Once a week frequency? Why?

[b fold the truth]

1. If the total weight lifted makes such a big difference in muscular growth and strength, then why am I (and SO MANY OTHERS) making such huge, fast gains in both size and strength? I only wish you participated in animal's board when the original thread was posted, there were lots of naturals who were gaining so fast that others thought they were on gear. I put on 40 lbs of muscle this year, and that's with wasted months of improper focus/diet/training.

2. We're not talking about beginners here. I'm not sure how this came about. A beginner should learn proper form before doing ANY routine.

3.

See #4 on my reply to needsize.

I'm not sure if I have anything else to say to you again. You either did not read my post or you could not understand it. You should...a lot.

In the same post where you say that you are not talking about beginners...you also include yourself when you talk about how you have gained so much on this...lol. How long have you been training again?

Go back and read my post...a few times.

I saw your #4 post to Needsize and I do believe I see where you said that the DC routine would provide the FASTEST gains in another post prior to that one.

Change your attitude...or leave (haven't I told you this before????)

B True

 

[IronLion]

I put on 40 lbs of muscle this year, and that's with wasted months of improper focus/diet/training.

You put on 40 pounds of muscle all natural after years of training? Ok that is horseshit....sorry but it is....and just for the record if you are going to talk nonstop about the effectiveness of a routine shouldn't you have some kind of stats? You must be what 275 pounds? 300? You can press double bodyweight right? Squat triple? I mean there are a lot of people who have used volume training and all sorts of other methods to achieve those type of stats.....

 

[Debaser]

I've trained for a little over a year now. B fold that is insulting, quite frankly. My form is nearly flawless. You say it's impossible ironlion? Go here.

I do believe I see where you said that the DC routine would provide the FASTEST gains in another post prior to that one.

Really? Because I don't.

Change your attitude...or leave (haven't I told you this before????)

Utter bullshit. Biased too. Laterninus started stirring up shit on my thread, and needsize fueled it with arrogant, misinformed comments. DC rarely comes here anymore because of that crap. He also had this to say:

Of all the boards I read, this is the only one I can say after almost 2 years now of my methods that people still come on here and say "it will only work for a little bit of time"-"it wont work"-etc etc etc. Please let me know when it will stop working as I would like to prepare ahead of time (thanks)--Im not trying to toot my own horn here but how many guys have to say "my strength is going up by leaps and bounds" "i gained 25lbs in 3 months" --post their before and after pictures (theirs four guys alone on muscle mayhem) before people will start getting the clue that it is working and working for almost every single person trying it. But this is pretty much the only board where I see that kind of response. Do I want someone to follow my methods blindly or not question why something is done? No I want you to make an educated decision. But to say something "wont work" when youve never tried it and disregarding the masses who are saying it does work makes the poster look like an idiot. Hearing things like Guldakat having 1 inch more on his arms and other testimonials make me happy as hell--thats basically why I came to the point of typing out my methods--I like to help people who might be kind of stuck in a rut. I truly dont want my methods to become the norm--I want it to be exclusive--an exclusive club of people who said "fuck off" to the normal TREND of thought that the brainwashed masses follow pertaining to training for the last 30 years and decided to try something new. The very same routines the last 30 years that only the genetically elite seem to have great gains with. I want this because i want the distinct differerence between "them" and "DC"---I want that guy who has been lifting at Guldakats gym for a long time to wonder what the hell Guldakat is doing because that guy has been following the Flex magazine routines for years and still looks the same as he did 4 years ago while Guld has changed pretty dramatically over the last 5 months. Id like DC to be known as the "dirty little secret" that people who never read bodybuilding boards --will never know about.

 

[IronLion]

I've trained for a little over a year now. B fold that is insulting, quite frankly. My form is nearly flawless. You say it's impossible ironlion? Go here.

Hey, let me know when you have been training for 4 years and are still making great gains on the strict DC program.

BTW some of us have goals other than pure aesthetics, and I can flat out say that DC's program is a piss poor program for a performance athlete. So remember that when you are trying to beat it's merit into us......

 

[sk*]

Anyone care to stop the pissing contest? lol...I'll try. If people want to piss for distance...I highly doubt that you are going to find anyone who can match me body for body, strength for strength, body weight for body weight, and agility for agility... To add to that...I don't train DC, HST, Weider Principles, OL, or strict WSB. I take a little of everything (MOSTLY WSB) and make it my own.

One of the big KEYS to progressive strength training (what we all do) is finding the right combination between intensity and volume. You can't have 100 percent intensity with 100 percent volume. You also can't have 10 percent intensity with 10 percent volume and expect the best gains. Finding it somewhere in the middle is the key. Sure, it varies a bit, but there IS a standard somewhere.

DC training takes it to an extreme of the variation. A trainee uses 100 percent intensity with 10 percent volume (or so, hopefully you get the point). It is an extreme of a theory... It has been put into place for many and I have used training principles VERY similar to them over the years with very limited success. The gains would be good for 3-4 weeks maximum then they would stall or actually work towards the negative.

There is a reason why people 'increase the volume' in their workouts. Simply, because it works. You can't increase the volume to an extreme amount (obviously, and people are taking it to the extreme...especially for 'arguments' sake...) but it does make a difference.

When a strength contest comes nearer...one starts to bring up the volume on their hams, erectors, glutes, triceps, abs, rotators, lats, etc... Of course...the last week they use ZERO volume to let their body recover and be completely ready for the contest.

One of the biggest problems with the DC method is that the volume is so low that the amount of weight lifted is VERY low (yes, it DOES make a big difference in muscular growth, recruitmen, and strength gains). When powerlifters start to go from doing 6 sets of 8 to tapering down (over 10-14 weeks) to doing 2 sets of 2 or even singles....the amount of weight or volume per workout is so low that they actually start to digress in their strength even though they are pushing heavier weights.

