TWO WEEK CYCLES are the safest!

[Realgains]

You could use test cyp or enanthate at up to a gram with a single shot on day one. A week after the shot you'll have 500 in the system and then after 2 weeks you will have about 250mg in the system and that is low enough for clomid to be effective. BUT this is not the best way to go as ideally one wants to have high levels of androgen in the system EVERY day of the two weeks up until you stop with the test on day 11 or 12.....so fast acting esters will give better results.

RG

 

[the urge]

Hey Real, could you effectivly use ox in a 2 weeker. I have been planning on trying this method for a while and have a lot of the paper ox lying around. Would you see anythng with a ox/dbol cycle, or would you have to also have tren or prop. Would short ox cycle in high doses(70+mgs/day) be effective. Would would you reccommend?

 

[bebaumax]

You could use test cyp or enanthate at up to a gram with a single shot on day one. A week after the shot you'll have 500 in the system and then after 2 weeks you will have about 250mg in the system and that is low enough for clomid to be effective. BUT this is not the best way to go as ideally one wants to have high levels of androgen in the system EVERY day of the two weeks up until you stop with the test on day 11 or 12.....so fast acting esters will give better results.

RG

RG, I think your numbers are off a bit there, bud. If you did 1000mg Cyp or Enanthate on Sunday, the following Sunday you'd have ~700mg, your body only having "used" about 300mg at that point. The half-life of those two esters is about 12 days and 10.5 days, respectively. It wouldn't be until Friday of the following week that you'd be down to 500mg on Cyp and late Wednesday would be 500mg on Enanthate.

-B

 

[Realgains]

RG, I think your numbers are off a bit there, bud. If you did 1000mg Cyp or Enanthate on Sunday, the following Sunday you'd have ~700mg, your body only having "used" about 300mg at that point. The half-life of those two esters is about 12 days and 10.5 days, respectively. It wouldn't be until Friday of the following week that you'd be down to 500mg on Cyp and late Wednesday would be 500mg on Enanthate.

-B

Actually bro I was being a bit "general" with the week thing...enanthate has a half life of about 5 days and cyp has a half life of about 6 days....
I think what you may be referring to is the time that the ester exhibits an ananbolic affect with an average dose.

RG

 

[samoth]

Whoa... 250mg of test floating in the system is 'low' enough for clomid to be efficient?? Can anyone explain this a bit more thoroughly, as I have always heard a standard of 50mgs of remaining test was the maximum...
I'll do some research on this as well, for I have no evidence to back up either claim, but there appears to be quite a contradiction here.
And yes, I agree with RG, the half lifes of the respective esters is five and six days.

 

[Realgains]

Whoa... 250mg of test floating in the system is 'low' enough for clomid to be efficient?? Can anyone explain this a bit more thoroughly, as I have always heard a standard of 50mgs of remaining test was the maximum...
I'll do some research on this as well, for I have no evidence to back up either claim, but there appears to be quite a contradiction here.
And yes, I agree with RG, the half lifes of the respective esters is five and six days.

Well 250 MIGHT be a tad high BUT remember a good deal of this 250 is in ester weight ...not all test bro. 250 of cyp has about 175 of actual test bro.
Clomid will have an affect if androgen levels are a little above normal(but not much) And also remember there is no penalty in starting clomid too soon anyway.

Also, something to keep in mind tis that estrogen is a little more inhibitory on HPTA than testosterone and clomid blocks the affect of estrogen at the hypothalamus.

 

[samoth]

remember a good deal of this 250 is in ester weight ...not all test bro. There might be 150 of actual test in this mix.

Excellent point, I didn't even take this into consideration.

*Edit* Just saw your own edit, thanks for further clarification.

