Things are getting dangerous: Thousands of illegal criminal immigrants march in Illinois demanding amnesty!

[mrplunkey]

Only in the US. How come we dont see illegals doing stuff like that here ? Oh wait, we kick them out !

I agree that as a group, illegals do less crime than other people in their socioeconomic class precisely *because* they don't want to be discovered and kicked-out.

Sure, illegals do crime, but compare their rates to their socioeconomic equals -- don't compare them to a bunch of US doctors and lawyers. I bet it's lower, but I doubt you could even do a study to prove it.

 

[DJ_UFO]

I posted this on another thread to, but it bears repeating here:
-------------------------------------------------------------
As far as all these anti-illegals and anti-immigration threads. Good luck, but even good luck isn't going to help you. Your fighting INCREDIBLE economic forces as well as fighting against the single fastest-growing voting group in the US -- LEGAL latinos.

The good news is, all this high-profile "send them home" crap is doing a great job galvinizing the the legal, voting latinos. This way, instead of integrating them as Americans, we can transform them into single-issue voters and let them vote in blocks. Good work!

That's what we need... a fastest-growing segment of galvinized, single-issue, high-turnout voters.

what you say is completely true, and at the same time is my worst fear. Right now we are heading that route for sure, thanks to politicians and thanks also to millions of Americans that do nothing or say nothing about it just because they don't feel affected by this issue. And as always I repeat. The day you find out we have a problem, will be too late. You'll be pwned by yourself.

 

[mrplunkey]

what you say is completely true, and at the same time is my worst fear. Right now we are heading that route for sure, thanks to politicians and thanks also to millions of Americans that do nothing or say nothing about it just because they don't feel affected by this issue. And as always I repeat. The day you find out we have a problem, will be too late. You'll be pwned by yourself.

Anytime you single-out a group of people based on a common characteristic, you are giving them a group identity. It doesn't matter if its the color of their skin, the religion they practice, the or the vice they participate in.

Now... once you give these people a group identity, deciding something needs to be "done" about them turns them into victims. Overnight, they become the oppressed... the downtrodden. "Opressed" people mobilize. "Opressed" people vote. "Opressed" people become politically active.

The legal latin population is by far the fastest growing population segment in our country. As they become Americans, we want them doing what the majority of other americans do: Display a broad array of political interests. We want them concerned about the economy... taxes... their children's education... foreign policy... abortion... the role of religion in society. Instead, all these "kick them illegals out" people are going to turn them into single-issue voters. Then, instead of participating in the political process in a balanced way, they'll become a voting block. Then, as a voting block, the politicians will line-up to see who can suck the latino voting block's political cock the best. Is that what you really want? If so, keep pounding away because that will be the end result.

Sad thing is... the "send them home" crowd will be howling louder than ever as politicians pander to these people harder than ever -- and the "send them home" people won't even have a clue that it was their efforts that made all this possible.

Nothing like a good enemy to galvanize a people. Hell, I wish we had the USSR back.

 

[juiceddreadlocks]

say it with me folks... "things will never be as good as they once were"


Okay, I hate people with that attitude. Even more I hate freeloaders.

 

[DJ_UFO]

Anytime you single-out a group of people based on a common characteristic, you are giving them a group identity. It doesn't matter if its the color of their skin, the religion they practice, the or the vice they participate in.

Now... once you give these people a group identity, deciding something needs to be "done" about them turns them into victims. Overnight, they become the oppressed... the downtrodden. "Opressed" people mobilize. "Opressed" people vote. "Opressed" people become politically active.

The legal latin population is by far the fastest growing population segment in our country. As they become Americans, we want them doing what the majority of other americans do: Display a broad array of political interests. We want them concerned about the economy... taxes... their children's education... foreign policy... abortion... the role of religion in society. Instead, all these "kick them illegals out" people are going to turn them into single-issue voters. Then, instead of participating in the political process in a balanced way, they'll become a voting block. Then, as a voting block, the politicians will line-up to see who can suck the latino voting block's political cock the best. Is that what you really want? If so, keep pounding away because that will be the end result.

Sad thing is... the "send them home" crowd will be howling louder than ever as politicians pander to these people harder than ever -- and the "send them home" people won't even have a clue that it was their efforts that made all this possible.

Nothing like a good enemy to galvanize a people. Hell, I wish we had the USSR back.

yeah I know what you're sayin but according to that what would be the solution? Open the borders and let them come here just to get the rest of the legals inserted into the American system? NO WAY!

The problem here, is a legal issue. Illegal is Illegal everywhere. Nobody is talking about legal latinos. But supporting a crime, makes you part of it. In this case, if legal latinos support the illegals, then we have a serious moral problem but the only single victim in that case is The United States of America. Under my values, a person supporting a criime is a piece of shit! and if we are going to have a single-issue voters composed by piece of shit people, sad for this nation. Sacrificing our values, giving a horrible example to the world, is not an option.

