AAS part of the equation?

[BigBadBootyDaddy29]

I was doing some thinking on the subject of steroids lately, and I decided to post this to get everyone's take on it. I am putting it on the training board, because the general attitude here is that training, sleep, and eating come before all else (as they should), where if I were to post it on most anabolic boards, it would detract from the post because the attitude there is drugs, drugs, more drugs, and the newest drugs......I am wondering how many of you feel steroids are just as important in the equation for somebody looking to be the best as sleep, nutrition, training genetics, etc.......Let me explain, I am not talking about somebody looking to improve upon themselves, ANYBODY can do that......and while I realize that a person's main competition is themselves, lets get real here,if you want to reach the highest level of anything, and be the best at that level, you have to compete against other people, and any way you slice it or word it that you compete against only yourself, you'd just be kidding yourself, while PRing is great, you've got to be able to beat others, not just yourself if you wanna be the best, period. This can apply to any athletic contest under the sun. I was thinking about myself lately, I was like okay, I've got good genetics to build size, power, and strength......I have the training knowledge and experience......I have the passion and fire inside of myself......I know what to eat, and I eat a lot of it, and I love to eat.......I get my sleep......I don't drink/party very often at all......I love to train......That being said, A LOT of people have all those attributes, everyone at a high level of competition in ANYTHING has those attributes, so therefore, the playing field is now even......okay, now one guy uses AAS, he has an adv......another guy uses, and another, and another, and before you know it, AAS are just as important as sleep, eating, training, genetics, because it is the only thing left, and your competition is using them, so not using AAS i the same as not lifting....or not sleeping....or not eating.......does everyone follow me? I want to hear everybody's thoughts on this.....expecially the guys who are natural right now....I am wondering what your goals are, and if they include being the best, are you ready to take on the best of the best, who are just as good as you when it comes to training, diet, preparation, desire, but they have that one thing you'renot using, the diffference maker.......

 

[mtellin]

I was doing some thinking on the subject of steroids lately, and I decided to post this to get everyone's take on it. I am putting it on the training board, because the general attitude here is that training, sleep, and eating come before all else (as they should), where if I were to post it on most anabolic boards, it would detract from the post because the attitude there is drugs, drugs, more drugs, and the newest drugs......I am wondering how many of you feel steroids are just as important in the equation for somebody looking to be the best as sleep, nutrition, training genetics, etc.......Let me explain, I am not talking about somebody looking to improve upon themselves, ANYBODY can do that......and while I realize that a person's main competition is themselves, lets get real here,if you want to reach the highest level of anything, and be the best at that level, you have to compete against other people, and any way you slice it or word it that you compete against only yourself, you'd just be kidding yourself, while PRing is great, you've got to be able to beat others, not just yourself if you wanna be the best, period. This can apply to any athletic contest under the sun. I was thinking about myself lately, I was like okay, I've got good genetics to build size, power, and strength......I have the training knowledge and experience......I have the passion and fire inside of myself......I know what to eat, and I eat a lot of it, and I love to eat.......I get my sleep......I don't drink/party very often at all......I love to train......That being said, A LOT of people have all those attributes, everyone at a high level of competition in ANYTHING has those attributes, so therefore, the playing field is now even......okay, now one guy uses AAS, he has an adv......another guy uses, and another, and another, and before you know it, AAS are just as important as sleep, eating, training, genetics, because it is the only thing left, and your competition is using them, so not using AAS i the same as not lifting....or not sleeping....or not eating.......does everyone follow me? I want to hear everybody's thoughts on this.....expecially the guys who are natural right now....I am wondering what your goals are, and if they include being the best, are you ready to take on the best of the best, who are just as good as you when it comes to training, diet, preparation, desire, but they have that one thing you'renot using, the diffference maker.......

paragraphs are sometimes nice...

 

[SofaGeorge]

I couldn't even read this.

 

[gettinlarger]

I read it, and understood it. I must, however, respectfully disagree with the "competition with oneself" idea. I am my only competition. I try to beat myself each workout. I don't look around the gym and eye some dude benching 405 for reps and think, "that fucker is gonna have to answer to MY lifts one day ..."

Anyway, I don't want to use any AAS. Not at this point. I'm still very young, and very new at this sport. I've been lifting for like 3 years. 1.5, maybe 2 of those seriously. I have a loooooooong way to go. I want to reach my complete, absolute natural apex. When that happens, maybe, and only maybe I'll consider the use of anything illegal.

Sure, I want to be the best ... by MY best. I couldn't care less if there is someone bigger or stronger than I am.

 

[bigguns15]

I compete natural and have always competed natural. I lift in a fed. where AAS are considered cheating, although I know this does not stop some individuals. For me, it is a moral thing. I'm not the best, yet. One day I will be. I placed 2nd in this past years nationals and I will win in the next couple of years. I know I could reach that goal a lot sooner with AAS, but that would be compromising my values, and I am not prepared to do that. When I reach the top one day, I want to be able to say with a clear conscience that it was a lot of hard work and dedication that got me there. I have most of the variables down..... the eating, sleeping, rest, and training hard. I choose to compete in my fed. because it takes AAS out of the equation, as much as it can anyway. Even if I knew for certain that my competition was using, I couldn't do it.

 

[T-Rage]

Good post...

After much research on the topic I have come to the conclusion that doing it natural is the way to go.

First, once you realize that your body has a maximum natural pontential then you see that AAS is not the way to go.

What this means is that to maintain a level of performance from AAS means you have to continue using them. Whether it be every few months or once a year. That is not a option for most of us who care about the legalities and health risks.

