them to either rupture or splinter. Plaque rupture is like a pimple bursting in the artery, you can find my analogy of this on EF for the past 10 years if you search it. It then exposes, let me back up, it's like a blister bursting, the endothelium (lining of the artery is breached) it then exposes the inner artery, the mesothelium to the blood flow and sends out alll these chemical messengers saying "IGOT a cut on my finger" and asks to be clotted off.
That's what happened to Stevesmi
A plaque rupture.

Now LVH is a sign of that process happening, a flare being sent up saying there is TOOO MUCH sheer mechanical force in the arterial system tree. But there are also other factors to consider like immflamation in the body, The fact that heart disease only affects 15% of the population (they dont tell you that in the media, 5 out of 6 people dont need to care about their cholesterol levels b/c only 1 out of 6 grow plaques in their arteries).

But sheer mechanical force in the arterial system is worse. IT causes end organ damage to every organ, brain (stroke), Kidneys (failure) etc...Its due to the fragile nature of the capillary exchange network present in every organ.

Now in terms of LVH and LVH eccentric vs concentric. I think there are 30 different genetic types of hypetrophic obstructive cardiomyopathies. And within each genetically afflicted there is a continuum of none present, mild, moderate, severe, critical.
There is no good or bad. Just have to be examined and followed up to see if it progresses. Make sure medications are correct, surgical options are available but would like to avoid it. Dont take steroids if you have LVH.
It goes away if it's not a genetic case, which most arent. Get your blood pressure as low as possible and if you ask about golgi berries I am going to reach through the computer screen and slap you.
An ACE inhibitor and HCTZ
if you are 1 out of 10 that gets a cough with an ACE use an ARB and HCTZ.

LVH can be life threatening in and of itself, it can cause the mitral valve to be sucked into the outflow tract of the aorta through the venturi effect (vacuum effect) and cause a person to pass out from lack of blood and certainly irritate the heart muscle itself to go into a fatal arrythmia. Seen it happen.
So if some douchebag shows up saying he thinks he killed himself by squirting some oil without aspirating and then during observation asks out a nurse. Well the diagnosis was probably correct. There's definitely something wrong with him but Im not a brain surgeon or a miracle worker. And lol at his liver.
Folks, 30% of india and china's by their own admissions and crackdowns are that the medications are bogus. there, 1 million people die a ywar from bogus malaria drugs.
Yes it sucks that people dont work for free, but come on, do you?

There is the Braunwald guide to heart disease, it's probably a 1000 pages in length, I cant remember anymore these days. I memorized it and that was just the first step in learning heart disease. That was just learning how to speak "french" so to speak.
I am not going to try and teach someone a foreign language in the half hour I have to gather their history symptoms and clinical data. If you were so keen on learning it, you'd have done so beforehand.

Brothabill's DunceCap Award goes to the Original Poster of this thread. And sure hopes his liver doesn't explode from his nurse's date rejection.
"Hey, wanna go to Chuck-E-Cheese?"
"Sorry- I would- I was a fitness model- I am so terribly attracted to guys like you... BUT your liver is going to explode so I'll have to pass I am afraid"
"Sit this one out"
"Look at the time I... Oh. my watch is gone, I got to go find my watch"
"Let me think about it, Id have to cancel a night of enemas so I am leaning towards a no"
"if your liver doesnt explode, my brain will"
"Its not you, it's me <I think you are a fucking moron and I only date morons"

 

[burnthiscorpse]

Re: Went 2 the Dr..guess what he told me...nothing compares..-- S. O'Connor song it a

Bravo^^^^^^^^

+ 10000000

Thread over.