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250-300g Protein/Day
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germaine91
Banned
Unless you are on a decent amount of gear, you won't need more than 150g protein to build muscle efficiently.
Thats not too much protein at all... I take in 375-400 a day and stay under 2500 calories... If your trying to cut but add size you want that high of protein with low fat, moderate carbs and moderate caloric intake
germaine91
Banned
It's not too much protein but it is an unnecessarily high amount when he only needs ~150g.
You can't realistically build muscle and lose fat simultaneously if you are not on gear unless you are a rank novice or obese.
Low fat is potentially hazardous to health. 0.45g/lb is minimum intake. 0.35-0.5g/lb seems to what the research suggests but going below 0.4g/lb isn't recommended for long periods of time.
Really?? Im a certified nutritionist and that statement is completely inaccurate... This is why i stay out of the diet threads because everyone wants to contradict but cant back it up with results... Do what you will but i assure you with the goals you have that it can be done without gear on that type if diet... What do i know though right?
Pound4PoundAAS
Survivor
I agree, I'm a nutritionist/PT and high protein intake works pretty damn well for me.
Dylan - Germaine is 22 years old, has never run a cycle and knows everything in the universe. He likes to tell RickRock advice about IF, says RippedRev doesn't know how to diet post-cycle, and that you clearly don't know about nutrition. That sub-6% bodyfat of yours is purely an accident - you couldn't possibly know what you're talking about.
germaine91
Banned
Well due to the physiological processes that go on in the body it is extremely difficult to lose weight and build muscle at the same time. I actually am certified in nutrition also but those certs are bogus (no offence intended). I'm going on the study dietary and physiological science and hopefully pursue a PHD. It can be done if:
- Beginner lifter
- Obese
- On Gear
- At such a slow rate no noticeable gains will be apparent
Most people will end up spinning their wheels and make no progress.
As for the protein recommendations, they are fully backed up by research, and lots of it. Eg:
Evaluation of protein requirements for trained strength athletes: Evaluation of protein requirements for trained strength athletes
Effect of Protein Intake on Strength, Body Composition and Endocrine Changes in Strength/Power Athletes: JISSN | Full text | Effect of Protein Intake on Strength, Body Composition and Endocrine Changes in Strength/Power Athletes
The fat intake is based off recommendations that the following leading PHD nutritionists in the sports field; Alan Aragon, Lyle McDonald, Layne Norton & Emma Leigh all recommend.
My claims aren't unsubstantiated, in fact, it's quite the opposite.
Lmao... I have a masters degree... 5.7 % body fat, countless certifications, awards, success over a decade and your going to tell me how it is huh?? Lmfao ok man... I have way too much real life work to do than go back and forth with a fucking kid... Stay in fantasy land...
germaine91
Banned
Trying to slander my name because you can't refute any of my research based statements on nutrition. And then again use another logical fallacy to defend your position. Is this what a reputable poster is here?
germaine91
Banned
Okay so ignore all the hard, science based, peer reviewed data, all supporting my claims, which are true. Ignorance is bliss.
So you think you know more about nutrition than Emma Leigh? Alan Aragon? Lyle McDonald? Layne Norton? Eric Helms?
You have also failed to even try attempt point flaws in my statements, nor have you provided any research stating otherwise.
germaine91
Banned
Here's a direct quote from emma leigh regarding fat intake:
Fats: Generally speaking, although the body can get away with short periods of very low fat, in the long run your body NEEDS fat to maintain general health, satiety, and sanity. However, the guidelines for fat requirements are very hard to find, and most of the time they are 'forgotten' until the end of traditional equations. But there are some studies that suggest the following:
If you are following a 'normal distribution' of intake then something between 1g and 2g per Kg bodyweight (0.4-0.9g per pound total weight) is a good starting figure. If you are overweight, then something between 0.66 and 1.8g per kg lean weight (0.35-0.8g per pound) may be more appropriate.
Note 1: Total fat intake is NOT the same as 'essential fats' (essential fats are specific TYPES of fats that are INCLUDED in your total fat intake).
