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Fattest guy on EF shred log... gw starting soon

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Addcd2gains

New member
Age: 21
W: 245
H: 6
BF: 30/35%

Okay, here we go. Time to shed all the weight I gained from my last FAILED tren cycle/lazyfuck syndrome. (Was doing great running tren/sust but tore rotator cuff, stayed on cycle in hope to heal shoulder faster... ended up not helping and just gaining 20 lbs.) I started last cycle at 195, tore rotator cuff 4 weeks into cycle at 217. Gained another 20 lbs after that (lost ALL muscle as well)... and basically became the laziest fuck ever. Got my medical marijuana card to "help" with shoulder pain...(it actually did help) but I also think smoking so much helped me loose all motivation to workout. Well, I stopped smoking about 2 weeks ago, and guess what? Im motivated to work out again!

...anyway, done blabbering. In short, I wanna run gw but cant afford it atm. Thought about waiting to start till I saved up enough to run it, but fuck that. Starting today. Will buy gw (tripple stack if I can) when I can.

I am running Kris Gethin 12 week trainer (modified once I start gw/tripple.stack.)

Ugh....... this is me, today:

I know about the gyno. The tissue actually isn't as bad as it looks, im just fat. The tissue is maybe 2 inches in diameter.

I'm no expert, this is just a way for me to track my progress, and receive criticism on my tactics to help guide my path.
 
Cannabanoids isn't that where all the good stuff is from in pot. Just Juice raw pot plants with high cannabinoids in it to get some real benefits.


My new phone update is killing me with auto correct and whacky sentence structures.

learn and apply
 
Last edited:
Do not run steroids if that's your question. Run the GW and some other sarms but you need to hit the treadmill and some weights and get your diet in check before anything else.
 
Do not run steroids if that's your question. Run the GW and some other sarms but you need to hit the treadmill and some weights and get your diet in check before anything else.

I didn't have a question.. no way in hell I'm gonna run a cycle till I loose all this bf... I'm focusing on diet and cardio.. all im taking is whey and bcaa... gw when I can afford it. No juice for me for a while

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I didn't have a question.. no way in hell I'm gonna run a cycle till I loose all this bf... I'm focusing on diet and cardio.. all im taking is whey and bcaa... gw when I can afford it. No juice for me for a while

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Don't do cardio, very little effect.

I was the same 1,5y ago, just 45 years young -:).

Weight training and HIIT does the trick...for me generally cardio is a waist of time and you spent to much time spinning wheels.
 
I took me1702s advice today and went with HIIT today.. thanks bud, good advice this was KILLER! Did HIIT at 10am this morning as well as chest, triceps and core at 3pm... I'm whipped.. doms should be kicking in tomorrow from legs yesterday, but I'm sure doing HIIT today helped that.

This was what I did for HIIT today (it was ugly and sloppy but I'll get there)

Workout Structure
Quick Cardio Warm Up
30 Minute HIIT Workout
33 Minutes Total
365-530 Calories Burned Total
No Equipment
Cool Down not included


HIIT Round One: Descending Ladder - Varying Active Intervals Per Exercise (15 seconds of rest in-between each)
- Using just two bodyweight exercises, we start off with 50 second intervals, and work our way down to 10 seconds. Do an entire descending ladder with each exercise.

50 Burpees
40 &
30 Walk Downs
20
10


HIIT Round Two: Pyramid Structure - Per Exercise (15 seconds of rest in-between each)
- Start off with short intervals; increasing by 10 seconds with each bout of activity, that reach a maximum length of 40 seconds before decreasing again. Just as you get to the point where you think that you can't go any longer, the active intervals begin to get easier again.

10 Mt Climber
20 &
30 High Knees
40
30
20
10


HIIT Round Three: Tabata - 20 On and 10 Off x 2 for each exercise
- Basic Tabata structure; do two rounds of each exercise before moving to the next. This one moves quickly.

1 Seal Push Ups
2 Jumping Lunges
3 Crossover Push Ups
4 Side Plank Toe Touches (L)
5 Side Plank Toe Touches (R)
6 Supine Plank Alternating Jackknifes (from crab walk position)
7 Lateral Jumps
8 Toe Touch Squats
9 Agility Dots
10 Jumping Jacks

Hasta mañana hombres
 
I took me1702s advice today and went with HIIT today.. thanks bud, good advice this was KILLER! Did HIIT at 10am this morning as well as chest, triceps and core at 3pm... I'm whipped.. doms should be kicking in tomorrow from legs yesterday, but I'm sure doing HIIT today helped that.

This was what I did for HIIT today (it was ugly and sloppy but I'll get there)

Workout Structure
Quick Cardio Warm Up
30 Minute HIIT Workout
33 Minutes Total
365-530 Calories Burned Total
No Equipment
Cool Down not included


HIIT Round One: Descending Ladder - Varying Active Intervals Per Exercise (15 seconds of rest in-between each)
- Using just two bodyweight exercises, we start off with 50 second intervals, and work our way down to 10 seconds. Do an entire descending ladder with each exercise.

50 Burpees
40 &
30 Walk Downs
20
10


HIIT Round Two: Pyramid Structure - Per Exercise (15 seconds of rest in-between each)
- Start off with short intervals; increasing by 10 seconds with each bout of activity, that reach a maximum length of 40 seconds before decreasing again. Just as you get to the point where you think that you can't go any longer, the active intervals begin to get easier again.

10 Mt Climber
20 &
30 High Knees
40
30
20
10


HIIT Round Three: Tabata - 20 On and 10 Off x 2 for each exercise
- Basic Tabata structure; do two rounds of each exercise before moving to the next. This one moves quickly.

1 Seal Push Ups
2 Jumping Lunges
3 Crossover Push Ups
4 Side Plank Toe Touches (L)
5 Side Plank Toe Touches (R)
6 Supine Plank Alternating Jackknifes (from crab walk position)
7 Lateral Jumps
8 Toe Touch Squats
9 Agility Dots
10 Jumping Jacks

Hasta mañana hombres

Not bad, just have mind HIIT is doing right very hard on your system, don't do more then 4 times a 20 min.

