Frustrated, please help me out

[flipican16]

Hey Girls!-
I am new to elite and wanted to get some input from ya'll. I just graduated from TSU and I am going to start at my new job in a few weeks.

I have lost 70 lbs. and want to lose another 10 lbs. to completely lean out. Problem is, I have been at a plataeu for 8 MONTHS!! I know that a plateau can last anywhere from 3 months to 1 1/2 years and I need to do something to lean out fast for credibility.

I have done everything: diet modifications, calorie rotations, changes in my exercise/training routine and nothing is working. I have even done the two weeks of rest to hopefully overcome my plataeu, but that hasn't helped either lol.....

I was debating on taking clenbuterol to help me lean out. Is there anything else supplement wise that will help me get rid of the last bit of body fat?!

I know how to diet and I know how hard to workout but the body is fighting me on the last bit of weight- ya'll know how it can be!! The last 10 lbs are the hardest to lose!!!!

I have been told that I will overcome my plateau in time, but time is running out. I wanna look good on the first day!!! LOL......
Thanks for any advice ya'll can give me, I appreciate it.

 

[the-short-one]

if you take clen, you will rebund and gain the weight back, maybe more along with it when you stop taking it.

how many calories are you taking in - and what is your current weight? also, please list your workouts/cardio.

 

[superqt4u2nv]

Welcome to Elite Post up your current diet please and bespecific as possible. Also list your current stats and training routine. Thanks

Example
8 am
6 egg whites
1/2 cup oatmeal

10 am
1 oz almonds
etc...

 

[Sassy69]

Congrats on your accomplishments so far. Please don't feel like you have to resort to stuff like clenbuteral - its overhyped and still it is ONLY a supplement to an already fine-tuned diet - its not the silver bullet and is not what will make the difference to what you are doing now. Your body is only responding to the fuel & stimulus reflected by your lifestyle - that means you have to tweak your lifestyle to get the results.

Can you tell us specifically where you are now - height, weight, bodyfat. "That last 10 lbs" doesn't really help me know where you are at. Also can you give an sample meal plan for a day (e.g. meal number, time you eat, what specificaly you eat & portion size) & your current training schedule?

 

[flipican16]

Thanks for the welcome!!

superqt4u2nv-thanks for the help!

Sassy 69 and the-short-one: Thank you for the info on clenbuterol. I am very hesitant on that stuff and I'm glad I am not the only one who feels that goals can be achieved in other ways. Like I said, frustration has kicked in and I am just getting desperate for some help. Hopefully ya'll will find something to change in the info proceeding. If I can get this dang body to work with me, then WOO HOO!!!! Thanks for the help gals!


Okay, so here's the 411 on me:
5'6"
160 lbs.
BMI chart says 25% but I had my body fat checked by the University and my actual Body fat: 23%

I have a athletic yet curvy physic; I am naturally muscular; I gain mass rather quickly.

My goal is to just allow myself to have a more lean look (hopefully all I need to lose is 2-3% body fat) and allow more definition to show. I don't want my body fat under 18% (don't want menses to cease) and I don't plan on having my body fat lower than 19% until I start competing next year (I'll have enough money by then hopefully- college makes you poor!!! LOL)

Here's a sample diet
6:00 a.m. Morning pre-workout: fat free yogurt (1/2 cup) I can't train on an empty stomach.

8:00 a.m. Breakfast :
Spinach and mushrooms with 3 egg whites to one yolk
whole wheat toast
Piece of fruit

11:00 a.m. Snack: Shake with skim milk

1:30 p.m. Lunch:
whole wheat, low fat turkey sandwich with tomatoes, lettuce, green peppers, olives, and oregano (no dressing- hate that stuff lol!!).
1 cup steamed veggies
Piece of fruit

4:00 p.m. Snack: shake with skim milk

6:00 p.m. Preworkout: Shake or fat free yogurt
Postworkout: Gatorade

7:30 or 8:00 p.m. Dinner:
Salmon or chicken with 1 tsp. olive oil
steamed broccoli (2-3 cups cooked- I LOVE broccoli!!!)
brown rice (1 cup cooked)

**My meals and snacks are eaten every two to three hours.
**I take in a lot of calcium because of my medication- it depletes my calcium stores.
If I'm still hungry or feel light headed, I will add 200-500 calories to my daily intake.

