Are there any programs better than Starting Strength?

[ronki23]

Thanks Zaad

Out of curiosity, what alternatives are there to Starting Strength and when can one switch around? From what I know there are several but I don't know when to switch/what to choose as an alternative or next step:

Stronglifts (good but not as good as Rippetoes I hear)

Hypertrophy Specific Routine

Bill Starr-this one is confusing-can someone find the original for me-there are many variations and I don't know what 1*10 stands for when it asks for 5x5;it also says ramp up the weight to your 5RM but it doesn't say how much by/what to start with!

All Pro

Any others? When does one do All Pro and SHOULD they? I don't like the look of All Pro simply because the reps are too high (I used to do programs at 8-12 reps and my strength was increasing 2 reps a session but my overall poundages didn't go up nearly as much as Rippetoes and people didn't notice the size I added/they said it was negligent

Arnold's Beginner Workouts

I read that the beginner workout used in Arnold's Encyclopedia were what he suggested to his 'juicing' friends/when preparing for a contest but I was told doing the workouts once a week/doing it twice a week and eating lots will help-especially for beginners

Note that he recommended 8-12 reps for upper body and 12-20 for lower body

Level I:

Mon, Thu:

4x Bench Press
4x Incline Press
4x Pullovers
Chin Up-50's
4x Bent Over Rows
*Once a week Deadlifts- 10/6/4 to failure
5x Crunches (25 reps)

Tue,Fri:

4x Clean and Press
4x Lateral Raises
*Once a week-Upright Rows- 10/6/4 to failure
*Once a week-Push Presses- 6/4/2 to failure
4x Standing Barbell Curls
4x Seated Dumbbell Curls
4x Close Grip Bench Press
4x Barbell Tricep Extension
5x Reverse Crunches (25 reps)

Wed,Sat:

4x Squats
4x Lunges
4x Leg Curls
5x Calf Raises (15 reps)
*Once a week-10/6/4 Straight Legged Deadlifts
*Once a week-10/6/4 Good Mornings
5x Crunches (25 reps)

Apparently Arnold actually did this type of workout in the offseason/prescribed it to beginners-he says 3x a week; I assume 2x a week would also work?

Squat 4x10
Bench Press 3x10
Chins/Pulldowns 3x10
Behind-Neck Press 4x10
Barbell Curl 3x10
Sit Ups 4x20

A member of T-Nation recommended I create my own workout

Do a push/pull/legs split.

6x a week.

3 Days on 1 Day off.

This gives you 4 days of rest between each day/phase of training.
As a beginner, you don't use heavy enough weight to warrant longer than 4 days of rest.
As a beginner, you don't use heavy enough weight to warrant a body part split.

Choose 2 basic money exercises per body part and 2 accessory exercises per body part.
E.g. Chest: Flat Bench, Incline Bench - DB Flyes, DB Decline Bench.

For a push day you need to hit your chest, deltoids and triceps. This totals 6 money exercises and 6 accessory exercises.

This is a lot of exercises.

Bench will probably utilize the triceps somewhat as well as the deltoids. So I recommend doing 1 money exercise and 1 accessory for each muscle other than the chest.

BUT...

If you are bringing up deltoids give them the most exercise attention. Same for triceps.

Do 3-6 work sets for each money exercise.
Do 3 work sets for each accessory exercise.

Do 6-10 reps for each money exercise.
Do 8-12 reps for each accessory exercise.

Lift as above, Eat then repeat.

Finally my Uncle said routine 1,5 and 6 work well in the following; he's new to this so why do programs like the above All Pro and Golden 6 and random internet programs work for everyone but it took me several years to find I respond to sets of 5 and most personal trainer programs suck for me?:

Sample Bodybuilding Routines

 

[ronki23]

Apparently this is quite a good program-although you need 9 months to do it to reap results-training 3x a week seems to be the reason only two heavy sets out of 5 are used. I'm not going to do it in lieu of starting strength-just looking at all the options.
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Reg Park's Three Phase 5x5 Program
​

Phase One​

45-degree back extension 3x10
Back squat 5x5
Bench press 5x5
Deadlift 5x5


Rest 3-5 minutes between the last 3 sets of each exercise.
Train three days per week for three months.

Phase Two for Bodybuilders

​

45-degree back extension 3-4x10
Front squat 5x5
Back squat 5x5
Bench press 5x5
Standing barbell shoulder press 5x5
High pull 5x5
Deadlift 5x5
Standing barbell calf raise 5x25


Rest 2 minutes between sets.

​

Phase Three for Bodybuilders​

45-degree back extension 4x10
Front squat 5x5
Back squat 5x5
Standing barbell shoulder press 5x5
Bench press 5x5
Bent-over barbell row 5x5
Deadlift 5x3
Behind-the-neck press or one-arm dumbbell press 5x5
Barbell curl 5x5
Lying triceps extension 5x8
Standing barbell calf raise 5x25


As Park explained it, 5x5 includes two progressively heavier warm-up sets and three sets at the same weight. He suggested increasing weights at approximately the same interval, for example

When you can complete the last 3x5 at a given weight, increase the weight on all five sets 5-10 pounds.


Has anyone made good progress on a 3-5 x 8-12 rep progress without starting this; just wondering if i've wasted my time doing hypertrophy programs/personal programs and the programs written for beginners with such high reps. With such programs, I normally got stronger by 1-2 reps per session,added 0.5-2lbs a week to weight and added an inch or two on bodyparts but people kept saying I made little progress.



​

 

[joeblow12345]

If your getting stronger and bigger why change? If it ain't broke don't fix it.

 

[ronki23]

If your getting stronger and bigger why change? If it ain't broke don't fix it.

In case I stall/need to move on (I doubt this applies to me haha)
Just asking why people do programs of 3-4 sets of 6-12 like the Arnold Golden 6/T-Nation suggestion/All Pro because they don't work for me near as much as strength programs

 

[joh]

If you are not a newb and have 2-3 years of weight training there is no better program i know of than DC Training. Google it and read up.
Puts size on and gives strength like nothing else.

 

[ronki23]

Thanks guys,

My aim is to build a muscular body with low bodyfat percentage AND be good athletic wise- the current crop of physiques do differ but they all are near 200lbs,have fairly low bodyfat and are fairly strong-not Hulk strong but still strong. These are the kind of physique I am aiming for:

If I had the genetics or 'arsenal' available to me i'd want to look like this

 

[moya]

In case I stall/need to move on (I doubt this applies to me haha)
Just asking why people do programs of 3-4 sets of 6-12 like the Arnold Golden 6/T-Nation suggestion/All Pro because they don't work for me near as much as strength programs

because people are lazy sheep....

 

[shirlene29]

Lol..never a truer word spoken

 

[joeblow12345]

One of the best, basic, and effective strength programs is Jim wendlers 531 program. You can find it on Amazon or elitefts.com.

 

[ronki23]

I'm back-current stats:

Squat-85kg 5RM ***Personal Best***
Bench Press- 57.5kg 3RM ***Personal Best ***
Deadlift- 85kg 6RM- ***Personal Best ***
Overhead Press 40kg 1RM
Power Clean 30kg 3RM

I'm a bit concerned my dips and chins aren't going up-both are assisted but i'm actually doing FEWER dips with 4 plates (assisted) and my chins are stalling. I assume because i've only been getting less than 4 reps on the Bench so i've been doing 5x3 instead of 3x5 to get strong on the Bench (yes even after a reset) that my triceps are fatigued from that?
My overhead press and bench press are very slow to progress-they only go up every 2-3 sessions.

My bicep curls and tricep extensions are weak-the extensions I am only doing 7kg per arm for 8-10 reps (on the lhs i'm doing kickbacks as my shoulder hurts on the left from tricep extensions-winged scapula from bad posture may be a factor). As for the bicep curls, my personal best is 12.5kg dumbbells for 6-10 reps but since it's only once a week and Ripp recommends Barbell curls, i've been doing arm blaster barbell curls and they're stuck on 16kg barbell for 4-8 reps (8 reps set 1, 4 set 2 i've tried with 18kg and that was only 6 reps set 1, 2 set 2).
Are the bicep curls weak from the arm blaster? I can do the same with 2x8kg dumbbells and with better form on the arm blaster-I assume the arm blaster and compound exercises are making my upper arms work harder.

Mainly concerned over upper body press being slow to progress and accessory exercises being weaker :/

I've got 3-4 weeks to go before I go back to Uni and do my martial arts; i'd like to get to 100kg on the squats and deadlifts and add at least 10kg on to upper body exercises.

P.S. my physique isn't changing much-haven't measured but my arms are a little bigger; I finally got to my biggest size/highest strength to date but i'm still very flabby-weight is fluctuating as it goes up one week or down another by 1-2lbs (i'm trying to lose fat so was hoping it'd go down).
At which point would one become fat AND muscular before thinking of stripping off the fat weight? I assume one would have to lift at least bodyweight on their upper body (bench press,chins and dips) to have larger-than-average arms with the same applying to lower body. I can lift bodyweight on lower body exercises and have big legs but I assume the legs would only look bigger and better if I lost fat and I assume that I should add more size and strength before losing fat??