Stopping Testcyp 8 weeks---FERTILITY ??

[chas3369]

Hello everyone-

My name is Charlie and I am 41 years old! I currently weight 290. I went to Dr. this past fall to have some bloodwork done, since I had not been for over 15 years. I had gained alot of weight over the last 2-3 years (40pounds), mainly around my stomach, and was concerned about diabetes/thyroid etc. Anyway, I was cleared of diabetes, however doc called me and said I had low Test levels and recommended Test injections- he said it would be good for losing belly fat and staying lean/gaining some muscle etc---sounded good! Here is my dliemma- my wife and I have been trying to conceive/get pregnant, and she has always had some hormone issues and challenges. I have always had great fertility/sperm lab results (3-4 tests). Bottom line is the general family doctor did not mention that this could shut me down or be harmful with fertility. I even asked him about this, and he said it is good for sperm motility and production. I rcvd my first shot in December 200mg of Tcyp. I returned in January and did not feel any difference after 3 weeks. So he then started doing weekly of 200mg ew for the last 7 weeks. I am concerned because I did not realize this could be an ongoing process (hence TRT), again doc never mentioned this. I was due for a shot this week on Tuesday and skipped it. I met with doc and asked questions about what was his plans, and he didnt have a clue in relationship to PCT or HCG/AI's etc. He just said he would taper me off!!! I asked to see an endo- going 2morror/Friday. Here is the deal I got a copy of my original labs from November (First & only lab), and my total test was 362 ng/dl ranfe of 280-800, and my Free Test (Direct): 8.3pg/ml range of 6.8-21.5. My free test seems low comparesd to Total. Any thoughts?? Also, should I consider taking some HCG for a few weeks to help out until I decide or get with ENDO?? Main concern is fertility & also getting my natural levels back to where they were!!!! I think through better diet, losing some weight, getting more sleep -terrrible sleep patterns/ and test boosters, loweering estrogen etc. that I will be ok in the 400-500 range! Anyone agree/ disagree?? I just dont wanna be on injections the rest of my life unless absolute necessary ya know! I would really appreciate some feedback and any ideas/ concerns! Lastly, what should I ask the endo on my appointment tomorrow???
I have some HCG and going to take some of it! --good idea?? What else for some PCT, if Im suppressed etc.??? Thanks ---- feedback appreciated!!!!!!

 

[Zyglamail]

If your dont with TRT, id do low dose (ie 250IU) 3x a week for 8 weeks or so. You should recover fine to your previous lowish numbers. Taking exo test will have a negative impact on fertility, but it, like your natural test production should return.

I dont see a point in seeing an endo if you are done with TRT.

 

[chas3369]

Thanks zyglamil!! Your recommending small doses of HCG, or a serm?? Did i break a rule??---- Byh the way I saw endo and he confirmed that the test probablly shut me down, and he wnats me to have bloodwork in a month and then see him again in 6 weeks. He confirmed many of my suspicions, but he doesnt want me to take any HCG or anything else. He just said we need to find out while I wass low in the first place!! Thanks again!!! Reason for going to endo is because i am very concerned with my fertility and want to get some answers and was hoping he might recommend or give me some good solutiuons!!!!

 

[Zyglamail]

Endos cant really give you answers set in stone, they, like any doc can make an educated guess. Doesnt sound like he told you any more than I did or could be learned here on the forum. I can gaurantee 5the test dose and duration you were on had a negative impact on your natural test production and sperm production. High test levels in the body, which is what you have when you produce test yourself and add more cause your body to stop producing LH and FSH. HCG mimicks LH in men and triggers test and sperm production in the testes. HCG can help men with fertility, even when on AAS. Many folks use it sparingly during a cycle just to keep their testes in good working order.

Your doc is going to have you likely make a few more visits at a few week intervals checking blood frequently until you get back to normal. At the end of the day he isnt going to fix anything because nothing is broken, you are simply experiencing the long known repercussions of using AAS. Stop AAS and most people bounce back just fine given time, for some a few weeks, others a few months.

 

[DJ_UFO]

Since you are not into bodybuilding, you are making a good decision. There are several ways to get natural good testosterone levels. There are great supplements here. Take care of your body weight, your diet and exercise. Follow the advice with HCG. Don't worry, your body will recover and your fertility will come back.

Good luck!!