Workout for the week is usually:

Monday: 45 min am cardio high intensity
45 min pm cardio high intensity

Tuesday: 45 min am cardio moderate intensity
chest/back pm workout

Wednesday: 45 min am cardio moderate intensity
legs pm workout

Thursday: 45 min am cardio moderate intensity
arms/shoulder workout

Friday: 45 min am cardio high intensity
45 min pm cardio high intensity

Saturday: One weight workout (work either legs, arms/shoulders, back/chest)- I will alternate every week.
40 minutes cardio moderate to low intensity and 20 minute intervals to finish

Sunday: Rest
**I've been an athlete most of my life, so my body is used to this type of routine. But once a month, I'll take Saturday and Sunday off to rest. I love working out!! It's such a great stress reliever!!!



Thanks ya'll!
I appreciate all of the help!

 

[Sassy69]

First - you are about my height / weight, I've got a lower bodyfat but I've also got a solid (post bodybuilding competition) muscle mass base. It looks like you are all about the 'right direction', so should really be a very easy tweak to your diet & training.

To start, if you don't already, put the meal plan you listed into a food counts program like www.fitday.com so you know what the total calories are and the macro nutrient breakdown - % protein / fat / carb. IMO you might want to do a change in your diet to dump some of the fruit & the bread and do sort of a 'cutting diet' that will help you get over the hump. I'm going to guess your body has acclimated itself to this diet and doesnt' respond to it so much anymore. Once we know the total cals & macronutrient breakdown, we can suggest some changes there.

Training-wise - again I'm willing to bet your body has acclimated itself to the cardio you do. You might want to change that up. Not sure how yet, but change something because it doens't respond so much to what you are doing now because it has been conditioned for it.

If you do just cardio in the morning, I might suggest you do empty stomach cardio or consider eating maybe egg whites instead of that yogurt to start with. If you do real training (not cardio but lifting) then I'd suggest a real meal prior to that.

Those are my suggestions - will depend on your current total cals & macros and then looking at the best way to tweak them.

Also I wanted to say that weight is not the only way to track progress. You may be at a point where your bodyfat / body composition needs to change some but the weight won't reflect that. To illustrate - last Jan I came off a "fat episode" where I got rather tubby in response to a move across the country, a new job, and a lot of other life stresses. So I started prepping for another bodybuildign competition in Jan 05. My body's 'set point' - the weight that it tends to settle at is about 160-165 lbs. But I was 24% bodyfat. Lots of muscle, lots of fat. So between Jan & Mar I dieted & trained - dropped 9% bodyfat and 2 lbs (164 lb to 162 lb). So if I went by what the scale said, I'd probably jump out the window in frustration at "lack of progress". After March, I changed up my diet & training again to go into the last 2 month stretch for competition & dropped another 15 lb of mass (mostly fat) and in the last few days another 5-7 lb of water and another 8% bodyfat for show day. Now I'm back up to around 160 lb and prob 18%-ish bodyfat.

Anyway -- those were my suggestions - sometimes it takes a focused change to get over what your body is conditioned for. Its just another phase of manipulating your body to respond to what you want for your goals.

And again things like clen and AAS and even other thermogenics are NOT the "difference' in reaching your goals or not. Just learning how to modify what you do to get your body to respond.

 

[flipican16]

First - you are about my height / weight, I've got a lower bodyfat but I've also got a solid (post bodybuilding competition) muscle mass base. It looks like you are all about the 'right direction', so should really be a very easy tweak to your diet & training.

To start, if you don't already, put the meal plan you listed into a food counts program like www.fitday.com so you know what the total calories are and the macro nutrient breakdown - % protein / fat / carb. IMO you might want to do a change in your diet to dump some of the fruit & the bread and do sort of a 'cutting diet' that will help you get over the hump. I'm going to guess your body has acclimated itself to this diet and doesnt' respond to it so much anymore. Once we know the total cals & macronutrient breakdown, we can suggest some changes there.

Training-wise - again I'm willing to bet your body has acclimated itself to the cardio you do. You might want to change that up. Not sure how yet, but change something because it doens't respond so much to what you are doing now because it has been conditioned for it.

If you do just cardio in the morning, I might suggest you do empty stomach cardio or consider eating maybe egg whites instead of that yogurt to start with. If you do real training (not cardio but lifting) then I'd suggest a real meal prior to that.

