My First Shirt from Karins arrived today

[JDarty6173]

Well about 30 minutes before heading to the gym UPS arrived with my Karins Double Denim Bench Shirt... And what a coincidence, today just happened to be my ME bench day and had Reverse Band Presses Planned... Well I get to they gym a little early and try the shirt on to see how it feels.. And man this thing was stiff... I also noticed that the seams on the side of the chest looked closer together that pics I have seen of these shirts.. But hey, I've never used a shirt before so I really didn't know what to expect... This shirt was ordered so that it would take around 470 to touch...Well my crew arrives and I decide to spray the shirt down with some water before I get around to using it a few sets in, and since it felt so ungodly stiff I really soaked it on the seams and across the chest...

Well I get to my last shirtless set and hit 460 for a PR... Then I shirt up, keeping the collar high and spraying a little more water here and there... So I load up 500 on the reverse band and get under it and needless to say i didnt feel comfortable in the shirt..But oh well, I knew I would have to get used to it...

Well it felt good when I unracked it, but then all hell broke loose.
About 3 Inches down I found myself fighting to pull the bar down...But to no avail...the bar came to a complete stop MAYBE halfway down, probably about 1/3 the way actually...So my spotters went ahead and grabbed it...Then I tried the same again with the same result....

Well the pain I felt during the lift was horrible...My tris are bruised to hell and back.. I honestly don't see how it would be possible to bring any amount of weight down to my chest..And if it did I'm almost certain my arms would be severed at the shoulders or the shirt would explode...

So now I guess I'll be calling Karins Back tomorrow about some alterations...Or I might try a couple more reps with it on my DE day first...Good news is it fits well in the arms and shoulders...It just appears that the chest area is too narrow....Anyone have any words of wisdom for me on geting weight to touch, or is it definitly just too tight? Also, I was trying to bring the bar as low on my abs as I could with a wide grip with index just inside rings and elbows tucked hard and tight.. Unfortunatly I never got the bar low enought to feel the groove of the shirt....

 

[Deciever]

im not an expect, but something that i think

You said it would take around 470 to touch. And you also said you went for a reverse band press w/ 500. so wouldnt the bands take off too much so it wouldnt touch??

 

[Hannibal]

im not an expect, but something that i think

You said it would take around 470 to touch. And you also said you went for a reverse band press w/ 500. so wouldnt the bands take off too much so it wouldnt touch??

That would be my take on the situation....given that scenario I wouldnt expect the 5 to touch either. I would try it without the bands before I sent it back.

 

[JDarty6173]

Yeah I thought about the bands being the problem, but I was only able to bring the bar down about 6 inches so most of the 500 was still there considering that I have very long arms...I had one of my guys measure my bar distance at lockout and at full lockout the bar is about 21 inches off my upper abs ... I was using blue bands set so that it took 135 to touch my chest... But considering it was reverse band, that is the reason I'm thinking about testing it again on DE day monday...But if I get a weight to touch it feels like I'll be cut into on either side....But then again this may just be part of the break-in process...But I will definitly be slapping some duct tape on the back of my tris next time...

 

[Deciever]

damn you have a long bench s troke.. mine is usually about 18 "

 

[JDarty6173]

Yeah Deceiver the long bench stroke sucks bad for benching, but should work out pretty well for deadlifting...Right now I can Pull 600 both Sumo and conventional raw...The only problem is my grip...I've trained BB style for 5 years using straps, so I really need to bring my grip up..

Hannibal, that what I was thinkin....It didn't feel like 500 would even come close to touching, but i will try it without bands before calling about alterations...And in the mean time I really see the need for some extra tricep strength...

 

[Hannibal]

Hannibal, that what I was thinkin....It didn't feel like 500 would even come close to touching, but i will try it without bands before calling about alterations...And in the mean time I really see the need for some extra tricep strength...

21"??! I can't imagine. I mean I am 6'2" with relatively long arms, and my stroke is about half that. Without actually seeing you bench I would think that there had to be a way to reduce that distance somehow...unless you are 7' tall.

I would definitely try the shirt again without the bands. In the meantime train the triceps...perhaps you can meet the shirt half way so to speak.

 

[JDarty6173]

Hannibal, I just measured My wingspan from fingertip to fingertip with arms fully extended out to my sides and it came to about 76 inches or 6ft 4 in and I am Just slightly over 6ft tall.. the measurement of my stroke was with a medium grip not a wide competition grip...But if you'll notice Deceiver's stroke is just a couple inches under mine will probably be even greater than mine in a year or two at his age...But I have been working on decreasing my stroke distance further, so hopefully I'll be successful there...

