Stop Recommending Testosterone To Newbies!

[HAYEZ]

dbol was used by itself so many times in the old school days, and those guys were Jizzacked!

People saying oral onlys suck is lame.

eating dbol every day is not a steroid cycle

 

[rediculus]

OK

So recommending test should be based off their desired end results? Willingness to pin or desire to stay safe.. From what I am being told the legal over the counter Prohormones can be as dangerous as Test?

 

[khemix]

OK

So recommending test should be based off their desired end results? Willingness to pin or desire to stay safe.. From what I am being told the legal over the counter Prohormones can be as dangerous as Test?

Desired end result and fear of adverse reaction. I personally cant name one single person that has had a majorly diverse reaction to 300mg of test.

I wouldn't say dangerous...but they can give very similar side effects, with much less of a result. This includes bloat (water retention), elevated liver values, mild acne and sometimes gyno.

 

[the_alcatraz]

See? A lousy 100mgs of HRT and I'm pissed at everybody! : )

lol

 

[the_alcatraz]

I typically really appreciate the variety that Nelly gives us here, though sometimes he can be a bit off base.

Its been a baseline fact around elite, even before Nelson was around, that a simple test cycle is more than enough for a firstie. Keep it simple, remember?? Instead, noobs that dont take the time to read through all 15 pages of this thread and cypher out the good posts from the bad, they're the ones that this effects the most. Now they think that test is too strong and aromatizes too much and that you need to use something like primo and anavar on your first cycle, just cause Nelson suggested it. All instead of a simple test & dbol cycle thats been tried and true for the past 20 years.

Nelson is a fantastic guy and an amazing contributor here, but its threads like these that I feel are more detrimental than contructive.

And thanks guys, to those who said nice things to say about me
Chris

Good post Chris!

 

[Nelson Montana]

kemix: I don;t see how Primo causes more problems than test. I think we just disagree on this. Sure, lots of guys have used test and it works fine, of course. But I see more and more guys shut down in their 30's. It's impossible to gauge but i think it's the higher test dosages.


One breath. Tren is a separate animal. Mg per mg, stronger than anything else and with a host of sides. Other than that, no, I don't see one steroid being that much better for bulking. Incidentally, Tren also burns fat better than any other steroid.

At any rate, we're back to splitting hairs. I guess my point is, WHY is test a BEST first cycle? There's no rhyme or reason for it and I haven;t really head one on this thread. For that matter, you can recommend ANYTHING. As long as the dose is reasonable.

And lots of guys do fine with dbol only. Like this guy: YouTube - Danny Padilla

It ain't the TYPE of drugs guys. it's the training and the diet and the genetics. ALL steroids work. Some suppress more than others. If you do anything long enough, it all tuns out the same. Beginners should go light.

 

[khemix]

kemix: I don;t see how Primo causes more problems than test. I think we just disagree on this. Sure, lots of guys have used test and it works fine, of course. But I see more and more guys shut down in their 30's. It's impossible to gauge but i think it's the higher test dosages.


One breath. Tren is a separate animal. Mg per mg, stronger than anything else and with a host of sides. Other than that, no, I don't see one steroid being that much better for bulking. Incidentally, Tren also burns fat better than any other steroid.

At any rate, we're back to splitting hairs. I guess my point is, WHY is test a BEST first cycle? There's no rhyme or reason for it and I haven;t really head one on this thread. For that matter, you can recommend ANYTHING. As long as the dose is reasonable.

And lots of guys do fine with dbol only. Like this guy: YouTube - Danny Padilla

It ain't the TYPE of drugs guys. it's the training and the diet and the genetics. ALL steroids work. Some suppress more than others. If you do anything long enough, it all tuns out the same. Beginners should go light.

Fking awesome post Nelson.

Can we PLEASE just end this thread right here guys?

 

[hurricane]

Fking awesome post Nelson.

Can we PLEASE just end this thread right here guys?

why ? there is nothing wrong with debate .. as long as its done in a civilized manner ..good thread nelson ..although some of it goes against what i believe .. u make some interesting points !

 

[khemix]

why ? there is nothing wrong with debate .. as long as its done in a civilized manner ..good thread nelson ..although some of it goes against what i believe .. u make some interesting points !

Its got nothing to do with debate. The debate was 14 pages ago.

The point of this thread was clarified and Nelson ended with some of the most solid fucking advice in this thread. I couldn't think of any better ending note.

Thanks.

 

[rudy76]

Yes. I know this is an unpopular stance but I maintain that a test only cycle is the WORST thing someone can do for a first cycle.

The reason is that test is what our body makes. It doesn't ake Primo or tren or deca. Give it test and it;'ll make less. People thinkother compounds are more suppressive. NOTHING is more suppressive than test! There are , however, things that will kill libido.

Tren and Deca raise prolactin and progesterone. That's the killer. They don't shut down the HPTA more than test.

And even dumber is when people suggest using test along with these compounds as some sort of responsible remedy. IT"S JUST ANOTHER SUPPRESSIVE COMPOUND!!! It will mask the problems but it still supresses.

I still think the best first cycle is a short low dose one -- to test the waters. I rmember when doing a couple of dbol was a major thrill. And we got results! Today, that isn;t enough , even if you're 150 pounds and haven't begun to tap your full potential.

Start slow. Use Primo or var or a little dbol. You can always add more and more test as you go along.

You are right this is an "unpopular stance."

From my experience Tren Ace at 100mg eod is more supressive to sex drive than anything else (I've never done Deca). Test gives massive erections on cue but when the high levels are gone you suffer with lack of sex drive the same way you do with high doses of Tren Ace / Prolactin.

From my experience w/100mg Tren Ace eod and 650 mg Test Enan/week testing the results were:

Prolactin 0
Test Levels >- (0)?

My test levels were "less than zero" while prolactin was proven to be zero. A less than zero may be an erorr??

This test was taken 5 weeks post cycle after full PCT.

My conclusion: testosterone depression can be severe and
Trenbolone doesn't always increase prolactin levels.

rudy76
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