Those are my suggestions - will depend on your current total cals & macros and then looking at the best way to tweak them.

Also I wanted to say that weight is not the only way to track progress. You may be at a point where your bodyfat / body composition needs to change some but the weight won't reflect that. To illustrate - last Jan I came off a "fat episode" where I got rather tubby in response to a move across the country, a new job, and a lot of other life stresses. So I started prepping for another bodybuildign competition in Jan 05. My body's 'set point' - the weight that it tends to settle at is about 160-165 lbs. But I was 24% bodyfat. Lots of muscle, lots of fat. So between Jan & Mar I dieted & trained - dropped 9% bodyfat and 2 lbs (164 lb to 162 lb). So if I went by what the scale said, I'd probably jump out the window in frustration at "lack of progress". After March, I changed up my diet & training again to go into the last 2 month stretch for competition & dropped another 15 lb of mass (mostly fat) and in the last few days another 5-7 lb of water and another 8% bodyfat for show day. Now I'm back up to around 160 lb and prob 18%-ish bodyfat.

Anyway -- those were my suggestions - sometimes it takes a focused change to get over what your body is conditioned for. Its just another phase of manipulating your body to respond to what you want for your goals.

And again things like clen and AAS and even other thermogenics are NOT the "difference' in reaching your goals or not. Just learning how to modify what you do to get your body to respond.

Hey Darlin'!! Thanks for the help. I will definitely do the fitday.com macro. analysis. I do a food diary already, so that will help with analyzing what I've been eating the past few weeks.
I'm alittle unsure about my exercise; that is, how to change it. I usually change my routine every two months because otherwise I get REALLY bored!!! LOL....
More trial and error is the best thing to do I suppose.

You are dead-on about the scale!! I hate looking at numbers. I go by the way my pants fit. I weigh more now than I did in high school, but my body looks better now than it did then

I appreciate all the help and hopefully I will see a transformation soon!!

 

[Sassy69]

Even just to get a set of data points as to total cals & macros really helps. To cut for competition my cals stay the same but I manipulate the hell out of my carbs and can still cut to 7% bf.

I'm 41 yrs old and in better shape than I was at age 20 and probably in better shape than 90% of my graduating class. I'm bigger but I also sport a nice big fat bicep peak that I wouldn't trade for the world

Hey Darlin'!! Thanks for the help. I will definitely do the fitday.com macro. analysis. I do a food diary already, so that will help with analyzing what I've been eating the past few weeks.
I'm alittle unsure about my exercise; that is, how to change it. I usually change my routine every two months because otherwise I get REALLY bored!!! LOL....
More trial and error is the best thing to do I suppose.

You are dead-on about the scale!! I hate looking at numbers. I go by the way my pants fit. I weigh more now than I did in high school, but my body looks better now than it did then

I appreciate all the help and hopefully I will see a transformation soon!!

 

[Daisy_Girl]

I HIGHLY second FitDay. It is amazing - even if you are writing everything down, once you actually SEE the breakdown, it can change the way you eat.

Nothing much else to add that has not been said already .....

~Check the STICKIES out at the top of the board - they can help with new training ideas and diet ideas.

~One thing that struck me with your initial post was that you said plateaus can last from 3 months to 1.5 years .... I am not so sure about that. If you have hit a plateau, then that is a hint that something needs to be changed. Then, you manipulate things, one by one, until you find what works. Yes, this can take time ..... But I have NEVER had a plateau last for more than a couple weeks while I fine-tuned things. If you have plateaued for 8 months, then you have not fine-tuned or changed things enough. JMO.

~ All that steady state cardio .... Jeez O Peets. Why not try some HIIT (High Intensity Interval Training)?

~ And it is a myth that your period will stop below 18% BF - a HUGE MYTH. SOme people's will stop - but it varies for everyone. Some people here get competition-lean (around 10% BF) and STILL get a monthly period. AT my lowest, 15%, I was still menstruating. Don't pick a ramdom "lowest BF I want" simply because of what some book says.

 

[Hams]

My fellow Texan,

El Paso on the clen.

I second what Daisy said about the cardio. But I'm also curious to know what you mean by "low", "moderate", and "high" intensity. You can make a lot of improvement by doing sprints 2-3x a week. Warmup 10 min, start with 3-4x100m (80-100% effort) w/3min rest between reps, cooldown 10min. Rest.

