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Happily married people...

4 years last month

Compromise, communication, similar goals and compatible personalities - ie my current hubby & I have similar personalities/humor styles, etc while my ex hubby & I didn't & he felt he could mold or change me into what he felt a wife should be.........
 
well I'm not sure how much my opinion counts seeing as I have only been married for going on 5 months but we have been together for over 6 years.

The problem that I see with a lot of marriages is that they happen way too soon. This whole getting married after being together for a year is ridiculous. Sure, there are some that have done this and have a happy marriage but there are many many more that fail. I don't care how much you think you know a person during that brief time, you never know everything. It's even worse with people who do not live together first. To not live with your partner before marriage is a recipe for disaster.

Some will say: "well my parents or grandparents never lived together before they were married because it was taboo back then". Well back then, divorce was very very uncommon and looked down upon so they would just live with the fact that they don't love one another and it was done for the sake of the kids. They end up sleeping in separate beds, never going out together, and only really being together when it involved the kids.

I say you should live with a person for a minimum of a few years before even thinking about marriage. Why not invest that little extra time to make sure all your ducks are in a row? For some reason, people think they must get married asap. I'm not sure if they are holding onto some childhood dream of getting married and making babies or what. This immature belief is what bites them in the ass later on.

I also think that if you are looking for someone to marry, you're gonna be let down. It's not something that can be hunted down. My wife's friend already has her wedding dress, wedding location, etc picked out and she doesn't even have a boyfriend. This kind of desperate, anatomical ticking clock mentality is what drives most guys and girls away or ends up in marriage only to last a few months and ends even worse than if you wouldn't have met the person in the first place.

To end my rambling, if you can't see you and your partner being friends, don't consider them marriage material. After all, your partner will be your best and closest friend until the day you die
 
Delinquent said:
well I'm not sure how much my opinion counts seeing as I have only been married for going on 5 months but we have been together for over 6 years.

The problem that I see with a lot of marriages is that they happen way too soon. This whole getting married after being together for a year is ridiculous. Sure, there are some that have done this and have a happy marriage but there are many many more that fail. I don't care how much you think you know a person during that brief time, you never know everything. It's even worse with people who do not live together first. To not live with your partner before marriage is a recipe for disaster.

Some will say: "well my parents or grandparents never lived together before they were married because it was taboo back then". Well back then, divorce was very very uncommon and looked down upon so they would just live with the fact that they don't love one another and it was done for the sake of the kids. They end up sleeping in separate beds, never going out together, and only really being together when it involved the kids.

I say you should live with a person for a minimum of a few years before even thinking about marriage. Why not invest that little extra time to make sure all your ducks are in a row? For some reason, people think they must get married asap. I'm not sure if they are holding onto some childhood dream of getting married and making babies or what. This immature belief is what bites them in the ass later on.

I also think that if you are looking for someone to marry, you're gonna be let down. It's not something that can be hunted down. My wife's friend already has her wedding dress, wedding location, etc picked out and she doesn't even have a boyfriend. This kind of desperate, anatomical ticking clock mentality is what drives most guys and girls away or ends up in marriage only to last a few months and ends even worse than if you wouldn't have met the person in the first place.

To end my rambling, if you can't see you and your partner being friends, don't consider them marriage material. After all, your partner will be your best and closest friend until the day you die
Click to expand...

Good post!! And I agree with your last statement wholeheartedly!! You & your partner are FIRST - BEFORE work, BEFORE children, etc.......cuz eventually - the kids will move out, etc & you'll be sitting there looking at this person like Who the heck are they??
 
Dating (off and on) since '97, married since '02.

Similar goals and beliefs about what we wanted our 'family' to look like is what solidified us. We got off to a very bad start, and it was a decision to grow up, put aside the games, and re-learn what a successful r'ship was. Our goal was that neither of us were willing for my son to have a 'part-time' dad or step-parent. So we buckled down and learned to work through our issues.

The keys were communication, willingness to compromise, and a determination to see it through till the end - divorce is not an option (barring infidelity). We had the basis of good friendship so if all else failed, we knew we could live together and get along on at least that level until D went to college.

A big part for each of us was getting over ourselves. Putting our petty nature away and doing what served the 'greater good' of the family. Holding grudges had to go.

We are, with one exception, the happiest couple I know.
 
HumorMe said:
Communication is ranked high. It's not about her or me but us. Being understanding and interested and supporttive of each other.

18 years this past July.
Click to expand...

Word....

Plus she is my absolute best friend, she understands me like no other, and I'm quite positive she would say the same about me. In short......she's the shit. :)

6 years here.
 
One more thing.... learning to respect each other is a big part of making our r'ship successful. Demeaning your spouse does nothing good in the long term.

I am APPALLED when I see some of the couple's on here airing their dirty laundry. No man should have to see his wife cut him down in front of people he 'knows' - even online. And men should have a stronger backbone than to come online looking for validation that his wife is a bitch from people they post with.

My husband only reads here, he doesn't even post - but there is NO WAY I would come on here and bitch about him. It's tacky, and shows a marked level of emotional immaturity.
 
Props to you married guys and gals.

I just don't feel it's something I can ever do.
 
jenscats5 said:
Good post!! And I agree with your last statement wholeheartedly!! You & your partner are FIRST - BEFORE work, BEFORE children, etc.......cuz eventually - the kids will move out, etc & you'll be sitting there looking at this person like Who the heck are they??
Click to expand...


exactly. Women get all worked up around the kids while they are small, but still have to spend some time with SO, cause, yes - the kids are gonna grow up, get married, move out, have kids on their own and the only one you are left with is your SO till death do you apart.
 
aandd said:
One more thing.... learning to respect each other is a big part of making our r'ship successful. Demeaning your spouse does nothing good in the long term.
I am APPALLED when I see some of the couple's on here airing their dirty laundry. No man should have to see his wife cut him down in front of people he 'knows' - even online. And men should have a stronger backbone than to come online looking for validation that his wife is a bitch from people they post with.
Click to expand...

I feel the same way. This should apply to ALL relationships on this board and in real life. Your post should be a sticky.
 
foreigngirl said:
exactly. Women get all worked up around the kids while they are small, but still have to spend some time with SO, cause, yes - the kids are gonna grow up, get married, move out, have kids on their own and the only one you are left with is your SO till death do you apart.
Click to expand...

I'm actually kind of looking forward to the day that the last kid moves off to college. LOL. As much as I love them, I miss the days when hubby and I could spend extended time together alone.
 
jenscats5 said:
4 years last month

Compromise, communication, similar goals and compatible personalities - ie my current hubby & I have similar personalities/humor styles, etc while my ex hubby & I didn't & he felt he could mold or change me into what he felt a wife should be.........
Click to expand...

I only spent one night with Jen & her husband (seperate beds!) and it was nice being around a loving & happy couple (it gave me hope. lol).

I guess this advice can apply to relationships as well. I can't see anyone having a successful relationship without all of what Jen mentioned.

I will also add that being secure & honest with yourself helps. How can you give love to someone else, when you don't love yourself? Being with someone because you need him and can't live without a man is absolutely sad.

And finally, sexually compatibility is very important (imo).
 
aandd said:
I'm actually kind of looking forward to the day that the last kid moves off to college. LOL. As much as I love them, I miss the days when hubby and I could spend extended time together alone.
Click to expand...


ahhhh, the releive of the kids being away :qt: I actually had my daughter (3 YO) in my country with my mom for 2 months. As much as I enjoyed making up for the lost alone time, I started missing her like after the 2nd week :worried:

At least we get the weekends alone, kids go at grandma's for a sleepover
 
nycgirl said:
I only spent one night with Jen & her husband (seperate beds!) and it was nice being around a loving & happy couple (it gave me hope. lol).

I guess this advice can apply to relationships as well. I can't see anyone having a successful relationship without all of what Jen mentioned.

