fixed cutting diet

[blood_drinker]

wtf!!!
I *COMPLETELY* agree with MS about it working in practice but not in theory. It has been my case.
And your theory isn't very solid, and just like our theory, yours has no scientific evidence. The difference between the two is that we have more "practice evidence" than your theory does. So what's it gonna be? Yours to decide. Try em both, see what works best for your body.

I think that's a solution we can all live with.

And MS, could you go into the biochemistry of

breakdown of muscle as a part of muscle "remodelling" is probably one of the most important aspects of muscle growth/maintenance in the right environment. In other words, short-term catabolism can lead to long term muscle growth/maintenance if you play your cards right.

Im interested, as this could be a final argument to this case. And if you have scientifc evidence of whatever you are going to say, that will shut cackerot up.

Not cackerot that Im not attempting to disrespect you. I actually respect you for doubting conventional thinking, it is what makes good scientists. But unfortunately im not on your side, that's all.

Peace

 

[Cackerot69]

"This is my last post on this subject, we are not getting anywhere."

No need to "shut me up", I'm already done.

Listen, There isn't any scientific evidence to support EITHER side, it just hasn't been done. All we have to work with is knowledge of the body, which i have explained numerous times in this thread.

EOD.

 

[MS]

I'm sorry it's your last post on this topic crackerot, because you've obviously been doing some deep thinking on this subject. No I am not on AS, and never have been. And I have many happy clients who have dieted for shows using this technique with good results.

Yes, you will catabolize some muscle (no matter when you do your cardio), but as long as you get enough carbs and protein circulating soon afterwards, the muscle catabolism (that is already underway to a certain extent when you roll out of bed) is repaired. This is part of humans normal adaptation to regular prolonged fasting. As long as the circulating amino acid pool is kept 'topped up', there is no evidence that this short term catabolism is permanent. If it were, we would gradually get smaller everytime we get up in the morning!

There is a tremendous amount of individual response to this. There is evidence (even in humans) that adrenergic stimulation such as induced by exercize or the use of beta-agonists (which I use before am cardio) favorably influence the ratio of calpistatin:calpain in skeletal muscle. We can expect that, just like in other animals, some humans will naturally exhibit different ratios or isoforms of these enzyme systems which may be why "it works for me but not for you". Of considerable interest to me is that Anabolic steroids upregulate calpistatin AND down regulate calpain, and this may ultimately prove to be their only truly 'anabolic' effect.

I should also mention that I am a big fan of glutamine and free form amino acids before my cardio, so it may be misleading to call it exercize on an empty stomach.

Ultimately, what this all means is that you need to try it and see if it works for you. If you feel you're losing too much muscle by doing cardio on an empty stomach, then by all means train later in the day, or have a small meal (or glutamine and amino acids). But IMHO 'catabolism' is the most abused and misunderstood word used by bodybuilders. Sometimes I get the impression that folks think they're going to shrink away like Alice-in-Wonderland just because they're an hour late for a meal, or have to get up and milk the cows before breakfast (or heaven forbid, go out and exert yourself to catch your breakfast like our predecessors).