the best pump in my tricep ever! the outer head of it

[nclifter6feet6]

i have always had a real problem hitting the outer head of my tricep. close grip bench presses hit it just a little bit but close grip bench tend to hit more right at my elbow or the middle head of the tricep...or with nosebreakers.....also french presses with an ez curl behined the neck hits my inner head of my triceps or a frech press with the dumbell behined the neck smokes my inner head of the triceps..


so today i tried close grip incline barbell bench press. but the key to this is use light weight and go VERY SLOW. keep your grip about 5 inches apart from each other and SLOWLY lower it down to your chin and SLOWLY push it up. don use much weight and go slow, like 5 seconds on the deccentric and 4 seconds on the concentric.

i used a 25 pound plate on each side. and i did it at the end of my other tricep work. i think u should try this at the end of the workout instead of the beginning. it really hit the outer head for the first time in a long time

 

[Vortexx]

I am gonna try this one with the Triceps bar lol!

 

[Debaser]

5 inches apart? I feel sorry for your wrists and elbows.

Pump does not equate to growth, btw.

 

[nclifter6feet6]

whats so hard about 5 inches apart? i routinely do close grips with hands touching eachother with 245 in sets of 3-5. but you can get better balance with 5. i have strong wrists ive done years of construction type work. try using broomsticks with a string with a weight on it to increase your wrist strength sinse you have trouble.

i feel i like to get a good pump in whatever muscle im working, so i can feel like ive done something. i dont train for strength i go for the pump and using perfect form and focusing on the muscle, but thats just my style. i go for tha pooooomp like aaaaaaaahhhhnold

the same goes for deadlifts i do deadlifts slowly with no momentum. to avoid the jerking motion and sloppy form on really heavy weights

 

[Debaser]

It has nothing to do with wrist strength.

thats like saying you should do deadlifts with a rounded lower back as long as it's strong. It's a compromising position, I guarantee if you keep this up your elbows will be fucked soon.

 

[nclifter6feet6]

deadlifts is also compromising position. so are squats so are alot of things.

thats why u dont use overly heavy weights and use good form better yet perfect form

 

[Debaser]

I don't think you understand what I mean...Deadlifts and squats are perfectly safe, if you use perfect form.

Close grip bench presses are perfectly safe, if you use perfect form, but this means at least 14" space. Some will debate this number, but it's sure as hell not close to 5".

I was equating 5" space to rounded back deadlifts to show that they're simply going to cause injury sooner or later, and almost assuredly sooner.

 

[Exodus]

i totally disagree with you. if he can do it and it doest hurt fine. our bodies are made differntly. so what is bizzare for you may be fine for him. i do my close grip with index finger on the smooth. but i have weak wrist. when i wasnt as strong i could do them that close. if he can do 245 for 3-5 with hands touching, the obviously he has got something going for him.

and wsb does do rounded back squats and goodmornings as well.

X

 

[nclifter6feet6]

exodus-what is the point of rounded back squats.....does it hit like mid way through the back like the top of the erectors or the lower erectors, or hit the quads different?

i feel that is my week point because usually if i do deads or squats i feel it either in my upper back or lower erectors

 

[tzan]

When you guys do yuor close grips, do you tend to keep your elbows pointed outwards, or do you keep them closerr to your body.

I haven't done closegrips in so long because of a fucked up elbow, but it is getting better and wanted to start up again at a light weight.

 

[Kid Dynamite]

I think he was using rounded back squats as an example, not saying you should do them. There is no reason to do those, unless you want an injury.

 

[nclifter6feet6]

he said in wsb they do round back squats.....i was asking why does wsb incorparate rounded back squats? it does seem like you could get injured...i guess? hell i dont know

 

[DrBones]

Rounded back squats or deads, may not cause immediate damage, but they do cause degenerative problems in your vertabrae over a prolonged period of time. The wear and tear will eventually catch up if you do your deads/squats in this manner and 20 years down the road you will be living in pain with arthritus or other such maladies.

 

[nclifter6feet6]

then why would west side barbell be so stupid to incorporate such things in there routines?

 

[Debaser]

i totally disagree with you. if he can do it and it doest hurt fine. our bodies are made differntly. so what is bizzare for you may be fine for him. i do my close grip with index finger on the smooth. but i have weak wrist. when i wasnt as strong i could do them that close. if he can do 245 for 3-5 with hands touching, the obviously he has got something going for him.

and wsb does do rounded back squats and goodmornings as well.

X

I will amend my statement slightly, saying PERHAPS (I am not completely sure) that deadlifts (not sure about squats and others) could be done with a rounded back, with SIGNIFICANTLY less weight, in order to prevent injury later by strengthening the muscles in the compromised position.

However this is not really relevant, especially here since this is more of a joint issue.

Just because it doesn't hurt now doesn't mean it won't later. Elbows, like shoulders are not something you want to fuck up. Doing what he's doing will do exactly that. It doesn't matter who you are, you might have joints more robust than others, but that is not a natural position for his joints, and he will learn that the hard way if he doesn't stop now.

 

[scruples]

i feel that i am able to keep my arms closer to my side with my grip just inside shoulder width... any closer and my elbows cannot help but to flare out to the sides, putting them into what i feel is a compromising position... but i also agree that everyone is different and that doing what works is far more important than following some dogma

 

[DrBones]

then why would west side barbell be so stupid to incorporate such things in there routines?

Good question, But I've talked to my chiropractor about this many times... He is by no means small.. he is 5'11, 215 ripped...
He has told me MANY times, that your vertabrae will slowly wear out from the contant wear and tear that is put on them in this compromising position....
It doesn't matter how strong your surrounding muscles are... with a rounded back, pressure is being put on your vertabrae.. end of story...

I'll try to get him to hook me up with some sources tomorrow

 

[b fold the truth]

I love it when bodybuilders argue...lol...

Close grip bench...I have done 315 with my thumbs touching before...years ago. I realized that I could get more of a tricep workout, safer, with a wider grip... Now, when I do them, I use pointer on the smooth... With a super close grip...I can't get the bar to touch my chest... Heck...my hands are in the way, elbows MUST turn out, and it also puts stress on the rotators too...

As far as round back exercises...they work WONDERS for increasing your deadlift and squat. People injure themselves when their back is 'rounded' so why not STRENGTHEN it like that. Don't avoid it...strengthen it!!!

Rounded squats? ????? Round back GM's for sure...a definate plus as well as Zercher Squats. Both are good for erector development, increasing the deadlift and squat, and injury prevention.

B True

 

[DrBones]

As far as round back exercises...they work WONDERS for increasing your deadlift and squat. People injure themselves when their back is 'rounded' so why not STRENGTHEN it like that. Don't avoid it...strengthen it!!!

As far as injury is concerned, I'm not talking about pulling a muscle in your back.... I'm talking about the position your vertabrae are put in while performing these movements.
This position may put you at risk for hurting muscles, and doing these movements in this manner may strengthen the muscles in your back, but after years and years of wear and tear in this position, the vertabrae in your lower back are going to have taken a severe beating... After 10 years of lifting in this manner I doubt it would be uncommon for many people who lift with rounded backs to have phase 3 subluxation in their lower vertabrae. I have phase 2 subluxation in my t2.t3,t4 vertabraes in my upper back already (from other things) which is the beginning of arthritus, and its fuckin terrible.. I get many nerve problems which span into my shoulders and neck...... Definitely not fun.

I'm only relaying what my chiropractor has told me, who also happenes to be a powerlifter turned bodybuilder, and obviously is a DR in spinal care has told me... After 8 years of schooling, he's got to know what hes talking about when it comes to spinal care.....

I'm not trying to rip on anyone here.. I just want you guys to be healthy... take care of your back, its a longevity thing... you only have one, and once its fucked.... well.. life is a lot more painful.. and working out becomes a lot more challenging

THanks

This isn't meant to be a big arguement.. I'm just trying to help prevent future back problems... as I'm already fucked up the wazoo and I'm only 21...

 

[Tagio]

B Fold, I'm training for aggressive inline, (basically rollerblading with jumping around and over stuff, not a 'real' sport) and so I'm working mostly on core strength, for vertical leap and injury prevention: deads, squats. since it's not possible to always keep a straight back during my sport, would you suggest some rounded back exercises added to my routine?

I was doing some dumbbell straight-leg deads, allowing my back to round at the bottom. this mimicked a position I find myself in a lot after an unbalanced landing. they felt great actually, should I keep doing them?

 

[b fold the truth]

DrBones: You know a lot more about what you are talking about in your post than I do. A lot of it is over my head...

I know that when people lose a lift (Squat or Dead) it helps if they have trained their back in a rounded manner to help them pull off the lift without injury. Many of my events are with a rounded back (stones, tire, conan's wheel, etc...) so exercises with a rounded back (zercher squats, rounded back GM's) are good for me and to prevent injury.

Also...the WSB guys suggest it...

Good thoughts though...very good thoughts.

B True

 

[b fold the truth]

B Fold, I'm training for aggressive inline, (basically rollerblading with jumping around and over stuff, not a 'real' sport) and so I'm working mostly on core strength, for vertical leap and injury prevention: deads, squats. since it's not possible to always keep a straight back during my sport, would you suggest some rounded back exercises added to my routine?

I was doing some dumbbell straight-leg deads, allowing my back to round at the bottom. this mimicked a position I find myself in a lot after an unbalanced landing. they felt great actually, should I keep doing them?

I really can't see why anyone would do rounded back stiff legged deads unless it was with SUPER LIGHT WEIGHTS!!!! You could do Zercher Squats or rounded back GM's or reverse hypers to strengthen the same area SAFER!!!

B True

 

[DanielBishop]

I'm no biologist....

.... but if it works for him, why not?

One of your said that just because it doesn't hurt now, doesn't mean it won't hurt later.... couldn't that apply to any exercise that any of us are doing all the time? I knew someone who developed joint problems and arthritis simply from walking a lot.... yep, just walking. Her natural walking gait was a bit strange and she walked around all the time in her younger years, but felt no pain at the time. So we could all be doing ourselves damage and not knowing it, if that's your mentality.

On the same token, I've known guys who did behind-the-neck pull-ups and presses all their life and have no problems. It all depends on the individual.

 

[DrBones]

DrBones: You know a lot more about what you are talking about in your post than I do. A lot of it is over my head...

I definitely respect everything you've been saying and so I decided to take it to my chiropractor today... Heres what he told me

He goes to A LOT of chiropractic seminars...
What the general consensus is on people from the western society is that the BEST position for one to keep their back in is the natural curvature of the spine...
HOWEVER, to give some credit to you and WSB, studies have been done on Eastern society, MAINLY asian women who pick vegetables from the ground, who are bent over ALL day with their backs CONTANTLY bent.... What they've found with them is ABSOLUTELY no back problems, due mainly to the strengthening and lengthening of the ligaments in the back... another factor slightly overlooked was the strengthening of the muscles in the back... just like you've been saying....

We discussed this for a bit, and he said that this could be a slightly evolutionary prosess since they have been doing this for centuries... and that its probably in my best interest to continue keeping my back in a natural curve while lifting....

My advice to you, since you have been doing lifts in this manner for some time, for both your own safety and for the purpose of finding the underlying truth, would be to head over to your local chirpractor, and getting him/her to take bi-anual ex-rays to make sure you are not causing yourself health problems with your back...

While my back is fucked in the upper portion, my lower back is in AMAZING condition.. I attribute it to the effort I have put in to keeping my back in the most natural curve position I'm capable of...

Please don't think I'm trying to discredit you or WSB.. I'm just trying to relay the things my doctor has told me....

Thanks for listening

 

[DanielBishop]

Picking vegetables is cool.

 

[b fold the truth]

Interesting info for sure...

Note that I don't go super hard or heavy on rounded back exercises...

B True