 

[chas3369]

Endos cant really give you answers set in stone, they, like any doc can make an educated guess. Doesnt sound like he told you any more than I did or could be learned here on the forum. I can gaurantee 5the test dose and duration you were on had a negative impact on your natural test production and sperm production. High test levels in the body, which is what you have when you produce test yourself and add more cause your body to stop producing LH and FSH. HCG mimicks LH in men and triggers test and sperm production in the testes. HCG can help men with fertility, even when on AAS. Many folks use it sparingly during a cycle just to keep their testes in good working order.

Your doc is going to have you likely make a few more visits at a few week intervals checking blood frequently until you get back to normal. At the end of the day he isnt going to fix anything because nothing is broken, you are simply experiencing the long known repercussions of using AAS. Stop AAS and most people bounce back just fine given time, for some a few weeks, others a few months.

I agree with you 100% ZYGlamail. If it werent for Need2 and a few other sites I joined, I would be in the dark and my family doc really didnt have a clue. Im surprise they allow docs to prescribe Test without really understanding the repercussions---shutting down/ and lowering your natty production. OKbottom line do u think Ill be ok taking this HCG I have here on hand & how much do u think I should dose?? I have been told 1500iu's every other day to spark, to 150iu's 2 times weekly. This Tuesday will be 2 weeks since my last shot, however, i did have a total of 8 shots over a 80 day period--Decemebr 10th thru March1st. I am going to go have a lab for sperm this week, and if i come back at under 20 million sperm count, I might file a complaint against my doc, cause he saod it would help with fertility, and he didnt mention anything about it suppressing my HPTA/shutting down---hes just clueless. His plan was just to give me 10 shots and then retest my blood--- well hell yes my T levels will go up because of the injections, but then what? I get lured onto TRT, when it really was not necessary, and furthermore he didnt mention anything about TRT. My endo asked me whats TRT-- he said there are no doctors of TRT, its unrecognized by the medical society in general. I said they specialize in hormone trreatments and helping people have a better quality of life and he said never heard of it!!! I said well look what listening to my MD doctor got me?? I said my doctor who referred me to you put me on the highest dosage of TRT therapy and didnt realize the affects to me/fertility etc. He said you got a point!! lol
Endo didnt even want me to be tested on next labs for E2/estrogen---do u guys think i should have that checked?? Again, would u guys take the 10,000 iu's of the HCG---i mean it couldnt hurt me any worse than where I am now, correct. And when should I consider taking some unleashed or Bridge or possibly Nolvadex if I decisde to order a good serm?? You think i should just take some good supps like ones I just mentioned or order a good serm like Nolva or clomid??? Thanks for your help!!!!!!!!

 

[Zyglamail]

I agree with you 100% ZYGlamail. If it werent for Need2 and a few other sites I joined, I would be in the dark and my family doc really didnt have a clue. Im surprise they allow docs to prescribe Test without really understanding the repercussions---shutting down/ and lowering your natty production. OKbottom line do u think Ill be ok taking this HCG I have here on hand & how much do u think I should dose?? I have been told 1500iu's every other day to spark, to 150iu's 2 times weekly. This Tuesday will be 2 weeks since my last shot, however, i did have a total of 8 shots over a 80 day period--Decemebr 10th thru March1st. I am going to go have a lab for sperm this week, and if i come back at under 20 million sperm count, I might file a complaint against my doc, cause he saod it would help with fertility, and he didnt mention anything about it suppressing my HPTA/shutting down---hes just clueless. His plan was just to give me 10 shots and then retest my blood--- well hell yes my T levels will go up because of the injections, but then what? I get lured onto TRT, when it really was not necessary, and furthermore he didnt mention anything about TRT. My endo asked me whats TRT-- he said there are no doctors of TRT, its unrecognized by the medical society in general. I said they specialize in hormone trreatments and helping people have a better quality of life and he said never heard of it!!! I said well look what listening to my MD doctor got me?? I said my doctor who referred me to you put me on the highest dosage of TRT therapy and didnt realize the affects to me/fertility etc. He said you got a point!! lol
Endo didnt even want me to be tested on next labs for E2/estrogen---do u guys think i should have that checked?? Again, would u guys take the 10,000 iu's of the HCG---i mean it couldnt hurt me any worse than where I am now, correct. And when should I consider taking some unleashed or Bridge or possibly Nolvadex if I decisde to order a good serm?? You think i should just take some good supps like ones I just mentioned or order a good serm like Nolva or clomid??? Thanks for your help!!!!!!!!

Well, if your not in a hurry to produce sperm then skip HCG and just ride it out until your test levels come back. If your in a hurry to procreate add HCG. I think a dose of 1500IU is overkill though. I wouldnt waste any time on nolva/clomid at all.