You can make HIIT easier in your gym. I follow Dr. Watson (performance lab Tampa) wind gate protocol.

5 min on spinning bike
10-15 sets of max 30 sec all out sprints.
Start in low gear, 5sec before you start with sprint hit the paddle as hard as you can. After 5 sec go to highest resistance and spin for 30 sec. Reality, you can't go longer then 20 sec.
Rest 30 sec low gear and catch breath and go again 14 sets.

HIIT is all about increase fat oxidation, you don't burn "much" fat during the exercise, but you burn fat on a high rate the rest of the day.

Ben Palulski, by the way my online couch, did this protocol before the Arnold and his legs grow -:)
 
I know you are pumped to start working out and getting on the right track.. but, you should start into it slow. A lot of people fail at their fitness journey because they throw so much at their body at once, instead gradually working themselves into. Those intense workout sessions are great, but they are going to drive your hunger go through the roof.. but you just started this new diet so your calories are limited. The first few days, maybe a week of this will be fine.. but eventually you're going to breakdown. Either not go to the gym, or stop your diet.. Something. Because all of this sudden change is just too much for your body and mind to handle.

The first thing you need in place is your diet. Then comes the training and working out.. In that order, not vise versa. Now you should still go to the gym and workout, just keep your workload minimum so you don't push your body to hard. Then after a few weeks of dieting and your body has adjusted, you can start to increase your workout workload, then a couple weeks later increase it some more. In a month or two, your diet will be spot on and you will be killing it in the gym, and your body and mind will be able to handle it just fine.

Hope that makes sense.

Best of luck on your journey.
 
Wish you the best of luck. Did you have a base before juicing? It would explain a rotator cuff Injury on steroids; especially tren which sends your strength through the roof. It's important that guys have a solid muscle foundation before juicing because it almost always results in injury. Tendon and ligament growth just can't keep up with muscle growth
 
Keep up the good work, bro, I love me some Tabata it's effective and only takes 4 minutes. In reference to strength training, lifting heavy shit is the most beneficial for your metabolism since it releases large amounts of testosterone and growth hormone. One full body workout or compound lift such as deadlift, squats or bench will keep your metabolism elevated for 2 days. That means strength training 3x week will keep your metabolism elevated all week and you're not putting your body in a catabolic state. Just a little tidbit to help with your progress. Remember, elite fitness is a marathon not a sprint. Go at your own pace and things will happen without you even realizing it. We're all here to help you so if you need some motivation don't be afraid to ask, buddy! Keep the updates coming.
 
The trick is to do as little as possible and still continue to lose fat. Don't go crazy doing so many session of HIT a week. There is no need to at this point.

By just changing ur diet, u should lose weight for well over a month without ever having to do cardio.

Once u kinda stall out then u SLOWLY start adding some cardio. And reduce cals.
 
I know you are pumped to start working out and getting on the right track.. but, you should start into it slow. A lot of people fail at their fitness journey because they throw so much at their body at once, instead gradually working themselves into. Those intense workout sessions are great, but they are going to drive your hunger go through the roof.. but you just started this new diet so your calories are limited. The first few days, maybe a week of this will be fine.. but eventually you're going to breakdown. Either not go to the gym, or stop your diet.. Something. Because all of this sudden change is just too much for your body and mind to handle.

The first thing you need in place is your diet. Then comes the training and working out.. In that order, not vise versa. Now you should still go to the gym and workout, just keep your workload minimum so you don't push your body to hard. Then after a few weeks of dieting and your body has adjusted, you can start to increase your workout workload, then a couple weeks later increase it some more. In a month or two, your diet will be spot on and you will be killing it in the gym, and your body and mind will be able to handle it just fine.

Hope that makes sense.

Best of luck on your journey.

makes sense, it's just when I get something in my head I'm a balls to the wall kind of guy... I'd almost rather keep at my pace and if I absolutely need more calories, I'll eat them. I'm doing 20carbs a day (just what's in my milk basically) and that's it.. not worrying about fat intake really at all... that's the taubes theory and I saw my dad loose 20 lbs in 2.5 months doing 30mins cardio every other day, and eating bacon, heavy cream, any fats he wanted... and he is 56!
You might be right, but I'm not worried about calories, only carbs... for now

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Wish you the best of luck. Did you have a base before juicing? It would explain a rotator cuff Injury on steroids; especially tren which sends your strength through the roof. It's important that guys have a solid muscle foundation before juicing because it almost always results in injury. Tendon and ligament growth just can't keep up with muscle growth

Yeah I had been lifting since I got out of high school, and was in wrestling/football 3 years in high school. Soph, jun, sen.

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Wish you the best of luck. Did you have a base before juicing? It would explain a rotator cuff Injury on steroids; especially tren which sends your strength through the roof. It's important that guys have a solid muscle foundation before juicing because it almost always results in injury. Tendon and ligament growth just can't keep up with muscle growth

It was just crazy how fast I was going up in weight and I got cocky with dumb bell flies

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I didn't have a question.. no way in hell I'm gonna run a cycle till I loose all this bf... I'm focusing on diet and cardio.. all im taking is whey and bcaa... gw when I can afford it. No juice for me for a while

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Nice man and good luck,im also trying to loose some bf before touching AAS even though im at 15% but i feel i should drop some more naturally first


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The trick is to do as little as possible and still continue to lose fat. Don't go crazy doing so many session of HIT a week. There is no need to at this point.

By just changing ur diet, u should lose weight for well over a month without ever having to do cardio.

Once u kinda stall out then u SLOWLY start adding some cardio. And reduce cals.

That's pretty much what RFJ said. You guys are right, I just miss the gym a lot. I wanna live there again, you know? Maybe it's my pride, but I feel like I can sustain my diet and workout how I have been.. you are right about the HIIT though, I'm in literal pain today. Like not a good kind of pain. I think I'll take today off and just stretch, hit hot tub and steam room.

Failure is not an option!