I was a runner, runner, runner in high school. Lost the period at 10-12%bf. It came back when bf went up. No big deal. Just gotta watch out for osteoperosis. Fortunately, weights help with bone density.

 

[flipican16]

Hey Daisy girl-

Thanks for taking the time to read and reply.

I learned from my college courses that plateaus can last for up to a year and a half. That's where I got that from.....prior to my degree, I also thought plateaus would last for only a few weeks, but it is possible that your body can fight you that much with losing the last bit of weight.

I appreciate the help with the body fat information. A few years ago I was only 17% bf and my period stopped (which I thought was weird because my bf wasn't too underweight but the dr told me it happens and I needed to gain some back), so that's why I am afraid to lose more than 19% if I'm not even going to prepare for a show anytime soon. But who knows, we'll see how things go when I lose more bf.

How much HIIT do you do a week and approximately how long do you do them for?

I like to do one minute all out sprinting followed by 2 minute recovery and repeat this until I have done 20 minutes worth of intervals.

I was thinking of changing it to 30 second high intensity sprints followed by one minute recovery...

Just curious. It's interesting to see what others do!
***Cute picture by the way- I Heart little ones; too cute, too cute***

 

[the-short-one]

agree with above - to me, it looks like you're doing too much cardio. you don't need to do that much - your body will respond better to 3 days a week of cardio and 2 of weight training. take the weekends off and let your body rest. even a little added muscle will help you burn more fat.

also - my period didn't stop until I hit 12%.

 

[flipican16]

agree with above - to me, it looks like you're doing too much cardio. you don't need to do that much - your body will respond better to 3 days a week of cardio and 2 of weight training. take the weekends off and let your body rest. even a little added muscle will help you burn more fat.

also - my period didn't stop until I hit 12%.

Thanks girls!!

I am going to try the three days cardio/ 2 days weight training. Oh darn, less cardio....feel the sarcasm in that by the way

I appreciate all of the help, thank you so much. I'll let ya'll know how this works for me!!




**Hams**Here's what I mean by low, mod, and high intensity:

Intensity Levels (breathing on a scale of 1 to 10- 1 is the easiest (at rest) and 10 being the hardest (struggle to breathe)

**Low intensity- walking, yoga, leisure swimming......not really hard to breathe 4-5

**Moderate intensity- jogging, volleyball, outdoor biking.....harder to conversate and breathing is a 6-7

***High intensity- intense aerobics, heavy wt. training, running/sprinting, SOCCER!!!....breathing 8-10 and conversation is out of the question

 

[Daisy_Girl]

Check the stickies for info on HIIT ...... Esp the thread called "Links to top threads". I will also try to find the post and link it here ..... BRB

Keep in mind that what they teach you in books ain't always the way it is in the real world of training and BF manipulation. Research is GREAT, and totally necessary, but diet and training is SO individual you cannot always say that things are one way or another. I still maintain that if you have hit a plateau for more than a couple weeks, then you need a SERIOUS overhaul in diet and/or training.



Thank you on my little one - she is a joy and pain all rolled into one!

 

[Hams]

**Hams**Here's what I mean by low, mod, and high intensity:

Intensity Levels (breathing on a scale of 1 to 10- 1 is the easiest (at rest) and 10 being the hardest (struggle to breathe)

**Low intensity- walking, yoga, leisure swimming......not really hard to breathe 4-5

**Moderate intensity- jogging, volleyball, outdoor biking.....harder to conversate and breathing is a 6-7

***High intensity- intense aerobics, heavy wt. training, running/sprinting, SOCCER!!!....breathing 8-10 and conversation is out of the question

I've got a buddy back at the University of Arkansas who is getting her Phd in Ex Phys. She calls your kind of measure of intensity "rate of perceived exertion", or RPE for short. When I think of intensity for a cardiovascular workout, I think of a percentage of maximum heart rate. So, if max heart rate is 200 beats/min, then 80% intensity is 160bpm. When I think of intensity for a weight workout, I think in terms of percentage of 1 rep maximum. So, if your 1RM in bench is 200lbs, then 80% intensity is 160lbs. It would be really interesting to see a study where they try to determine to what extent RPE is correlated with percent of maximum heart rate and percentage of 1RM. In any case, to determine cardio intensity, you'd need a heart rate monitor or to be able to check your pulse during or immediately after the exercise. Or, you might be able to correlate it with speed. For example, if you ran 100m in 18s and your pulse immediately after is 160 (assuming 200 is the max), then you know that an 18s 100m run is 80% intensity for you; that is, until your fitness improves.

