Protein intake on cycle during bulk

[LostCauze]

Hey guys,
Okay so I know this topic has been around a lot but it never hurts to get some fresh perspectives.

I know there a lot of guys out there who swear to 2g+ protein per lb bodyweight while on cycle. They say this because steroids increase muscle protein synthesis.

My question is, do you think this is really necessary? I've seen thread after thread where a guy is consuming a certain amount of protein carbs and fats daily and he isn't seeing the progress he wants then people say to up protein to 2g-3g per lb of body weight. Then these guys start seeing results. But is it really from the protein or more so the increase in calories? (They kept all other macros the same and just added protein which results in additional calories)

Example:
200 lb man
Maintenance macros (1g pro per lb)
200 protein 420g carb 90g fat.

Now we add in 500 calories for bulking. We're going to leave fat the same (.45g per lb)

*1g protein per lb bulk macros
200g pro 545g carb 90g fat

*2g protein per lb bulk macros
400g pro 345g carb 90g fat

*3g protein per lb bulk macros
600g pro 145g carb 90g fat

So to give some perspective all calories are identical for our 200lb man on a 500 calorie surplus bulking diet.

Do you think the gains in lean muscle mass will be different while running a steroid cycle?


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[LostCauze]

Anyone have any input?

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[RickRock13]

There are a lot of variables that make this very hard to answer, and there are a ton of opinions and theories on this. For me personally, I have never been at 2g per pound of bodyweight on protein on cycle or off. I try to get 1.5g per pound whether I'm running a cycle or not, which for me is around 300g per day. I've had excellent results with this. Even with a higher rate of protein synthesis, your body can still only use so much protein per day. I personally think those that add in extra protein and see better gains, is because of the higher total caloric content, and not necessarily the protein exclusively. Another thing to consider is the kidney strain associated with very high levels of protein.

 

[joonp]

I watched a george farah and kai greene seminar and they discussed the same thing. Basically he said 1.5-2.5 g per lb is all u need. If u start going over this ur gonna run the risk of kidney dialysis later on due to the strain on ur kidneys. He said carbs are looked at as evil but are in fact ur friend. He was promoting more carb intake. That doesnt mean go overboard or eat as many carbs as u want. Check it out on you tube
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[RickRock13]

I watched a george farah and kai greene seminar and they discussed the same thing. Basically he said 1.5-2.5 g per lb is all u need. If u start going over this ur gonna run the risk of kidney dialysis later on due to the strain on ur kidneys. He said carbs are looked at as evil but are in fact ur friend. He was promoting more carb intake. That doesnt mean go overboard or eat as many carbs as u want. Check it out on you tube
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I've seen that video, and I've watched a lot of videos on George Farah's principles. A lot of my diet strategies were influenced by Farah's methods. I also try to push carbs higher with very low fat and protein intake around 1.5g per pound. Works like a charm for me

 

[LostCauze]

See what has me confused is yes steroids increase muscle protein synthesis. But so does eating protein, working out, and even consuming certain bcaa. These things provide a greater difference between breakdown and building which is where muscle is formed. Now in a natty lifter recent science had pretty much verified .8-1g per lb is all that is needed to build muscle. Even when consuming much more protein, if calories are equal then there was zero difference in total muscle built even if short term MPS(24hr) was elevated.
Also there are studies where people used bcaa which elevated MPS vs people who didn't use bcaa, they trained the same and diet was virtually identical and there was no difference in the long term muscle growth.

So to me looking at this data and seeing the results leads me to believe that crazy amounts of protein are almost unnecessary. I stick to 1g natty bulking and through trial and error I've found 1.2g per lb while cutting (on or off). I can see where steroids could allow more protein to be utilized because it's a superficial amount of hormone. But I don't know if anything over 1.5 is just a waste and the calories could be better utilized as carbs.

Thinking about doing my next run 1/2 of the cycle at 1g per lb the other half at 2g per lb (sub carbs respectively) and seeing if there is much of a difference if any.

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[LostCauze]

Bump

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[LostCauze]

has anyone had any experience while on cycle changing their protein intake/carb intake and maintaining equal calories??
If so was there a noticeable difference?

 

[1989et]

While on cycle yet only have done one and it was amazing.im not a bodybuilder but i lift for mma and physique.i was trying to get as much protein i could every hour and half.yes ima newbie and have been reading up on this site its great.

 

[Francofranco]

For me it all depended on my daily schedule how much I needed to eat. Though I can say that total calories and carbs were what seemed to fuel me better and help achieve better results. When i was young I read a book endorsed by "the oak" and he laid out a meal plan...To mimic his meals I ate and ate and ate plenty carbs plenty calories fair mount of protein to say the least, and since I have many times reverted back to those simple beginnings. Since I've tried pushing the limits on protein intake to influence my results as an athlete and in my experience results were fair not great...But reverting back to my youth, even though now I am more conscious about my diet and will set parameters for that diet, the rule still seems to apply for me at least.