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Nice man and good luck,im also trying to loose some bf before touching AAS even though im at 15% but i feel i should drop some more naturally first


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Thanks bro.. what do you mean naturally? The only non natural way off losing weight I'm aware of is lipo and anorexia lol

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Thanks bro.. what do you mean naturally? The only non natural way off losing weight I'm aware of is lipo and anorexia lol

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Sorry for not making my self clear mate i mean im not in to any drug at the moment im only training and getting my diet fixed


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So I took your guys advice and took it easy today.

Workout log: 1/5/14
Dumb bell bench:
40lbs 15r
45lbs 12r
50lbs 10r
Incline db bench:
35lbs 15r (failure at 10r)
35lbs 10r (failure at 7r)... total failure
Tricep v bar pull downs:
80lbs 15r
90lbs 12r
100lbs 10r
110lbs 8r
120lbs 6r (5.5r)
Tricep strait bar 80 lb to failure
20r

Cardio
20 min walk to gym
30 minutes bike HR goal set to 155.

Post workout 2 raw eggs 1 large chicken breast 1 avacado

I'm pooped
 
Diet it's basic. 20grams carbs, basically unlimited fat, 200g protein, lots of veggies, and some low sugar fruits. It's the taubes diet plus my 20g of carbs.. I gotta have milk with my protein shakes

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You're eating fruit and milk with unlimited fat? That's a recipe for disaster. If you're doing low carbs, ketogenic style diet, you're going to need to cut out ALL the lactose and fructose. It's only going to hinder your fat loss by filling your liver with glycogen (fructose is stored in the liver first) and preventing a full ketogenic state.

The ratios you should be doing are around: 50% fat/45% protein/5% carbs to start and shift closer to the evolutionary diet ratios as you keep going.
 
You're eating fruit and milk with unlimited fat? That's a recipe for disaster. If you're doing low carbs, ketogenic style diet, you're going to need to cut out ALL the lactose and fructose. It's only going to hinder your fat loss by filling your liver with glycogen (fructose is stored in the liver first) and preventing a full ketogenic state.

The ratios you should be doing are around: 50% fat/45% protein/5% carbs to start and shift closer to the evolutionary diet ratios as you keep going.

Not all fruits, I'm actually not sure which ones I can have but I haven't had any yet. And I'm tapering of carbs cause I felt ill after trying to go cold turkey. Only carbs I had today was a cup of cheerios and 1 banana (okay, guess I did have 1 piece of fruit) and a cup of milk.. I will be moving toward what you suggested soon, should be there by the end of the week

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Not all fruits, I'm actually not sure which ones I can have but I haven't had any yet. And I'm tapering of carbs cause I felt ill after trying to go cold turkey. Only carbs I had today was a cup of cheerios and 1 banana (okay, guess I did have 1 piece of fruit) and a cup of milk.. I will be moving toward what you suggested soon, should be there by the end of the week

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Change the cheerios to oatmeal, drop the banana and milk, add more veggies and fiber. Are you taking psyllium husk fiber and probiotics? If not, start asap.

When are you starting your Cardarine (GW)?
 
Change the cheerios to oatmeal, drop the banana and milk, add more veggies and fiber. Are you taking psyllium husk fiber and probiotics? If not, start asap.

When are you starting your Cardarine (GW)?

K, I'll do that. What's psyllium husk fiber, and why do I need to be taking that and the probiotics?

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Change the cheerios to oatmeal, drop the banana and milk, add more veggies and fiber. Are you taking psyllium husk fiber and probiotics? If not, start asap.

When are you starting your Cardarine (GW)?

...I honestly don't know. But most likely within a week. As soon as I get $120, then however long it takes to get here

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So I took your guys advice and took it easy today.

Workout log: 1/5/14
Dumb bell bench:
40lbs 15r
45lbs 12r
50lbs 10r
Incline db bench:
35lbs 15r (failure at 10r)
35lbs 10r (failure at 7r)... total failure
Tricep v bar pull downs:
80lbs 15r
90lbs 12r
100lbs 10r
110lbs 8r
120lbs 6r (5.5r)
Tricep strait bar 80 lb to failure
20r

Cardio
20 min walk to gym
30 minutes bike HR goal set to 155.

Post workout 2 raw eggs 1 large chicken breast 1 avacado

I'm pooped

Try not to train to failure. It may seem like a good idea but the next time you workout your muscles won't contract/fire as efficiently due to a defense mechanism. I always leave a few reps in the bank. There's a saying that goes, "If you train to failure you are training to fail." Just a heads up, bro.
 
Try not to train to failure. It may seem like a good idea but the next time you workout your muscles won't contract/fire as efficiently due to a defense mechanism. I always leave a few reps in the bank. There's a saying that goes, "If you train to failure you are training to fail." Just a heads up, bro.

Really? Even if I hit each muscle group once every 3 or 4 days?

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Ugh.. got up early to go to gym today, but it's -11 out there in "sunny" Colorado. Since I can't drive, I might be waiting a little while. I freaking hate wintertime!

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good luck bro.. I hope this helps you get to the right direction and I have zero problem with you using GW in this type of situation. its actually part of my shredder stack

however as you know fat loss starts in the kitchen, the GW will aid you along but you will have much stronger results with the kitchen. I agree with what a previous poster WOlfgangalpha said.. no more cereal and milk bro. the advertising that claims cheerios is good for you is bullshit, maybe for a kid its better than eating some other crap for breakfast but you are a man now.. eat some eggs instead, cooked slowly and not fried. and make sure they aren't cooked in bad oils..

also consider reading my shredder stack in my signature below and following that, this is perfect for you. I have overweight clients who have very fast results following it.
 
well done for having the balls to post this thread, best of luck bro...if you need help with diet or training just PM me.

i have hit you with a temp plat membership.
 
Breakfast: 3 eggs, 2 pinches of bacon bits, cheddar cheese, half ovacado, and 2 cups of coffee.