I will also add that being secure & honest with yourself helps. How can you give love to someone else, when you don't love yourself? Being with someone because you need him and can't live without a man is absolutely sad.

And finally, sexually compatibility is very important (imo).
Click to expand...

:lmao:

You're so funny!! (and such a sweetie!) And yes, I agree with what you said in bold.
 
HumorMe said:
Communication is ranked high. It's not about her or me but us. Being understanding and interested and supporttive of each other.

18 years this past July.
Click to expand...
that's awesome man, and impressive.

some great posts on this thread
 
Well...been together almost 20 yrs and married 14 yrs......OKAY i know this sounds like a Gymgurl thing lol....sex sex and more sex...Communication and RESPECT for each other.....not sweating the small shit and learning to forgive the big shit when possible......I personally think that you really need to date someone for awhile to really get to know them before getting married..that way things don't change that much once you do...RESPECT is the Key for my success.......
 
marraige requires "intimacy"....defined: Intimacy [is] the capacity to commit [oneself] to concrete affiliations and partnerships and to develope the ethical strength to abide by such commitments, even though they may call for significant sacrifices and compromises...(Erick Erickson)
Intimacy- simply put, is to think about your willingness to be known. Intimacy involves recieving as well as giving...think about what you are willing to reveal and what you are willing to accept.
Are you willing to be close enough to tolerate someones elses fears, dependency, character weaknesses. So many of us vastly perfer the sexy, strong, exciting first impressions our lovers make.
Intimacy, which means getting close enough to see the detail, is a mixed blessing. We long for intamcy in theory, but we mourn the loss of our fantasies that closeness brings...
for me, this was the demise of my marraige...my ex could only hold onto Intimacy for a short while...it became too scary for her as we progressed....to me it was freedom- to her it was a boundry with walls that were too high to scale.
 
8 years plus here...

Communication, similar interests, ability to compromise, and maintaining attractiveness and sensuality. (That means not saying to your wife, "Pull my finger!" in a car with the heat on and the windows up.)

Oh, and never have kids. That was one of the biggest reasons I married my wife. She don't want them, and neither do I.


Bluesman
 
FUCK COMMUNICATION...

That's what gets couples into fights and arguments..
Just go with the flow and do whatever you want.

You'll know if they don't like it or not.
If they don't like it, stop doing it to make them happy.

18 years
 
I was married for 9 years and I`ve been divorced for 5. Having a life outside of eachother lead to divorce. You have to still be your own person, have your own life. Just make sure you blend those two lives together and compromise w/ eachother...
 
Tytan said:
I was married for 9 years and I`ve been divorced for 5. Having a life outside of eachother lead to divorce. You have to still be your own person, have your own life. Just make sure you blend those two lives together and compromise w/ eachother...
Click to expand...
Thats the definition of compatibility i think. Interesting breakdown nonetheless.
 
jenscats5 said:
Good post!! And I agree with your last statement wholeheartedly!! You & your partner are FIRST - BEFORE work, BEFORE children, etc.......cuz eventually - the kids will move out, etc & you'll be sitting there looking at this person like Who the heck are they??
Click to expand...

I disagree here.. I would never a partner before my kids. EVER

sure sooner or later they are gone but as long as they are with me its my responsibility to care for them, love them, understand them and provide for them.

My partner however is an adult who can for the most part live his life with or without me. I would more than openly accept him to join in on the loving, caring and attending to my kids but never in a million years could I ever imagine putting someone above them.

I brought them into this world. Its my responsibility to give them all that I have in me to ensure safety, and security. If i pass them over for some man then who do they have?
 
PBR said:
marraige requires "intimacy"....defined: Intimacy [is] the capacity to commit [oneself] to concrete affiliations and partnerships and to develope the ethical strength to abide by such commitments, even though they may call for significant sacrifices and compromises...(Erick Erickson)
Intimacy- simply put, is to think about your willingness to be known. Intimacy involves recieving as well as giving...think about what you are willing to reveal and what you are willing to accept.
Are you willing to be close enough to tolerate someones elses fears, dependency, character weaknesses. So many of us vastly perfer the sexy, strong, exciting first impressions our lovers make.
Intimacy, which means getting close enough to see the detail, is a mixed blessing. We long for intamcy in theory, but we mourn the loss of our fantasies that closeness brings...
for me, this was the demise of my marraige...my ex could only hold onto Intimacy for a short while...it became too scary for her as we progressed....to me it was freedom- to her it was a boundry with walls that were too high to scale.
Click to expand...

I feel the same way, but have trouble putting it into words. Well said.
 
Frisky said:
I disagree here.. I would never a partner before my kids. EVER

sure sooner or later they are gone but as long as they are with me its my responsibility to care for them, love them, understand them and provide for them.

My partner however is an adult who can for the most part live his life with or without me. I would more than openly accept him to join in on the loving, caring and attending to my kids but never in a million years could I ever imagine putting someone above them.

I brought them into this world. Its my responsibility to give them all that I have in me to ensure safety, and security. If i pass them over for some man then who do they have?
Click to expand...


I think you missed my point completely.

I'm referring to the people who completely IGNORE their spouse as it supposedly benefits the kids. It's one thing to care & nurture kids, etc as you said & I'm certainly not suggesting ignoring the kids to the point of abuse/neglect. But there are people (I've seen them) who take NO interest in their spouse and barely even know they EXIST cuz of the attention they feel they have to show their kids......

There needs to be & can be a balance.
 
Frisky said:
Its my responsibility to give them all that I have in me to ensure safety, and security. If i pass them over for some man then who do they have?
Click to expand...
If your husband and father of your children acts as simply "some guy", well I guess you would be putting your children first. But if your husband has the same attitude and goals as yourself concerning his children then he will never have to pass them over for "some woman". Moral of the story is pick a spouse who will make a great parent.
 
Bottom line is this.... LUCK!

The whole best friends business, communication, dating and really getting to know someone before you take that big step, etc etc are all fine and dandy answers, but it comes down to luck.

How can I say this? Simple. My parents will be going on 50 years together shortly. They were arranged. Never dated before they got hitched. Weren't best friends, let alone friends, before they got married. Married during their late teenage years, yet are still together. None of those others things you guys are saying. Their marriage bond is greater then anyone else I know. That's luck for ya!
 
jenscats5 said:
I think you missed my point completely.

I'm referring to the people who completely IGNORE their spouse as it supposedly benefits the kids. It's one thing to care & nurture kids, etc as you said & I'm certainly not suggesting ignoring the kids to the point of abuse/neglect. But there are people (I've seen them) who take NO interest in their spouse and barely even know they EXIST cuz of the attention they feel they have to show their kids......

There needs to be & can be a balance.
Click to expand...

I agree with Jen. My mother did this. She put so much into her career and her daughters that she totally forgot about my father and her marriage. It lead to a very unhappy period in their marriage.
 
wutangnomo said:
Bottom line is this.... LUCK!

The whole best friends business, communication, dating and really getting to know someone before you take that big step, etc etc are all fine and dandy answers, but it comes down to luck.

How can I say this? Simple. My parents will be going on 50 years together shortly. They were arranged. Never dated before they got hitched. Weren't best friends, let alone friends, before they got married. Married during their late teenage years, yet are still together. None of those others things you guys are saying. Their marriage bond is greater then anyone else I know. That's luck for ya!
Click to expand...

Interesting..........what culture is that (re: the arranged marriage)??
 
wutangnomo said:
Bottom line is this.... LUCK!

The whole best friends business, communication, dating and really getting to know someone before you take that big step, etc etc are all fine and dandy answers, but it comes down to luck.

How can I say this? Simple. My parents will be going on 50 years together shortly. They were arranged. Never dated before they got hitched. Weren't best friends, let alone friends, before they got married. Married during their late teenage years, yet are still together. None of those others things you guys are saying. Their marriage bond is greater then anyone else I know. That's luck for ya!
Click to expand...
Im guessing that this wasnt in America? If not then there is something to be said for the crushing weight of societal expectations concerning marriage. (i.e. arranged marriages in cultures such as asia).
Another way to look at it is that if in America the consequences of divorce were the same from the culture your parents got married in, then arranged marriages wouldnt be out of the question here.
 
jenscats5 said:
I think you missed my point completely.