I think on Monday after speed bench I'll just keep loading up the bar until I can find what will touch...It may be way over what I can lock out, but hey, thats what spotters are for right...And it will give me some measure of what alterations might be necessary... If I can get 525 or less to touch I'll probably just keep it as it is and use it once I have the strength for it and just purchase a second shirt, possibly a Titan Fury.. Afterall, I really don't know what all federations I might decide to compete in, so I'll probably need a good Poly at some point..

 

[Deciever]

about my bench stroke, my grip is narrow (pinky inside the rings) so thats why my stroke is so long. Once i get used to a wider grip, the arching, tucking the shoulder blades, i should be down to around 10-12 inches... hopefully i'll have that down in a few weeks.

 

[JDarty6173]

Deceiver, that sounds like my bench.. I usually go with Pinkys about 1 or 2 fingerwidths inside the rings...But I definitly will be working on getting the stroke down some...I have been benching BB elbows out style for over 5 years up until 7 weeks ago when I started training Westside.. I have almost no arch and what i consider poor form on tucking my shoulder blades.. Maybe eventually I'll attend a Westside Seminar and see if Dave himself can straighten me out some...

 

[benchmonster]

Jdarty

You absolutely must go to a max legal grip width when wearing a shirt. If you go narrower, it will take way too much to touch. I can wear a shirt that takes 530 to touch and by moving my grip in a few inches, it could take well over 600 to touch. And I ain't hoss enough to press up that much, yet.

try it again with a wide grip, and it may help getting it down. You may just have too much shirt, but I would try it with a wider grip before sending it back in.

also, make sure you pinch your shoulder blades together as much as possible too. The more you pull those shoulder joints away from the bar, the shorter the stroke will be.

B.

 

[powerlifterjay]

The idea of pulling weight down is crazy at first. I have to do it. If you got the tri power for 500 plus then that is gonna be your new weight. Forget the bands. You had 400 at the bottom of that. to get used to the shirt do this

week 1 shirt with 4 brd. If its to easy go 3 brd. Learn to pull to the 3 brd. When comforatble go to the 2 brd

week2 2brd with shirt

week3 1 brd or no board. But stay on that board till you get it down evey time. Then down one.

I used this for my last trainnig cycle for my meet and it worked ok. Try it.

 

[Hannibal]

Good Post Jay. I remember the first time I put on a shirt...having to PULL the weight down seemed crazy. I used the same board progression and it worked well.

 

[JDarty6173]

Ok guys great.. So it looks like I'll start the board progression for the next 3 ME days or so... Along with starting to use a max legal width grip with it... I think I'll spend a day this weekend at the gym just trying to work on decreasing my stroke by practicing pinching my shoulder blades correctly and adjusting to a wider grip, then maybe take a couple heavy reps with the shirt on DE day Monday..

PLJ and Hannibal, I definitly see what you mean about pulling weight down, it just seemed unnatural....But oh well, I'll just have to get used to it...One thing, is it supposed to feel like the shirt is going to cut you in half at your pits?

 

[Hannibal]

One thing, is it supposed to feel like the shirt is going to cut you in half at your pits?

YES

 

[JDarty6173]

LOL....yeah I kinda figured as much

 

[VDizenzo]

JDarty6173,
My shirt from Karin has never felt like it was going to cut me in half at the pits. It could be too tight. I can put my shirt on completely by myself, it is a good test for seeing if the shirt is too tight. O.K. now, here is my advice: never use reverse band with the shirt, do not use boards with the shirt, with your height you must be at maximum legal grip width, your elbows must be tucked down to bench in Karin's shirt, the weight needs to touch at your stomach, not at your chest or sternum, you need to work on your arch (Get on your knees, sit your butt on your feet and start leaning backwards with your hands over your head. Eventually your hands will touch the ground, when they do start pushing them into the floor and create a larger bridge in your back). Pinch your shoulders behind you down into your lats, do not pinch them up around your neck. Make sure your back is dry so when you bench you don't slide out of your shoulder pinch and arch (it always looks funny, but my handlers fan my back with a towel between lifts when I am wearing my shirt). When you are holding the bar, imagine that you are trying to rip it in half, this will ensure that your grip is tight and that you can pull the weight down if you need to. After taking in your air make sure to push out on your stomach, this will reduce your range of motion and push the shirt into the belt so that it will not move. Lastly, do reverse band pulldowns (not with your shirt). Set your power rack up just like you are going to do reverse band bench just do not add any weight. Make sure you set up exactly how you are going to bench and pull the bar low to your stomach and hold it for a second. Do not jerk the bar down. This will teach you the shirt groove and also show you how to pull weight in and push on your stomach if necessary. Most importantly it will incorporate your lats. Benching in an open back denim requires good lat strength so make sure to work them well. Good luck.