Success note: haven't smoked a cigarette in 3 days :)

Workout plan: back and biceps, 30 minutes fat burn mode on the bike
 
good luck bro.. I hope this helps you get to the right direction and I have zero problem with you using GW in this type of situation. its actually part of my shredder stack

however as you know fat loss starts in the kitchen, the GW will aid you along but you will have much stronger results with the kitchen. I agree with what a previous poster WOlfgangalpha said.. no more cereal and milk bro. the advertising that claims cheerios is good for you is bullshit, maybe for a kid its better than eating some other crap for breakfast but you are a man now.. eat some eggs instead, cooked slowly and not fried. and make sure they aren't cooked in bad oils..

also consider reading my shredder stack in my signature below and following that, this is perfect for you. I have overweight clients who have very fast results following it.

Right on. If I need carbs again I'll just eat some oats like alpha said. After my workout yesterday I just felt like Casio and I know it's cause I went from hundreds of carbs a day to 0. My diet plan is the Gary Taubes diet, or basically the evo diet. Kitchen is going good so far. Haven't really had any cravings yet

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THIS is what I call dinner!
Chicken, brocalli, ovacado, cherry tomatoes, brocalli smothered in buttery chicken seasoning and parmisan cheese... yum!

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Not all fruits, I'm actually not sure which ones I can have but I haven't had any yet. And I'm tapering of carbs cause I felt ill after trying to go cold turkey. Only carbs I had today was a cup of cheerios and 1 banana (okay, guess I did have 1 piece of fruit) and a cup of milk.. I will be moving toward what you suggested soon, should be there by the end of the week

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actually if you are going to use gw, low carb/ high fat is not the best option

gw will bypass carbs and go right to fat burning..much better using a balanced or low fat diet
 
Eating less than 20 carbs a day is going to backfire my man. You will be a fat burning machine for a couple weeks, but then your body will start burning fat and muscle. You need to make sure to do some re-feeds every 7-10 days (high carb days) to get you body back into an anabolic state. This way you can wreak the benefits on low carb/fat burning diet, and also maintain muscle mass.

Also, eating that few of carbs and being in a caloric deficit is going to drive your hunger through the roof.. where "cravings" turn into a necessity to eat. So you may binge or purge because it is your bodies natural response.. like a survival instinct.

You also just started killin it in the gym which is going to increase the potential problems I just told you about.
 
actually if you are going to use gw, low carb/ high fat is not the best option

gw will bypass carbs and go right to fat burning..much better using a balanced or low fat diet

Well if it burns fat like its marketed, I would think that low carb high fat would be best?.I've acting seen people say that on here. I wanna say it was gemelli but I can't say for sure. I've also decided not to start taking gw until I hit a weight loss plateau... let it kick in and work it's magic when my body is done working its own

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Eating less than 20 carbs a day is going to backfire my man. You will be a fat burning machine for a couple weeks, but then your body will start burning fat and muscle. You need to make sure to do some re-feeds every 7-10 days (high carb days) to get you body back into an anabolic state. This way you can wreak the benefits on low carb/fat burning diet, and also maintain muscle mass.

Also, eating that few of carbs and being in a caloric deficit is going to drive your hunger through the roof.. where "cravings" turn into a necessity to eat. So you may binge or purge because it is your bodies natural response.. like a survival instinct.

You also just started killin it in the gym which is going to increase the potential problems I just told you about.

That should like a really good idea man! (And delicious) I think I will do 1 carb day per week. That didn't take to much convincing lol

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That should like a really good idea man! (And delicious) I think I will do 1 carb day per week. That didn't take to much convincing lol

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Before you do that though, you need to go about 2-3 weeks for your body to fully transition into the metabolic change. Then do the refeeds every 7-10 days.
 
Man, im so freaking sore today! (I have doms) I think I'll take today off and just hydrate, hot tub, and steam room.

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Remember what I said at the beginning of the thread? You've already made a post about cravings, and now your so sore you're missing a day in the gym. Slow and steady my man.. let your body adjust.
 
Remember what I said at the beginning of the thread? You've already made a post about cravings, and now your so sore you're missing a day in the gym. Slow and steady my man.. let your body adjust.

Maybe your right... I'm used to feeling this whenever I start working out, is been that way since high school. I just get sore more than anyone else.. lots of lactic acid I guess. My muscles just need a day off rest and good food, I'll be fine tomorrow. The pain is just the muscles, I don't feel nutrient deficient at all.

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Maybe your right... I'm used to feeling this whenever I start working out, is been that way since high school. I just get sore more than anyone else.. lots of lactic acid I guess. My muscles just need a day off rest and good food, I'll be fine tomorrow. The pain is just the muscles, I don't feel nutrient deficient at all.

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i will be following bro,its a marathon.. not a sprint.
 
Eating less than 20 carbs a day is going to backfire my man. You will be a fat burning machine for a couple weeks, but then your body will start burning fat and muscle. You need to make sure to do some re-feeds every 7-10 days (high carb days) to get you body back into an anabolic state. This way you can wreak the benefits on low carb/fat burning diet, and also maintain muscle mass.

Also, eating that few of carbs and being in a caloric deficit is going to drive your hunger through the roof.. where "cravings" turn into a necessity to eat. So you may binge or purge because it is your bodies natural response.. like a survival instinct.

You also just started killin it in the gym which is going to increase the potential problems I just told you about.

Not only that he'll be in the hospital quick! Unless hes not counting veggies as carbs ud die on 20grams of carbs ed! 60 is low!
 
Not only that he'll be in the hospital quick! Unless hes not counting veggies as carbs ud die on 20grams of carbs ed! 60 is low!

I have brocalli and lettuce every day... seriously? You're way overreacting to no carbs for 2 months.. I'll bee fine. I'm already down 13lbs!

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Not only that he'll be in the hospital quick! Unless hes not counting veggies as carbs ud die on 20grams of carbs ed! 60 is low!

I hope you're joking. A ketogenic state is entered after a dieter keeps carbohydrates under 5% of daily BMR. In a ketogenic state, a healthy male will shed bodyfat, and keep his muscle gains, as the metabolic rate shifts from glucose burning to fat-burning. Read the following diets: Atkins, Anabolic diet, bodyopus, evolutionary diet. Please do more research: The Evolutionary Diet - Evolutionary.org
 
Eating less than 20 carbs a day is going to backfire my man. You will be a fat burning machine for a couple weeks, but then your body will start burning fat and muscle. You need to make sure to do some re-feeds every 7-10 days (high carb days) to get you body back into an anabolic state. This way you can wreak the benefits on low carb/fat burning diet, and also maintain muscle mass.

