What constitutes overtraining

[bigp3]

I always wondered how those guys in prison got so big. I'm sure they weren't drinking 8 scoops of protein mega mass in a shake every day with steak and chicken whenever they want it.
I think those guys get big in prison because of that frequency. I mean shit, if you were in prison, wouldn't you lift 7 days a week? what the fuck would you do on your off day if you were to take one, play scrabble with your cell mate?
So my question is, why am I so hesitant to try these new methods? It's not like I'm huge at 5'9" 173lbs after years of on and off lifting.
Overall, I think the key is consistency. going to the gym day in and day out and staying on top of your dieting/rest. Low intensity, high volume, either way at the gym you'll grow if you go. question is, which method will you grow more from?

Good thought on this one. A buddy of mine is a prison guard and he says that they usually limit the guys to one hour of lifting per day. Granted this is a max security federal prison and not the county jail. I think what this does is limit the amount of time these guys have to lift which forces them not to overtrain. In addition to this,,, the train with more frequency since they have nothing better to do. I would also bet these guys train with high intensity as well since the majority of people that are federal inmates are extremely aggressive. So what does this add up to? High intensity, high frequency and low volume by force.

 

[bigp3]

another thought on the prison guys,,,, how much cardio do you think they are doing,,,, I bet none and more than likely the spend most of there day just sitting around doing nothg.... this = recovery

 

[Bulldog_10]

Bulldog, I think you're confused as to what gains muscle, as are 95% of weight trainees.

So many people think it is "mixing it up" because your body "constantly adapts" and needs "new stimulus" to continue growth. BULLSHIT. I've said it millions of times:

PROGRESSIVE POUNDAGES IS WHAT BUILDS MUSCLE.

If you squat 100 lbs now and in a few years you squat 500 lbs, you will be completely transformed. If you "mix it up" and change your routine every month then in a few years you'll probably be squatting 150-200 lbs, and won't have changed much. Periodization in the sense that most people describe, is a bunch of horseshit. It's a new spin on the same tired old high volume split routines that most trainees give up on. Go ahead and listen to Poliquin. But first, name one hardcore bodybuilder that he has produced.

So you don't make progress by periodizing your workouts?

When you perdiodize, you lift very heavy, very low volume for 4 weeks, then you drop the intensity a bit and raise the volume a bit. Until you're lifting with relatively low intensity and high volume (8-12 rep sets). Then you start the whole thing over...the next time with higher weights.

And of course, if you squat 100 pounds now, and 500 later, you'll be bigger. But your body can't go on just adding weight workout after workout. It needs a break. I think the best, safest way to get to that 500 pounds is by working your body in different ways.

And if you want to just go ahead and keep tossing the poundages up, go for it. But it will lead to injury and burnout.

And one thing I don't get about this training program you think is so great: Are you lifting at the highest possible intensity for 8-12 reps? Because that seems pretty contradictory to me.

And no, poliquin doesn't train hardcore bodybuilders...but I'll bet my life that most of the guys he trains look alot better than most of the "hardcore bodybuilders" you know...and they can actually use their bodies for alot more than squatting 500 pounds.

 

[bigp3]

I only know one way to do things and that is balls to the wall,,, whether it is business, training or whatever. Too many people half ass their way through life. I know I only have a short time here on this earth and I want to make the most of it.

 

[babbabuee]

I'm with you on the balls out bigp. good point too about the rest and lack of cardio for the inmates. I'm seriously interested in this HIT (or whatever you call it) training. I'm going to do a cycle in a couple of months, so I thought I could try this different approach for two months and see what happens.

 

[bigp3]

all I can say is that since I have lowered the volume of my training my gains have increased at a dramatic rate. I cant wait to start working with DC in a month or so.

 

[sk*]

Your body adapts to your routine after about 4 weeks, so why not go 4 weeks balls to the wall, then cruise for a week, then start over? That's basically what I do, except I do it in different levels...it's not just balls to the wall and cruise.

What goes on during the cruising phase? Low intensity and low volume? Active recovery?

If you read DC's original posts on A's board you will see that he suggests 4 "balls to wall" and 2 "cruise weeks."

-sk

 

[bigp3]

amen

 

[Debaser]

But your body can't go on just adding weight workout after workout. It needs a break.

I don't consider adding volume a break. One of the best ways to add weight is intensity cycling. We'll use squats as an example...

An example training cycle for the 20 rep squat. Let's say your 5RM is 300 lbs:

Session 1: 240 lbs (80% Max)
Session 2: 255 lbs (85%)
Session 3: 270 lbs (90%)
Session 4: 285 lbs (95%)
Session 5: 300 lbs (100%) Though this might not feel like 100% effort anymore.
Session 6: 310 lbs, you give it your all and your squat is up 10 lbs
Session 7: 315 lbs you're working pretty damn hard at this point
Session 8: 320 lbs still moving like a freight train
Session 9: 325 lbs incredibly tough, feeling form starting to waver

Now it would be ridiculous to start adding volume, what you can do if you have them is break out the little plates. DC training accomplishes the same goal by alternating exercises, but let's stick with this option for example...

Session 10: 327 lbs form remained good
11: 330 lbs doing great

And so on for a few more weeks, hitting PRs and adding weight every single time. Eventually, let's say session 14 You give it your all and just cannot add weight or reps. Then you simply start the cycle over. People vary where they start, but it's generally 70-85% of their max. You can very much train for the rest of your life in this manner. If you hit walls that are seemingly impossible to overcome, it's time to start focusing on the weak link in the chain of a compound movement, not adding volume, changing your entire workout around. That will completely disrupt your focus and make linear progress difficult if not impossible.

 

[bigp3]

I don't consider adding volume a break. One of the best ways to add weight is intensity cycling. We'll use squats as an example...

An example training cycle for the 20 rep squat. Let's say your 5RM is 300 lbs:

Session 1: 240 lbs (80% Max)
Session 2: 255 lbs (85%)
Session 3: 270 lbs (90%)
Session 4: 285 lbs (95%)
Session 5: 300 lbs (100%) Though this might not feel like 100% effort anymore.
Session 6: 310 lbs, you give it your all and your squat is up 10 lbs
Session 7: 315 lbs you're working pretty damn hard at this point
Session 8: 320 lbs still moving like a freight train
Session 9: 325 lbs incredibly tough, feeling form starting to waver

Now it would be ridiculous to start adding volume, what you can do if you have them is break out the little plates. DC training accomplishes the same goal by alternating exercises, but let's stick with this option for example...

Session 10: 327 lbs form remained good
11: 330 lbs doing great

And so on for a few more weeks, hitting PRs and adding weight every single time. Eventually, let's say session 14 You give it your all and just cannot add weight or reps. Then you simply start the cycle over. People vary where they start, but it's generally 70-85% of their max. You can very much train for the rest of your life in this manner. If you hit walls that are seemingly impossible to overcome, it's time to start focusing on the weak link in the chain of a compound movement, not adding volume, changing your entire workout around. That will completely disrupt your focus and make linear progress difficult if not impossible.

could not have said it better myself