 

[VDizenzo]

Damnit, I forgot to mention the most important part of learning how to use your shirt. Do reps. Even if your first rep does not touch do more because on you following reps the bar will come down with more speed. Don't worry about taking more air in at the top, just let the bar come right back down. I am not saying you need to throw caution to the wind, but you do need to be aggressive to get weight into the hole. Never complain about not being able to touch weight, that is why you bought the shirt. It is very strong and that is what you want. You simply need to learn how to make the shirt work for you. Fortunately Karin's shirts are very lifter friendly. By working with my shirt every week I have learned how to touch as little as 500lbs. yet manipulate the shirt so that 700lbs. barely touches.

 

[Hannibal]

This was posted by Bob Youngs on Dave Tate's website...

I do all shirt work with a full ROM. Keep in mind that the "full" means as far as the shirt will allow the bar to come down. I use only my comp grip which is index finger on the line. We bascially use two different shirt workouts down here. The last shirt workout before the meet is done by going up to your planned opener for 2-3 singles.

The workout we use most often is much different. Our goal for the day is to get 10 singles done in the shirt. We also put the shirts on on this day much earlier. We are doing a shirt day this weekend and my plan is:
barx3
95x3
135x3
185x1
225x1
275x1
Put shirt on from here on:
315x 2 singles
365x 2 singles
405x 2 singles
425x1
445x1
465x1
485x1 (opener)

I don't really care if any of these touch or not. We are focusing on making sure the bar is where it needs to be.

 

[JDarty6173]

Thanks V, Looks like I really have a lot to work on as far as my arch and shoulder blade tuck, I have been tucking them up into my traps up till now...Hannibal, I like the Shirt day workout you outlined there...I might try that same one on my next ME day Thursday...

I had no trouble getting the shirt on by myself, only takes a few seconds..

 

[JDarty6173]

Well I tried my shirt again for the second time on Thursdays ME Bench day.. I hit 3 Board Presses up to 405x1 without shirt first...Then I shirted up just to see what I could make touch...Well I loaded 485 first....Well It was if I hti a brick wall 8 inches off my chest...I pulled on it to see if I could get it any further, but all that did was cause it to dump back towards my face.... Well after my workout I called Karins, told her the situation and all the specifics...She went over each measurement in detail to try and find where the problem is...Well it turns out that when my workout partner was taking my measurements, he goofed on on...Since the chest circumference is taken at the nipple line he also too the chest width measurement at the nipple line...When actually it should have been taken half way between the nipple line and my collar bone from arm pit to arm pit...Well on me this turns out to be almost a 6 inch difference in the measurement...So she laughingly told me that I would be very lucky to get anything under 700 to touch...Wow, talking about jumping the gun on my progress here LOL....I was only wanting to get 470-480 to touch....

Oh well, so back it goes for alterations, giving the nasty cuts n bruises from the shirt time to heal....

 

[bigokie]

Well I know what you guys are talking about. But I think if your stroke is that long you really need to work on it. I'm 6'5" tall with long arms for my heighth. Here's what I did to work on it. I went thumbless for one, and now my thumbs touch the line. Then I really pinch my back together, now together instead of up into traps thanks to VDizenzo. It makes a world of difference. I now move the bar probably 10 or so inches compared to closer to 20. It will really cut your stroke down. I'm gonna be getting a Karins shirt soon and will hopefully be able to use it good. Later

 

[JDarty6173]

bigokie. VDizenzo also gave me the same advise on pulling my shoulder blades together instead of into my trap...I tried this on Thursdays ME 3 Board Presses, but I really had a hard time with it...Even just sitting here trying to do it seems difficult to squeeze them together without going up into my traps... And when I do I feel like I'm in a weaker position...Guess its just because its different...But I can tell that it shortens my stroke....

One thing bigokie... What kind of difference did you notice form going to a thumbless grip? Easier to tuck elbows? Shorter stroke? Or what?