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Bill Starr's 5 x 5 program... Variation per Madcow2 (thanx) So here it is! K up now!
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Re: Bill Starr's 5 x 5 program... Variation per Madcow2 (thanx) So here it is! K up n
So going by the program I am following as written above in post #661; on which day would you suggest I add them in? I am already in the gym for about 1hr and 15 minutes (including stretching, general warm-up and some core work twice a week) and don't really want to stay for much longer.
The most logical thing I can think of would be to add in three sets off pull-ups on Wednesday and do three sets of light squats (instead of four). However, wouldn't the total volume be to high with pull-ups added in above everything else (refer to post #661).
Madcow2 said:
So going by the program I am following as written above in post #661; on which day would you suggest I add them in? I am already in the gym for about 1hr and 15 minutes (including stretching, general warm-up and some core work twice a week) and don't really want to stay for much longer.
The most logical thing I can think of would be to add in three sets off pull-ups on Wednesday and do three sets of light squats (instead of four). However, wouldn't the total volume be to high with pull-ups added in above everything else (refer to post #661).
Re: Bill Starr's 5 x 5 program... Variation per Madcow2 (thanx) So here it is! K up n
. Wed makes sense. A few sets of pullups shouldn't skew anything too terribly. Add them and see what happens.
If it's a time constraint, it looks like a great excuse to get rid of the calf raises|D_J^B_J| said:
. Wed makes sense. A few sets of pullups shouldn't skew anything too terribly. Add them and see what happens.Ok, I've decided to do one set of calf raises after each workout (three times a week), added in three sets of pull-ups on Wednesday and reduced the four set squat on Wednesday to three sets. This should save some time while getting in all the exercises I want.
One other question:
A couple of weeks ago, I made my target weight for the three rep bench and back-off set on Friday, but just failed with five reps of the same weight on the following Monday. The next Friday I did the same as I did last Friday, and this Monday I tried the same weight for five reps and got about 4 and a half reps again (the spotter had to add his finger for half of the rep).
So, what should I do this Friday, should I do the same weight for three reps and back-off again, or up the weight for three reps and go for the lower weight for five reps on Monday?
Hope that makes sense.
P.S. This is the beginner's 5 x 5 I'm talking about, not the dual factor program.
One other question:
A couple of weeks ago, I made my target weight for the three rep bench and back-off set on Friday, but just failed with five reps of the same weight on the following Monday. The next Friday I did the same as I did last Friday, and this Monday I tried the same weight for five reps and got about 4 and a half reps again (the spotter had to add his finger for half of the rep).
So, what should I do this Friday, should I do the same weight for three reps and back-off again, or up the weight for three reps and go for the lower weight for five reps on Monday?
Hope that makes sense.
P.S. This is the beginner's 5 x 5 I'm talking about, not the dual factor program.
Re: Bill Starr's 5 x 5 program... Variation per Madcow2 (thanx) So here it is! K up n
Kind of grey area. If your other lifts are progressing, I'd try hammering at it for a bit longer. If everything goes into a stall, take a few lighter weeks training at 2x per week (maybe even use a 3x3 rep scheme and just up the weight from what you are doing now - just adapt it) and then start lower and reramp through the progression and hammer at it again for a bit. You'll probably blow right throught.
Basically, just wait and see, and then get back to us. It might be useful to examine your lifts and know where your specific weak points are and such. Just hammer away and keep watch to see what happens.
|D_J^B_J| said:
Kind of grey area. If your other lifts are progressing, I'd try hammering at it for a bit longer. If everything goes into a stall, take a few lighter weeks training at 2x per week (maybe even use a 3x3 rep scheme and just up the weight from what you are doing now - just adapt it) and then start lower and reramp through the progression and hammer at it again for a bit. You'll probably blow right throught.
Basically, just wait and see, and then get back to us. It might be useful to examine your lifts and know where your specific weak points are and such. Just hammer away and keep watch to see what happens.
Re: Bill Starr's 5 x 5 program... Variation per Madcow2 (thanx) So here it is! K up n
maxes before and after 5x5
before
squat - 335
bench - 315
deadlift - 335
military - 185
after
squat - 365
bench - 345
deadlift - 365
military - 225
i dont really know what i was rowing before, but i can now row 275 for 5
still nowhere near my previous numbers
, but still major improvements.
except military, thats the most ive ever pressed in my life.
i didnt really gain weight, but i look different, bigger delts and traps, lats and quads. grip improved a hell of a lot. my form also got better.
taking a week off, i hurt my right delt testing my bench max just a lil tweak, itll prolly be gone in a week, ill be training my rotator cuffs and rehabbing knees and lower back in the mean time.
ill be posting here again when i start my 2nd run
maxes before and after 5x5
before
squat - 335
bench - 315
deadlift - 335
military - 185
after
squat - 365
bench - 345
deadlift - 365
military - 225
i dont really know what i was rowing before, but i can now row 275 for 5
still nowhere near my previous numbers
, but still major improvements.except military, thats the most ive ever pressed in my life.
