No sex....some advice please

[uniden44]

I've been dating this girl for almost three years now and we just moved in together about 5 months ago. I really care about her and are relationship is good but are sex life has been almost no existant for a several months.

We usually have a hot sex life, but lately she doesn't want anything to do with it. She acts the same in every other way but nothing sexual. This did happen once before when I moved away followed by use taking a break for a few months.

I've brought it up to her but she says shes not in the mood and this happens to girls sometimes. Were in are mid 20s so I'm assuming her sex drive should be ok.

Any suggestions or reasons? I love this girl but sex is part of a relationship. I know shes not cheating on me but its really starting to get to me. What should I do.

 

[lavarat]

hmmm...

This happened to me too a few times but it would only last about a week max. The thing I found is that I try not to bring it up (unless I think it's serious). Go on as though everything is normal and NEVER make her feel bad or guilty about it otherwise it'll just keep going on and on. If it goes on a long time then you better get talking because there might be something wrong physically or emotionally.

Good luck man

 

[Sassy69]

There are a couple other threads about this on this board - you might check those. None of them really arrive at any answers except that it is a common experience, sort of like a "phase", regardless of age really. Its just a thought, but for women, "sex drive" has so much to do w/ the emotional side of things as well as the physical and sometimes all of that just combines and maybe it just gets turned down for a while.

The things that I've found suggested for it are:

1) first review if there are any valid medical reasons, e.g. low thyroid or something. This could probably be answered w/ just a general physical and a general screen of all levels, etc.

2) can you both communicate easily -are there any parts of your relationship that she isn't comfortable talking about or she often sidesteps? It can even be somethign subtle that maybe she can't quite identify as an "issue" and you aren't even aware of as an issue.

3) Then they suggest a counselor -- I guess if you do identify somethign that can't be easily talked about to draw it out & discuss it.

But this all comes at the point where she thinks there's a problem & is concerned. Otherwise, like above - dont' make it an issue, continue to treat her like she's gold and make every other part of the relationship as important as the sex part.

 

[BigRupe]

There are a couple other threads about this on this board - you might check those. None of them really arrive at any answers except that it is a common experience, sort of like a "phase", regardless of age really. Its just a thought, but for women, "sex drive" has so much to do w/ the emotional side of things as well as the physical and sometimes all of that just combines and maybe it just gets turned down for a while.

The things that I've found suggested for it are:

1) first review if there are any valid medical reasons, e.g. low thyroid or something. This could probably be answered w/ just a general physical and a general screen of all levels, etc.

2) can you both communicate easily -are there any parts of your relationship that she isn't comfortable talking about or she often sidesteps? It can even be somethign subtle that maybe she can't quite identify as an "issue" and you aren't even aware of as an issue.

3) Then they suggest a counselor -- I guess if you do identify somethign that can't be easily talked about to draw it out & discuss it.

But this all comes at the point where she thinks there's a problem & is concerned. Otherwise, like above - dont' make it an issue, continue to treat her like she's gold and make every other part of the relationship as important as the sex part.

Gee Sassy is this stuff contagious? LOL if so it's worse than avian flu.

I think there has to be something wrong in all of these cases as I don't believe the comments that women often just lose interest in sex for months at a time and that it's natural.

The only thing is I would do differently from what you suggest is I would make it an issue but do it with love because it "is" an issue so don't pretend it isn't.

 

[Wulfgar]

Girls gotta get dick from somewhere man
I ignored that same phenomena with girls in the past. 100% of the time they were fucking some other guy.
be wary and watch your ass so you dont get burned

 

[KillahBee]

Girls gotta get dick from somewhere man
I ignored that same phenomena with girls in the past. 100% of the time they were fucking some other guy.
be wary and watch your ass so you dont get burned

Dead on balls accurate. I have NEVER seen a woman just "lose" interest in sexual interaction or go thru a "phase". 9 times out of 10 this is a major sign that she has lost some form of interest in you or the relationship (could be emotional, could be sexual) and/or is involved with someone else or considering it.

Have you spoken to her about it??!! Are you able to see past her words and decipher her actions? Women don't always (i.e. ever) come out and say things direct. They are not wired that way. YOU need to use some thought and insight and figure this out.

 

[Synpax]

Propose. That should fix it.

 

[Colonel Ingus]

I've been dating this girl for almost three years now and we just moved in together about 5 months ago. I really care about her and are relationship is good but are sex life has been almost no existant for a several months.

We usually have a hot sex life, but lately she doesn't want anything to do with it. She acts the same in every other way but nothing sexual. This did happen once before when I moved away followed by use taking a break for a few months.

I've brought it up to her but she says shes not in the mood and this happens to girls sometimes. Were in are mid 20s so I'm assuming her sex drive should be ok.

Any suggestions or reasons? I love this girl but sex is part of a relationship. I know shes not cheating on me but its really starting to get to me. What should I do.

I am about double your age and while that does not mean anything in the big picture, I'll tell you what happened in my life that sort of parallels this. I had a girlfriend that seemed generally interested in sex, but was kind of hung-up on waiting until after marriage. Since I loved her, I bought into that, and we got married. Well, nothing really changed. While there were a precious few times that we did have what I remember as pretty good nights together, the general interest that I had hoped would blossom never really did so. Fast forward almost two decades and you have a lot of animosity and resentment. If I had been a different person, then everything would have worked out fine, but as a younger man I was pretty adventurous sexually, and I do know what I'm missing. Like they say, ignorance is bliss. We are now struggling with what I believe are the death throes of our relationship.

