SARMs S4 & SERMs Tamox - 1 Month Cycle Journal

[IMS4]

Baselines:
Guy #1
38 years old
5'8"
152lbs
9-10% bf
Fit endurance athlete
S4: 20mg
Tamox: 1ml

Guy #2
32 years old
6'
202lbs
15-18% bf
Strong & athletic
S4: 30mg
Tamox: 1ml

Goals: Get leaner & stronger - While these are very generic goals, neither of us have ever taken anything stronger than Hydroxycut in the past. We have researched hormone replacement clinics for test & hGH and scoured bodybuilding forum posts to find products that have promising results with little side effects. There is a ton of hype and a disproportionate amount of BS to actual real-world results, so for the next 30 days we will give a first-hand account of our progress with S4 and Tamox liquid.

Why S4 & Tamox? The goal was to use the SARMs and SERMs together to create a balance between raising test and lowering the risk of estrogen production. At $50/bottle the Tamox is very inexpensive and hopefully will boost testosterone production along with the S4.

Amounts: Why did we choose such a low dose? (S4: 20mg - 30mg, Tamox: 1ml) All the reviews we have read on S4 have ranged from 50mg - 150mg of S4, and at $200/bottle that's a $400/mo. cycle. Also, the night vision problems seem to happen for people taking over 100mg/day. We figured that any amount of S4 would be better than none at all, so to take low doses for the first cycle and see how we feel and then decide whether to take higher dosages when we place our next order.

Day 1: Received S4 & Tamox from CEM, S4 vial was even smaller than anticipated. The oral syringe seemed small & cheap. We'd read that the taste of S4 was akin to "fiberglass glue" and drinking orange or grapefruit juice was a good way to mask the flavor. The smell and taste of both the S4 AND the Tamox was exactly as described, yuck - like gargling with kerosene. A few sips of grapefruit juice and a stick of gum and it was ok after a few minutes.

Day 1 Workout: A full body cross-training with bodyweight exercises, kettle bells & medicine balls. No differences from our normal workout, no extra energy or pump. Nothing out of the ordinary at all - as expected. With this low dose, we expect it to be 4-5 days before we notice anything other than the model glue taste.

 

[lookinfit75]

Cool thread and I hope you have good results. I am interested in S4 myself and have just started to research it. Tamox is going to mess with you vision as well if you are susceptible to that type of problem so just be prepared. I have used it in P.C.T. for A.A.S. cycles in the past and can't really go past 20 mgs/ED or else the vision problems starts. Mainly just annoying auras..

 

[IMS4]

A couple notes on day 1: The doses were all taken at 11am (S4 20/30mg, Tamox 1ml) instead of splitting into multiple doses. The amount is so small that spitting it accurately with the little dropper provided by CEM would have been more difficult than necessary. Also, with these small doses it shouldn't matter in our systems. Early in the afternoon, Guy #2 noticed his cheeks were flush, and also seemed to feel like he had more energy. He didn't have any energy drinks or caffeine all day, so he found that a little odd. I haven't noticed anything, but have spent the afternoon staring at a computer screen and haven't thought about it. I always have energy and am known to do push-ups in my office from time to time... I guess I feel up to it right now.
Overall, a "good" day.

 

[IMS4]

Day 2: Same doses/same time. The taste wasn't as bad today; we found that a swig of grapefruit juice right before and right after taking the S4 and Tamox and a quick one after neutralizes the taste. There is a chemical (duh) aftertaste that stays with you for 10-15 min, and chewing a piece of gum will take care of that. No extra energy above the normal "high" amounts, still the occasional urge to do push-ups in the office.
Read somewhere that you are supposed to shake S4 vigorously before dosing, no directions on the package either way.

 

[IMS4]

Day 3, 4 & 5: The concoction appears to be working - but tastes like licorice mixed with gasoline. Since our dose is so small and we haven't seen any side effects, we decided not to take 1-2 days off like some folks do on a higher dose.
Guy 1 (endurance athlete): I felt great after a fast 7.5 mile run on Saturday and punishing 60 mile bike ride on Sunday. Monday, I pushed (2) full circuits of field workout (think football training camp) and added extra pull-ups, etc. I felt amazing. I'm also seeing a better pump with more dense muscle and vascularity. That's surprising considering my really small dose. 20mg S4, 1ml Tamox.
Guy 2: My arms feel slightly bigger and I was able to rip through my morning workout and still feel like I could do more. I had to back off so I didn't overdo it. 30mg S4, 1ml Tamox.

[NOTE] - Not sure if this is a something because of S4 or Tamox, but Guy #2 is ALWAYS hungry now. Can't seem to get enough food in the day. Anyone know about this?

[NOTE 2] - Guy #1 just ate Guy #2's avocado that was in his fridge. Apparently I am uncontrollably hungry too.

 

[lookinfit75]

If Tamox is tamoxifen then no, it will not cause hunger. It's a SERM so you might actually get moody, feel like shit, loose appetite, and over all be quite a pisser while using it lol. Good to see you are feeling the effects of the SARM's. I am monitoring another guy's experience with SARM's s4 and he had a very good cycle. His dose was way higher than yours though (started at 50mgs and ended at 150mgs) so it could be dose related.

 

[IMS4]

If Tamox is tamoxifen then no, it will not cause hunger. It's a SERM so you might actually get moody, feel like shit, loose appetite, and over all be quite a pisser while using it lol. Good to see you are feeling the effects of the SARM's. I am monitoring another guy's experience with SARM's s4 and he had a very good cycle. His dose was way higher than yours though (started at 50mgs and ended at 150mgs) so it could be dose related.

After this month I think the next cycle of S4 will be a 50mg dose for 3-4 weeks. I have no idea if the SERM is doing anything.

 

[lookinfit75]

I don't know much about SARM's yet but I don't see what the purpose of having it in your cycle would be. Maybe some further research on my part might help enighten me.
Keep up the blog

 

[IMS4]

Day 7 & 8; Dosage and time the same. (Guy #1) I feel a small amount stronger and hornier than I did a week ago. Strangely enough, if I were to put a number on how much more I feel of those things it would be equal to my dose: 20mg = 20% stronger & hornier. I've had more of a desire to work out with weights for my cross-train sessions, and have been putting up heavier weights and getting a better pump. I also seem to have (about 20%) more drive to push through each set. I feel strong on the bike and while running as well. I know I'm taking a very small dose, but I'm pretty content with the 20mg as a trial. In the past week I'm happy with the small results (but the taste still sucks).

 

[IMS4]

(Guy #1) Day 9: I found a pretty good method of eliminating the taste today; take a good sip of orange juice and shoot the S4 into the back of the tongue right before I swallow. (repeat for Tamox). No aftertaste! I looked in the mirror this morning after my shower and look a little bit more shredded... each day this seems to get better. I'm looking forward to a lunchtime workout and then a 10k run tonight.
I can also see why people start upping their dose of S4 once they start seeing results. Right now I can't afford another $200 for supps with all I have going on, so I'm sticking to the 20mg for the rest of the month. If I had plenty of cash I'd be doing 1ml/day easy.