Keep in mind however if you add HCG its going to throw off your labs for your endo. Just like taking test lowers natural test production, HCG will affect your body producing LH BUT it will trigger test release and sperm creation.

At the end of the day you need to decide if you want to just let things come back normally, which could take a few months. Or, if your in a hurry to procreate, taking LH should up your sperm count and help testes recover but it will have an impact on natural LH production which sooner or later your going to have to overcome.

 

[chas3369]

Why do u think I shouldnt worrry about taking any nolva/clomid. many others are telling me to skip the HCG & start a mild PCT asap. They are saying that the clomid will stimulate the lh and help me to restart my system. Im even more confused now. I understand the effects of the HCG, but if I didnt take it while on cycle, should I just skip it all together maybe? My plan is to start 500iu's twice a week for 2-3 weeks, and then see how I feel. Then possibly some ggood supps from there. What will supprressing my LH mean to my overall system??? thanks

 

[Zyglamail]

Clomid and nolva block the estrogen receptor because they are a form of estrogen. They often cause sides most dont want to deal with and generally speaking taking them when test levels are normal will increase test levels slightly. However, taking them when testes are shut down hasnt really provent to be all that effective, especially considering the sides so many face.

That being said, youve been on low dose test for 8 weeks, quiting cold turkey shouldnt be hard for you to come back from so you likely dont need anything. BUT, if your trying to knock someone up today, then using low dose HCG may be the way to go. If short term fertility isnt a concern then just let things ride amd keep going back to you endo for blood work.

 

[chas3369]

Clomid and nolva block the estrogen receptor because they are a form of estrogen. They often cause sides most dont want to deal with and generally speaking taking them when test levels are normal will increase test levels slightly. However, taking them when testes are shut down hasnt really provent to be all that effective, especially considering the sides so many face.

That being said, youve been on low dose test for 8 weeks, quiting cold turkey shouldnt be hard for you to come back from so you likely dont need anything. BUT, if your trying to knock someone up today, then using low dose HCG may be the way to go. If short term fertility isnt a concern then just let things ride amd keep going back to you endo for blood work.

Thnks Zyglamail,

I think were on the same wavelength. I was thinking of 250-500iu's 2-3 time /week for the next 2 weeks. I had another guy on anabolicminds & also telling me absolutely no HCG since I have stopped the shots. Through me for a loop. Their saying its too late, and to just start PCT etc. I do know the proper protocol sseems to be to take HCG while on cycle, and then PCT 2 weeks after last shot, but my main concern is fertility--followed by just getting back my natural Test levels... I suppose I should just stop all drugs and consider some good supps for a PCT/test recovery. Can i be harmed by taking like 5-6 injections of HCG only 300-500iu's per shot??

 

[Zyglamail]

Simply put HCG mimics your own LH and WILL get the testes going whether on cycle or off, there is no question about that.

However, LH is produced by the anterior pituitary gland and its release is ceased when test levels are too high which in turn means your testes stop producing. If you take external LH (in the form of HCG) it will get the testes working but it doesnt mean your going to help your anterior pituitary gland produce lh. So no matter how you cut it, introducing something from the outside into the system will have a negative effect on something.

The consensus has been that the anterior pituitary gland is more apt to start up LH production after a vacation than your testes so using HCG on and off for a little while during a cycle keeps the testes working to some degree so that when all exo test is out of the system they are more apt to restart production a little faster because they have at least been sporadically (ie 2x a week or so) triggerd into action while your bodies own LH production was stopped.

Can i be harmed by taking like 5-6 injections of hcg only 300-500iu's per shot??

HCG has a short half life, like 24 hours, so daily injections shouldnt cause any harm, but as I said above, constant use will just suppress your anterior pituitary gland from producing LH on its own so when you stop HCG you now need to wait for that to start working again.

 

[pendit]