I would advise you to have a very honest discussion with her and tell her what your observations are, and what your concerns are. Tell her what direction you would like to have things take and ask her for her input on all of those things. This may take a few times to be resolved, but by all means, resolve it now. If she is losing her libido now, for whatever reason, you have to decide if that is something you are willing to accept. Look at her parents, do thay have the kind of relationship that you would like to have? How about your own parents? If the example she grew up with differs from what you grew up with, neither of you is going to be happy in the long run. It doesn't make either one of you "wrong", but it won't be what you expected, and unfulfilled expectations lead not to happiness.

Sorry if I got too gloom and doom with this, but it's better you look hard at things now than deal with the consequences later.

 

[Dieselicious]

She has got to say more then she is not in the mood bro. have a sit down with her - on the serious tip - and find out why is not wanting the charles dickens? If it really is that she is just not in the mood, then there are pills for woman too - she should be willing to take them.

 

[Sassy69]

I agree w/ all of the above. I think when you are in a relationship for a long time, there may actually be some sort of aspect to it where the phase of "Don't touch me" comes in - maybe its boredom or lack of excitement or something -- I'm not saying to not discuss it - but I am saying to not frame it like "You're broken" but rather see first if she will acknowledge that she recognizes this thing missing just as you do - that establishes that you are on the same page. Then can you discuss it objectively - not blaming her or anything else - and on one my threads I did draw a parallel to when guys are on PCT and these feelings of whatever that have no particularly tangible source arise --- basically make you ambivalent or just want to cry for no apparent reason -- these do exist and women experience them. But its also a legitimate call to see if there's soemthign else going on - totally legit to wonder she's getting it somewhere else. If you / she can't or won't talk about it - then I see a problem because communication is the basis of a good & healthy relationship.

 

[musclemom]

Gentlemen, lemme let you in on a little secret. The FASTEST sex drive killer on the planet:

She's PISSED at you.

Might be something REALLY small, but it's something she's brought up to you, probably time and time again, you won't do a damn thing about it, keep forgetting that she's mentioned it, maybe don't even hear her saying it to you.

And for all y'all that think women can't live without getting laid, gents, hate to break it to you, but women can self service, too

AND BY THE FREAKING WAY ... just because we don't WANT to fuck you doesn't mean we would RATHER be fucking someone else ... it COULD mean we just DON'T want to fuck you!!! We are not men. If we're not in the mood, it's not because we're satiated, it's because WE DON'T WANNA.

Oh, and here's a little secret about women -- if we're cheating on you, we have been known to suddenly START fucking you a lot to throw you off the trail

 

[Gymgurl]

Girls gotta get dick from somewhere man
I ignored that same phenomena with girls in the past. 100% of the time they were fucking some other guy.
be wary and watch your ass so you dont get burned

This is a good thing to listen to......if she really wanted it before and no longer wants it.....

BUT there are so many other things it can be

 

[SheDragon]

How could she not want sex??? Especially being in her 20's!! I agree, make sure its nothing medical cause that sure is weird!!

 

[SheDragon]

or she could be losing interest in you

 

[uniden44]

Thanks for all the advice. I've tried bringing it up before but she gets defensive and asks is that all I care about. I will give it another shot and ease into it.

I know everyone has heard this a million times but I know shes not cheating on me. I just want to try and figure this out before it goes on too long. I love her but for a long term (which I know she wants) I don't know if I can handle it.

I try no to resent her or get angry but sometimes its hard b/c I really just don't understand. I will let you all know how it goes. Thanks again!

 

[SheDragon]

Thanks for all the advice. I've tried bringing it up before but she gets defensive and asks is that all I care about. I will give it another shot and ease into it.

I know everyone has heard this a million times but I know shes not cheating on me. I just want to try and figure this out before it goes on too long. I love her but for a long term (which I know she wants) I don't know if I can handle it.

I try no to resent her or get angry but sometimes its hard b/c I really just don't understand. I will let you all know how it goes. Thanks again!

sometimes you dont want to believe that there's someone else but reality is, many times thats the reason behind this. i could always tell when my ex had something on the side. i could tell by his suddenly "losing interest" or just "having sex" as opposed to "making love".. and i didnt need proof, i just knew it.

 

[musclemom]

Thanks for all the advice. I've tried bringing it up before but she gets defensive and asks is that all I care about. I will give it another shot and ease into it.

I know everyone has heard this a million times but I know shes not cheating on me. I just want to try and figure this out before it goes on too long. I love her but for a long term (which I know she wants) I don't know if I can handle it.

I try no to resent her or get angry but sometimes its hard b/c I really just don't understand. I will let you all know how it goes. Thanks again!

Dude, she's pissed at you. If she didn't feel good, or was getting worried about it herself, she'd get weepy and say she couldn't figure out what it is, ask you to bear with her ... uh uh, she knows EXACTLY what it is.

You're leaving the toilet seat up, or forgetting to take out the garbage, or dumping the household chores on her, or drinking too much, or spending too much time watching television or haven't taken her out recently, or haven't complimented the way she looks or SOMETHING!!! She feels like you're taking her for granted, is what it comes down to.

Take her away this weekend, surprise her, plan it all out, wine and dine her, splurge a little. Couple of nice meals, nice hotel, nice flowers ... be prepared for her to vent her spleen, then have hot makeup sex. BUT ABSOLUTELY, UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES, BRING UP THE SUBJECT OF LACK OF SEX ... let bring it up.

You're in deep doo-doo, and if you don't fix it, it's just gonna get worse.

If it DOESN'T smooth things out, then broach the subject of couples counseling, see how she takes that.

But I'm telling you, if she was worried about her libido she would have said as much to you, there's something else going on with her.

 

[KillahBee]

Dude, she's pissed at you. If she didn't feel good, or was getting worried about it herself, she'd get weepy and say she couldn't figure out what it is, ask you to bear with her ... uh uh, she knows EXACTLY what it is.