I'm referring to the people who completely IGNORE their spouse as it supposedly benefits the kids. It's one thing to care & nurture kids, etc as you said & I'm certainly not suggesting ignoring the kids to the point of abuse/neglect. But there are people (I've seen them) who take NO interest in their spouse and barely even know they EXIST cuz of the attention they feel they have to show their kids......
Click to expand...

No i did get it.. but there are also people who completely igonre their kids because of some new young flesh that enters their lives.

If i had to chose, id take my kids any day of the week. I'd postpone my entire life to cater to them.

And for clarity... ANY new parent can attest that having an infant requires so much attention.. even kids in grade school. Your entire life changes. you go from being able to do what ever you want with your mate to having to attend to the wee ones daily. If you don't have afull time job its different, things can get done earlier..

But like me for instance, Full time job and then I own my own home business so that adds on to it. When I got home, my X was not on the top of my list. It was first my kids, homework feeding, bathing... etc and then him. sometimes by the time I did all of that I was exhausted. Its not my kids fault, and i'd neverb hold them accountable. I have motherly instincts.. and to be quite honest don't feel one bit of guilt about pushing the so to the side to tend to my kids... not now not ever.

When my kids were infants, our sex life suffered alot... of course it did. there were no late night massages or long talks ets because i had a long day at work then had to come home and put in a good 4-6 more hours of cleaning cooking, caring for two others.

Maybe this is a sore subject for me becuase i've witnessed more times than I ever care to, a mother passing over her kids for some fresh meat. It sickens me. god, then kids, then mate.. there is no other order. Either he takes it or leaves it, there is no discussion about it. I owe it to my kids to raise them care for them provide for them. They need me, not 50% of me.. they need 100% of me.
 
wutangnomo said:
Bottom line is this.... LUCK!

The whole best friends business, communication, dating and really getting to know someone before you take that big step, etc etc are all fine and dandy answers, but it comes down to luck.

How can I say this? Simple. My parents will be going on 50 years together shortly. They were arranged. Never dated before they got hitched. Weren't best friends, let alone friends, before they got married. Married during their late teenage years, yet are still together. None of those others things you guys are saying. Their marriage bond is greater then anyone else I know. That's luck for ya!
Click to expand...

See, I would say that is commitment. If both parties agree that divorce isn't an option - you MAKE it work. You commit to the marriage and you do what you have to in order to work through issues. Just depends on your value/belief system.
 
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I've been on both sides of that fence. My first marriage ended because of my second one. The thing is when me and my current wife (5 years now) got together, it wasn't all lust and smootches. She was married as well. Our first date was spent basically asking the other why they were there. What went wrong and what would you do to fix it if given another shot at marriage. As far as cheating goes, my wife has clearly defined it.

Cheating is:
"Something you would not want the other person to see, hear or read about."
 
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superdave said:
If your husband and father of your children acts as simply "some guy", well I guess you would be putting your children first. But if your husband has the same attitude and goals as yourself concerning his children then he will never have to pass them over for "some woman". Moral of the story is pick a spouse who will make a great parent.
Click to expand...

Well i'm not with my kids dad anylonger.. of course together we understood the whole process.

now, i'd never tolerate someone who didn't understand.

My kids come first BOTTOM LINE. If the relationship doesn't work.. then oh well, ill move on.

My kids are just that..... kids. My life can begin when the are adults and on their own.. until then they are my universe, my whole being.
 
Frisky said:
But like me for instance, Full time job and then I own my own home business so that adds on to it. When I got home, my X was not on the top of my list.
Click to expand...
Was this X your husband and father of your kids?
 
aandd said:
See, I would say that is commitment. If both parties agree that divorce isn't an option - you MAKE it work. You commit to the marriage and you do what you have to in order to work through issues. Just depends on your value/belief system.
Click to expand...

YEP. I strongly agree. My grandparents were together almost 40 years common law (no license, no ceremony, no ring) and 20 years legally married until death. My parents have been married 39 years and have worked through a lot of issues. I know the day one of them passes on, the other will be right behind. This has shaped my values/beliefs on commitment and marriage.

I don't believe in divorce. Marriage is a committment that should be taken seriously. This is why I am not married and will not get married until I meet someone that I consider to be my partner & friend.
 
Frisky said:
No i did get it.. but there are also people who completely igonre their kids because of some new young flesh that enters their lives.

If i had to chose, id take my kids any day of the week. I'd postpone my entire life to cater to them.

And for clarity... ANY new parent can attest that having an infant requires so much attention.. even kids in grade school. Your entire life changes. you go from being able to do what ever you want with your mate to having to attend to the wee ones daily. If you don't have afull time job its different, things can get done earlier..

But like me for instance, Full time job and then I own my own home business so that adds on to it. When I got home, my X was not on the top of my list. It was first my kids, homework feeding, bathing... etc and then him. sometimes by the time I did all of that I was exhausted. Its not my kids fault, and i'd neverb hold them accountable. I have motherly instincts.. and to be quite honest don't feel one bit of guilt about pushing the so to the side to tend to my kids... not now not ever.

When my kids were infants, our sex life suffered alot... of course it did. there were no late night massages or long talks ets because i had a long day at work then had to come home and put in a good 4-6 more hours of cleaning cooking, caring for two others.

Maybe this is a sore subject for me becuase i've witnessed more times than I ever care to, a mother passing over her kids for some fresh meat. It sickens me. god, then kids, then mate.. there is no other order. Either he takes it or leaves it, there is no discussion about it. I owe it to my kids to raise them care for them provide for them. They need me, not 50% of me.. they need 100% of me.
Click to expand...

Your last paragraph is not what I was referring to either. We can just agree to disagree.......
 
superdave said:
Was this X your husband and father of your kids?
Click to expand...

yes he was


If i deem my self single for ever, f**k it. If the person Im seeing cant understand that no matter what..... NO MATTER. My kids are before them then things just won't work.

I can't now nor ever put someone above them, my flesh, my blood, my responisibility. I mold them to what they will be and I want them to love and nurture and be responsible. If I walk away from them, for what ever reason or what ever time span, no matter how much I or someone may think its importance is.. it influences them.

I've been there, been the kid, and felt the rejection. My promise to myself when I decided that I wanted kids of my own was to NEVER do to them what i had to endure. I won't break that promise nor would i ever subject them to feeling like they are 2nd choice.

I'd die before I did that.
 
For me, I just knew it when I met her. We dated for about 3 mos. then got married. It will be 8 yrs. this mon. :luxlove: It's been great so far. Honestly, I've always been one to say you need to live w/ someone to see how you get along once the bells stop ringing. You're always on your best behavior at first. But for whatever reason it was dif. w/ my wife. Never knew for sure w/ other girls but I did w/ her. Anyway, I would say as others have, definately have similar goals. A sense of humor(life's too fucked up most of the time w/o it). I'm not sure about being similar. She's way more outgoing and willing to take up conversation w/ a stranger than me. We've been a good combination so far.
 
superdave said:
Im guessing that this wasnt in America? If not then there is something to be said for the crushing weight of societal expectations concerning marriage. (i.e. arranged marriages in cultures such as asia).
Another way to look at it is that if in America the consequences of divorce were the same from the culture your parents got married in, then arranged marriages wouldnt be out of the question here.
Click to expand...

I agree with your post, but the point is regardless what the situation may be sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't... arranged or not. My parents have been in Canada almost 30 years now, so the whole cultural issue is not as relevent in their case.

As much as two people may be "best friends" and dated forever, etc etc, you just never know. I've got a looonnngg list of married and divorced friends to back this up. My best female friend is in the process of getting divorced. She's been married almost 30 years. Tried to make it work. Was once best friends with her soon to be ex. They just grew apart.