i didnt really gain weight, but i look different, bigger delts and traps, lats and quads. grip improved a hell of a lot. my form also got better.
taking a week off, i hurt my right delt testing my bench max
just a lil tweak, itll prolly be gone in a week, ill be training my rotator cuffs and rehabbing knees and lower back in the mean time. ill be posting here again when i start my 2nd run
Re: Bill Starr's 5 x 5 program... Variation per Madcow2 (thanx) So here it is! K up n
A couple of things - if you didn't gain any weight at all, either fat or muscle, that brings forth the question of caloric excess not being present. If there is excess and you don't gain muscle, it will go to fat. If you are gaining muscle with caloric excess, you'll have to be systematically increasing your excess as the new muscle will increase your requirement. I don't know if adding muscle was your goal but if there is no weight gain at all, there simply wasn't an excess of calories, otherwise they'd have gone to increasing your fat stores and total weight would have still increased. This is a fairly common thing here mainly resulting from people trying to stay lean and eat right at the margin - unfortunately pegging down your caloric requirement and activity levels can be a bit hard and if they eat at the razors' edge they can completely misestimate their requirement and wind up wondering why they don't grow. This was my one and only diet post that you'll find in my thread: http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4866519&postcount=465
Also, I didn't follow it closely but in the after period you were doing some really high rep stuff like in the 20 range from what I recall and then you waited a few weeks to test your max. If you were just doing it to do it, that's one thing but this isn't really the best way to put up your best possible numbers on a meet or testing day. You want to gradually segway into some singles while continuing to lower load (i.e. further deloading). But it's going to be essential to use some singles and doubles and further slash volume and frequency to make the most of your abilities. Maybe that's better for future reference or you were just looking for a baseline this time before starting again.
TheOak84 said:maxes before and after 5x5
before
squat - 335
bench - 315
deadlift - 335
military - 185
after
squat - 365
bench - 345
deadlift - 365
military - 225
i dont really know what i was rowing before, but i can now row 275 for 5
still nowhere near my previous numbers
except military, thats the most ive ever pressed in my life.
i didnt really gain weight, but i look different, bigger delts and traps, lats and quads. grip improved a hell of a lot. my form also got better.
taking a week off, i hurt my right delt testing my bench max
ill be posting here again when i start my 2nd run
A couple of things - if you didn't gain any weight at all, either fat or muscle, that brings forth the question of caloric excess not being present. If there is excess and you don't gain muscle, it will go to fat. If you are gaining muscle with caloric excess, you'll have to be systematically increasing your excess as the new muscle will increase your requirement. I don't know if adding muscle was your goal but if there is no weight gain at all, there simply wasn't an excess of calories, otherwise they'd have gone to increasing your fat stores and total weight would have still increased. This is a fairly common thing here mainly resulting from people trying to stay lean and eat right at the margin - unfortunately pegging down your caloric requirement and activity levels can be a bit hard and if they eat at the razors' edge they can completely misestimate their requirement and wind up wondering why they don't grow. This was my one and only diet post that you'll find in my thread: http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4866519&postcount=465
Also, I didn't follow it closely but in the after period you were doing some really high rep stuff like in the 20 range from what I recall and then you waited a few weeks to test your max. If you were just doing it to do it, that's one thing but this isn't really the best way to put up your best possible numbers on a meet or testing day. You want to gradually segway into some singles while continuing to lower load (i.e. further deloading). But it's going to be essential to use some singles and doubles and further slash volume and frequency to make the most of your abilities. Maybe that's better for future reference or you were just looking for a baseline this time before starting again.
Re: Bill Starr's 5 x 5 program... Variation per Madcow2 (thanx) So here it is! K up n
well, i look bigger, so i had to gain something, as i said before, i look wider in the shoulder, leg and back area. i ate alot, but i also ran alot for work. this time im gonna concentrate on eating much more. seeing im starting an apprentice school, ill have much more time to eat, and less physical work.
week 10, i did a few 20 rep sets, week 11, i tested i max with sets of 3 to warm up, working up to a max single. i did test the maxes to make the first week of my next program.
i was feeling burnt out by week 11, so i think the maxes are off by 5-10 pounds, which is ok by me.
Madcow2 said:
well, i look bigger, so i had to gain something, as i said before, i look wider in the shoulder, leg and back area. i ate alot, but i also ran alot for work. this time im gonna concentrate on eating much more. seeing im starting an apprentice school, ill have much more time to eat, and less physical work.
week 10, i did a few 20 rep sets, week 11, i tested i max with sets of 3 to warm up, working up to a max single. i did test the maxes to make the first week of my next program.
i was feeling burnt out by week 11, so i think the maxes are off by 5-10 pounds, which is ok by me.
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