You're leaving the toilet seat up, or forgetting to take out the garbage, or dumping the household chores on her, or drinking too much, or spending too much time watching television or haven't taken her out recently, or haven't complimented the way she looks or SOMETHING!!! She feels like you're taking her for granted, is what it comes down to.

Take her away this weekend, surprise her, plan it all out, wine and dine her, splurge a little. Couple of nice meals, nice hotel, nice flowers ... be prepared for her to vent her spleen, then have hot makeup sex.

If it DOESN'T smooth things out, then broach the subject of couples counseling, see how she takes that.

But I'm telling you, if she was worried about her libido she would have said as much to you, there's something else going on with her.

IN ABSOLUTELY NO WAY SHOULD YOU FOLLOW THIS ADVICE!!! For real, this is TERRIBLE advice. This type of approach is the root of all the issues we men have with American women - the spoiled little princess attitude.

What MM is saying is simply this - "your girl is upset for whatever reason - reward her for being upset and not communicating that in a mature, adult manner". It's ridiculous, nonsensical and quite amateurish as well.

 

[Wulfgar]

Propose. That should fix it.

Hey thats what I did!! She actually said yes...lol
i think she just wanted to wea the 30K$ ring for a few days...i heard later from a couple of the guys she was fucking that she would wear the ring and laugh her as off about how pathetic i was while she was jerking them off and sucking thier cocks with the hand her ring was on(ya, she was a lefty)

 

[Wulfgar]

Gentlemen, lemme let you in on a little secret. The FASTEST sex drive killer on the planet:

She's PISSED at you.

Might be something REALLY small, but it's something she's brought up to you, probably time and time again, you won't do a damn thing about it, keep forgetting that she's mentioned it, maybe don't even hear her saying it to you.

And for all y'all that think women can't live without getting laid, gents, hate to break it to you, but women can self service, too

AND BY THE FREAKING WAY ... just because we don't WANT to fuck you doesn't mean we would RATHER be fucking someone else ... it COULD mean we just DON'T want to fuck you!!! We are not men. If we're not in the mood, it's not because we're satiated, it's because WE DON'T WANNA.

Oh, and here's a little secret about women -- if we're cheating on you, we have been known to suddenly START fucking you a lot to throw you off the trail

god i want one of those! One who will at least give me some ass before she crushes me and lets me know she has been screwing all my homies...i been getting hosed

 

[musclemom]

IN ABSOLUTELY NO WAY SHOULD YOU FOLLOW THIS ADVICE!!! For real, this is TERRIBLE advice. This type of approach is the root of all the issues we men have with American women - the spoiled little princess attitude.

What MM is saying is simply this - "your girl is upset for whatever reason - reward her for being upset and not communicating that in a mature, adult manner". It's ridiculous, nonsensical and quite amateurish as well.

Okay, Killah, I'll have you know my husband of 12+ years is SAYING THIS right behind me ...

You've been married ummm, how long?

 

[Wulfgar]

Thanks for all the advice. I've tried bringing it up before but she gets defensive and asks is that all I care about. I will give it another shot and ease into it.

I know everyone has heard this a million times but I know shes not cheating on me. I just want to try and figure this out before it goes on too long. I love her but for a long term (which I know she wants) I don't know if I can handle it.

I try no to resent her or get angry but sometimes its hard b/c I really just don't understand. I will let you all know how it goes. Thanks again!

De"Nile" is a river in Egypt

like I said..watch your ass bro...

 

[musclemom]

IN ABSOLUTELY NO WAY SHOULD YOU FOLLOW THIS ADVICE!!! For real, this is TERRIBLE advice. This type of approach is the root of all the issues we men have with American women - the spoiled little princess attitude.

What MM is saying is simply this - "your girl is upset for whatever reason - reward her for being upset and not communicating that in a mature, adult manner". It's ridiculous, nonsensical and quite amateurish as well.

Most of the time a woman gives you the silent treatment is because she's said the same thing, OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN, and is never heard, silence speaks louder than words sometimes.

A relationship takes work, it's not necessarily easy, but both parties have to communicate and contribute.

You know what, when you've been married 12 years, you tell me how to work it, okay?

 

[SheDragon]

Most of the time a woman gives you the silent treatment is because she's said the same thing, OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN, and is never heard, silence speaks louder than words sometimes.

A relationship takes work, it's not necessarily easy, but both parties have to communicate and contribute.

You know what, when you've been married 12 years, you tell me how to work it, okay?

you go mom! =)

 

[KillahBee]

Okay, Killah, I'll have you know my husband of 12+ years is SAYING THIS right behind me ...

You've been married ummm, how long?

a) marriage is something you could not PAY ME to take part in right now. NO WAY. so, that point is useless

b) if your husband acts that way, then he is not a secure person.

 

[musclemom]

a) marriage is something you could not PAY ME to take part in right now. NO WAY. so, that point is useless

b) if your husband acts that way, then he is not a secure person.

a) Frankly, your decision to remain a single person does nothing but improve nationwide divorce statistics, so I applaud you.

b) Shouldn't judge other's by yourself Killah my husband is one of the few men I know that has his head screwed on straight. The whole world can be blowing the fuck up, but the ONE thing we both KNOW can depend on and trust is each other.

And for the record, I don't give him the silent treatment when I'm angry, I have NEVER used sex as a bargaining chip, I've never used manipulation, and we haven't had an argument in years.

My husband is also secure enough to be married to a woman like me, and it takes ONE hell of a man to be married to a high rollin' bitch like me, hon, I don't take shit from nobody, I think you know that by now.

 

[BBBBig Phenom]

This happened to two of my really good friends....They both found out she was fucking other people and not just one guy....They each went to an online service where you can pay like $20 bucks and find out anyone's # either land line or cell phone...They looked at their girls cell phone bills and found guys they were calling....Not saying she is...but,,,keep all options open.