If you can fall in love, you can fall out of love.
 
wutangnomo said:
I agree with your post, but the point is regardless what the situation may be sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't... arranged or not. My parents have been in Canada almost 30 years now, so the whole cultural issue is not as relevent in their case.

As much as two people may be "best friends" and dated forever, etc etc, you just never know. I've got a looonnngg list of married and divorced friends to back this up. My best female friend is in the process of getting divorced. She's been married almost 30 years. Tried to make it work. Was once best friends with her soon to be ex. They just grew apart.

If you can fall in love, you can fall out of love.
Click to expand...

I will always love you. :heart:
 
If the couple is compatible in character and personality, and the guy has the chance to get an extra adventure once in a while, the marriage can last forever.
 
aandd said:
See, I would say that is commitment. If both parties agree that divorce isn't an option - you MAKE it work. You commit to the marriage and you do what you have to in order to work through issues. Just depends on your value/belief system.
Click to expand...

I used to believe this, but I would also have to disagree with this post. I was once there.

I wouldn't say that two people divorce because they did not try hard enough to make it work. I'm not talking about "Hollywood" type marriages that last 6 months to 1 year. I'm talking about the cases in which people have been married 20+ years and it just didn't work out.

Many people choose to remain in UNhappy marriages because they have moral/religious hangups with the divorce path or because they do not want the divorce label/association. Believe me, these people WOULD get divorces if they weren't so ignorant. The difference between these people and those who actually do get divorced is that they simply remain legally married; however, their marriage is just as much over as those who divorced.

If you can fall in love, then you can fall out of love.
 
Frisky said:
I disagree here.. I would never a partner before my kids. EVER

sure sooner or later they are gone but as long as they are with me its my responsibility to care for them, love them, understand them and provide for them.

My partner however is an adult who can for the most part live his life with or without me. I would more than openly accept him to join in on the loving, caring and attending to my kids but never in a million years could I ever imagine putting someone above them.

I brought them into this world. Its my responsibility to give them all that I have in me to ensure safety, and security. If i pass them over for some man then who do they have?
Click to expand...

You BOTH brought them into the world not just YOU



Frisky said:
yes he was


If i deem my self single for ever, f**k it. If the person Im seeing cant understand that no matter what..... NO MATTER. My kids are before them then things just won't work.

I can't now nor ever put someone above them, my flesh, my blood, my responisibility. I mold them to what they will be and I want them to love and nurture and be responsible. If I walk away from them, for what ever reason or what ever time span, no matter how much I or someone may think its importance is.. it influences them.

I've been there, been the kid, and felt the rejection. My promise to myself when I decided that I wanted kids of my own was to NEVER do to them what i had to endure. I won't break that promise nor would i ever subject them to feeling like they are 2nd choice.

I'd die before I did that.
Click to expand...

That's pretty fucked up to just push the father away because of the kids. It's kinda like you used him for his sperm them dumped him on the side of the road. Granted I don't know what the reasons were for your separation but if it was because you couldn't share the love you had for your kids with him, then that's just horrible.


It's not about priorities. It's about having the heart and determination to bring a kid into the world so that you both can experience. Then when the time comes for them to move out, you still have each other.

The kids will eventually move on with their lives and you will be.....alone
 
wutangnomo said:
Many people choose to remain in UNhappy marriages because they have moral/religious hangups with the divorce path or because they do not want the divorce label/association.
Click to expand...

Marriage is what you make it. I was UNhappy for a while too. Since divorce was not an option for us (not moral or religious - but based on what we wanted for our kid) we did what we needed to in order to make it work. We discussed what made us UNhappy and commited to changing it so that we were both happy. If a person is so concerned with only THEIR happiness and THIER satisfaction, they are probably too self-centered to be successful in marriage anyway.

Twice you've said: "If you can fall in love, then you can fall out of love.", but what you don't get is that I am talking about something much different than just looking at your spouse and sighing about how much you are "in love". Feelings come and go depending on stresses SURROUNDING the r'ship. There have been days when I was positive I hated my husband. But I didn't pack my bags and run off to the next flame looking for "the spark". I told my husband I was UNhappy, we discussed it and corrected the problem. Sometimes we worked for months to get past issues. But we didn't give up - we don't see that as an option.

If you don't have a firm COMMITMENT to the r'ship and to the FAMILY UNIT then of course it is very easy to see greener grass elsewhere and moan about how you just aren't "in love" anymore. Commitment is what makes the difference. Not commited in "I love you as long as it's easy and you make me happy and there's not a cute neighbor who sparks my interest". Commited as in: this is IT. Come what may, I'm not giving up on this r'ship.
 
Delinquent said:
You BOTH brought them into the world not just YOU





That's pretty fucked up to just push the father away because of the kids. It's kinda like you used him for his sperm them dumped him on the side of the road. Granted I don't know what the reasons were for your separation but if it was because you couldn't share the love you had for your kids with him, then that's just horrible.


It's not about priorities. It's about having the heart and determination to bring a kid into the world so that you both can experience. Then when the time comes for them to move out, you still have each other.

The kids will eventually move on with their lives and you will be.....alone
Click to expand...


....... My first comment was for FUTURE partner. I am not currently with My childrens father!

Our Seperation had nothing to do with OUR kids. We both had the same mindset about who came first.

I didn't abandon him.. not at all. But given the choice, had he been selfish i'd choose my kids any day.

My point was that you shouldn't put your kids after your spouse. If that said spouse is so selfish that he/she can't reconize the fact that an infant/child requires more attention than an adult and can't accept the fact that 'alone' time comes after the kids are tended to. Then sorry, he has no place in my life.

I have responsibiliities.. and with my particular X he knew where I stood on priorities before we had our first child. He knew it would take away from his and our time and that it would impact our lives alot. Would I take a minute of it back.. hell no. MY kids are the best thing that has ever happened to me, there is nothing now nor ever that could amt to what they have taught me.

I may sound like a cold hearted bitch.. and oh well. Not sure if you have kids. If you do, I hope they are top of your list and that you and your spouse both agree that they are both of YOUR responsibility.. what is putting off 18 years to give 100% to somenone you brought into this world? so yea.. you can't do the little things that youdid when you were courting.. that is all to come in time.

It takes a very strong relationship, lots of love and understanding to put aside the selfish manners and allow yourself to be put second in someones life. A family is not just born, its built and maintained. Its not easy to keep it all organized and keep everyone happy, there has to be priorities.. anyone that I am associated with knows where mine are. I've never had a problem with that, I make sure its known from the beginning.

your last comment about being alone... If my partner can't understand me wanting to give to my kids and to devote myself to them then yes I will be alone. My kids will be with me forever. My family ties run thick, i guess i'm different than most here. And I actually have kids and have been in that particular situation of being pushed aside for the new 'woman'. Sorry.. I can't and won't put my kids thru that. If I die a lonely woman then yes I brought it all upon myself but I'd rather die lonely then to ever have my kids feel the way I felt growing up.
 
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Frisky said:
yes he was


If i deem my self single for ever, f**k it. If the person Im seeing cant understand that no matter what..... NO MATTER. My kids are before them then things just won't work.

I can't now nor ever put someone above them, my flesh, my blood, my responisibility. I mold them to what they will be and I want them to love and nurture and be responsible. If I walk away from them, for what ever reason or what ever time span, no matter how much I or someone may think its importance is.. it influences them.

I've been there, been the kid, and felt the rejection. My promise to myself when I decided that I wanted kids of my own was to NEVER do to them what i had to endure. I won't break that promise nor would i ever subject them to feeling like they are 2nd choice.

I'd die before I did that.
Click to expand...

I wasn't speaking of totally rejecting one's children for a man or dumping the kids once some hot guy comes along.

What I WAS talking about was simple decency, respect & civility towards one's spouse, which should NEVER end just because one has children. Such as speaking to them with respect, showing appreciation for what they do, allowing them to share in the joy of the children also, maybe making some time with them - even tho the kids DO take a lot of time.