Note 2: For those who are on LOW carb diets, or those who have SPECIAL NEEDS - fat intakes CAN BE HIGHER with values up 2.2g per kg (1g per pound) can be used.
Fats: Generally speaking, although the body can get away with short periods of very low fat, in the long run your body NEEDS fat to maintain general health, satiety, and sanity. However, the guidelines for fat requirements are very hard to find, and most of the time they are 'forgotten' until the end of traditional equations. But there are some studies that suggest the following:
If you are following a 'normal distribution' of intake then something between 1g and 2g per Kg bodyweight (0.4-0.9g per pound total weight) is a good starting figure. If you are overweight, then something between 0.66 and 1.8g per kg lean weight (0.35-0.8g per pound) may be more appropriate.
Note 1: Total fat intake is NOT the same as 'essential fats' (essential fats are specific TYPES of fats that are INCLUDED in your total fat intake).
Note 2: For those who are on LOW carb diets, or those who have SPECIAL NEEDS - fat intakes CAN BE HIGHER with values up 2.2g per kg (1g per pound) can be used.
The job of any good and smart trainer or nutritionist is to realize every person is different than the other... Instead of taking generalized bull shit you take a person, their circumstance, body type, history etc through consultation and trial and error... You dont take a bunch of regurgitated bull shit snd apply it to everyone and think your right... Thats mot how it works... Maybe thats why i di this for a living... Maybe thats why i have thousands and thousands of clients per year... Maybe thats why ive made it where i am... So ill take what ive got going for me ( hands on knowledge with the feedback and RESULTS to prove it) all day over your cut and paste bullshit and your know it all with no experience to back it up... You are out of your league on this... Throw all your cutting and pasting you want... Then look at my results, check feedback all over the internet, my client list the past fucking decade, my accomplishments etc. and tgen compare it to yours...
germaine91
Banned
Actually it seems you are out of your league. Once again you just ramble on without any peer reviewed scientific evidence.
Yes, diets do have to be tailored individually to a certain degree, but the physiological aspects remain the same.
What I posted is not generalised bull shit. Once again you show your ignorance.
If you done a bit more reading, were a bit more open-minded and took in more information, it would only make you better at what you do.
Lmfao... So send all your clients, your accomplishments, your accolades, your feedback, your pics, etc and lets see whose out of their league my friend... Your a little kid who hasnt and will never do shit... Who has all the respect here? Me or you? Who has the body and knowledge to back what they do? Me or you? Ask around... Lets see all your accomplishments and compare then... You dont know shit my friend... Your a little kid that has not done one thing... Like i said, i have all the back up you dont
germaine91
Banned
Seems all of your posts revolve around a bunch of nonsense that has no relevance to the topic at hand. And referring to your physique or whatever as proof is a logical fallacy, thus making it void.
Accolades?
Accomplishments?
You have more than Layne Norton, Lyle McDonald, Alan Aragon, Eric Helms, Emma Leigh altogether? Doubt it. Doubt you have as many as even one of those.
Seriously, brush up on your knowledge with some recent research.
Who also obviously has no respect for anybody as well...still is young enough to educate himself better and come back once he does.
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germaine91
Banned
Wrong assumption. I'm not trying to come across disrespectful at all. I'm merely pointing out flaws and misconceptions in certain people's statements. They then take offence because I call them out on bad information.
I am educating myself constantly, and I urge you's to do the same, as most of the information being said is very outdated, not backed by science and actually refuted by peer reviewed research.
Neither do you kid.
I'd like to see a picture of this troll to see what we're dealing with here...
germaine91
Banned
1. I never stated I did. I do however follow their work.
2. Because that's relevant...... Ad hominem?
Kid, I have a daughter your age, I am 42 years old, been bodybuilding over 20 years, do I have a bogus (as you say) certification in nutrition...no, do I have education based on what I have researched and through trial and error...real life experience...yes. Have I competed in bodybuilding which requires strict dieting, training, and knowledge for muscle groups...yes several, and have done pretty well. Do I have an ego and go around like yourself attacking mods and respected members of this forum thinking I am the all knowing on nutrition and stating I have scientific evidence...no, my bros here know me pretty well and know the type of man I am...one who loves this lifestyle, loves helping others, and loves to compete in bodybuilding. Do you? I am a mod on this forum and so is my bro Dylan, and keep this in mind...attacking a mod is like wrestling a pig in the mud...eventually you find out the pig enjoys it. I would suggest that you pick up your ego and leave it at the door and you are welcome back in to be a humble contributor to this forum we all call home...we are not about to have some young kid come into our home and disrespect our family like you are doing...this will be considered a final friendly warning...do you hear me???