 

[Wulfgar]

I sense a disturbance in the force

 

[Sassy69]

Thanks for all the advice. I've tried bringing it up before but she gets defensive and asks is that all I care about. I will give it another shot and ease into it.

I know everyone has heard this a million times but I know shes not cheating on me. I just want to try and figure this out before it goes on too long. I love her but for a long term (which I know she wants) I don't know if I can handle it.

I try no to resent her or get angry but sometimes its hard b/c I really just don't understand. I will let you all know how it goes. Thanks again!

In response to the "Is that all you care about..." thing --- coming from a guy it probably does sound a bit like a guy "I need to get laid" thing, but I think its valid to say straight up that sex is a critical part of a healthy relationahip - its more than just "sex" - its an integral component of that close, trusting and sharing thing called "love".

Back to the question - does she acknowledge that she's not been interested for a long time and does she feel like anythign is missing from the relationship or is there something else / different that she wants? Its ok for a while, but several months makes you start to miss that component of the relationship. You aren't accusing her or attacking her - but rather concerned about it, wantn to make sure you aren't slacking on something or is there somethign that you can help fix? If not, does she think its possible there might be a medical reason & is she interested in at least getting that checked out to eliminate it from the equation?

(Why do I keep feeling like Chesty's recent situation is creeping in here....?)

At the end of the day - whatever is the reason or whatever - you ask because you are in a close, committed relationship & if you can't talk about the things that concern you openly, trustingly and with nothing but best of intentions, does she think that's "ok"? That communication thing is almost literally the most important component of the relationship. Without it you can't deal w/ situations like this.

 

[Gymgurl]

My husband is also secure enough to be married to a woman like me, and it takes ONE hell of a man to be married to a high rollin' bitch like me, hon, I don't take shit from nobody, I think you know that by now.[/QUOTE]



This says it all......

 

[musclemom]

My husband is also secure enough to be married to a woman like me, and it takes ONE hell of a man to be married to a high rollin' bitch like me, hon, I don't take shit from nobody, I think you know that by now.

This says it all......[/QUOTE]
"You must spread some Karma around before giving it to Gymgurl again."

 

[uniden44]

I don't ever yell or get angry when I bring it up b/c I know thats not the way to go about it. I don't think shes mad at me for anything b/c everything else in are relationship is fine. If shes with holding sex for that long for something small that shes upset about but won't tell me then I don't know what to do.

She knows that I'm concerned about it but she doesn't seem to worried. I don't think she would be concerned enough to go to the doctors. I do everything for this girl, I treat her great. She's even brought up the marriage thing (which if we can't communicate then were in no way ready for).

I agree that the closeness of sex is part of love and a relationship but the more time that passes it just strains the relationship for me. At what point do I say enough is enough? I don't want her to have sex with me if she doesn't want to (obviously) and if she does have someone else, which I don't think she does, then she can have him. I enjoy being in a relationship but I feel like I'm missing out on part of it. Thanks all keep u posted

 

[musclemom]

I don't ever yell or get angry when I bring it up b/c I know thats not the way to go about it. I don't think shes mad at me for anything b/c everything else in are relationship is fine. If shes with holding sex for that long for something small that shes upset about but won't tell me then I don't know what to do.

She knows that I'm concerned about it but she doesn't seem to worried. I don't think she would be concerned enough to go to the doctors. I do everything for this girl, I treat her great. She's even brought up the marriage thing (which if we can't communicate then were in no way ready for).

I agree that the closeness of sex is part of love and a relationship but the more time that passes it just strains the relationship for me. At what point do I say enough is enough? I don't want her to have sex with me if she doesn't want to (obviously) and if she does have someone else, which I don't think she does, then she can have him. I enjoy being in a relationship but I feel like I'm missing out on part of it. Thanks all keep u posted

Dr. Phil said, that hack, did make a very astute observation, "Sex, when it's working and good in the relationship, makes up LESS than 10% of what goes into a good relationship ... when it is bad, it takes over 80%."

If you guys are under 30, don't have any kids or extreme stressors including health, work, financial or travel problems, and you haven't had ANY sex in more than two months, you guys have a problem.

If she's not harboring some resentment towards you (and assuming you have sweet breath, no BO, and no outrageous offensive personal habits, etc.), and she gets angry if you bring up doctor or counseling, then you sit her down in front of the computer and make her read this entire thread. She needs to communicate with you WTF is going on.

A sexless relationship is not workable if you both aren't into it, seriously.

 

[BigRupe]

Hey thats what I did!! She actually said yes...lol
i think she just wanted to wea the 30K$ ring for a few days...i heard later from a couple of the guys she was fucking that she would wear the ring and laugh her as off about how pathetic i was while she was jerking them off and sucking thier cocks with the hand her ring was on(ya, she was a lefty)

You're a better man than me to be able to joke about it. I'd probably be in Cell Block D if my GF did something like that to me. LOL

 

[dullboy]

dullboy is loathe to agree with the cynics because you actually seem to care for this girl, but barring the recent use of anti-depressants, a sudden lack of interest in sex and passive aggresive behavior is an indicator of unfaithfullness. this actually supports musclemoms anecdotal experience. although she may not have cheated when she was unhappy in an existing relationship, most women will.

ergo, if you read the many posts dullboy has made concerning these sorts of matters, you'll understand that girls generally won't cheat unless they're unhappy or unfufilled an existing relationship.



dullboy has extensive clinical experience doing csw type stuff, which is why he chose to change professions. dullboy gets sad hearing about other peoples relationship issues.

 

[Wulfgar]

dullboy is loathe to agree with the cynics because you actually seem to care for this girl, but barring the recent use of anti-depressants, a sudden lack of interest in sex and passive aggresive behavior is an indicator of unfaithfullness. this actually supports musclemoms anecdotal experience. although she may not have cheated when she was unhappy in an existing relationship, most women will.

ergo, if you read the many posts dullboy has made concerning these sorts of matters, you'll understand that girls generally won't cheat unless they're unhappy or unfufilled an existing relationship.



dullboy has extensive clinical experience doing csw type stuff, which is why he chose to change professions because dullboy gets sad hearing about other peoples relationship issues.

Wulfgar thinks his own life dramas would be more than enough. Wulfgar couldnt imagine having to deal with others relationship issues as well.

 

[Wulfgar]

You're a better man than me to be able to joke about it. I'd probably be in Cell Block D if my GF did something like that to me. LOL

Well man, I just had to ask myself before I went to exact "revenge" th question "what am I fighting for?"
pride? revenge? a righteous fury? Indignation? Hatred? Intolerance? Unforgiveness?
All traits I am willing to sacrifice in life. Those arnt necissarily empowering aspects of self. Yet so many people cling to those very traits they hate in others the most.

 

[dullboy]

Well man, I just had to ask myself before I went to exact "revenge" th question "what am I fighting for?"
pride? revenge? a righteous fury? Indignation? Hatred? Intolerance? Unforgiveness?
All traits I am willing to sacrifice in life. Those arnt necissarily empowering aspects of self. Yet so many people cling to those very traits they hate in others the most.

dullboy is always stunned by how open you are about past relationship "issues". most guys resist being so frank. dullboy respects you the nth degree for your forthrightness.

dullboy is a little older than you and would just like say that most women are suprisingly loyal to men. you seem to have had some bad experiences, but these situations tend to be more controlled by you than your sig other.

meaning that if you treat a girl "right", the odds are greatly in your favor that she'll remain loyal. treating a woman "right" doen't equal weakness. it just means being a good guy.

the issue that you need to be careful about is preemption. meaning that if you always conclude that a girl will cheat on you (based on past experience), you may take on self fufilling behavior that enables the girl to justify being unfaithfull to you.

 

[BigRupe]

It's reverse for men...when men are pissed sex is a unique way to administer a little bit of discipline with some rather hard thrusting to get the point across.

Gentlemen, lemme let you in on a little secret. The FASTEST sex drive killer on the planet:

She's PISSED at you.

Might be something REALLY small, but it's something she's brought up to you, probably time and time again, you won't do a damn thing about it, keep forgetting that she's mentioned it, maybe don't even hear her saying it to you.

And for all y'all that think women can't live without getting laid, gents, hate to break it to you, but women can self service, too

AND BY THE FREAKING WAY ... just because we don't WANT to fuck you doesn't mean we would RATHER be fucking someone else ... it COULD mean we just DON'T want to fuck you!!! We are not men. If we're not in the mood, it's not because we're satiated, it's because WE DON'T WANNA.

Oh, and here's a little secret about women -- if we're cheating on you, we have been known to suddenly START fucking you a lot to throw you off the trail

 

[BigRupe]

Well man, I just had to ask myself before I went to exact "revenge" th question "what am I fighting for?"
pride? revenge? a righteous fury? Indignation? Hatred? Intolerance? Unforgiveness?
All traits I am willing to sacrifice in life. Those arnt necissarily empowering aspects of self. Yet so many people cling to those very traits they hate in others the most.

You have an excellent point. What would you, me, or anyone actually be fighting for? The person won't change and fuck if they can't see the worth of you and do that sort of shit then hell it's their loss.

Great comments Wulfgar!

 

[Wulfgar]

dullboy is always stunned by how open you are about past relationship "issues". most guys resist being so frank. dullboy respects you the nth degree for your forthrightness.

dullboy is a little older than you and would just like say that most women are suprisingly loyal to men. you seem to have had some bad experiences, but these situations tend to be more controlled by you than your sig other.

meaning that if you treat a girl "right", the odds are greatly in your favor that she'll remain loyal. treating a woman "right" doen't equal weakness. it just means being a good guy.

the issue that you need to be careful about is preemption. meaning that if you always conclude that a girl will cheat on you (based on past experience), you may take on self fufilling behavior that enables the girl to justify being unfaithfull to you.

Dullboy makes good points

I beleive that alot of my past relationships have been based on the archeatypes from my dad and his wives(6 of them). they were all gorgeous, and all emotionally fucked up. so growing up I ALWAYS was told how "women are unfaithful", "dont trust women"...etc.. i beleive this indoctrination went unoticed by me for a long time so in order to play out the exact things i DID NOT want to ahppen to me(i.e. what happened to my father) i have attracted the same type of women.
Interestingly enough i just came upon this relaization and have taken ownership for it very recently(like 2 months ago)

 

[TC2]

IN ABSOLUTELY NO WAY SHOULD YOU FOLLOW THIS ADVICE!!! For real, this is TERRIBLE advice. This type of approach is the root of all the issues we men have with American women - the spoiled little princess attitude.

What MM is saying is simply this - "your girl is upset for whatever reason - reward her for being upset and not communicating that in a mature, adult manner". It's ridiculous, nonsensical and quite amateurish as well.

no fucking shit...fuck all the hoops american women would have you jump through.

 

[musclemom]

Dullboy makes good points

I beleive that alot of my past relationships have been based on the archeatypes from my dad and his wives(6 of them). they were all gorgeous, and all emotionally fucked up. so growing up I ALWAYS was told how "women are unfaithful", "dont trust women"...etc.. i beleive this indoctrination went unoticed by me for a long time so in order to play out the exact things i DID NOT want to ahppen to me(i.e. what happened to my father) i have attracted the same type of women.
Interestingly enough i just came upon this relaization and have taken ownership for it very recently(like 2 months ago)

We learn what we live, Wulfgar, even if we are AWARE that what we lived was totally FUBAR.