Also, eating that few of carbs and being in a caloric deficit is going to drive your hunger through the roof.. where "cravings" turn into a necessity to eat. So you may binge or purge because it is your bodies natural response.. like a survival instinct.

You also just started killin it in the gym which is going to increase the potential problems I just told you about.

There might be a bit of a misunderstanding.:artist: If he's taking in over 50% fat and under 5% carbohydrates from his BMR, he'll be in a ketogenic state within roughly 2-3 days (the first time). Ketones are protein sparing, making a ketogenic state anti-catabolic. In addition, the refeeds that will be done every 10 days or so, ; thus, he will replenish glycogen stores, creating an anabolic effect. At his weight, a ketogenic style diet is best. He just needs to keep his fat intake up and carb intake down.

One of my articles on the topic:
The Evolutionary Diet - Evolutionary.org
 
What is this "owned!" crap? I have to copy paste in a blank file to read this stuff. Why?

I got a plat g bomb dropped on my ass for posting about I am Legend lol (in the conversation boards... thank -SD- for that

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There might be a bit of a misunderstanding.:artist: If he's taking in over 50% fat and under 5% carbohydrates from his BMR, he'll be in a ketogenic state within roughly 2-3 days (the first time). Ketones are protein sparing, making a ketogenic state anti-catabolic. In addition, the refeeds that will be done every 10 days or so, ; thus, he will replenish glycogen stores, creating an anabolic effect. At his weight, a ketogenic style diet is best. He just needs to keep his fat intake up and carb intake down.

One of my articles on the topic:
The Evolutionary Diet - Evolutionary.org

What about the second time?

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Man, I got face fucked by other EF users as soon as I woke up... people hatin on my bitchtits haha IDGAF.

Anyways, I can't believe how hard I hit cardio today, I felt unstoppable! An hour on the bike interval training, and 500 yards in the pool! I hope I get that much hate EVERY MORNING!

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I got a plat g bomb dropped on my ass for posting about I am Legend lol (in the conversation boards... thank -SD- for that

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I just gave you 100k karma, don't worry about the haters, good job at trying to change your life.:cool:
 
What about the second time?

Once you're out of ketosis, the length and depth of your refeeds - as well as your post-refeed training - is going to determine how fast you're back in ketosis. I found most guys can shift back into a ketogenic state within 48 hours of the refeed.
 
Once you're out of ketosis, the length and depth of your refeeds - as well as your post-refeed training - is going to determine how fast you're back in ketosis. I found most guys can shift back into a ketogenic state within 48 hours of the refeed.

Cool... and even though carbs are allowed on a re feed day, I doubt it's just a unlimited carb day. I should still sick to whole grain, complex carbs... not just wrote rice and deep fried chicken...right? I'm still on a diet here...or did it matter?

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Once you're out of ketosis, the length and depth of your refeeds - as well as your post-refeed training - is going to determine how fast you're back in ketosis. I found most guys can shift back into a ketogenic state within 48 hours of the refeed.

So refeeds are critical... to anyone on a no carb diet, no matter what?

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Cool... and even though carbs are allowed on a re feed day, I doubt it's just a unlimited carb day. I should still sick to whole grain, complex carbs... not just wrote rice and deep fried chicken...right? I'm still on a diet here...or did it matter?

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You need to do some reading my friend, read my article, it explains everything:
The Evolutionary Diet - Evolutionary.org
 
So refeeds are critical... to anyone on a no carb diet, no matter what?

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Yes. Eventually, you'll hit a plateau in your fat loss, as your metabolic rate slows down and your body starts cruising in ketogenic mode (think Atkins). Without refeeds, you can't have these intense workouts nor anabolic gains. You need to refill your liver/muscle glycogen stores to upregulate hormone and thyroid activity.
 
Yes. Eventually, you'll hit a plateau in your fat loss, as your metabolic rate slows down and your body starts cruising in ketogenic mode (think Atkins). Without refeeds, you can't have these intense workouts nor anabolic gains. You need to refill your liver/muscle glycogen stores to upregulate hormone and thyroid activity.

does taking gw/s4 affect that at all? I'll be starting both in a few days (when they get here)

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Smoking note... haven't smoked a cig since my last post saying I quit them... today was stressful for me do I decided to smoke a cig... 2 drags in I felt like puking! Fuck cigerettes! Line forever! Ewewwwe went did I ever smoke these things??

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does taking gw/s4 affect that at all? I'll be starting both in a few days (when they get here)

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Due to your ketogenic state, start them at low dosages and see how it goes, feel out what dosages are best for you. The usual is 20mgs/ed cardarine (gw-501516) + 50mgs S-4/ed (Andarine), but you need to start lower 1/2 and move up slowly to see how you're effected.
 
I hope you're joking. A ketogenic state is entered after a dieter keeps carbohydrates under 5% of daily BMR. In a ketogenic state, a healthy male will shed bodyfat, and keep his muscle gains, as the metabolic rate shifts from glucose burning to fat-burning. Read the following diets: Atkins, Anabolic diet, bodyopus, evolutionary diet. Please do more research: The Evolutionary Diet - Evolutionary.org

Yeah, ok. Sure. Any more wiki shit? Seriously! 20 grams of carbs? Go for it. This is why I never post here anymore.
 
Why are you so against it? I feel great

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First off carbs are very important! Very! They are vital for recovery, muscle, strength, endurance, energy, etc.... All of my Ifbb buddies have NEVER had to do 20g of carbs and are pros. Even my buddy Rich Mr. CA. does not. He might go 40-50 just one day and is currently at 270 6-8%. Those are competitors ( not Rich) your just trying to loose some fat. Am 235 and stay 8-11 all year on 200-400 grams of carbs. On cycle days Ill hit 60-120 on low days depends how I feel.

If I were to have 6 of NTBM whey protien shakes and nothing more that would put me at 24 grams of carbs ed. No way! With only 124 grams of protien. Only an ex on how low you are if u really are which I do not believe bc you say you feel good. You riskind going into ketosis.

What your doing is senseless imo respectfully. No need for it you traing lags badly if thats what you have to do to loose weight. You can not run a car low on gas all the time the fuel pump will burn!

Think about this why do pros start carb cycling 8-6-4-2 weeks before comp? Then carb up day before show? Why? Carbs are your friend! Yes, if you wanna cut you have to drop some carbs agreed but 20g ed is stupid sorry no disrespect at all.

Here just a little on carbs but doesnt even touch ground on it. However I do not know everything I only know from trail and error and being 240@8% with over tens years expieiance in training. There is a good reason why Dylan has not replied to this thread one of the best on diets. However, its not a diet its eatting rite thats all. If you heath is worth you looks then by all means continue.

Unfortunately, whether due to a misinterpretation of what low carbohydrate dieting actually is or an “all-or-nothing” approach to restricting carbohydrates or perhaps the influence of low-carbohydrate-done-wrong diets like Atkins, many people (and especially athletes) try or attempt to try a low carbohydrate diet and end up messing the whole thing up, experiencing the hidden dangers of a low carbohydrate diet and hurting their bodies.

So what are the hidden dangers of a low carbohydrate (AKA “ketogenic”) diet?

Here are the low carbohydrate risks, in ten steps:

1. Your body stores carbohydrate, mostly in your liver and muscles, in the form of glycogen. Depending on your size, you can store roughly in the range of 1500-2000 calories of storage carbohydrate (although that number is fairly variable based on your fitness and size).

2. If you’re sedentary and don’t really exercise much (which I don’t encourage), this amount of storage carbohydrate is more than sufficient to get you through a typical day. Really, your body only needs a maximum of 600 calories of carbohydrate to survive each day – and that carbohydrate can be derived from diet, or from you own storage glycogen.

3. But if you’re active and at the same time consuming a low carbohydrate diet, you can easily burn through your liver and muscle glycogen stores in anywhere from 2 days to a couple weeks. The nice part about this, if you’re trying to lose weight, is that since glycogen carries up to four times it’s weight in water, a low carbohydrate diet can quickly shed 5-10 pounds (or more), which seems quite satisfactory. But the problem is, most of what you’ve lost is A) energy to sustain intense physical activity and B) water.

4. So now you have very little storage carbohydrate and are potentially dehydrated. If you’re an athlete or a physically active individual, this means that you’re limited to utilizing fat as a fuel for energy. Fat, through a process called “beta-oxidation”, can provide tens of thousands of calories of readily utilizable fuel, but the problem is that it burns far more slowly than carbohydrate.

5. This means that if you’re on a strict low carbohydrate diet, you can say goodbye to intense weight training, track intervals, or just about any activity that would be consider “tempo”, “threshold”, or “intervals”. And this is the stuff that adds lean muscle to your body, boosts your metabolism and gets you fit fast – compared to a slow and sluggish slog in your “fat-burning zone”. This is not negotiable by your body. It is simple physiology. When you deplete muscle glycogen, there is a directly proportional increase in muscle fatigue, and also an increase in muscle catabolism (direct metabolism of your body’s own muscle protein, or conversion of that protein into glucose via gluconeogenesis). Many people on a low-carbohydrate diet simply stop exercising, because it can suck so much.

6. As you lose muscle mass, your already handicapped metabolism drops even more. I will acknowledge that muscle fibers don’t burn as many calories or boost your metabolism as much as we all like to think, but this is still an important consideration for those trying to maintain lean muscle mass or tone.

7. For active people, this trouble may all be “in vain”. Since physically active individuals and athletes are far more sensitive to insulin and less susceptible to blood sugar fluctuations, any attempt to eat low carbohydrate in conjunction with exercise, for the pure purpose of “controlling blood sugar levels” could be a mostly unnecessary endeavor anyways.

8. Low carbohydrate diets, if implemented improperly, result in low fiber intake from a sharp reduction in plant-based food consumption, which can increase risk of digestive cancers and cardiovascular disease, and also leads to constipation and bowel issues. In addition, a drop in fruit, vegetables, legume and grain consumption can result in inadequate phytonutrient, antioxidant, vitamin C and potassium intake. Many (but not all) low carbohydrate diets have these problems.

9. Typical “low carbohydrate” meal replacement bars and shakes, ice creams or ice cream sandwiches, and other low carb or sugar-free snacks often contain potentially unhealthy ingredients like maltitol, and are chock full of preservatives and highly processed ingredients. If your low carbohydrate diet involves boxed, wrapped and packaged food, it probably falls into this category.

10. There can be long term health issues as your body is chronically carbohydrate depleted over extended periods of time. Your liver is exposed to extra stress as it is forced to assist with manufacturing glucose from fats and proteins, potentially toxic amounts of ammonia are produced as proteins are converted into glucose, your body has a more difficult time producing mucus and the immune system becomes impaired as risk of pathogenic infection increases, and your body loses the ability to produce compounds called glycoproteins, which are vital to cellular functions.

So is it possible to “do a low carbohydrate diet right”?

Absolutely.
 
First off carbs are very important! Very! They are vital for recovery, muscle, strength, endurance, energy, etc.... All of my Ifbb buddies have NEVER had to do 20g of carbs and are pros. Even my buddy Rich Mr. CA. does not. He might go 40-50 just one day and is currently at 270 6-8%. Those are competitors ( not Rich) your just trying to loose some fat. Am 235 and stay 8-11 all year on 200-400 grams of carbs. On cycle days Ill hit 60-120 on low days depends how I feel.

If I were to have 6 of NTBM whey protien shakes and nothing more that would put me at 24 grams of carbs ed. No way! With only 124 grams of protien. Only an ex on how low you are if u really are which I do not believe bc you say you feel good. You riskind going into ketosis.

What your doing is senseless imo respectfully. No need for it you traing lags badly if thats what you have to do to loose weight. You can not run a car low on gas all the time the fuel pump will burn!

Think about this why do pros start carb cycling 8-6-4-2 weeks before comp? Then carb up day before show? Why? Carbs are your friend! Yes, if you wanna cut you have to drop some carbs agreed but 20g ed is stupid sorry no disrespect at all.