 

[Daisy_Girl]

Here is some HIIT info -

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5772954&postcount=9

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=504204&highlight=HIIT

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?t=455964&highlight=HIIT

 

[velvett]

70lbs!
Damn girl, congrats!!!!!!

I'm stunned by the amount of cardio you're doing... Yikes - that's really well, too much.

Also, off the top of my head...

Any chance you can take calcium supplements? How many additional mg's do you need to get in per day because of your meds? You can get calcium from kale, spinach, broccoli, salmon, almonds, tofu instead of yogurt and milk.

And maybe swap out the wheat bread for sweet potato and/or oatmeal.

 

[que_66]

Way to go on loosing 70lbs!

 

[T-Cake]

Welcome welcome welcome!

First let me say I'm literally ready to jump into the screen to try and give you advice because so much of what you have experienced and are experiencing has happened to me too.

70 lbs is ASTONISHING! Way to go on that -- we're so glad to help you out especially since you seem to know a lot alraedy (which is a bonus, though not necessary) and, more importantly, we know you're already motivated!

About the plateaus -- honey, I'm WITH YOU on that! I could not break 185 lbs at 5'6" for TWO YEARS and I really thought I had done all in my power to overhaul my diet, change it up, change my workout, try weightlifting, etc.

Believe it or not... there IS a way out, and we're definitely going to help you find it. I am finally down to 160 or so and I have the last 20 lbs to do -- but it's with the help of Elite and these girls here that I really figured out what my body needed to get past the plateau. And YES -- it was a major change and NO it was not something I did before.

Echoes and ideas and thoughts thus far from me:
1) Cardio is a good thing, but make it worth your while when you DO do it! Moderate activity is lovely and all... but I personally, as a "fit" person, don't count it as true workout unless it's HIIT. Get the most out of your time, you know?! The ladies here are right about changing it up, REST MORE, get LOTS of sleep (trust me -- THIS IS HUGE!), and you'll feel better.

2) Fitday... oh my goodness, it's a godsend and it saved me. SAVED ME! For real, I logged EVERYTHING and my diet at its cleanest was much like yours -- and from what I read, it appears you have the needed calcium... but it's also adding a great deal of carbohydrates (though complex) to your diet too. I think once you get the ball rolling with fitday, you'll see that your body is screaming for more protein. Again -- read those stickies!

3) In addition to the stickies, READ LOGS on the women's board whenever you have time. Most of us have them, and some are older and some are newer -- some of us have a FEW of them... but they're ALL valulable and you'll find really great ideas on how to change-up your lifting routine. I get some great ideas from these girls.

I'm so excited for you to be here because I really think I could relate to someone like you and vice versa. Congrats on all your progress, and I can't wait to see you kick this plateau. You're going to do it!

 

[flipican16]

Welcome welcome welcome!

First let me say I'm literally ready to jump into the screen to try and give you advice because so much of what you have experienced and are experiencing has happened to me too.

70 lbs is ASTONISHING! Way to go on that -- we're so glad to help you out especially since you seem to know a lot alraedy (which is a bonus, though not necessary) and, more importantly, we know you're already motivated!

About the plateaus -- honey, I'm WITH YOU on that! I could not break 185 lbs at 5'6" for TWO YEARS and I really thought I had done all in my power to overhaul my diet, change it up, change my workout, try weightlifting, etc.

Believe it or not... there IS a way out, and we're definitely going to help you find it. I am finally down to 160 or so and I have the last 20 lbs to do -- but it's with the help of Elite and these girls here that I really figured out what my body needed to get past the plateau. And YES -- it was a major change and NO it was not something I did before.

Echoes and ideas and thoughts thus far from me:
1) Cardio is a good thing, but make it worth your while when you DO do it! Moderate activity is lovely and all... but I personally, as a "fit" person, don't count it as true workout unless it's HIIT. Get the most out of your time, you know?! The ladies here are right about changing it up, REST MORE, get LOTS of sleep (trust me -- THIS IS HUGE!), and you'll feel better.