With the exception of physical abuse, when I married my first husband I essentially was marrying my father: emotionally abusive and manipulative, jealous to the point of obsession, pathological liar, materialistic, etc. All of these were traits my father had possessed but I lied to myself about a lot of this stuff for a very long time. I was playing out all the exact same shit that I had seen my parents do.

I dunno, the older I get it the more it seems that life is nothing but a series of repeating cycles, that we keep getting presented with the same variables under a different set of circumstances until we learn to recognize the warning flags and break the cycle, like you said, owning our thoughts and actions.

 

[musclemom]

dullboy is loathe to agree with the cynics because you actually seem to care for this girl, but barring the recent use of anti-depressants, a sudden lack of interest in sex and passive aggresive behavior is an indicator of unfaithfullness. this actually supports musclemoms anecdotal experience. although she may not have cheated when she was unhappy in an existing relationship, most women will.

ergo, if you read the many posts dullboy has made concerning these sorts of matters, you'll understand that girls generally won't cheat unless they're unhappy or unfufilled an existing relationship.

dullboy has extensive clinical experience doing csw type stuff, which is why he chose to change professions. dullboy gets sad hearing about other peoples relationship issues.

I fully admit that I cheated in an unhappy relationship ... hindsight being 20/20 I also know, rationally, why I did it but also see no reason to justify my actions. My explanations would fall on deaf ears, and I'm condemned for my actions before I even start (the impartial judgement of dullboy and others aside). I've NEVER said my adultery was RIGHT, but I can honestly tell you there was a point in my life where there just didn't seem to BE any other option. If I could have gotten out of the marriage, I would have, but he threatened to kill himself if I left him, and I believed him. The fact is I had a child, a job that paid dirt, and NO friends or family to turn to for help (obsessed men generally don't like you to have friends and can do things to drive them away, I'm an only child with no extended family). When I told him I was taking a loan out to go to business school so I could quit janitorial work it triggered a two week fight. Shit, he wouldn't let us have a telephone for several years, I had to walk to a pay phone to call my mother once a week.

Long story short, when I had finally gotten into a position where I could afford to support myself and my child whether my ex lived or died, I divorced him.

 

[dullboy]

I fully admit that I cheated in an unhappy relationship ... hindsight being 20/20 I also know, rationally, why I did it but also see no reason to justify my actions. My explanations would fall on deaf ears, and I'm condemned for my actions before I even start (the impartial judgement of dullboy and others aside). I've NEVER said my adultery was RIGHT, but I can honestly tell you there was a point in my life where there just didn't seem to BE any other option. If I could have gotten out of the marriage, I would have, but he threatened to kill himself if I left him, and I believed him. The fact is I had a child, a job that paid dirt, and NO friends or family to turn to for help (obsessed men generally don't like you to have friends and can do things to drive them away, I'm an only child with no extended family). When I told him I was taking a loan out to go to business school so I could quit janitorial work it triggered a two week fight. Shit, he wouldn't let us have a telephone for several years, I had to walk to a pay phone to call my mother once a week.




Long story short, when I had finally gotten into a position where I could afford to support myself and my child whether my ex lived or died, I divorced him.

I'll step out of dullboy for this post because this is serious business...


I hope that I didn't offend you.

I was referring to your first post in this thread. I believe that you said not to listen to the guys who knee-jerkingly claimed that she was "fucking someone else".... that it wasn't necessarily the case that a woman is probably fucking someone else when they suddenly lose interest in sex and display passive aggresive behavior towards their s/o.

I just assumed that you projecting your own personal experience, that is to say that when when you were unhappy in past relationships (unfufilled is the more common term that women use), that you never "cheated".

women generally won't cheat until they feel that their relationship has no future. i'm sure that you'll agree that this was your case.


i've posted this 100 times and i'll post it again - when women cheat in a serious relationship - they generally aren't looking for "sex" so to speak.
they're generally looking to fufill and unfufilled emotional need.


guys cheat for sex.

 

[Wulfgar]

Its an interesting argument. Cheating because of unfullfillemtn vs. cheating for sex.
What happens if you cheat because you are unfulfilled sexually? Isnt that basically the same thing.
My ex-fiance claimed she was having sex with other men because @ the time I was preparing for a BBing contest. My sex drive was low because I was exhausted most of the time. Apparantly she told the guys she was cheating with "she just needed more cock than what i was giving her". so in essence she was cheating for sex right? or was she unfullfilled? or both? Rasies alot of questions of why cheaters cheat. Unfullfillment and sex aside, its an addiction IMHO. Adultery is exciting, fun, secretive, new, dangerous, etc.... i beleive these are really are the true motivations that cheaters use but most are afraid to admit. No one wants to admit they are intrinsically "bad people" because of things they do. So the ego will make up a bunch of BS to justify thier actions which obviously served them a purpose(i.e. unfullfillment, sex, happiness..ect..). It is amzing, people tha are ruled by the impetuisness of the childish ego mind dont care who or what they have to destroy to achieve it's "goals". Why is it so hard to just break it off with someone B4 the transgressions are commited? The 5 minute conversation and hurt would save years of pain, betrayal, unhappiness and regret.

 

[musclemom]

I'll step out of dullboy for this post because this is serious business...


I hope that I didn't offend you.

... .

Oh you're so sweet no-no-no-no, no offense at all, in my little vent up there ... I have been judged (not by you but others) because of what I did ... as I said, I've never claimed it was RIGHT I just felt at that time/space/place there WERE no other options.