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Thanks guys... this is the type of shit that makes me not even want to help... getting put into question when there is nothing to question but this kid is just one of those know it alls and that doesn't know shit... its more than comical...
I have kept this asshole in the dark for like three days now so I don't have to read his nonsense copy paste google bullshit
Dylan, you obviously lack knowledge of nutrition. Lose some weight fatty. And everyone is individual? You made that up...
MA, what's that daughter look like?
Haha just kiddin man, hope you and your girls are doing well buddy!
Dylan, you obviously lack knowledge of nutrition. Lose some weight fatty. And everyone is individual? You made that up...
MA, what's that daughter look like?
Haha just kiddin man, hope you and your girls are doing well buddy!
Nevermind about my daughter and go have an animal cracker or something...she is beautiful and a know it all as well, it's the underdevelopment of the frontal lobe of the brain, it isn't until they reach 25 when they actually start to make any kind of sense from what I have been told.
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Look at me I can regurgitate the shit I read in books and pretend I know what I am talking about. Kid you are a typical punk looser. You haven't been on this earth long enough to have real knowledge so you quote books as a reference to give yourself some false wealth of knowledge. I wouldn't pay you to give nutritional advice to my dog. You don't know how to adapt what you have read to individuals so you clump everyone into a large group. Pretty sad life of false Impressionism if you ask me.
Oh and your lack of respect shows what a soar looser you are. Well most just a looser, but a soar one too.
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That plus the fact that all women are batshit crazy . . . love them to death but even most of them will admit they are nuts when they are being honest about it.
Hey...only this dad can call his daughter batshit crazy...it is more like she has been abducted and hasn't returned yet. Women are a necessity of a mans life...if we didn't have them to take care of us or for us to fornicate with men would have killed eachother off a long time ago.
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Murker
New member
Real talk right there man! Too much generalizing on forums, gotta get the information thats right for you, and only you! Germaine tried to feed me that crap too, I was thinking like "wth is this guy talking about, none of this sounds right at all"
EDIT : 250-300grams of protien!?!? great god! haha. I should try that out, just I find it so difficult to consume that much protein. For example, to get in around 30-40grams of protein I would need to eat a whole skinless lean chicken breast. Thats like 9 chicken breasts a day!(of course I know you will be taking in protein in other ways, but please, enlighten me how!)
EDIT EDIT : By enlighten me, I mean give me an example of the meal plan in a 24 hour period that grants you over 250 grams of protein, not doubting you can do, I just want to know how
Wasn't speaking about yours in particular - just women in general. And I'm joking (well at least partially). I love them and worship them. Raised by a single mother and treat the women in my life like queens. Irrational queens who can't make up their mind and speak a different language than men . . . .
There's an old George Carlin quote that goes something to the effect of "All women are fucking crazy. All men are fucking stupid. Half the reason women are fucking crazy is because men are stupid. The other half just comes naturally."
germaine91
Banned
That's why you've been PM'ing me asking for my advice......
I haven't fed you any crap. It's really easy. Here let me show you. For a natural:
Figure out maintenance calories
Subtract 10-20%
Eat 1g/lb Protein
Eat 0.45g/lb Fat
Fill remaining calories primarily with carbs but a combination of others is fine.
Try get 13-15g/1,000kcal fibre
Yes diets can be tailored but that's an individual thing. Find out whether you need a pre-workout meal or train fasted. Figure out if you respond better to high fat or high carb. But those guidelines still apply.
Actually I never attacked anyone personally or disrespected anyone. Look at the posts. It's the opposite.