The second major problem I see with the DC program is that if you have an issue with form on a certain exercise...you only get basically ONE set to fix it per week. You also have one balls to the wall set that you can really screw yourself with (serious injury). A beginner has NO BUSINESS doing this type of routine simply for that reason. A beginner would greatly benefit from doing one of Cornholio's routine where you are performing the big lifts on a bi/tri-weekly basis and you have a lot of opportunity to perfect the lifts.

Debasser, please refrain from EVER saying that DC will produce the FASTEST results or that it is the BEST....EVER again!!! That kind of statement has no business here. Trust me...I know. I got into it with Cornholio over a year ago and it nearly ruined the relationship between the two of us (he is one of the nicest persons you can ever meet). We both made remarks to each other similar to these, it got personal, and he left for a long time. Do NOT run anyone off with your attitude!!!

B True

Good post bfold.

In DC's defense though, you only go "balls to wall" for 4weeks and take it easy for 2weeks.

The program works, that's for sure, but you can't just say it's the best as that is ignorant.

Simply for strength gains, volume works much better for me.

-sk

 

[pwr_machine]

Anyone care to stop the pissing contest? lol...I'll try. If people want to piss for distance...I highly doubt that you are going to find anyone who can match me body for body, strength for strength, body weight for body weight, and agility for agility... To add to that...I don't train DC, HST, Weider Principles, OL, or strict WSB. I take a little of everything (MOSTLY WSB) and make it my own.

I've got just the person that will take the challenge. You up for it? I think she'll give you a run for your money. j/k Actually, I bet the two of you share very similiar training principles.

 

[Debaser]

Hey, let me know when you have been training for 4 years and are still making great gains on the strict DC program.

BTW some of us have goals other than pure aesthetics, and I can flat out say that DC's program is a piss poor program for a performance athlete. So remember that when you are trying to beat it's merit into us......

Everyone else has, I don't see how I would be any different. Like DC said, please let him know when it'll stop working so he can prepare in advance.

And this thread is about hypertrophy. I never claimed anything else. Though your strength will go up a lot as well (hell that's how DC works). The stronger you get the bigger you get, and there are definately monsters that do DC training (that are both huge and brutally strong).

 

[needsize]

Debaser, i cant believe you call my comments arrogant. I did not, at any point put down any training system or say that one was better or more effective than another. But you continually do that, about pretty much any approach that isnt DC. Thats arrogance, which is compounded by the fact that you've been training for only a year, but yet you come here and preach. Thats a newbie bro, and a newbie should be able to make great gains on ANY of the training systems listed in this forum.

The funny thing is that we have a great forum here where flames pretty much never happen. But every thread I've ever seen you post on has turned into a flame fest. Why is that??? Because your attitude sucks, and you continually try to force feed your gospel down other peoples throats. No one else in this forum does that, despite the fact that most of this forum has more training experience than you; hell, there are many people on here that have decades more experience than you. But yet you, with ALL your experience and knowlege, continually tell us we should be training more effectively, like you are.

For the third time, I have tried every training system out there, including ones that were VERY similar to DC, and HST; 12 years of training gives you the time to do these things. And while those systems were an effective part of my periodization, I did not find them more effective than other ones that I have used. So how about you get your mouth off of DC's nuts for just a minute, and lose the attitude. Intelligent debate is welcome in this forum, but you have been told by more than one member that your holier than thou attitude is not!!!

 

[overhead]

First off I am not an expert, I have only been training for 19 months , so I am not going to jump into the middle of this rather heated discussion with my opinions on training .But I do have a question.
I am not training to become a body builder, and I do not plan on becoming a power lifter anytime in the near future. I lift because I like it, I like getting stronger and I also like getting bigger. For the past 7 weeks I have been following a DC style program, not following it to the letter, I throw in some DE work for bench and squats because I think my lack explosivness(is that even a word?) on those lifts is my weak point. I was planning on following the low volume routine for 3 months, than switching to more of a power lifting type program (west side etc) for three months and continue three month rotations. It would seem that most programs switch between low volume and high volume more frequently than that. In your opinion would it be more effective for me to follow a program that included lower and higher volume work more frequently? Or will a longer rotation allow for both strenth and size gains at a similar rate?

 

[Debaser]

The funny thing is that we have a great forum here where flames pretty much never happen. But every thread I've ever seen you post on has turned into a flame fest. Why is that??? Because your attitude sucks, and you continually try to force feed your gospel down other peoples throats. No one else in this forum does that, despite the fact that most of this forum has more training experience than you; hell, there are many people on here that have decades more experience than you. But yet you, with ALL your experience and knowlege, continually tell us we should be training more effectively, like you are.

You're thinking about how I was months ago. Maybe if you looked at my posts you'll see that I don't do that anymore. Need I remind you, there were NO flames until laternius and you came around. And I didn't start anything. I'm not even doing DC training right now, I'm starting to think you're just a jackass. All I have to do is mention DC training, and you come on here thinking that I'm flaming everyone. You're just biased too. I pissed you off a few months back and you think that I still want to flame lots of people. I started this thread for casual debate, but to you this is unacceptable. I'm not trying to debate, I'm trying to force feed DC down everyone's throat (even though I am discussing a CONCEPT, not a specific routine).

It's VERY convenient for you to say that you tried programs similar to DC and HST, with no other information, and you simply say that they were not very effective. What are the details? What exactly was your routine? I seriously doubt it was that similar to HST, it's not exactly an intuitive program.

You keep calling me a newbie that could make gains on any program, that doesn't change the fact that I'm making them much faster than others. I don't know ONE trainee that put on 40 lbs of muscle their first year. It's easy for you to talk about how great your gains are on your program, but exactly how much of those gains were natural?