 

[bosundave]

OK, here's my 2 sheckels worth. In a recent conversation with a former Mr. Universe and former Mr. Olympia he shared HIS(not nec. mine) opinion on cycle length. He also swears he is a product of hard training and applied science, not genetics. I've heard that one before, but his deal is this: When stacking, always stack fast acting with fast acting and slow acting with slow acting. 4 weeks on (with no anti e's, maybe some proscar) and 2 weeks off with Hcg, 5000iu per week plus clomid. Then a change of speed and type of AAS and another 4 weeks on followed by 2 weeks off with HcG and clomid. Another change of AAS and 4 weeks on followed by 4weeks off finally after the 3rd cycle.Clomid for the full 4 weeks and HcG for 2or 3 weeks. Looks like this:

4 weeks on with sim. acting AAS
2 weeks off with HcG and clomid
change type and or speedof AAS
4 weeks on with sim acting AAs
2 weeks off with Hcg and clomid
Change type and or speed of AAS
4 weeks on with sim. AAS
4 weeks off with HcG and clomid
Repeat this year round

I myself can see alot of holes in this in this scietifically, but I thought I'd throw out HIS cycle history. I didnt argue with him, but I know him well unuf that he doesn't blow smoke about what HE does. He still looks great in any case.
OK guys, tear this approach apart I am interested.

 

[bebaumax]

Actually bro I was being a bit "general" with the week thing...enanthate has a half life of about 5 days and cyp has a half life of about 6 days....
I think what you may be referring to is the time that the ester exhibits an ananbolic affect with an average dose.

RG

Ok, bro, I totally understand using rough figures to point something out, that's cool. But where do you get your half-life times from? Here's what I have:

Depot steroids Drug Active half-life
Deca-durabolin (Nandrolone decanate) 15 days
Equipoise 14 days
Finaject (trenbolone acetate) 3 days
Primobolan (methenolone enanthate) 10.5 days
Sustanon or Omnadren 15 to 18 days
Testosterone Cypionate 12 days
Testosterone Enanthate 10.5 days
Testosterone Propionate 4.5 days
Testosterone Suspension 1 day
* Winstrol (stanozolol) 1 day

From here:
Muscletalk.co.uk half-life list

Now I'm curious, as that's a pretty big discrepancy.

I'm also curious, where did you get the idea that 250mg of cyp is 175mg of test and 75mg of ester? I've never heard of this, and the idea makes no sense to me at all. It would make dosing nearly impossible, as every time someone went to calculate a dose of something, they've have to know ester weight. I thought that had already been calculated in for you. ??? Help me out here, bud.. I mean, this would be like, Test suspension 200 = more test than test cyp 250. Is that true? Thanks for all clarifications, RG!
-B

 

[Lift Chief]

OK, here's my 2 sheckels worth. In a recent conversation with a former Mr. Universe and former Mr. Olympia he shared HIS(not nec. mine) opinion on cycle length. He also swears he is a product of hard training and applied science, not genetics. I've heard that one before, but his deal is this: When stacking, always stack fast acting with fast acting and slow acting with slow acting. 4 weeks on (with no anti e's, maybe some proscar) and 2 weeks off with Hcg, 5000iu per week plus clomid. Then a change of speed and type of AAS and another 4 weeks on followed by 2 weeks off with HcG and clomid. Another change of AAS and 4 weeks on followed by 4weeks off finally after the 3rd cycle.Clomid for the full 4 weeks and HcG for 2or 3 weeks. Looks like this:

4 weeks on with sim. acting AAS
2 weeks off with HcG and clomid
change type and or speedof AAS
4 weeks on with sim acting AAs
2 weeks off with Hcg and clomid
Change type and or speed of AAS
4 weeks on with sim. AAS
4 weeks off with HcG and clomid
Repeat this year round

I myself can see alot of holes in this in this scietifically, but I thought I'd throw out HIS cycle history. I didnt argue with him, but I know him well unuf that he doesn't blow smoke about what HE does. He still looks great in any case.
OK guys, tear this approach apart I am interested.

Bump for comments on this approach. I'm also interested. I suppose this type of cycle would be for someone competing though because the time on=time off rule is not being followed.