I'm not a sore loser. Why would I be? I'm not losing anything. I've provided hard evidence substantiating my claims. I've proved you wrong.
Can you regurgitate what you have read in books or in research papers? Have you actually read anything relevant of that nature?
The truth hurts. None of it is copy and paste google crap. It's called research.
Actually there is something to question. You still haven't been able to provide any peer reviewed research supporting your claims. I have. Don't get so offended. I'm not attacking you or your profession, just some of your information.
I've not been unfriendly per se, nor do I think I'm a know-it-all or claim to be. You're making assertions of me with little validity. I never attacked anyone personally, just pointed out the flaws and misconceptions with regards some of the information. I don't understand why people are getting so butt hurt.
Also, yeah real life experience is great in finding out what works best for you, but it's anecdotal evidence and not really accepted.
Post pics then so we see how great your diet is and then post some client feedback and maybe some proof you make a living doing this... Lets start there...
germaine91
Banned
Why? That doesn't change anything. The information is the same regardless. The science is the same regardless. The research is the same regardless.
If it turns out I'm Jay Cutler does that mean everything I said is true?
Why don't you google what a logical fallacy is. Scroll through them. I'm sure you've used a few, including but not limited to, ad hominen.
Jigga14
New member
Germaine I'm pretty sure Dylan just wanted to see if you have applied your knowledge to the real world. Scientific literature is great, but it is not the end all be all. only a few hundred years ago we thought the world was flat. For every study there is another study showing different results.
The question is, do you apply your knowledge and see real world results in your personal training or that of your clients? Or are you just some google happy kid in his parents basement who loves regurgitating info because he wants to look smarter than a group of seasoned bodybuilders and fitness enthusiasts?
The question is, do you apply your knowledge and see real world results in your personal training or that of your clients? Or are you just some google happy kid in his parents basement who loves regurgitating info because he wants to look smarter than a group of seasoned bodybuilders and fitness enthusiasts?
germaine91
Banned
If you want a good example follow Matt Ogus on youtube.
Myself, I do apply it. I track macros daily and find it extremely easy to manipulate body composition doing so. It also is a great way to figure out what your body responds best to.
What is that your are saying?
I can't read all that black.
I can't read all that black.
germaine91
Banned
You're really mature. How old are you again?.....
Just post a pic bro, we all have pics and vids up...
Stop avoiding it.
This is a callout.
Stop avoiding it.
This is a callout.
Attack me and I'll ban your ass so fast, Dylan is a well knowledged mod here. You have a problem with him you have a problem with me
germaine91
Banned
Ban me for proving that your nutritional information is incorrect?
Try call me out on some of the information I posted...
The maturity level in this thread is pathetic. Agree to disagree. Getting personal and insulting someone over their thoughts is childish. I love this forum, but this is embarrassing. After 13 years I thought we had a little more class. After 13 years, I should have know better. For shame.
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E
Evan Tipps
Guest
I agree completely.. They bring up respect.. But are completely disrespectful
Then fucking leave if you don't like it.
E
Evan Tipps
Guest
Lol.. You're a arrogant prick who looks like shit. Ban me. I don't give two shits. There ya go! I gave you the same respect you gave me
only thing is, I'll get banned for it. But your fat ass won't! I don't fucking care though.
Lol.. You're a arrogant prick who looks like shit. Ban me. I don't give two shits. There ya go! I gave you the same respect you gave me
Lol@fatass have you seen pics of me? My left leg weighs more than your body. Nice hair.
roguemonkeyjr
New member
Germaine91... youre pretty funny. You think you can just waltz in here and insult and criticize and tell other people that our most reputable members know nothing about what they do. That alone is just disrespectful. I think I speak for almost every member of the EF family that Dylan, Rick and RippedRev have always given great advice to EVERYONE! Not only do they know what the f*ck they are talking about but they have the proof that they know what the f*ck they are talking about! So I think you should just back off and leave and never come back you are just pissing everybody off (this ain't no assumption). Leave and go back to your shitty techniques and your super knowledge and start your own fucking forum! Thanks and have a nice day
Ryan
you are just pissing everybody off (this ain't no assumption). Leave and go back to your shitty techniques and your super knowledge and start your own fucking forum! Thanks and have a nice day Ryan
TheRippedReverend
Banned
TheRippedReverend
Banned
Lmao!!! Thanks for puttin sum comedy in here man after readin this dudes bs I bn goin at with him since dat day.