 

[mrplunkey]

yeah I know what you're sayin but according to that what would be the solution? Open the borders and let them come here just to get the rest of the legals inserted into the American system? NO WAY!

The problem here, is a legal issue. Illegal is Illegal everywhere. Nobody is talking about legal latinos. But supporting a crime, makes you part of it. In this case, if legal latinos support the illegals, then we have a serious moral problem but the only single victim in that case is The United States of America. Under my values, a person supporting a criime is a piece of shit! and if we are going to have a single-issue voters composed by piece of shit people, sad for this nation. Sacrificing our values, giving a horrible example to the world, is not an option.

Here's the solution:

Mexican immigrants need a legal way to work in the United States. They shouldn't be granted citizenship quickly, nor should they recieve the full measure of US benefits. It needs to be a glorified "day workers" program.

Then, after they have an established track record, give them a citizenship procedure that isn't trivial, but that the law-abiding, hard-working immigrants can complete. I'm fine with criminalizing, detaining, and/or deporting the ones who commit real crimes.

After the processes mentioned above are in-place (and not a second before), then prosecute the employers who go outside the process. Fine them on a per illegal - per hour worked basis, and make the fine hefty.

It would be an easy fix, but it requires the "send thum foreigners out of Umarrika" to compromise. It also requires the "let them in fancy free" group to compromise as well.

 

[DJ_UFO]

Here's the solution:

Mexican immigrants need a legal way to work in the United States. They shouldn't be granted citizenship quickly, nor should they recieve the full measure of US benefits. It needs to be a glorified "day workers" program.

Then, after they have an established track record, give them a citizenship procedure that isn't trivial, but that the law-abiding, hard-working immigrants can complete. I'm fine with criminalizing, detaining, and/or deporting the ones who commit real crimes.

After the processes mentioned above are in-place (and not a second before), then prosecute the employers who go outside the process. Fine them on a per illegal - per hour worked basis, and make the fine hefty.

It would be an easy fix, but it requires the "send thum foreigners out of Umarrika" to compromise. It also requires the "let them in fancy free" group to compromise as well.

ok but even if you establish that system. What would you do with those that still cross illegaly without any legal way to work here? THEY WILL NOT STOP. Isn't that enough crime?

 

[mrplunkey]

ok but even if you establish that system. What would you do with those that still cross illegaly without any legal way to work here? THEY WILL NOT STOP. Isn't that enough crime?

That's easy. You have to go after the source of demand. Not the supply.

Let's say roofer XYZ gets busted with a roofing crew of 8 illegal workers. You go back to him and say, we think you've employed this crew for approximately 4 months.

That's 4 months x 30 days/month x 8 guys x 40 / hour = $38,400 please

Then use the proceeds to fund additional enforcement actions.

This isn't a supply-side problem. There will always be someone willing to scale a wall, climb a fence, tunnel under a barrier... as long as the economics support doing so.

That's what strikes me as ridiculous about marajuana. If they really want to eliminate it, allocate $100B from "the war on drugs" and build some really massive prisons. Then, make possession or use of marjuana a 40 year crime without the possiblity of parole. Why not just lock 'em up and be done with it?

 

[chewyxrage]

Re: Things are getting dangerous: Thousands of illegal criminal immigrants march in I

That's what strikes me as ridiculous about marajuana. If they really want to eliminate it, allocate $100B from "the war on drugs" and build some really massive prisons. Then, make possession or use of marjuana a 40 year crime without the possiblity of parole. Why not just lock 'em up and be done with it?

Lock people up for possession of a plant, sure, why not. Fuck while we're at it we should do the same thing for speeders.

 

[mrplunkey]

Re: Things are getting dangerous: Thousands of illegal criminal immigrants march in I

Lock people up for possession of a plant, sure, why not. Fuck while we're at it we should do the same thing for speeders.

I agree! I mean... after all... it's all ILLEGAL -- just like those illegal aliens crossing our borders!

P.S. Chewy... in case you missed it, I was countering the argument that we should boot-out all these illegal mexican workers simply because they are breaking the law. By looking at other relatively minor infractions such as marajuana and speeding, I was making a counter argument. I'm guessing you missed that part

Now... as far as my real views? I'm a conservative libertarian with relatively liberal social views. I don't really give a shit if you want to smoke dope, bang your great dane or hire an illegal mexican to scrub your toilets.

P.S.S. Chewy -- cite the relative harmlessness of marajuana, not the fact that it's "a plant". Cocaine and heroine come from plants too and those drugs can be hella dangerous!