I just assumed that you projecting your own personal experience, that is to say that when when you were unhappy in past relationships (unfufilled is the more common term that women use), that you never "cheated".

women generally won't cheat until they feel that their relationship has no future. i'm sure that you'll agree that this was your case.

i've posted this 100 times and i'll post it again - when women cheat in a serious relationship - they generally aren't looking for "sex" so to speak.
they're generally looking to fufill and unfufilled emotional need.

guys cheat for sex.

Honey I can't say it better ... seriously. It's a concept that a lot of men don't understand, though, that sex for (most) women is first emotional/psychological THEN physical.

I cheated because I was trapped in a relationship with a person that (intentionally or not), eroded my ego/personal value/self respect 24/7. I was married to a man who made me feel VERY bad about myself, and perhaps even worse DOUBT myself and my own attractiveness, every day, and since I couldn't get AWAY from him I sought approval from other men.

 

[Wulfgar]

Oh you're so sweet no-no-no-no, no offense at all, in my little vent up there ... I have been judged (not by you but others) because of what I did ... as I said, I've never claimed it was RIGHT I just felt at that time/space/place there WERE no other options.


Honey I can't say it better ... seriously. It's a concept that a lot of men don't understand, though, that sex for (most) women is first emotional/psychological THEN physical.

I cheated because I was trapped in a relationship with a person that (intentionally or not), eroded my ego/personal value/self respect 24/7. I was married to a man who made me feel VERY bad about myself, and perhaps even worse DOUBT myself and my own attractiveness, every day, and since I couldn't get AWAY from him I sought approval from other men.

MM, please understand i am not passing judgement on you or anyone, u did what u felt was the ONLY thing you could do in the current position, and I understand that but i do have some thoughts on the topic. This is kinda more geared toward pople in general and thier methods of handling stressful situations.
U know as well as I do there are ALWAYS other options. And there are no accidents in this world. To say that someone "made" you feel a certain way and "drove" you into bed with an other man shows a lack of self-determinism. I beleive instead of denoting blame on others we should ourselves take responsibility and teach others to be more responsible for thier actions.
Self-Determined people think and act rationally in ANY given situation. Those that let thier lives be determined by outside sources(such as the beleifes and views of other people, religions, societies, groups etc..) tend to act with reaction to situations. It truly is a grave disservice to everyone
I sincerly hope that as the planet becomes more and more enlightened we start seeing more Self and Co-Determined people and less reactionary Other-Determined individuals.

 

[dullboy]

Its an interesting argument. Cheating because of unfullfillemtn vs. cheating for sex.
What happens if you cheat because you are unfulfilled sexually? Isnt that basically the same thing.
My ex-fiance claimed she was having sex with other men because @ the time I was preparing for a BBing contest. My sex drive was low because I was exhausted most of the time. Apparantly she told the guys she was cheating with "she just needed more cock than what i was giving her". so in essence she was cheating for sex right? or was she unfullfilled? or both? Rasies alot of questions of why cheaters cheat. Unfullfillment and sex aside, its an addiction IMHO. Adultery is exciting, fun, secretive, new, dangerous, etc.... i beleive these are really are the true motivations that cheaters use but most are afraid to admit. No one wants to admit they are intrinsically "bad people" because of things they do. So the ego will make up a bunch of BS to justify thier actions which obviously served them a purpose(i.e. unfullfillment, sex, happiness..ect..). It is amzing, people tha are ruled by the impetuisness of the childish ego mind dont care who or what they have to destroy to achieve it's "goals". Why is it so hard to just break it off with someone B4 the transgressions are commited? The 5 minute conversation and hurt would save years of pain, betrayal, unhappiness and regret.

too many issues here for me address now - but i do have answers to some of your questions.

it's possible, although unlikely, that the cause of your fiance being so unfaithful was that she was clinically "hypersexual".

hypersxuality in females is generally associated with some some of chemical addiction - (was she a drug user - specifically, cocaine?)

hypersexual behavior generally occurs during periods of depression as a result of cocaine use.


the other possibility (though much less likely) is that she suffered some other comorbid condition such as severe ocd.


before i continue - did either of these conditions exist?

 

[Gymgurl]

Its an interesting argument. Cheating because of unfullfillemtn vs. cheating for sex.
What happens if you cheat because you are unfulfilled sexually? Isnt that basically the same thing.
My ex-fiance claimed she was having sex with other men because @ the time I was preparing for a BBing contest. My sex drive was low because I was exhausted most of the time. Apparantly she told the guys she was cheating with "she just needed more cock than what i was giving her". so in essence she was cheating for sex right? or was she unfullfilled? or both? Rasies alot of questions of why cheaters cheat. Unfullfillment and sex aside, its an addiction IMHO. Adultery is exciting, fun, secretive, new, dangerous, etc.... i beleive these are really are the true motivations that cheaters use but most are afraid to admit. No one wants to admit they are intrinsically "bad people" because of things they do. So the ego will make up a bunch of BS to justify thier actions which obviously served them a purpose(i.e. unfullfillment, sex, happiness..ect..). It is amzing, people tha are ruled by the impetuisness of the childish ego mind dont care who or what they have to destroy to achieve it's "goals". Why is it so hard to just break it off with someone B4 the transgressions are commited? The 5 minute conversation and hurt would save years of pain, betrayal, unhappiness and regret.

Very good insight

 

[musclemom]

MM, please understand i am not passing judgement on you or anyone, u did what u felt was the ONLY thing you could do in the current position, and I understand that but i do have some thoughts on the topic. This is kinda more geared toward pople in general and thier methods of handling stressful situations.
U know as well as I do there are ALWAYS other options. And there are no accidents in this world. To say that someone "made" you feel a certain way and "drove" you into bed with an other man shows a lack of self-determinism. I beleive instead of denoting blame on others we should ourselves take responsibility and teach others to be more responsible for thier actions.
Self-Determined people think and act rationally in ANY given situation. Those that let thier lives be determined by outside sources(such as the beleifes and views of other people, religions, societies, groups etc..) tend to act with reaction to situations. It truly is a grave disservice to everyone
I sincerly hope that as the planet becomes more and more enlightened we start seeing more Self and Co-Determined people and less reactionary Other-Determined individuals.