2) Fitday... oh my goodness, it's a godsend and it saved me. SAVED ME! For real, I logged EVERYTHING and my diet at its cleanest was much like yours -- and from what I read, it appears you have the needed calcium... but it's also adding a great deal of carbohydrates (though complex) to your diet too. I think once you get the ball rolling with fitday, you'll see that your body is screaming for more protein. Again -- read those stickies!

3) In addition to the stickies, READ LOGS on the women's board whenever you have time. Most of us have them, and some are older and some are newer -- some of us have a FEW of them... but they're ALL valulable and you'll find really great ideas on how to change-up your lifting routine. I get some great ideas from these girls.

I'm so excited for you to be here because I really think I could relate to someone like you and vice versa. Congrats on all your progress, and I can't wait to see you kick this plateau. You're going to do it!

Hi there darlin'!!-
Thank you so much for the help- I appreciate it! I'm glad you've experienced this problem as well...well, you know what I mean
It's nice to see I'm not the only one who has been in this LONG slump lol....
I'm so proud of you!- Go girl!!! I hope I'll overhaul the plateau asap.
Can't wait to let ya know how things go.

 

[flipican16]

Thanks to all the girls for the advice and input! I can't wait to let ya'll know how things go

 

[Daisy_Girl]

I really thought I had done all in my power to overhaul my diet, change it up, change my workout, try weightlifting, etc.

Believe it or not... there IS a way out, and we're definitely going to help you find it. I am finally down to 160 or so and I have the last 20 lbs to do -- but it's with the help of Elite and these girls here that I really figured out what my body needed to get past the plateau. And YES -- it was a major change and NO it was not something I did before.

The key point to see here is that she THOUGHT she had tried everything.
I still maintain that a plateau should not last years - and T said the reason hers did last that long was that there were things she did not know to try.

 

[T-Cake]

The key point to see here is that she THOUGHT she had tried everything.
I still maintain that a plateau should not last years - and T said the reason hers did last that long was that there were things she did not know to try.

Righty-o, and I will gladly play the ignorance card on that one.

It's so true, though! Everyone goes on and on and on *blah blah* about lifting weights and here I was, in the back of my mind thinking (like a stubborn ass), "Well I lost the first 80 doing this... it'll work for the last 50!"

Ha -- yeah, right.

What broke me? Changing my timing on carbs... and yes... *ahem* -- WEIGHTLIFTING. Like, REAL, serious, in-your-face-and-I-mean-it weightlifting.

I'm a changed woman.

 

[Daisy_Girl]

Righty-o, and I will gladly play the ignorance card on that one.

It's so true, though! Everyone goes on and on and on *blah blah* about lifting weights and here I was, in the back of my mind thinking (like a stubborn ass), "Well I lost the first 80 doing this... it'll work for the last 50!"

Ha -- yeah, right.

What broke me? Changing my timing on carbs... and yes... *ahem* -- WEIGHTLIFTING. Like, REAL, serious, in-your-face-and-I-mean-it weightlifting.

I'm a changed woman.

I didn't mean it as a "slam" against you, or that you are a dummy . Just that sometimes - we think we have tried EVERYTHING, but really we have not. Ya know?

 

[Sassy69]

People don't teach you 'nutrition' anywhere in your typical education, and then the media and snake oil marketers convince people that quicky fixes are legitimate answers to things and some how it further translates not only to ignorance and setting yourself up for failure but it also starts to become a deeply rooted self-confidence and self-image issue.

I lifted for nearly 15 yrs before I "got" how diet goes w/ lifting and then really saw the value of fundamental manipulation of macros an additional 9 yrs later.

Its not that its rocket science, but what should be common sense isn't really pointed out (i.e. its not obvious, but if someone gave you that little bit of insight say in a HS health class, it would click) is further buried by the snowjob society gets from the media and image marketing.

 

[Daisy_Girl]

People don't teach you 'nutrition' anywhere in your typical education, and then the media and snake oil marketers convince people that quicky fixes are legitimate answers to things and some how it further translates not only to ignorance and setting yourself up for failure but it also starts to become a deeply rooted self-confidence and self-image issue.

I lifted for nearly 15 yrs before I "got" how diet goes w/ lifting and then really saw the value of fundamental manipulation of macros an additional 9 yrs later.

Its not that its rocket science, but what should be common sense isn't really pointed out (i.e. its not obvious, but if someone gave you that little bit of insight say in a HS health class, it would click) is further buried by the snowjob society gets from the media and image marketing.