I wasn't referring to the extremes you brought up of total rejection, abuse or "group home" type stuff (yes I've seen that stuff 1sthand also and agree it's horrible). But just because one has kids doesn't mean one has begin to treat their SO badly.

Sorry if you were merely changing the subject....... ;)
 
jenscats5 said:
I wasn't speaking of totally rejecting one's children for a man or dumping the kids once some hot guy comes along.

What I WAS talking about was simple decency, respect & civility towards one's spouse, which should NEVER end just because one has children. Such as speaking to them with respect, showing appreciation for what they do, allowing them to share in the joy of the children also, maybe making some time with them - even tho the kids DO take a lot of time.

I wasn't referring to the extremes you brought up of total rejection, abuse or "group home" type stuff (yes I've seen that stuff 1sthand also and agree it's horrible). But just because one has kids doesn't mean one has begin to treat their SO badly.

Sorry if you were merely changing the subject....... ;)
Click to expand...

I never NOT once said i treated my SO poorly.. hell I waited on him hand and foot. Provided for him catered to him, loved him unconditionally. I guarantee you he was never treated so good.

What I was referring to was this direct statement made by you, which I disagreed with. Not me being right or you being wrong. Just the way I live my life and I'd never put my SO first. That by no account means I am disrespectful to him, or ignore him. It means our time comes after WE have taken care of Family and responsibility.

jenscats5 said:
You & your partner are FIRST - BEFORE work, BEFORE children, etc.......cuz eventually - the kids will move out, etc & you'll be sitting there looking at this person like Who the heck are they??
Click to expand...

I don't expect for anyone to agree with my way of thinking.. hell doubtfully anyone will. Everyone has their way, their priorities. I Love my kids, currently I am a single mom. I won't ever accept someone in my life that can't accept that my kids come first. If I have to cancel dinner because of homework.. oh well.. they are first. even something as petty as my daughter really wants to spend time watching a movie so maybe we can reschedule.. sorry they come first.

Maybe this makes me the most sorry ass potiential wife/girlfriend. I'm sure it does. I wouldn't be with someone that ever put me above their kids. NEVER!
 
Frisky said:
I never NOT once said i treated my SO poorly.. hell I waited on him hand and foot. Provided for him catered to him, loved him unconditionally. I guarantee you he was never treated so good.

I never said you did treat him badly - nor did I ever suggest it. I was merely clarifying what I meant cuz you brought up more than once dumping the kids for a guy or abusive type stuff........neither of which is what I meant by my original statement

What I was referring to was this direct statement made by you, which I disagreed with. Not me being right or you being wrong. Just the way I live my life and I'd never put my SO first. That by no account means I am disrespectful to him, or ignore him. It means our time comes after WE have taken care of Family and responsibility.


I don't expect for anyone to agree with my way of thinking.. hell doubtfully anyone will. Everyone has their way, their priorities. I Love my kids, currently I am a single mom. I won't ever accept someone in my life that can't accept that my kids come first. If I have to cancel dinner because of homework.. oh well.. they are first. even something as petty as my daughter really wants to spend time watching a movie so maybe we can reschedule.. sorry they come first.

Maybe this makes me the most sorry ass potiential wife/girlfriend. I'm sure it does. I wouldn't be with someone that ever put me above their kids. NEVER!
Click to expand...

Again, what I meant by putting one's partner first is by continuing to treat them as a person, doing certain things to make them feel special, stuff like that......Again, "putting someone first" DOES NOT necessarily mean one is ignoring one's kids for the sake of another, rejecting them, abusing them, neglecting them or doing X to make sure Social Services has to intervene.

I'm not saying I'm right or wrong here but we're apparantly speaking about two totally different things here.........
 
jenscats5 said:
Again, what I meant by putting one's partner first is by continuing to treat them as a person, doing certain things to make them feel special, stuff like that......Again, "putting someone first" DOES NOT necessarily mean one is ignoring one's kids for the sake of another, rejecting them, abusing them, neglecting them or doing X to make sure Social Services has to intervene.

I'm not saying I'm right or wrong here but we're apparantly speaking about two totally different things here.........
Click to expand...

I won't get into a battle of what is right or what is wrong, honestly its not worth it to get that deep. A good relationship involves trust, honesty, friendship and loyalty. All of which has to be there for me before I take that step of even considering mass producing.... or in my case now, sharing my kids with my S/O.

Clearly we are on different pages. I misunderstood your post and ran with it.

and ill add to this once more before I am out for the evening, I'm not speaking of Social services or total neglect.. I am however speaking of a line of duty. I'm not and never did bring up any type of abuse that would even promp social services. What some DON'T understand is the unwritten.. that unspoken abuse that isn't often talked about. You don't have to put your spouse on a ladder to make him feel appreciated. He doesn't have to be revolved around for your relationship to be great.

Its equal.. and its a friendship. If he is truely a friend then he will understand.
 
I wouldnt consider a woman a person of integrity if the emotional and physical well being of her kids didnt surpass all other concerns on the radar.


The interesting part of this is you cant have any idea what you're on about with this topic if you DONT have kids of your own.


he said, she said. you cannot know the true depth of commitement and responisblity without being in the game yourlself, that goes for all things in life. you either KNOW. or you HEARD. two very different animals. otherwise, its theory.
 
all of the above. honest communication, compromise, each one setting the 'foot' down sometimes. abitlity to grow and adapt. etc etc....

12yrs here and going strong.
 
ChefWide said:
I wouldnt consider a woman a person of integrity if the emotional and physical well being of her kids didnt surpass all other concerns on the radar.
The interesting part of this is you cant have any idea what you're on about with this topic if you DONT have kids of your own.
Click to expand...

I strongly disagree. I think Jen's post was misunderstood. As I said in this and other posts, one does not have to be married and have children to understand certain things.

I know exactly what Jen is talking about because I saw it with my parent's marriage. My mom would always be on top of my sister and I, but rarely did she ask my Dad "How was your day?". She would always stay late at work but rarely show any affection to my father. She took care of all of the chores and catered to him (my Dad is an OLD-fashioned man) and when she couldn't my sister and I cooked and cleaned. Don't get me wrong, she loved him. But she neglected his emotional and physical needs.
 
spongebob said:
all of the above. honest communication, compromise, each one setting the 'foot' down sometimes. abitlity to grow and adapt. etc etc....

12yrs here and going strong.
Click to expand...

YES!
 
ChefWide said:
I wouldnt consider a woman a person of integrity if the emotional and physical well being of her kids didnt surpass all other concerns on the radar.


The interesting part of this is you cant have any idea what you're on about with this topic if you DONT have kids of your own.


he said, she said. you cannot know the true depth of commitement and responisblity without being in the game yourlself, that goes for all things in life. you either KNOW. or you HEARD. two very different animals. otherwise, its theory.
Click to expand...

I have to disagree with you since the original topic was about marriage and while I haven't given birth myself I DO have a step-child, thus am entitled to an opinion on child-rearing. Being a step parent can possibly be harder & more challenging than being a biological parent.

Plus, as an adopted person, one does not have to have biological kids to be a good and effective parent. Your post is almost an affront to all those who have adopted children or have become foster parents withougt producing thier own offspring.

Now back to the original topic......
 
nycgirl said:
I strongly disagree. I think Jen's post was misunderstood. As I said in this and other posts, one does not have to be married and have children to understand certain things.

I know exactly what Jen is talking about because I saw with my parent's marriage. My mom would always be on top of my sister and I, but rarely did she ask my Dad "How was your day?". She would always stay late at work but rarely show any affection to my father. She took care of all of the chores and catered to him (my Dad is an OLD-fashioned man). But she neglected his emotional and physical needs.
Click to expand...

To show attention and to actuall catorgorize people in your life are totally different.