Here just a little on carbs but doesnt even touch ground on it. However I do not know everything I only know from trail and error and being 240@8% with over tens years expieiance in training. There is a good reason why Dylan has not replied to this thread one of the best on diets. However, its not a diet its eatting rite thats all. If you heath is worth you looks then by all means continue.

Unfortunately, whether due to a misinterpretation of what low carbohydrate dieting actually is or an “all-or-nothing” approach to restricting carbohydrates or perhaps the influence of low-carbohydrate-done-wrong diets like Atkins, many people (and especially athletes) try or attempt to try a low carbohydrate diet and end up messing the whole thing up, experiencing the hidden dangers of a low carbohydrate diet and hurting their bodies.

So what are the hidden dangers of a low carbohydrate (AKA “ketogenic”) diet?

Here are the low carbohydrate risks, in ten steps:

1. Your body stores carbohydrate, mostly in your liver and muscles, in the form of glycogen. Depending on your size, you can store roughly in the range of 1500-2000 calories of storage carbohydrate (although that number is fairly variable based on your fitness and size).

2. If you’re sedentary and don’t really exercise much (which I don’t encourage), this amount of storage carbohydrate is more than sufficient to get you through a typical day. Really, your body only needs a maximum of 600 calories of carbohydrate to survive each day – and that carbohydrate can be derived from diet, or from you own storage glycogen.

3. But if you’re active and at the same time consuming a low carbohydrate diet, you can easily burn through your liver and muscle glycogen stores in anywhere from 2 days to a couple weeks. The nice part about this, if you’re trying to lose weight, is that since glycogen carries up to four times it’s weight in water, a low carbohydrate diet can quickly shed 5-10 pounds (or more), which seems quite satisfactory. But the problem is, most of what you’ve lost is A) energy to sustain intense physical activity and B) water.

4. So now you have very little storage carbohydrate and are potentially dehydrated. If you’re an athlete or a physically active individual, this means that you’re limited to utilizing fat as a fuel for energy. Fat, through a process called “beta-oxidation”, can provide tens of thousands of calories of readily utilizable fuel, but the problem is that it burns far more slowly than carbohydrate.

5. This means that if you’re on a strict low carbohydrate diet, you can say goodbye to intense weight training, track intervals, or just about any activity that would be consider “tempo”, “threshold”, or “intervals”. And this is the stuff that adds lean muscle to your body, boosts your metabolism and gets you fit fast – compared to a slow and sluggish slog in your “fat-burning zone”. This is not negotiable by your body. It is simple physiology. When you deplete muscle glycogen, there is a directly proportional increase in muscle fatigue, and also an increase in muscle catabolism (direct metabolism of your body’s own muscle protein, or conversion of that protein into glucose via gluconeogenesis). Many people on a low-carbohydrate diet simply stop exercising, because it can suck so much.

6. As you lose muscle mass, your already handicapped metabolism drops even more. I will acknowledge that muscle fibers don’t burn as many calories or boost your metabolism as much as we all like to think, but this is still an important consideration for those trying to maintain lean muscle mass or tone.

7. For active people, this trouble may all be “in vain”. Since physically active individuals and athletes are far more sensitive to insulin and less susceptible to blood sugar fluctuations, any attempt to eat low carbohydrate in conjunction with exercise, for the pure purpose of “controlling blood sugar levels” could be a mostly unnecessary endeavor anyways.

8. Low carbohydrate diets, if implemented improperly, result in low fiber intake from a sharp reduction in plant-based food consumption, which can increase risk of digestive cancers and cardiovascular disease, and also leads to constipation and bowel issues. In addition, a drop in fruit, vegetables, legume and grain consumption can result in inadequate phytonutrient, antioxidant, vitamin C and potassium intake. Many (but not all) low carbohydrate diets have these problems.

9. Typical “low carbohydrate” meal replacement bars and shakes, ice creams or ice cream sandwiches, and other low carb or sugar-free snacks often contain potentially unhealthy ingredients like maltitol, and are chock full of preservatives and highly processed ingredients. If your low carbohydrate diet involves boxed, wrapped and packaged food, it probably falls into this category.

10. There can be long term health issues as your body is chronically carbohydrate depleted over extended periods of time. Your liver is exposed to extra stress as it is forced to assist with manufacturing glucose from fats and proteins, potentially toxic amounts of ammonia are produced as proteins are converted into glucose, your body has a more difficult time producing mucus and the immune system becomes impaired as risk of pathogenic infection increases, and your body loses the ability to produce compounds called glycoproteins, which are vital to cellular functions.

So is it possible to “do a low carbohydrate diet right”?

Absolutely.

Okay, you have a lot off very good points. Than what would you suggest as a good diet for me? I've started to plateau in weight loss so it's probably time to change things up anyway. I do cardio 10 times a week, and hit the weights 6 times a week. Typical cardio sessions are 45 minutes, unless it's a double cardio day. In that case, I do 30 minutes of HIIT in the morning, and 1000 yards swimming later that evening. Maybe I should get a body bug to really perfectly tune my diet, cause I'm not sure how many calories I actually burn on a daily basis.

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Okay, you have a lot off very good points. Than what would you suggest as a good diet for me? I've started to plateau in weight loss so it's probably time to change things up anyway. I do cardio 10 times a week, and hit the weights 6 times a week. Typical cardio sessions are 45 minutes, unless it's a double cardio day. In that case, I do 30 minutes of HIIT in the morning, and 1000 yards swimming later that evening. Maybe I should get a body bug to really perfectly tune my diet, cause I'm not sure how many calories I actually burn on a daily basis.

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You don't need to be doing zero carb or even carb cycling at this point. That is generally reserved for people going contest low in body fat. You are still very high in BF, and can and will lose the fat with simply calorie counting.
For one week weigh everything that goes into your mouth on a kitchen scale. I prefer one that is digital, it's more precise. Measuring cups/spoons and even already portioned foods are an inaccurate way to track calories.
Why the hell are you doing so much cardio? You can't out exercise a bad diet. You'll burn out quick. Get your diet in order and use cardio as a tool to create a bigger deficit. Hell, I do almost zero cardio while cutting and have never had an issue getting to where I wanted to be. In some people cardio can actually increase hunger.
 