Own dis bish!!!
Germain a tang whats your fav color?
BLACK
Welcome to EF
germaine91
Banned
Because it is pointless. What is the point? Explain. If I'm Jay Cutler all of a sudden my information is correct? Seriously, go to Google, type in Logical fallacies, scroll through them, read them, pay close attention to ad hominem.
Germaine91... youre pretty funny. You think you can just waltz in here and insult and criticize and tell other people that our most reputable members know nothing about what they do. That alone is just disrespectful. I think I speak for almost every member of the EF family that Dylan, Rick and RippedRev have always given great advice to EVERYONE! Not only do they know what the f*ck they are talking about but they have the proof that they know what the f*ck they are talking about! So I think you should just back off and leave and never come back
Ryan
1. I didn't insult anybody. Don't know where you got that from. It has been the other way around.
2. I never told people they know nothing. Selective reading.....
3. They don't have proof.
4. I can come in a criticize information when it's wrong.
Exactly. Do you think I have been respectful? I haven't intended to be disrespectful in my posts.
Couldn't agree with you more. Hard to believe I'm the 21 year old the way some people are taking criticism of their information.
kitstreasure
New member
Germaine, you are a blind man trying to tell a sighted man what color clothes he's wearing. You can post links to your "peer reviewed scientific research" all you want, I can post study after study to counter what you're posting. For that matter, there are now several studies on just how worthless "peer reviewed scientific research" has become in the scheme of things due to the way that the peer review is handled. Please stop trying to shove your perspective and opinion down everyone else's throat. You have repeatedly stated your opinion and thoughts on this matter, and no one agrees with you. Dude, just let it go.
Roth753repper
New member
I may be mistaken, but did you go from a certified nutritionist to an English major. Take your ad hominem and logical fallacy shit somewhere else.
germaine91
Banned
Yes research is worthless. Guess we just better give up trying to evolve. Maybe we should go back to living in caves and hunting with spears.
Do it.
germaine91
Banned
In this thread people can't refute my claims so call me a dumb kid. Logic is strong in these forums. Also people get butt hurt, offended and turn to logical fallacies and slander to argue my claims. Classy.
As you know, you are going to enjoy a timeout for posting disrespectful posts on another thread. Grow up
germaine91
Banned
Show me my disrespectful posts.
Other members have came in and even pointed out it is not me who has been disrespectful. You're just taking sides instead of actually reading what has gone on.
C0LUMB0
Moderator
Take a step back , drop the preachy attitude and all the other BS.
Any more nonsense in this thread or any others and its lights out.
Final warning.
I shit 150 grams of protein every time my ass hits the seat. 150 grams is nothing.
But, this thread got way out of hand in just about every direction. Let's not let this happen again.
People may come and post peer reviewed studies about XYZ, and still be wrong. Fine. Are they trolls? Maybe. Maybe they just don't know any better. Anyone who says an athlete only needs 150g of protein a day isn't an athlete.
1g/lb? Maybe if you want to maintain and you're not too big to begin with (<200lbs). If you're trying to gain/bulk then I generally recommend 2g/lb or even more.
Meantime, EVERYONE please be more respectful. If you want to disagree, do it respectfully please.
But, this thread got way out of hand in just about every direction. Let's not let this happen again.
People may come and post peer reviewed studies about XYZ, and still be wrong. Fine. Are they trolls? Maybe. Maybe they just don't know any better. Anyone who says an athlete only needs 150g of protein a day isn't an athlete.
1g/lb? Maybe if you want to maintain and you're not too big to begin with (<200lbs). If you're trying to gain/bulk then I generally recommend 2g/lb or even more.
Meantime, EVERYONE please be more respectful. If you want to disagree, do it respectfully please.
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