One of those dumb situational Questions

[ZGzaZ]

i agree with you that most boxers would get wasted...but what I clearly said was some of the best in the business like Mike, Roy Jones, or Lewis would not be beaten by any of them. And what you said about being in a bare knuckled fight, exactly! now just imagine a boxer like one of these that trains for punching power, defense, and speed...lets take Roy Jones, i dont give a damn how good your takedown is, that boy is quick, and a few of his punches to your head...dont stand a chance, as for axe kicks and shit like that...nah...

 

[danielson]

Boxers punching power is unrivaled by any other form in my opinion. But they lack elbows, kness, and most of all grappling. Many of their stances keep their front leg close to their opponent which leaves them open to most leg takedowns and kicks,

i hear this a lot, and the few boxers i train with hit very hard (for their size anyway )

why do you think this is? because these are there only weapons so these are the ones they train the most and therefore are very good technique wise?

or that their stance, while perhaps being a bit unstable os good for punching power? or is their technique that different?

i;ve noticed when they punch they put a lot more of their body into it, and essentially are all over the place when punching, is this it?


(p.s. im sure MMA fighters will train for the possibility of a punch knock out otherwise no-one would bother with the hand skills. your essentially comparing someone who trains one half of striking vs. someone who trains all of striking and grappling and maybe some other stuff in there.)

 

[ZenMachine]

i agree with you that most boxers would get wasted...but what I clearly said was some of the best in the business like Mike, Roy Jones, or Lewis would not be beaten by any of them. And what you said about being in a bare knuckled fight, exactly! now just imagine a boxer like one of these that trains for punching power, defense, and speed...lets take Roy Jones, i dont give a damn how good your takedown is, that boy is quick, and a few of his punches to your head...dont stand a chance, as for axe kicks and shit like that...nah...

I can't even fathom that people can still be this deluded about boxing. Roy Jones Jr. is arguable one of the best boxers of all time (at least pound for pound) and he could very well get a shot or two off when the gap is being closed, but once that happens he has effectively been taken out of his world. He has no room to punch.

You are comparing two completely different sports. It is like you are saying that Wayne Gretsky would be a great golfer solely due to the fact that he swings a stick really hard. Too many other factors go into the mixed martial arts match besides punching speed and power.

 

[epimetheus]

You are comparing two completely different sports. It is like you are saying that Wayne Gretsky would be a great golfer solely due to the fact that he swings a stick really hard. Too many other factors go into the mixed martial arts match besides punching speed and power.

Well, what I was trying to ask was how would a boxer hold up in a MMA ring and vice versa. Not necessarily on the street. And certainly not trying to compare the sports. I should have been more clear.

Thaibox- I have always respected you, for your knowledge and supposed badassness (which I never wish to test), your post in which you interjected quite rudely in a conversation that was already over was a surprise. Your message was even more surprising. Accusing me of filling my posts with big words for the simple purpous of pretension was quite the insult. I had every right to get snarky back. How you responded was the childish thing. So you use your vast knowledge and great skill to be an overglorified bully and threaten those that "disrespect" you with your MA skill? I must say I am let down, though I do appologize, just not because you chose to threaten or challenge me, but because I was actually being a prick.

 

[danielson]

this post is going no-where fast......

 

[Thaibox]

epimetheus,

threaten or challenge me

I don't "threaten" people, that's just my way of trying to keep the board clean.

So you use your vast knowledge and
great skill to be an overglorified bully and threaten those
that "disrespect" you with your MA skill?

No, I never have. I hold myself above no one and hope that I have never made it sound otherwise. I think I make it very clear that I consider myself a student of the arts and nothing else, just like the guy with 3 weeks experience in the local dojo. I was reffering to you disrespecting me as a person, period...as well as disrespecting the board.

your post in which you interjected quite
rudely in a conversation that was already over was a
surprise. Your message was even more surprising.
Accusing me of filling my posts with big words for the
simple purpous of pretension was quite the insult. I had
every right to get snarky back

I simply meant to state my opinion on sophistic people in general. I was arguing against your statements, not you personally. You were making an argument about vocabulary being synonymous with intelligence, and I strongly disagree. Therefore, I made my argument. I would have qualified myself, but you seem to be a relatively intelligent person, so I figured you would have seen this. You have to understand that I teach philosophy part time and I get very tired of the people that never shut up, yet never add anything to the productivity to the class.

Anyway, it was never my intention for anything to become personal. It turned that way, so I followed.

And boxers will never beat a well rounded martial artist unless bound by the rules of boxing.

 

[epimetheus]

I simply meant to state my opinion on sophistic people in general. I was arguing against your statements, not you personally. You were making an argument about vocabulary being synonymous with intelligence, and I strongly disagree. Therefore, I made my argument. I would have qualified myself, but you seem to be a relatively intelligent person, so I figured you would have seen this. You have to understand that I teach philosophy part time and I get very tired of the people that never shut up, yet never add anything to the productivity to the class.

Anyway, it was never my intention for anything to become personal. It turned that way, so I followed.

I agree that a big vocabulary isn't synonymous with intelligence. A relativly stupid person can memorize a bunch of big words. (though usually they don't use em properly) I do believe that language, and the more the better, is a vital tool to the construction of thought. (intelligence being a pretty subjective term) A baby that is not taught how to speak misses out alot on further development. I was just following that thread of reasoning.

I try not to be that person in class that doesn't contribute.

I saw that you were attacking the argument eventually. It took forever, and even then I didn't aknowledge it due to the usual ego issues like pride. I agree that I shouldn't have made it personal, and my attack on you in this thread was immature and uncalled for. I should have dropped it when I had the chance.
Again, my apology.

 

[ZGzaZ]

ThaiBox - And boxers will never beat a well rounded martial artist unless bound by the rules of boxing.

heh-heh....agreed. But Roy Jones, Lewis, or Tyson would wup anyones ass in any type of fight. Most other boxers, sure .. youre right.

 

[Lord_Suston]

i hear this a lot, and the few boxers i train with hit very hard (for their size anyway )

why do you think this is? because these are there only weapons so these are the ones they train the most and therefore are very good technique wise?

or that their stance, while perhaps being a bit unstable os good for punching power? or is their technique that different?

When a boxer plants to punch with full torque, and only really good ones do, they use full body movement combine with increadilbe hand speed makes them the best punchers in my opinion. I know plenty of styles where the fighter can deliver one massive punching strike but they lack on combos.

(p.s. im sure MMA fighters will train for the possibility of a punch knock out otherwise no-one would bother with the hand skills. your essentially comparing someone who trains one half of striking vs. someone who trains all of striking and grappling and maybe some other stuff in there.) [/B]

Many MMA fighter have their stances sutied for leg takedowns and do not punch with full hip rotation, they train in all parts of fighting. to train in every part they to divert from upper striking skills. Can you honstly say that if you train to use all aspects of your body that your skills ould match someone who trained a sole method? I know when I train to fight, not box I lose a little of my boxing skills to accommodate my grappling techniques

 

[ZenMachine]

heh-heh....agreed. But Roy Jones, Lewis, or Tyson would wup anyones ass in any type of fight. Most other boxers, sure .. youre right.

Were you aware that Roy Jones was actually challeged by Ralph Gracie to a MMA match? Roy declined.

Tyson is also a huge MMA fan, and don't quote me, but I think has stated he wouldn't hang long with the top level MMA fighters.