Not just that, but if you do study nutrition in school - the textbooks are for GENERAL POPULATION, for very general health needs. Not for people trying to refine their physique or get to the next level.

For example, I met with my Internist the other day. We discussed diet in general terms. He said the recommended caloric intake for an adult is 2000 calories. To lose weight, I should cut 200 calories from that. He said I should not go below 1800 calories or my metabolism will shut down and it will be impossible to lose weight.

While I agree with in general what he was getting at, I have spent YEARS getting to know my body and how it responds to things. And I know what he learned was good for the general population - but not me.

Textbooks are great - but not always applicable to everyone.

 

[T-Cake]

I didn't mean it as a "slam" against you, or that you are a dummy . Just that sometimes - we think we have tried EVERYTHING, but really we have not. Ya know?

I didn't take it as a slam at all! I was actually quite flattered that you made an example out of what I said and pointed that particular part out!

It's the TRUTH, and so easily overlooked! I hear ya', sista!

 

[T-Cake]

People don't teach you 'nutrition' anywhere in your typical education, and then the media and snake oil marketers convince people that quicky fixes are legitimate answers to things and some how it further translates not only to ignorance and setting yourself up for failure but it also starts to become a deeply rooted self-confidence and self-image issue.

I lifted for nearly 15 yrs before I "got" how diet goes w/ lifting and then really saw the value of fundamental manipulation of macros an additional 9 yrs later.

Its not that its rocket science, but what should be common sense isn't really pointed out (i.e. its not obvious, but if someone gave you that little bit of insight say in a HS health class, it would click) is further buried by the snowjob society gets from the media and image marketing.

So true! I can't believe how hard I worked to count every calorie, make it to the gym all the time -- I mean, it'll be 8 years for me April 2007 from the first day I decided to lose weight -- and I can't believe either that ONE or TWO rules -- EASY ones... were all it took to turn my life completely upside-down in a GOOD way in 2006!

Absolutely absolutely -- just ONE clue and wham -- you've got it. When people outside of EF ask me for help to lose weight, I always have to downplay what I'm about to tell them to do because I think they have the perception that I'm about to slam them with all the "instruction manuals" the media has fed them and they're about to feel defeated in less than 60 seconds.

All people are sensitive -- I'm glad there ARE people who do know the easier, less complicated, just-as-fulfilling-if-not-more route. Sure saved me!

 

[Sassy69]

Not just that, but if you do study nutrition in school - the textbooks are for GENERAL POPULATION, for very general health needs. Not for people trying to refine their physique or get to the next level.

For example, I met with my Internist the other day. We discussed diet in general terms. He said the recommended caloric intake for an adult is 2000 calories. To lose weight, I should cut 200 calories from that. He said I should not go below 1800 calories or my metabolism will shut down and it will be impossible to lose weight.

While I agree with in general what he was getting at, I have spent YEARS getting to know my body and how it responds to things. And I know what he learned was good for the general population - but not me.

Textbooks are great - but not always applicable to everyone.

Actually that was the other thought I had - the medical community is amazingly underschooled on nutrition. Its like 1 semester or just a section of one semester in a complete MD program -- so in many cases, what really should be looked at from a nutrition / body response point of view is instead dealt w/ from a 'here take this and that collection of pills for that will deal w/ this & that symptom but there will be a whole shitload of sides because we really only understand this selective part of what this stuff does...."

Egads. No wonder healthcare costs are so high...

 

[Daisy_Girl]

Actually that was the other thought I had - the medical community is amazingly underschooled on nutrition. Its like 1 semester or just a section of one semester in a complete MD program -- so in many cases, what really should be looked at from a nutrition / body response point of view is instead dealt w/ from a 'here take this and that collection of pills for that will deal w/ this & that symptom but there will be a whole shitload of sides because we really only understand this selective part of what this stuff does...."

Egads. No wonder healthcare costs are so high...

sofuckingtrue

That is the main reason I left my previous Internist - I got bloodwork done (when pregnant and then when breastfeeding - both of which as KNOWN to cause high blood lipids, mind you) and my lipids were scary high.

WITHOUT EVEN DISCUSSING DIET AND EXERCISE he wanted to put me on cholesterol meds as soon as I was done breastfeeding.

I was so outta there.