Each one of us has natural potential. Some have more than others of course. Once we reach our maximum natural potential our progress begins to flatten out. We have all seen incredible gains early on and the longer one has been lifting the slower the gains and progress become.

This is because our bodies are in a battle between anabolism and catabolism. The extreme workouts necessary to continue making progress naturally after years of advanced training begins to have a negative effect and that's where progress will most likely stop. If it didn't we would all be monsters winning the World's Strongest Man competition.

Let's say my maximum natural lean body weight is 207 lbs. (I'm 5'-7"). That would mean that once I hit that point the workouts would have to be so intense to push me beyond that limit that they I would end up overtraining, injurying myself or requiring weeks to recover. All of these things would result in no forward progress and hence you have reached the limit. I'm sure small gains can be made beyond this point but they may be as little as a pound every year or two. Remember I'm talking about lean mass.

Now of course AAS can take you far beyond this limit but once you come off you will eventually go back to your maximun natural bodyweight. It might take a year but it will happen.

I'm ok with this. Just being able to say you have taken you body to the maximum possible if enough for me.

Also, I have seen countless lifters who use AAS (personal friends included) that don't train nearly as hard as me. This is because AAS allows one to be lazy and get away with shitty diets and lousy workouts. True champions have to endure hard workouts all the time, pay attention to their diets all the time, etc. This is the kind of thing that builds confidence and determination and ultimately excellent competitors.

 

[jackangel]

I did. Well, most of it.

I am not informed about AAS, and have no intention of using them ever. Then again, I don't need them for my goals*. But, to be the absolute, unqualified best (in terms of performance), I don't doubt that they're necessary. The rules of the game are defined by those who play.

I question that need to be the best at (almost) any cost. But for those who don't have such reservations, AAS is a natural choice (no pun intended).


*Incidentally, my goals are to get to a decent size (maybe 195-205 at 8-10% bf, 5'11") and then concentrate on building as much strength as possible. I'm sure I could use AAS to get stronger, but for me, it wouldn't mean the same thing if I used them. But, obviously, I have no aspirations to weightlifting or powerlifting or bodybuilding.

 

[needsize]

If you get to a point where you cant progress any more naturally, and you are no where near your goals, then I see no reason why you cant make the educated decision to do them

 

[casualbb]

I am wondering how many of you feel steroids are just as important in the equation for somebody looking to be the best as sleep, nutrition, training genetics, etc

Unfortunately, steroids are as important. Sleep, nutrition, and training will only get you so far. Most guys can't even get to their genetic limit through training. The closer you get, the harder it is to make gains. Say a guy can get to 210 @ 8% bodyfat naturally. Now he will certainly look good and be pretty strong. But the use of steroids will allow his bodyweight to climb past 250 while still being lean. 40 pounds of musclemass makes quite the difference.

Here's how steroids relates to everything:
1) Training: steroids make up for ineffective training. But the results will be greatly increased if the training is good.

2) Diet: this is one steroids won't make up for. If one takes steroids and F's up his/her diet, not much will happen. Maybe he/she will trade some BF for muscle, but that's it. No gaining like 15 pounds in a cycle.

expecially the guys who are natural right now....I am wondering what your goals are, and if they include being the best, are you ready to take on the best of the best, who are just as good as you when it comes to training, diet, preparation, desire, but they have that one thing you'renot using, the diffference maker.......

I'm not really trying to compete with anybody. It's vain, but I just want to look good. I'd love to be 180 at 7%, and god forbid I'll need steroids to get there. I don't like the freaky big look that currently pervades bodybuilding. I like Steve Reeves because he provides an example of what can be achieved naturally, and nobody can say he doesn't look good.

If I juiced, I'd feel like I were cheating myself. I guess I want to prove to myself I can get there without a giant crutch.

-casual

 

[BigBadBootyDaddy29]

Mtellin and Sofa George, I posted this up to generate a discussion, not to be graded in grammar and punctuation. I re-read it, and although I didn't use textbook grammar, it is perfectly understandable. So, if you can't understand it, then you better see what your problem is and address it. Also, Sofa, you have been in this game a long time, at least according to your posts anyway. I would seriously be interested in your take on this, so if you could bring yourself to get over my grammatical short-comings, which have apparently made my post un-readable, I would appreciate a response since I think you could offer a lot.

As for the other responses, thanks. What I am referring to is competing in a sport at a very high level. I did not mean the average lifter. Steroids are not necessary to make progress, but I feel they are necessary to compete on a world-class level.

To address the competetion part of my post, I wasn't referring to the guy benching next to you, or the dude working in the power rack with you. I agree with Gettinlarger on that. I was referring to competition in a sport, however. Basically, if you're a defensive end, the offensive tackle you're running at doesn't care if you're stronger than you were 2 months ago, if HE is stronger than YOU on this given day, you're going to be in a lot of pain. Another example of this would be bodybuilding. Look at the best of the best. At this year's O, Jay, Gunter, and Ronnie all want to win. Ronnie Coleman won't be satisfied with 2nd or 3rd place just because he looks better than he ever did because if Jay or Gunter still look better than him, they win. So, in that sense, his competition is on a greater level than setting PR's and going against himself.

I hope I cleared myself up a little. I posted this on a lunch break, and I never knew posts were graded on grammar and punctuation. I think I got my ideas across, and there were no major misspellings that couldn't be chalked up to typos. If you've read my previous posts, I see no reason to flame, so if you have a problem with me, PM me and we'll talk about it, but don't ever fucking flame one of my posts because this is not bullshit, it was a serious question. Thanks again to the guys who responded with their opinions though, I hope this post doesn't turn into a mess.