Please Please Help My Hams!!!

[fitmedic]

I guess I need to take my own advice and be patient but geez. I have tried everything it seems ..from diet to heavy, heavy legs to seriously deep squats to lunges to dumbell curls to glute ham raises and I can not get these things to repsond. How much diet is legs?? I tried strict carb rotating I didn't see a difference. Can someone give me -in laymen's terms- the gist of carb rotating. (please don't say, "do a search, or read this thread", I already have) More carbs=more muscle or less carbs=more muscle? I tried to figure it out my self by actually rotating and researching here on Elite but to no avail. Am I forever genetically void of hams? Oddly enough I have no problem anywhere else. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[vinylgroover]

What will diet or carb rotation do for your hams. You either have muscle there or you don't. What is your training like?

Carbs are ESSENTIAL for building muscle as is protein. Everyone seems to be on low carb diets these days which i don't understand when trying to build muscle, particularly if you are not using steroids.

Try prioritising hams in your workouts for a little while by doing them before quads if you do them on leg day.

Do 4 sets of stiff leg dead lifts, followed by 3 sets of lying leg curls and then get into your quad work. Try doing negatives. Negatives seem to work well for hams.

 

[BrickGirl]

If you are wanting to build up muscle quickly, Lift Heavy, eat Plenty of protein, eat Plenty of carbs, eat Plenty of fat, Give yourself plenty of time to put it on and quit looking in the mirror about that little extra love handle and put on some size, when you diet down correctly, the muscle will be there

 

[makedah]

Good mornings? Pull-throughs?

 

[THeMaCHinE]

hypers? reverse hypers?

I'm not sure if you wanted this, but here's a decent article on hamstring training:

http://www.testosterone.net/nation_articles/237pain2.html

 

[Serenity Head]

Biggest trouble with my women clients seems to be the lack of mind-body control. When I do my hams they feel like they are going to tear off the bone. Before and after you work outs take time to flex, squeeze and control your leg contractions, you want them to almost cramp up. Then this will relate into better work outs in future. Also try and go to failure on every set, of course don't put yourself in harms way, but try to when you can!
I have seen amazing results with this technique.

 

[fitmedic]

What will carb rot. do for hams directly...i don't know. Nothing apparently, if you look at mine. I have been on the NHE pan for 8 weeks now. About 20-30g carbs and high pro and fat/ day. Im gonna try something else-diet wise-cause that doesn't seem to have helped. I'll try prioritizing vinyl and see how that helps. And BG, define "plenty." Are you saying don't worry about the fat that will appear on my legs or stomach just pack on size then diet the fat away? What are pull thru's, hypers and reverse hypers? I see everyone talking about them but not sure what they are or how to do 'em. Serenity, maybe that is also part of my problem. I'm not feeling too much of a contraction when I do hams. It's really hard to find the exact place to feel that good squeeze..or cramp. lol. So does that mean I'm wasting my time? Thanks to all for taking the time to post.

 

[THeMaCHinE]

fit --

If you are not familiar with execution of a couple of the exercises, click on that article link I posted; it has full descriptions and pics of a number of good hamstring exercises.

 

[fitmedic]

And to The Machine, you were right, that was a fantastic article on ham training. The photos were very helpful. It's printing as I type this. Thanks!!

 

[vinylgroover]

Focus on your training FM. You need to build the muscle before you can 'diet' to reveal it.

Hyperextensions as follows

http://www.weightliftingdiscussion.com/hyperextension.html

Primarily a lower back exercise which also stresses the hams.

Reverse Hypers:

http://www.fitrex.com/fitness_info/exercise1039.html

Both are fine although can be tricky if your gym doesn't have the right equipment.

Why not concentrate on stiff leg deadlifts, leg curls and lunges and even leg press (with feet high up on the platform). Don't perform all in one workout, mix them up.

 

[THeMaCHinE]

And to The Machine, you were right, that was a fantastic article on ham training. The photos were very helpful. It's printing as I type this. Thanks!!

You bet! I tried to reply to your PM, but your box was full...

 

[fl8meplz]

Hey fitmedic, try this as I had the same problems and it worked for me. It's kind of a bizarre superset but I hope it helps you.

You have to completly exhaust your hams on lying leg curls first, so do this:

2 sets to failure with just enough weight so you fail around 20 reps on your first set.
- rest no more than 1 minute -
Keep the weight the same and do a set where you don't straighten your legs all the way out for 10 then after the tenth 'mini-curl' finish the set out to failure curling the full range.
- rest 1 minute -
Do 1 more set to failure.

Next you are going to put more weight on a 45 degree leg press than you could do a full press with. You will do very shallow presses and try to shoot for 100 reps. You should feel this in your exhausted hamstrings first, then your ass.
- rest 1 minute -
Do another set of leg curls to exhaustion - have someone spot you and do a forced rep or two.
- no rest -
Move your feet a tad furter apart than before and do another set of shallow leg presses and try for 70 reps. You will feel this more in your ass this time. You should be seeing jelly worms and stars at the end of this set.
- rest 1 minute -
Now alternate doing hyperextensions and traveling lunges for two sets each.

When you are done, you should be wiped out. Be sure to eat.

 

[Serenity Head]

What will carb rot. do for hams directly...i don't know. Nothing apparently, if you look at mine. I have been on the NHE pan for 8 weeks now. About 20-30g carbs and high pro and fat/ day. Im gonna try something else-diet wise-cause that doesn't seem to have helped. I'll try prioritizing vinyl and see how that helps. And BG, define "plenty." Are you saying don't worry about the fat that will appear on my legs or stomach just pack on size then diet the fat away? What are pull thru's, hypers and reverse hypers? I see everyone talking about them but not sure what they are or how to do 'em. Serenity, maybe that is also part of my problem. I'm not feeling too much of a contraction when I do hams. It's really hard to find the exact place to feel that good squeeze..or cramp. lol. So does that mean I'm wasting my time? Thanks to all for taking the time to post.