I agree with you 100% ZYGlamail. If it werent for Need2 and a few other sites I joined, I would be in the dark and my family doc really didnt have a clue. Im surprise they allow docs to prescribe Test without really understanding the repercussions---shutting down/ and lowering your natty production. OKbottom line do u think Ill be ok taking this HCG I have here on hand & how much do u think I should dose?? I have been told 1500iu's every other day to spark, to 150iu's 2 times weekly. This Tuesday will be 2 weeks since my last shot, however, i did have a total of 8 shots over a 80 day period--Decemebr 10th thru March1st. I am going to go have a lab for sperm this week, and if i come back at under 20 million sperm count, I might file a complaint against my doc, cause he saod it would help with fertility, and he didnt mention anything about it suppressing my HPTA/shutting down---hes just clueless. His plan was just to give me 10 shots and then retest my blood--- well hell yes my T levels will go up because of the injections, but then what? I get lured onto TRT, when it really was not necessary, and furthermore he didnt mention anything about TRT. My endo asked me whats TRT-- he said there are no doctors of TRT, its unrecognized by the medical society in general. I said they specialize in hormone trreatments and helping people have a better quality of life and he said never heard of it!!! I said well look what listening to my MD doctor got me?? I said my doctor who referred me to you put me on the highest dosage of TRT therapy and didnt realize the affects to me/fertility etc. He said you got a point!! lol
Endo didnt even want me to be tested on next labs for E2/estrogen---do u guys think i should have that checked?? Again, would u guys take the 10,000 iu's of the HCG---i mean it couldnt hurt me any worse than where I am now, correct. And when should I consider taking some unleashed or Bridge or possibly Nolvadex if I decisde to order a good serm?? You think i should just take some good supps like ones I just mentioned or order a good serm like Nolva or clomid??? Thanks for your help!!!!!!!!

Sounds like you got the worst of both worlds, a clueless doc injecting you and an endo that never heard of TRT. I must say though, your test levels are low, especially your free test. My free test came in at 8.2 last time and I felt like crap, even though my total test was higher than yours. I think if you get your test levels up for a while, you'll eventually realize how much better life is. I understand that right now you're concerned about fertility. Follow Zyg's advice, but consider TRT in the future once there's a bun in the oven. This site is filled with more information than you can imagine on steroid usage, etc. Read and learn so you can go back to your doc for injections and know how to make up for his lack of knowledge. You're lucky to find a doc wanting to do weekly 200mg injections!

 

[chas3369]

Sounds like you got the worst of both worlds, a clueless doc injecting you and an endo that never heard of TRT. I must say though, your test levels are low, especially your free test. My free test came in at 8.2 last time and I felt like crap, even though my total test was higher than yours. I think if you get your test levels up for a while, you'll eventually realize how much better life is. I understand that right now you're concerned about fertility. Follow Zyg's advice, but consider TRT in the future once there's a bun in the oven. This site is filled with more information than you can imagine on steroid usage, etc. Read and learn so you can go back to your doc for injections and know how to make up for his lack of knowledge. You're lucky to find a doc wanting to do weekly 200mg injections!

You got it man!! If i was really interested in getting jacked little bit--yeah my doc is cool and issuing the m200mg ew sounded good and my strength was startin to mkick in damn good; however, my testes were starting to die out ya know after that 6th shot!! I just wish he would had a clue cause I couldve started taking HCG the last 4 shots and kept my boyzz going and then not have to worrry as much about all this shutting down and PCT etc. Bottom line is shit happens for a reaon and I agree that you can learn alot by reading and posting and self-educating, and now the issue is will I crash little bit or will I rebound OK---Im hoping my levels will get back to where they were aND THEN i CAN MONITOR And watch for things and have an idea of whats going on. I do think I need to have my estradiol checked because it seems I have some sides of having high estrogen!!!! Thanks guys!!!!!!!

 

[XMAN.]

in ur case i wouldn't use anything just let ur body bounce back to where it was b4, forget about hcg or serms , the only thing that u can do without sides and can actually boost ur natural production is to take an AI (aromatase inhibitor) like Aromasin , 2 or 3 halves tabs per week (12.5mg/e3d or eod) it'll lower ur estro and shbg and boost lh productiion and free more test for anabolism and can actually help u remove some of that belly fat u have by blocking estro production.

 

[chas3369]

in ur case i wouldn't use anything just let ur body bounce back to where it was b4, forget about hcg or serms , the only thing that u can do without sides and can actually boost ur natural production is to take an AI (aromatase inhibitor) like Aromasin , 2 or 3 halves tabs per week (12.5mg/e3d or eod) it'll lower ur estro and shbg and boost lh productiion and free more test for anabolism and can actually help u remove some of that belly fat u have by blocking estro production.

Xman wheres the best place to get aromasin/aramidex??

 

[XMAN.]

Xman wheres the best place to get aromasin/aramidex??

sorry i can't tell u that no sourcing is allowed on this board only if there's a sponsor that sells it but there's not, so u have to find it yourself. but what i can help u with is give u the address of this forum which many of the guys here on EF r members in including me and it's a source check forum which can help u find a legit source for anything : Elite-bodiez Steroids Sources and Supplement Forums