Dieting on High Carbs???

[SouthernLord]

It's time to trim the fat. I have crept up to 20% body fat and I would like to reduce that to 10% before I run my first cycle.

Who here has successfully lost fat while preserving LBM on a higher carb diet? All the hype seems to be high pro, low cho, and high fat diets for cutting. After reading BFFM by Tom Venuto my views on dieting have changed based on his advice.

His baseline diet is 50-55% CHO, 30% PRO, and 15-20% fat. Of course there is no magical macro nutrient ratio that will allow for greater fat loss. Fat Loss boils down to calories in vs. calories out. He advocates keeping CHO high to keep glycogen stores full so you can continue to train hard and preserve LBM. "Burn the Fat, Feed the Muscle"

For me those macros fly in the face of everything I have done in the past and what I have been taught to believe. I kinda like it

The CHO is way higher than what I am used to. He advocates complex starchy and fibrous carbs with every meal. The fibrous carbs slow down the rate of which your body burns up the complex starchy carbs for fuel. I believe the fibrous carbs also blunt the insulin response to the starches. The addition of the fibrous carbs makes a lot of sense and I think is the main reason I have not done too well on starchy carbs alone in the past. This past week I have ate starchy and fibrous carbs with most of my meals while eating at maintenance kcal levels and I am not crashing and my energy levels are through the roof.

The protein intake is not normal for me either. On my upcoming low calorie days I am only consuming .8 of my body weight in protein. I am used to eating close to if not more than 2x my body weight daily. Take in mind my calories from CHO have been a lot lower than he recommends. On my high calorie days (maintenance cals) my protein intake is just over 1x body weight.

Fat intake is very low by my standards. I was consuming red meat twice daily along with whole eggs every morning, sometimes up to a dozen a day. This provided me with quite a bit of fat daily. I have replaced those with salmon/fish, egg whites, and I am continuing to eat chicken. I have cut out my smart balance spread, ANBP (for now), and all nuts. The only supplemental fat I am consuming at the moment is fish oil.

The plan is to alternate 3 low cal days and 1 high cal day (maintenance) for three months. After those three months I am going to carb cycle and add LipoFlame and LipoStim to hopefully drop down into the single digits. I know most people would add the stims right off the bat, but I think letting my diet, training, and cardio do most of the work instead of using the stims as a crutch. Plus I want to see how far I can go with diet and training alone. I know this is a four month plan and most people cut in a shorter time frame. I do NOT want to loose any of the LBM I worked my ass off to gain. I would be happy with a .5-.75% loss of body fat a week. It would also be nice to gain 3-5 pounds of LBM in this time frame as well. It is possible.

What do you guys think of this??? Sorry I posted so much, but I was on a roll

 

[OneBreath]

I was just PMing a dude that was asking about diet advice. It was the first time i've actually said just to keep it simple. I've sort of come full circle recently and think that unless you are trying to go from 8% to 6% (essentially something difficult), then just keeping it simple is best.

So for instance, at 20%, most any adjustment should yield results. Then you get stuck at 18 and have to get more strict, then 16 and so on.

My plan these days is to just keep carbs and protein about the same and somewhat minimize saturated fat (not completely exclude). I'm probably sitting at around 40% protein / 40% carbs / 20% fat right now. I eat as soon as i finish morning cardio and i keep eating throughout the day never letting myself get hungry. Everytime i eat protein is the base. Then a starchy carb, then a good fat source.

I think this is the biggest factor right here: when i don't plan well, i'll not eat until around 11AM, and then binge. Then i'm fucking full as shit and ready to pass out. This will lead to a longer period before i eat again and then i binge again. The pattern just keeps repeating. This is what will keep me > 15% every time. Its not that i'm taking in too many carbs (or some other macro factor). Its that my body is in starvation mode and then i feed it 1500 calories at once.

Cliffnotes: Don't over analyse, don't let your body get hungry, make protein your base of every meal.

 

[SouthernLord]

Thank you bro. You are right. I need to keep it simple and basic. It all starts with finding exactly how many calories you need and eating a little bit less than that. The hardest part of the whole thing for me so far is counting kcals and keeping a food log. I have four menus made up with two being at my maintenence intake and two being 20% less. This seems to make things a little easier.

 

[OneBreath]

Yeah, i'd say focus on those cals and you'll be at 15% before you know it. One thing i think is crucial is shit tons of fiber. This keeps the appetite a little regulated (easier to limit cals). I go mainly with oats/flaxmeal/broccoli. Huge fiber doses will also push some of that water right out and give you a quick feeling of results. That's important to keep the motivation and momentum flowing.

 

[Nomak666]

wow SL, 20%? what was your diet like? dirty bulking? i do not agree with the "fat loss comes down to calories in vs calories out". if you consume less calories then your body uses, you will no doubt about it, 100% lose "weight" but it will come from fat, stored carbs, and muscle. i hope that makes sense, it did in my head. lol. and good choice on letting your diet training and cardio do the work first, im doing the same with lipoflame and lipostim, waiting til i hit a wall, then through them in the mix.

 

[SouthernLord]

I fucking love broccoli!!!

I am eating broccoli, spinach, cabage, or green beans with every meal. You do not want to use the bathroom after me lol.

The best thing about these wonderful fibrous veggies is that they are actually a "negative calorie" food. They supply your body with less calories than your body uses to digest them.

 

[SouthernLord]

Yeah bro. I let it get out of hand. In the past year and a half I ate my way from 190 to nearly 230 drug free. This is hard to do without adding some adipose. I am ready to take it off.

 

[OneBreath]

wow SL, 20%? what was your diet like? dirty bulking? i do not agree with the "fat loss comes down to calories in vs calories out". if you consume less calories then your body uses, you will no doubt about it, 100% lose "weight" but it will come from fat, stored carbs, and muscle. i hope that makes sense, it did in my head. lol. and good choice on letting your diet training and cardio do the work first, im doing the same with lipoflame and lipostim, waiting til i hit a wall, then through them in the mix.

Interesting. I heard an idea recently that you should only cut cals by 100 or 200 (rather than the standard 500). The idea was to trick your body into thinking you were not dieting, but to make up the calorie deficit with lots of lower intensity steady state cardio.

 

[Nomak666]

Interesting. I heard an idea recently that you should only cut cals by 100 or 200 (rather than the standard 500). The idea was to trick your body into thinking you were not dieting, but to make up the calorie deficit with lots of lower intensity steady state cardio.

i barely count calories but i can get a good guess on how much i consume daily. the most important part of cutting is definitely carbs. to be honest, i think you can eat as much protein as you want, to an extent. if you eat 1 pounds of chicken at one meal, i doubt youll eat many protein in the next. so just make sure you get your 40-50 grams of protein at each meal, and if youre still hungry, eat a little more protein. and just keep your carbs at the first 4 meals of the day and none on the last 2 exept for veggies. once you stop losing, then eat less carbs at those meals. i think a good start is 2 cups of oatmeal for breakfast, and 2 cups of brown rice at the next 3 meals. then when you get stuck, cut half a cup of carbs with meal 4, then meal 3, then 2, then 1. so now you should be consuming 1 and a half cups of carbs at each meal. when you get stuck, thats right, another half a cup starting with meal 4, etc. hope that makes sense.

 

[cobracock1979]

Good thread.

Calorie/ carbs zig zagging randomly works for me on a cal surplus