Bulking on low/moderate carbs

[Deleted member 33117]

I haven't read body opus, but have heard things about the book.

Overhead, I'm the same way. Anyone who is an efficient fat oxidizer can go back into ketosis within 12 hours of cutting their carbs out from their carb up, without a "depletion workout". The amount of glycogen present in muscle tissue and the liver is not that much of a factor in going into ketosis for most people.

 

[overhead]

Yeah Sk, I check with keto strips every now and then. Its funny, but I have been on and off low carb diets for so long now that I can *tell* if I am in ketosis or not. I was checking on Sundays to see how long it took me to get back into ketosis. I think part of the reason I get back into ketosis so quickly is the amount of time I have been doing these type of diets. My body is now more effective in using fat as energy as opposed to carbs. Oddly enough my worst workout of the week is usually Sunday, the day after my carb up, and my best is Weds. Sunday I feel almost hungover, my muscle are "pumped up" for sure, by my energy levels are not good. I am guessing here, but it maybe due to a lack of available ketones in my system, or I am burning off some of the carbs from the day before.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

sk, since overhead is an efficent fat oxidizer and does keto diets very often, he can get into ketosis easier. If he keeps his carbs low enough, he can stay in deep keto with a higher protien intake that alot of others can get away with. I'm eating 500 grams of protien a day, and in deep ketosis. I can stay in ketosis on up to 80 grams of carbs a day, so if I keep it lower, I can substitute a great deal of those carb grams with protien in a 5:1 ratio and do just fine.

 

[overhead]

Don't get me wrong, I do not suck down whey protein shakes all day, much of my protein comes from red meat and chicken. I bet if I threw in 6 whey protein shakes a day I would have a problem staying in ketosis. I have a whey shake after my workouts, and any other shake I have includes olive oil and is usually casinate instead of whey.

 

[sk*]

I don't even feel weak or anything when I switch to a keto type diet.

The first time I did it, it was horrible. I felt like dying and all I could think about was sugar, but these days I can easilly eat no carbs and feel perfectly fine.

I never used the keto strips though and do not know if I get into ketosis or not.

-sk

 

[Deleted member 33117]

I agree on the whey overhead. Whey will very quickly put one out of ketosis. I only use it post-workout, and always mix flax or olive oil with it. Casinate with olive oil should be fine though.

 

[Fat_eater]

sk, since overhead is an efficent fat oxidizer and does keto diets very often, he can get into ketosis easier. If he keeps his carbs low enough, he can stay in deep keto with a higher protien intake that alot of others can get away with. I'm eating 500 grams of protien a day, and in deep ketosis. I can stay in ketosis on up to 80 grams of carbs a day, so if I keep it lower, I can substitute a great deal of those carb grams with protien in a 5:1 ratio and do just fine.

Where you get from the 5:1 ratio?
So basically what you say is the more somebody is efficient in fat burning the more protein/carbs can he eat on keto diets?

How the amount of fat eaten influance it? So if I eat 200 gr of fat and 200 gr of protein or 150 gr fat and 200 gr of protein does it make any difference?

 

[overhead]

I am not sure about the five to one ratio, but if you eat 150 grams of fat or 1800 cals from fat and 200 grams of protein or 800 cals from protein your fat to protein ratio is still pretty high. I focus on keeping fat calories at 50-60% of my total calories.

 

[Deleted member 33117]

What I ment by the 5:1 ratio was that I can drop my carbs by 40 grams (40 instead of 80) and increase my protien 200 grams, and usually still stay in ketosis, as long as my fat intake is over 50% of my calories. Staying in ketosis is about balancing your fat intake with the combined insulin response from your protein/carb intake.

 

[Fat_eater]

What I ment by the 5:1 ratio was that I can drop my carbs by 40 grams (40 instead of 80) and increase my protien 200 grams, and usually still stay in ketosis, as long as my fat intake is over 50% of my calories. Staying in ketosis is about balancing your fat intake with the combined insulin response from your protein/carb intake.

Interesting but it makes me think why you think that taking 200 gr of protein is more beneficial than taking 40 gr of carbs?
You are enhanced so probably for you it makes sense but for natural people I'm not quit sure if it's better.