You don't need to be doing zero carb or even carb cycling at this point. That is generally reserved for people going contest low in body fat. You are still very high in BF, and can and will lose the fat with simply calorie counting.
For one week weigh everything that goes into your mouth on a kitchen scale. I prefer one that is digital, it's more precise. Measuring cups/spoons and even already portioned foods are an inaccurate way to track calories.
Why the hell are you doing so much cardio? You can't out exercise a bad diet. You'll burn out quick. Get your diet in order and use cardio as a tool to create a bigger deficit. Hell, I do almost zero cardio while cutting and have never had an issue getting to where I wanted to be. In some people cardio can actually increase hunger.

Cause I love cardio! I'm used to 2 or 3 hour wrestling practices for cardio. For me, it's the best place in the world. Just putting on my music and dripping sweat.. or flowing through the water just focusing on my strokes and breathing. It's not so much about burning fat as it is just about escaping

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Cause I love cardio! I'm used to 2 or 3 hour wrestling practices for cardio. For me, it's the best place in the world. Just putting on my music and dripping sweat.. or flowing through the water just focusing on my strokes and breathing. It's not so much about burning fat as it is just about escaping

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Well you need to pick one. Either no carbs and very little to zero cardio or carbs and a shit ton of cardio. Of course there's somewhere in between too but it seems like you are a one extreme kind of person.
You could look into something like Lyle Mcdonalds RFL.


And no offense to the sponsors here but you don't need any sarms, steroids or anything at this point. Your diet is off and that should be number one.

I went back and read... U said you are down 13lbs then said you're at a plateau... So which is it? How long has it been since you've seen a scale loss? How long have you been dieting for? How many calories are you eating per day and how are you tracking this?
 
Cause I love cardio! I'm used to 2 or 3 hour wrestling practices for cardio. For me, it's the best place in the world. Just putting on my music and dripping sweat.. or flowing through the water just focusing on my strokes and breathing. It's not so much about burning fat as it is just about escaping

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ain't no one love cardio
 
1. Your body stores carbohydrate, mostly in your liver and muscles, in the form of glycogen. Depending on your size, you can store roughly in the range of 1500-2000 calories of storage carbohydrate (although that number is fairly variable based on your fitness and size).

2. If you’re sedentary and don’t really exercise much (which I don’t encourage), this amount of storage carbohydrate is more than sufficient to get you through a typical day. Really, your body only needs a maximum of 600 calories of carbohydrate to survive each day – and that carbohydrate can be derived from diet, or from you own storage glycogen.

3. But if you’re active and at the same time consuming a low carbohydrate diet, you can easily burn through your liver and muscle glycogen stores in anywhere from 2 days to a couple weeks. The nice part about this, if you’re trying to lose weight, is that since glycogen carries up to four times it’s weight in water, a low carbohydrate diet can quickly shed 5-10 pounds (or more), which seems quite satisfactory. But the problem is, most of what you’ve lost is A) energy to sustain intense physical activity and B) water.

4. So now you have very little storage carbohydrate and are potentially dehydrated. If you’re an athlete or a physically active individual, this means that you’re limited to utilizing fat as a fuel for energy. Fat, through a process called “beta-oxidation”, can provide tens of thousands of calories of readily utilizable fuel, but the problem is that it burns far more slowly than carbohydrate.

5. This means that if you’re on a strict low carbohydrate diet, you can say goodbye to intense weight training, track intervals, or just about any activity that would be consider “tempo”, “threshold”, or “intervals”. And this is the stuff that adds lean muscle to your body, boosts your metabolism and gets you fit fast – compared to a slow and sluggish slog in your “fat-burning zone”. This is not negotiable by your body. It is simple physiology. When you deplete muscle glycogen, there is a directly proportional increase in muscle fatigue, and also an increase in muscle catabolism (direct metabolism of your body’s own muscle protein, or conversion of that protein into glucose via gluconeogenesis). Many people on a low-carbohydrate diet simply stop exercising, because it can suck so much.

6. As you lose muscle mass, your already handicapped metabolism drops even more. I will acknowledge that muscle fibers don’t burn as many calories or boost your metabolism as much as we all like to think, but this is still an important consideration for those trying to maintain lean muscle mass or tone.

7. For active people, this trouble may all be “in vain”. Since physically active individuals and athletes are far more sensitive to insulin and less susceptible to blood sugar fluctuations, any attempt to eat low carbohydrate in conjunction with exercise, for the pure purpose of “controlling blood sugar levels” could be a mostly unnecessary endeavor anyways.

8. Low carbohydrate diets, if implemented improperly, result in low fiber intake from a sharp reduction in plant-based food consumption, which can increase risk of digestive cancers and cardiovascular disease, and also leads to constipation and bowel issues. In addition, a drop in fruit, vegetables, legume and grain consumption can result in inadequate phytonutrient, antioxidant, vitamin C and potassium intake. Many (but not all) low carbohydrate diets have these problems.

9. Typical “low carbohydrate” meal replacement bars and shakes, ice creams or ice cream sandwiches, and other low carb or sugar-free snacks often contain potentially unhealthy ingredients like maltitol, and are chock full of preservatives and highly processed ingredients. If your low carbohydrate diet involves boxed, wrapped and packaged food, it probably falls into this category.

10. There can be long term health issues as your body is chronically carbohydrate depleted over extended periods of time. Your liver is exposed to extra stress as it is forced to assist with manufacturing glucose from fats and proteins, potentially toxic amounts of ammonia are produced as proteins are converted into glucose, your body has a more difficult time producing mucus and the immune system becomes impaired as risk of pathogenic infection increases, and your body loses the ability to produce compounds called glycoproteins, which are vital to cellular functions.

.

So you're saying you wrote this? Interesting, how you forgot to cite your source. how about I do it for you:
The Hidden Dangers Of A Low Carbohydrate Diet

If you're going to copy someone and pass it off as your own information, at least give them credit for it.:verygood:
 
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