1.) I didn't say you would feel the squeeze right away...it takes time and dedication. One of the best exercises is to just stand straight up and attempt to flex the ham while your foot on the ground. This is why you see bodybuilders put their hands on their hams on stage to feel if the ham is tight. It is one of the hardests muscles to gain control of. I personally have found that through my demonstrations as a trainer I get enormous squeezes in the exercises I am demonstrating to begginers even though I have little/no weight on machine.

2. I would not recommend the deadlift the way they had it in the picture, I would hang the bar with hands, being sure to stick your but out and only use your hams to pull it up, this is where muscular control becomes important.

3. If I were you I would do the following:You have option to have a leg split or to do a full leg day.
Prefatigue Hams: Ham curls 2 sets 20 reps as warmup
Squats: 4 sets 8-12 reps
One legged leg sled: 4 sets 10-15 reps
Ham Curls(Could use modified version in article): 5 sets 15,12,10,8,20 reps
Lunges: 3 sets to failure
Standing leg curl: 2 sets-20 reps go for that tight squeeze.

Can use alternate lifts week by week, but I personally always keep at least one of the squats or leg sleds in there.


A million people will tell you a million things, my advice is pick one and use it...you can add variation but try to keep a 3 month plan.
I think you will see awesome results if in 3 months you can make that hamstring "cramp" on demand....Goood Luck

 

[fitmedic]

spatts and makedah mentioned pull throughs. can someone please 'splain it to me?? fl8, how flat were your hams? that sounds like a brutal ham workout. i will definitely try it along with what serenity has posted. should i change my ham workout everytime I do them which now is 1x/week.

 

[fl8meplz]

my hams were flat as bacon. now they are starting to look like biceps.

 

[SteelWeaver]

Damn! Both those workouts sound brutal! I've heard here and there that hams are usually made up of predominantly fast-twitch fibres, and thus can be worked in a lower rep range. But I guess the key is to keep switching things up every now and then.

Pull-throughs: stand with your back to a low cable stack, legs spread a bit wider than shoulder width (or wider if you like) with a rope or leather straps attached to the cable. Bend down and grab the rope between your legs - yes, you WILL get stares whenever you do this move in the gym. Now walk forward a bit to increase the tension on the cable, then straighten up, pulling the cable up between your legs. You'll end up with the rope handles um .... basically just below your groin, depending how long your arms are, lol. The move is like a GM in reverse - with a GM you start vertical and bend down, then come back up. With this you start bent down, stand up, then bend down again. Same form requirements - back, abs tight, slight bend in knees, etc etc.

These, along with heavy SLDL's and some GM's gave me some nice improvements in my hams. I even did drop sets on pull-thoughs a few times. OMG! Lately I've been doing SLDL's not straightening up all the way to vertical - stopping about 30 degrees from the top - this keeps the tension on the hams and butt - OW!

I've noticed that heavier isn't always better.

As for mind-muscle, try flexing your hams whilst sitting around at work, or whatever you're doing.

 

[MR. BMJ]

Was that you Spatt's?

I've never even thought about hitting hams in that format. I'll have to give them a try. However, should the person be moving so quickly? I'd probably do it a little slower....whattya say eh?

BMJ

 

[fitmedic]

carbs

ok, what's the deal-in laymen's term-with carbs... hi carbs=more muscle or low carbs=more muscle... im confused. BTW, what type of handle is being used w/pull thru's??

 

[slinky]

Mainstay for ham/glutes: Good mornings. Will throw in reverse hypers for good measure. Also, glute-ham raises - THESE are amazing.

After a workout, I'll consume a shake that is made up of dextrose and maltodextrin and some protein powder and also creatine. It's best to consume a high GI carb for recovery purposes after a grueling workout. I even do the same after a boxing workout. Works beautifully for me!

 

[Nonerz]

PULL-THROUGHS

check out that hip drive!!!

 

[fitmedic]

slinky, what kind of glute-ham raises are /were you doing? apparently there are variations...

 

[slinky]

Yeah, on the floor.

I use my glute/hams to control the fall (make sure your hands/palms are out, too. Need them to "cushion" the fall to the ground). You will not need anytype of weight plate. Especially when beginning to do this exercise.
My boyfriend keeps my feet pinned to the ground - as we don't have the right apparatus and we've tried using a barbell with a couple of 45's, but that doesn't work as well.

I love these. These and good mornings are all that I do for my ham/glutes anymore.

 

[slinky]

Hi spatts!

Here, check this out (I view the following w/Real Player)
www.i-a-r-t.com/articles/quickresponse.html

Watch how this guy, Adam Archuleta performs his glute-ham raises. THIS is how I eventually want to be doing them. Overall, this video is amazing!

 

[SofaGeorge]

Fitmedic,
I've added 2 inches onto my thighs in the last few months. The basis for my hamstring routine is... SPRINTS.

I run 5 sets of 200 yards in the grass before I go to the gym. (The I start my gym work with 5 sets of 5 on squats.)

I trained at Gold's Venice for 10 years. I know many of the top pro bodybuilders... male and female. Many of the old guard swear by sprints as the top hamstring builder for mass.

I will admit sprints worked for me... much better than leg curls ever could.

 

[fitmedic]

HOLY HAMSTRINGS SOFAGEORGE...2 INCHES??!! ARE YOU FOR REAL?? