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Tren and test cycle ?

M

musty-92

New member
Age 21 height 163cm weight 81kg sex male

My original cycle was tren 750mg & 750mg test per week
3x injections a week friday sunday tuesday repeat.
I started on friday with 250mg tren 250mg test. Its sunday now
And considering to lower my dosage to 200/200mg. Reason last night sode afeecta already kikd in like anxiety and its hard to sleep.

Thinking of injecting 3x a week 200/200mg
 
Way too much.

Try 300/wk Tren, 250/wk test
tren hits hard and you want the test lower than the tren to mitigate estrogen problems and since the tren is strong to begin with.
which tren is it, Ace? Enantate? Hex?
 
21 and taking tren? Thats not very smart mate and your dose with tren and test is far too high. Whats your pct like? And you make no mention of on cycleb support...lay out your full cycle

Sent from my GT-I9505 using EliteFitness
 
Oh shit I totally missed the age. Forget tren and steroids altogether bro. Too young
 
come on guys use common sense here. a natty 21 year old who has been training for 9 months isn't gonna be a muscular short 180 pounds.. its gonna be all fat.

we already tried to help this guy in his previous threads, he doesn't want to listen.... he will learn the hard way
 
Bf is between 22-27 . Ok full story ive lost 20kg and i wanna lose the last 10kg coz its really hard im dieting and excersing going to gym 5-6 a week
 
musty-92 said:
Bf is between 22-27 . Ok full story ive lost 20kg and i wanna lose the last 10kg coz its really hard im dieting and excersing going to gym 5-6 a week
Click to expand...

Lose the BF%. No cycle should be ran above 10%.
 
Why the fuck does everyone think roids help with weight loss and post surgery recovery?

What next? They make you taller?
 
jesus that's insane amount of tren, you ony need 300-400mg tops,,, cut the doses in half or run the risk of aborting the cycle early due to stress
 
Just stop bro you need to get atleast 15% and less bf...b smart this shit isnt a game

Sent from my GT-I9505 using EliteFitness
 
dabuffguy said:
Lose fat yes, 10% gtfo. You don't have to be that lean to cycle.
Click to expand...

10% Makes for the best lean gains with the least amount of sides. And youre correct you don't HAVE to be that lean to cycle, no shit. But it is the safest and best way to do it.
 
No offense but I thought u had to be over 21 to post on the aas section

Also there was a few studies out that showed better muscle gains around 10-12%
 
Idobehigh said:
No offense but I thought u had to be over 21 to post on the aas section

Also there was a few studies out that showed better muscle gains around 10-12%
Click to expand...

5) We do not condone advising people under the age of 21 to use AAS.
 
Just don't want to see you in trouble, I saw someone around your age giving advice on here and one of the mods made it a point for him not to do that
 
Evan Tipps said:
10% Makes for the best lean gains with the least amount of sides. And youre correct you don't HAVE to be that lean to cycle, no shit. But it is the safest and best way to do it.
Click to expand...



Says who?

That's completely illogical.

Someone at 15% vs @ 10% would make an equal amount of lean muscle gain, all else being equal. Implying that you would make less muscle gain because you are carrying an extra 10 lbs of fat is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.



Also, if you were 15% and ran tren, with some gw, you will just end up losing more total fat, and end up being nearly every bit as lean, with the same muscle gain as you would if you started at 10% bf if you diet correctly.


Obviously, we won't disagree that someone fat and out of shape has no business using steroids.
 
dabuffguy said:
Says who?

That's completely illogical.

Someone at 15% vs @ 10% would make an equal amount of lean muscle gain, all else being equal. Implying that you would make less muscle gain because you are carrying an extra 10 lbs of fat is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.



Also, if you were 15% and ran tren, with some gw, you will just end up losing more total fat, and end up being nearly every bit as lean, with the same muscle gain as you would if you started at 10% bf if you diet correctly.


Obviously, we won't disagree that someone fat and out of shape has no business using steroids.
Click to expand...

First, high endogenous estrogen levels in men come from high aromatase activity. Aromatase is the enzyme that converts androstenedione and testosterone into estrone and estradiol. Aromatase is found most prevalently in fat cells, hence the more body fat a man has, the more aromatase hence the more estrogen. When a person who has a high levels of endogenous estrogen and adds an exogenous drug that aromatizes, that person is just going to raise his estrogen levels even more and more than likely just get fatter (increase fat cells).

Moreover, excess body fat, will likely cause a spike in estrogen and return lower testosterone levels. Consequently, you are worse off than when you began the cycle because you added fat and lowered your testosterone levels. I noticed this problem is prevalent on these boards.
 
Again buddy I said you dont HAVE to be that lean to cycle, but it is the most optimal.
 
depends on your age. 15% body fat for a 40 year old is the same as a 20 year old who is 10% body fat. just the way it is for a male.

we all had 8 packs when we were younger, as you get older its not so easy as your metabolism slows down

also not everyone shreds on tren. a huge chunk of the population is insulin sensitive and will add body fat on anabolic compounds. I don't care how solid your diet is.. some guys will still gain fat on tren.. and on the flipside some guys will shred up on tren even on a shitty diet. but once you come off tren you get a boomerang effect

a perfect example of how in fitness its an individual thing and you cannot throw a big net on everyone and expect the same results. if that was true in our fitness competition everyone would have ended up like PLJ and went from looking like shit to looking like a god on a beach in Miami taking professional pics with a hottie in 16 weeks

regardless i think everyone agrees the OP after just 9 months training and very amateurish stats is far from ready to mess with an advanced compound like tren.
 
Evan Tipps said:
First, high endogenous estrogen levels in men come from high aromatase activity. Aromatase is the enzyme that converts androstenedione and testosterone into estrone and estradiol. Aromatase is found most prevalently in fat cells, hence the more body fat a man has, the more aromatase hence the more estrogen. When a person who has a high levels of endogenous estrogen and adds an exogenous drug that aromatizes, that person is just going to raise his estrogen levels even more and more than likely just get fatter (increase fat cells).

Moreover, excess body fat, will likely cause a spike in estrogen and return lower testosterone levels. Consequently, you are worse off than when you began the cycle because you added fat and lowered your testosterone levels. I noticed this problem is prevalent on these boards.
Click to expand...



Because it's impossible to use an AI, or use a non-aromatizing compound (tren being one of them).

It's really a moot point if you actually know what you're doing.
 
dabuffguy said:
Because it's impossible to use an AI, or use a non-aromatizing compound (tren being one of them).

It's really a moot point if you actually know what you're doing.
Click to expand...

Ais shouldnt be needed and can hinder gains. But I'm done talking about this, you have your opinion and I have mine!
 
stevesmi said:
regardless i think everyone agrees the OP after just 9 months training and very amateurish stats is far from ready to mess with an advanced compound like tren.
Click to expand...

Couldn't have said it better.....reminds me of Taylor Wooton, the baseball player in Texas who juiced and then killed himself. His father made MacGuire cry in the congressional steroid Mitchell Report hearings in that movie "Bigger Faster Stronger." I'm doing my 1st tren cycle and I'm about 8 cycles deep and have a degree focused on exercise physiology and nutrition. I can remember my 1st time going higher than 300 mgs of test and I felt crazy. I can't imagine being 21 on tren. I don't think some people realize how foreign some anabolic compounds are. Tren is exponentially more androgenic and anabolic than test.

Keep us posted kid!
 
Idobehigh said:
Woow sense when can an ai hinder gains? To much of an ai yes but not a low dose of an ai...
Click to expand...

Using an aromatase inhibitor, estrogen levels still remain low, as we are actively preventing the body from doing what it's trying to do. That means the body will keep signaling for more estrogen while waiting for the testosterone levels to reduce. There's truth that aromatase inhibitors make the body want to produce MORE aromatase, since it's not seeing the estrogen production increase that it's looking for. There's also potential for ending up with too little estrogen. Both of these scenarios can result in a rebound type effect where once the aromatase inhibitor is stopped, the body stays in overdrive trying to make estrogen, which cause levels to spike.
 
Evan Tipps said:
Using an aromatase inhibitor, estrogen levels still remain low, as we are actively preventing the body from doing what it's trying to do. That means the body will keep signaling for more estrogen while waiting for the testosterone levels to reduce. There's truth that aromatase inhibitors make the body want to produce MORE aromatase, since it's not seeing the estrogen production increase that it's looking for. There's also potential for ending up with too little estrogen. Both of these scenarios can result in a rebound type effect where once the aromatase inhibitor is stopped, the body stays in overdrive trying to make estrogen, which cause levels to spike.
Click to expand...

If one runs a-dex on (a blocker) and exemestane off (a suicide inhibitor), you're usually good to go. But when discussing endocrinology everybody is different.
 
Evan Tipps said:
Ais shouldnt be needed and can hinder gains. But I'm done talking about this, you have your opinion and I have mine!
Click to expand...



But you expressed concern about too much aromatase with higher bf being your reasoning for saying you should only cycle with low bf, an ai solves that concern.

Don't write it off as opinion-based differences without significance because you didn't think it all the way through.

The reason I even say anything is because something absurd was said and needed to be fixed. I'm not looking to start a pissing match, I just want rational, logical, accurate advice and comments being given. I encourage the discussion, no need to "be done" about anything.
 
if you are stacking 8 things and 2 of them are DHT's then those can serve as an AI.

but a newb running test 500mg a week the first time should definately be running an AI from start to finish no questions asked. if gains get affected then so be it. not worth getting gyno or going into pct with high estrogen levels

Aromasin is perfect.. letro is too harsh. there is a balance that you need.
 
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