What I read in jens response was put YOU and YOUR spouse first.. Kids, job next.

You don't have to put your spouse first to show love, respect and attention.

Sometimes being a parent, is overwhelming. Some days, honestly I can't go anymore by the end of the day. Work, Clean, cook, homework, baths, etc etc.. I will truthfully say that sometimes it becomes a chore and all the emotion is removed.

I wouldn't ever say your mom was wrong.. maybe she never realized that she was just following the motions of her everyday life. Trust me it happens. Have you ever been so exhausted that you didnt' even have the energy to cry? I have, burnt out completely.
 
nycgirl said:
I strongly disagree. I think Jen's post was misunderstood. As I said in this and other posts, one does not have to be married and have children to understand certain things.

I know exactly what Jen is talking about because I saw it with my parent's marriage. My mom would always be on top of my sister and I, but rarely did she ask my Dad "How was your day?". She would always stay late at work but rarely show any affection to my father. She took care of all of the chores and catered to him (my Dad is an OLD-fashioned man) and when she couldn't my sister and I cooked and cleaned. Don't get me wrong, she loved him. But she neglected his emotional and physical needs.
Click to expand...


Where, exactly, my fast to the draw friend, did i say a feckin thing about neglecting my SO? I am UberMensch and do both with flying colors!

It is easy to do both, if you BOTH do both. My assertion is based purely on the hypothetical that someone might neglect ones children for the sake of spousal attenttion. NO accusatory anything, so dont make me stamp my feet and whine about it. ;)

... now, yes, you can extrapolate any experience from looking from the outside in, anyone of above average intelligence can, that does not alter one bit the absolute need to BE IN IT to truely have an ORGANIC knowledge of it.

I could write a thousand volumes on kissing and the reader, no matter how gifted, will not KNOW until they DO. Period.
 
jenscats5 said:
Now back to the original topic......
Click to expand...


Ok

I think it was about Happily married people.

Your turn
 
Frisky said:
I don't expect for anyone to agree with my way of thinking.. hell doubtfully anyone will. Everyone has their way, their priorities. I Love my kids, currently I am a single mom. I won't ever accept someone in my life that can't accept that my kids come first. If I have to cancel dinner because of homework.. oh well.. they are first. even something as petty as my daughter really wants to spend time watching a movie so maybe we can reschedule.. sorry they come first.

Maybe this makes me the most sorry ass potiential wife/girlfriend. I'm sure it does. I wouldn't be with someone that ever put me above their kids. NEVER!
Click to expand...

Actually Fisky, I can relate to your position. When my kids were born, my life was nurse, sleep, nurse, change diapers, nurse, sleep..... I was exhausted all the time. Intimacy with my husband did suffer. I had a kid hanging off my boob most of the day, or being carried, or rocked to sleep, or held while he slept. I didn't have the time or energy for my husband. My r'ship with him HAD to take a back seat to nurturing a baby.

And no, we didn't have the option of dropping the baby off somewhere, for "us" time. So the r'ship suffered. We had sex maybe once a month. If that. but we both knew that the kids came first. We were BOTH commited to that end (as it sounds like you two were). We balanced our lives as much as possible and looked forward to the day that the kids gained a little more independence and we could focus more on each other.

i guess we were lucky that we were on the 'same page' and were commited to working through the difficult time.
 
jenscats5 said:
I have to disagree with you since the original topic was about marriage and while I haven't given birth myself I DO have a step-child, thus am entitled to an opinion on child-rearing. Being a step parent can possibly be harder & more challenging than being a biological parent.

Plus, as an adopted person, one does not have to have biological kids to be a good and effective parent. Your post is almost an affront to all those who have adopted children or have become foster parents withougt producing thier own offspring.

Now back to the original topic......
Click to expand...


Wrong. Having adopted or step kids, is, in all ways, or at least should be, the same level of emotional and parental commitment as pumpin' em out yourself.

You dont have to squeeze em out to love em. Did you hear someone say that? My comment was 'kids of your own' if you consider that child 'yours' how it got that way is of no import.

So, you and NYC, go gang up on somebody else, i am very sensitive today as my new boxers are chaffing my nethers and i cant stand the abuse....
 
ChefWide said:
Wrong. Having adopted or step kids, is, in all ways, or at least should be, the same level of emotional and parental commitment as pumpin' em out yourself.

You dont have to squeeze em out to love em. Did you hear someone say that? My comment was 'kids of your own' if you consider that child 'yours' how it got that way is of no import.

So, you and NYC, go gang up on somebody else, i am very sensitive today as my new boxers are chaffing my nethers and i cant stand the abuse....
Click to expand...

Hey, I was just responding to your call-out...... Too many people play that card and I just won't have it! Ya hear? *stamps foot*
 
jenscats5 said:
Hey, I was just responding to your call-out...... Too many people play that card and I just won't have it! Ya hear? *stamps foot*
Click to expand...


look, missy angrypants, a pile of Bittersweet Peanut Butter tartlets with french vanilla ice cream!!!


BWHAHAHAAHHAAHAH!!!




best regards,

Eevil Von Smoove
Secret Lair
Transillllwania
 
ChefWide said:
look, missy angrypants, a pile of Bittersweet Peanut Butter tartlets with french vanilla ice cream!!!


BWHAHAHAAHHAAHAH!!!




best regards,

Eevil Von Smooth
Secret Lair
Transillllwania
Click to expand...

I'm no longer dieting...........so there Mr. Homemade Spicy Hot NJ salsa pants. So I can eat what I want!! So I'm immune to your culinary kryptonite!! HAHAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!! :p
 
jenscats5 said:
I'm no longer dieting...........so there Mr. Homemade Spicy Hot NJ salsa pants. So I can eat what I want!! So I'm immune to your culinary kryptonite!! HAHAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!! :p
Click to expand...


DRAT! Mutley, lets get out before NYC gets back with her canoli tubes and a jar of astroglide!
 
aandd said:
Marriage is what you make it. I was UNhappy for a while too. Since divorce was not an option for us (not moral or religious - but based on what we wanted for our kid) we did what we needed to in order to make it work. We discussed what made us UNhappy and commited to changing it so that we were both happy. If a person is so concerned with only THEIR happiness and THIER satisfaction, they are probably too self-centered to be successful in marriage anyway.

Twice you've said: "If you can fall in love, then you can fall out of love.", but what you don't get is that I am talking about something much different than just looking at your spouse and sighing about how much you are "in love". Feelings come and go depending on stresses SURROUNDING the r'ship. There have been days when I was positive I hated my husband. But I didn't pack my bags and run off to the next flame looking for "the spark". I told my husband I was UNhappy, we discussed it and corrected the problem. Sometimes we worked for months to get past issues. But we didn't give up - we don't see that as an option.

If you don't have a firm COMMITMENT to the r'ship and to the FAMILY UNIT then of course it is very easy to see greener grass elsewhere and moan about how you just aren't "in love" anymore. Commitment is what makes the difference. Not commited in "I love you as long as it's easy and you make me happy and there's not a cute neighbor who sparks my interest". Commited as in: this is IT. Come what may, I'm not giving up on this r'ship.
Click to expand...

What you're basically insinuating is that people who divorce do not have a firm commitment and devotion to one another and their marriage the way you and your husband have. Honey, my best friend is 51. She has been married about 30 years, probably longer then you've lived (or right around your age). She has been working on her marriage problems probably longer then you've been married, which is YEARS! She didn't just pick up her bags and run off to the next flame. The fact that you say this shows that you haven't been married all that long, I'm guessing under 10 years.

She is now getting a divorce, not because she and her husband are not committed to one another and the family unit, but simply because it did not work out. Simple. They BOTH tried their damndest to save their marriage, but it wasn't mean to be. They drifted apart and fell out of love with one another.

Yes, it does happen A LOT where, despite BOTH parties working hard and GIVING IT THEIR ALL to the marriage, that it still does not last. This does not mean they were not as committed as you and your husband are. It just means it was not meant to be.