Oh no, Wulf, seriously, I really try to make it clear that what I did: a) Wasn't the BEST solution at the time; b) I wouldn't do it NOW and; c) I own it, if I gave the impression I didn't own it I'm sorry.

You have to understand, I was in my late 20s, quite naive, and I honestly wasn't thinking straight (if I ever had). Were there other options? Probably, but could I see them?? No, so as far as I was concerned, I was trapped, deeply depressed and virtually hopeless. When you say that I my saying he "drove me" to certain actions shows a lack of self-determination ... well, honestly that's a very good descriptoin of me at that time. I was the daughter of an abusive man, and I had married an emotional manipulator/abuser at a very young age (18). I can say comfortably that I completely lacked self determination. Abused children perceive the world differently, and when you're an abused woman who marries another type of abuser ... frankly I had no concept of what "NORMAL" is, if that makes sense.

Today I wouldn't take the shit that my ex handed me, but it was my experiences in struggling to achieve self-actualization and get out of that mistake of a marriage that gave me the confidence to realize that I don't have to let any other person dictate my life or happiness to me.

Was it wrong, of course. Do I regret it? On ONE level, sure, but on another level I learned I was my own master, if that makes sense.

And Wulf I realize we're not debating or anything, I'm just telling you what I lived, that's all (I'm sort of on a journey of self these days, too). The only other person on this planet whose opinion of me that matters is the man I'm married to, and he knew every skeleton in my closet and piece of dirty laundry long before we ever even kissed. He's the only person I've ever had in my life that's ever looked at me and never judged me and found me lacking.

 

[Wulfgar]

too many issues here for me address now - but i do have answers to some of your questions.

it's possible, although unlikely, that the cause of your fiance being so unfaithful was that she was clinically "hypersexual".

hypersxuality in females is generally associated with some some of chemical addiction - (was she a drug user - specifically, cocaine?)

hypersexual behavior generally occurs during periods of depression as a result of cocaine use.


the other possibility (though much less likely) is that she suffered some other comorbid condition such as severe ocd.


before i continue - did either of these conditions exist?

I dont feel she was ever on Coke. She likes weed but thats it. She was always a very high level athlete. She excelled at EVERYTHING she started. But she really never finished anything. She would get distracted and go pursue something else. I wouldnt say OCD..but definately didnt really have too much drection in life. A ton of potential, but no real goals. Of course, she was still in her early 20's...not too many people seem to really know what they want in life @ that age.

 

[Wulfgar]

Oh no, Wulf, seriously, I really try to make it clear that what I did: a) Wasn't the BEST solution at the time; b) I wouldn't do it NOW and; c) I own it, if I gave the impression I didn't own it I'm sorry.

You have to understand, I was in my late 20s, quite naive, and I honestly wasn't thinking straight (if I ever had). Were there other options? Probably, but could I see them?? No, so as far as I was concerned, I was trapped, deeply depressed and virtually hopeless. When you say that I my saying he "drove me" to certain actions shows a lack of self-determination ... well, honestly that's a very good descriptoin of me at that time. I was the daughter of an abusive man, and I had married an emotional manipulator/abuser at a very young age (18). I can say comfortably that I completely lacked self determination. Abused children perceive the world differently, and when you're an abused woman who marries another type of abuser ... frankly I had no concept of what "NORMAL" is, if that makes sense.

Today I wouldn't take the shit that my ex handed me, but it was my experiences in struggling to achieve self-actualization and get out of that mistake of a marriage that gave me the confidence to realize that I don't have to let any other person dictate my life or happiness to me.

Was it wrong, of course. Do I regret it? On ONE level, sure, but on another level I learned I was my own master, if that makes sense.

And Wulf I realize we're not debating or anything, I'm just telling you what I lived, that's all (I'm sort of on a journey of self these days, too). The only other person on this planet whose opinion of me that matters is the man I'm married to, and he knew every skeleton in my closet and piece of dirty laundry long before we ever even kissed. He's the only person I've ever had in my life that's ever looked at me and never judged me and found me lacking.

MM, K to you for being one of the very very few people who can own what they did and who they are. Such a rarity these days. So few people are evolvers of self in this world. It takes ownership to acquire acceptance and understanding of lifes experiences. good or bad. Seems to me that you have learned that. I applaud u.

 

[KillahBee]

no fucking shit...fuck all the hoops american women would have you jump through.

funny you say that, a friend of mine is in Sweden right now and he wrote me this email about the chicks over there:

Oh, don't I know it. None of that cunty 'everyone
pay attention to me and give me everything I want
because I'm a douchebag princess' bullshit American
fuck bitch attitude. IT'S GREAT!

 

[TC2]

funny you say that, a friend of mine is in Sweden right now and he wrote me this email about the chicks over there:

Oh, don't I know it. None of that cunty 'everyone
pay attention to me and give me everything I want
because I'm a douchebag princess' bullshit American
fuck bitch attitude. IT'S GREAT!

Yep..never another white girl for me.

I was at the car wash today, the ones where they detail your car and wash it while you wait, and this typical white american princess, I think my shit don't stink girl was eye fucking the shit outta me.

Don't get me wrong, she was "hot" by most guys standards, blond, fake ass tan skin total memememe girl, I just can't stand that type...I just looked her up and down and looked away letting her know I was totally unimpressed.

I think she came in her pants alittle bit, because I wasnt awe struck by her like everybody else there was.