It is ignorant to assume that anyone who divorces is not committed. That's just flat out wrong.
 
wutangnomo said:
What you're basically insinuating is that people who divorce do not have a firm commitment and devotion to one another and their marriage the way you and your husband have. Honey, my best friend is 51. She has been married about 30 years, probably longer then you've lived (or right around your age). She has been working on her marriage problems probably longer then you've been married, which is YEARS! She didn't just pick up her bags and run off to the next flame. The fact that you say this shows that you haven't been married all that long, I'm guessing under 10 years.

She is now getting a divorce, not because she and her husband are not committed to one another and the family unit, but simply because it did not work out. Simple. They BOTH tried their damndest to save their marriage, but it wasn't mean to be. They drifted apart and fell out of love with one another.

Yes, it does happen A LOT where, despite BOTH parties working hard and GIVING IT THEIR ALL to the marriage, that it still does not last. This does not mean they were not as committed as you and your husband are. It just means it was not meant to be.

It is ignorant to assume that anyone who divorces is not committed. That's just flat out wrong.
Click to expand...


Well, I would not attribute failure of a marriage to "it wasn't meant to be" or "luck". That implies that you had no choice and leads to the comforting thought that you have no responsibility for the negative consequence.

My point on commitment was that, in all honesty, I felt you were doing a disservice to your parents in calling their success "luck" rather than "hard fucking work" and "commitment to raising their family together". I would think that your parents marriage went far beyond 'luck'.

Beyond that, I'm not saying someone else isn't as commited as *I* am. I'm not judging your friend at all, and would not presume to know the state of your friend's 51 year marriage. To each their own. The topic was what worked in MY marriage. People get divorced for all sorts of reasons. Each person has their opinion of what a "deal breaker" in their marriage is.

Not everyone has my family's motivation. I don't expect them to. I also don't expect everyone to agree with our decisions. In fact, I'm sure most people would regard us as old-fashioned in regards to marriage.
 
......................and back to the original topic.

Unlike Chef, and Frisky (not placing blame or flaming in any way)....I am still married to the mother of my children. She and my kids share an equal standing in the schematics of my priorities..

My kids and wife are the single most important things in my world, none moreso than the other. If you decide to pick sides (children vs. spouse) at some point one or the other............or both will resent you like no other.

:)
 
Good thread QT.

All I can do is observe here........
 
I have gathered that human beings are very complex creatures, and that having a successful marriage amounts to the ability to summon all of one's strengths- physical, mental, and emotional, together for the one they love.
 
aandd said:
Well, I would not attribute failure of a marriage to "it wasn't meant to be" or "luck". That implies that you had no choice and leads to the comforting thought that you have no responsibility for the negative consequence.
Click to expand...

Exactly. Some people make wrong decisions, which may take many years to realize or rear its ugly head down the road. This does not mean they don't try hard enough or are not commmited enough, which is what you were saying with your earlier post.

aandd said:
My point on commitment was that, in all honesty, I felt you were doing a disservice to your parents in calling their success "luck" rather than "hard fucking work" and "commitment to raising their family together". I would think that your parents marriage went far beyond 'luck'.
Click to expand...

How am I doing my parent's a disservice by saying it's luck? They were arranged. That means they did not know one another before they were wed. You're telling me that's not luck? Of course it is. Luck does not take away from my parent's hard work and commitment. You're saying that "hard fucking work" and "commitment" will supercede any road bumps and incompatibilities between a married couple, which is not always the case. If your husband should cheat on you, become abusive, etc etc amongst who knows what else (always possible), do you think hard work and commitment will resolve all those problems? Fact is many couples go through all this and it just isn't enough. Come back to me when you're 40 or 45 and we'll see.
 
OK
Luck is very important at first, when meeting someone. I met my wife when she was barely 15. She says she knew then we were meant to be. We dated for a while, I dropped out of school & joined the army. After leaves each year, when we finally got married, she was 2 wks out of H.S. & we'd probably physically been together 5 months & 3 months of that was before I had left.
The next part is critical, I think. We spent the next 2 years alone, in Germany, with no family to interfere. We were forced to lean on each other, communicate, & compromise.
When we had the kid, the next few years were the toughest on our marriage for some of the reasons Frisky mentioned. I was partly selfish, & she didn't know I existed, escept to earn money. We fought, I sulked, she withdrew, we talked, started dating, & here we are.
We compliment each other, meaning we each are what the other is not. We are best friends, & honestly, after my daughter moves on in her life, college, marriage, etc. I cannot wait to be alone with my baby.
Kids are important, but so is your spouse. IMO, in order to give kids proper perspective, you have to help them understand that others are important too. That means, on occasion, leaving the kids with a sitter & going out to dinner, a movie, even getting a hotel room.
So basically, it's about respect, compromise, & hard work.
Together 25 years, married 22.
I love her to death. I cannot breath when I think of her not being with me.
 
In the end it's all about both partners' personality

If you're both open minded, flexible, ready to compromise and have some good will you can make you mariage work

On the other hand if you're still an immature selfish kid it's no gonna work
 
pitbullstl said:
......................and back to the original topic.

Unlike Chef, and Frisky (not placing blame or flaming in any way)....I am still married to the mother of my children. She and my kids share an equal standing in the schematics of my priorities..

My kids and wife are the single most important things in my world, none moreso than the other. If you decide to pick sides (children vs. spouse) at some point one or the other............or both will resent you like no other.

:)
Click to expand...

Nice post.
 
wutangnomo said:
Exactly. Some people make wrong decisions, which may take many years to realize or rear its ugly head down the road. This does not mean they don't try hard enough or are not commmited enough, which is what you were saying with your earlier post.
Click to expand...

No, that is your incorrect interpretation of what I was saying. Who knows why some couples decide to divorce. Your friend, if I were assuming, I would think that she tried hard for 51 years and then reached a point where the reward was no longer worth the commitment to keep trying. Does that mean I think she wasn't "commited enough"? NO WAY. Like I said before - everyone has their idea of a 'deal breaker'. She obviously encountered hers (as do over 50% of couples in a first marriage). Am I better than them? NOPE. Who am I to judge how much work a person has put in? Unless a person slept in the couple's bed at night, there's really no way to know that.



wutangnomo said:
How am I doing my parent's a disservice by saying it's luck? They were arranged. That means they did not know one another before they were wed. You're telling me that's not luck? Of course it is. Luck does not take away from my parent's hard work and commitment. You're saying that "hard fucking work" and "commitment" will supercede any road bumps and incompatibilities between a married couple, which is not always the case. If your husband should cheat on you, become abusive, etc etc amongst who knows what else (always possible), do you think hard work and commitment will resolve all those problems? Fact is many couples go through all this and it just isn't enough. Come back to me when you're 40 or 45 and we'll see.
Click to expand...

My my, you are getting awfully personal in your replies. That is amusing to me.

Like I said above - that is once again your incorrect interpretation of what I'm saying, based on your views of marriage. Basically it seems we disagree on the existence of some mystical force that awards some success and others failure. I don't believe in luck, therefore it is impossible for me to accept the premise of your argument that your parents were simply "lucky".

And yes, I think hard work and commitment can resolve issues like infidelity. Lets just say I have experience that tells me it can. That doesn't mean it is not a future "deal breaker" in this household. That would be where I decided that the rewards were no longer worth the work. Do I think that means I'm not commited enough. Nope.
 
My wife's parents separated the year we got married. IMO, they should have divorced 10 yrs earlier. She put up with shit that should have made her just walk out.
 
you cannot get a man or a woman to make a commitment.
Commitment is an internal act. The ability to make a commitment is something we grow up to. its a developmental point, a willingness to be an adult. it is the ability to choose to direct ones life...
It happens inside.

some really great posts here...QT caused quite a stir...I lead my life from a spiritual perspective, i dont believe in fate, luck or a draw from the hat. I believe relationships go much deeper than what most described here...Doctrines , rules , labels, religions, judgements all have one thing in common- they change, they fail, they are temporary...love is everlasting no matter what position its in.
 
PBR said:
some really great posts here...QT caused quite a stir....
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Yeah I rule :verygood: LOL But seriously some really great replies here I knew if we tried hard enough we could still have intelligant topics on C & C.
 
superqt4u2nv said:
Yeah I rule :verygood: LOL But seriously some really great replies here I knew if we tried hard enough we could still have intelligant topics on C & C.
Click to expand...
you were very successful :) , and nobody got bombed!!!!! imagine that, in the midst of a heated and debatable subject no less, and no loss of life....maybe there's hope.
 
PBR said:
some really great posts here...QT caused quite a stir...I lead my life from a spiritual perspective, i dont believe in fate, luck or a draw from the hat. I believe relationships go much deeper than what most described here...Doctrines , rules , labels, religions, judgements all have one thing in common- they change, they fail, they are temporary...love is everlasting no matter what position its in.
Click to expand...
I believe luck is an element, but only at the beginning. As in my case, it was pure luck that we met with each other and started dating. We'd both had partners who were, on the surface, better fits.. We honestly didn't know each other well enough to say we loved each other. I think we were just in love with an ideal, & we made it work.
I don't think love is ever lasting. How many people grow apart from too many external factors? There were times that I think I despised my wife & I'm sure she felt the same for me. I'm not sure how she dealt with it, but I would think of the way we used to feel together. I'd think about the things I'd loved about her & realize they were still inside her. In short, we fell out of love for a while, but we didn't give up. That's where it takes work & commitment. It's easy to stay married when everything is hunky dory. It's a little harder when things aren't so smooth. For the last 15 years it's been easy. A coupla years before that it was hard.
 
Almost 21 years. The secret is to realize that marriage isn't suppose to be happy all the time. It is just like like peaks and valleys. That is why it bums me out when I hear people that get a divorce because they were probably just in a valley and the peak was around the corner. The other key is to try to make your partner as happy as possible because when you get love you want to return love.
 
PBR said:
you cannot get a man or a woman to make a commitment.
Commitment is an internal act. The ability to make a commitment is something we grow up to. its a developmental point, a willingness to be an adult. it is the ability to choose to direct ones life...
It happens inside.

some really great posts here...QT caused quite a stir...I lead my life from a spiritual perspective, i dont believe in fate, luck or a draw from the hat. I believe relationships go much deeper than what most described here...Doctrines , rules , labels, religions, judgements all have one thing in common- they change, they fail, they are temporary...love is everlasting no matter what position its in.
Click to expand...
Dude, I knew from your avatar that you were cool, but, I have to say that was one of the most concisely intelligent posts I have ever seen. Very true words. Thank you.
 
Happy & Married..... same damn sentence.


Pulease......







hee hee.. Im kidding Im kidding ;)
 
Frisky said:
Happy & Married..... same damn sentence.


Pulease......







hee hee.. Im kidding Im kidding ;)
Click to expand...
Frisky....i have been down your path and have more in common with you and your experiences then you probably care to know. From the places ive been, and the things ive seen i was given a choice to learn from, or to reject all....Youre an intelligent woman and the choice is yours ( you are very passionate about this subject & possibly a little PO'd ;) )....The prospects of marraige is not so simple- combining two human beings into one motion....there is so much at stake.

Hidngod- i respect your view on luck...thats why i prefaced my response of my spiritual nature first...i believe that no one comes across our paths hap-hazardly....and when we truely love another person (truely and deeply) i believe it never ever expires....we may not always be together with them, but the LOVE we have for them never ceases to carry on...

Split- thats the coolest thing anyone has ever said to me....i just blew hammy's karma away...thanks very much.
 
curling said:
Almost 21 years. The secret is to realize that marriage isn't suppose to be happy all the time. It is just like like peaks and valleys. That is why it bums me out when I hear people that get a divorce because they were probably just in a valley and the peak was around the corner. The other key is to try to make your partner as happy as possible because when you get love you want to return love.
Click to expand...
you need to go back to my above post curling...."supposed to" is a rule...( your not supposed to fuck the pool guy while iam at work)....marriage is not always fun and games, because it involves real time, real life...there are peaks and valleys= hence, "ebb and flows", we do this on our own, by ourselves without partners...its natural. it becomes a problem when we EXPECT it not to be natural when we have a partnership....
 
PBR said:
Frisky....i have been down your path and have more in common with you and your experiences then you probably care to know. From the places ive been, and the things ive seen i was given a choice to learn from, or to reject all....Youre an intelligent woman and the choice is yours ( you are very passionate about this subject & possibly a little PO'd ;) )....The prospects of marraige is not so simple- combining two human beings into one motion....there is so much at stake.
Click to expand...

Oh yes, i know.

Im not a bitter Xwife. I had a happy marriage for some time. Things just didn't work out. Will I ever marry again? possibly... I'm not against marriage at all.
 
Frisky said:
Oh yes, i know.

Im not a bitter Xwife. I had a happy marriage for some time. Things just didn't work out. Will I ever marry again? possibly... I'm not against marriage at all.
Click to expand...
Let me ask you this....knowing what you do now, do you find it (marriage) more frightening than ever before, or are you more confident and at ease with the thought of it? not just the word or term "marraige" , but "relationship" allowing yourself to be in love and or loving someone else?
 
PBR said:
Let me ask you this....knowing what you do now, do you find it (marriage) more frightening than ever before, or are you more confident and at ease with the thought of it? not just the word or term "marraige" , but "relationship" allowing yourself to be in love and or loving someone else?
Click to expand...

I now know how hard it is.. I was with my x for 11 years, jumped right on in not realizing what it took to make a marriage.

We both did fight to make it work, but I guess our fight wasn't good enough. Thing is, you can't just fight the good fight at the end when your bleeding to death. You have to fight the good fight from day one. We waited to late to try to salvage our marriage.

I learned ALOT. relationships are not born they are harvested. If you don't plan the seed and water the fruit then you will end up with a dead tree.

I will not turn away the possibility of living a happy life, loving, caring, sharing.. with someone I connect with. Good, bad, or indifferent. You won't have perfection ever in a marriage or a relationship. but you can build something solid, you just need patience, trust, love and compassion.
 
PBR,

dang bro, that sucks. How did you find out about the pool guy?

I should have said that faithfulness is just expected.
 
Frisky- i could write a book on this topic and you have provoked yet more thoughts...but i need to get out of here right now....so, for the moment- Thank you, more to come.

Curling- love is blind at times. i was the last to know anything. perhaps this was best looking at it now.
 
Good thread.

Together 10 years, married for 6...

I think all the best qualities of a good marriage have already been listed above. I can't think of one damn thing to add but I do have a list of qualities that I think make my marriage a success:

* Either one of us can bring up the answer to a 3-day-dead question and the other wi'll know exactly what they're talking about (e.g., On a Monday she asks me who sang "On The Other Hand" and I say Hell if I know then Thursday during dinner I might blurt out "Randy Travis" and she knows exactly what I mean.)

* I can look at her from across a crowded room and she knows exactly what I'm trying to tell her (e.g., "This party blows. Get your stuff and let's get outta here.")

* She keeps the kitty shaved even though she says it's a pain because she knows I like it that way

* We take care of ourselves so we'll continue to find each other physically attractive

* We TALK -- about everything

* She doesn't freak when I want to do a cycle

I know, boring but I had to contribute. It was a very fun thread to read.
 
PBR said:
Hidngod- i respect your view on luck...thats why i prefaced my response of my spiritual nature first...i believe that no one comes across our paths hap-hazardly....and when we truely love another person (truely and deeply) i believe it never ever expires....we may not always be together with them, but the LOVE we have for them never ceases to carry on...
Click to expand...

I agree with your posts PBR, especially the part about love never expiring. However, love does change, and it is this that causes two people to drift apart.
 
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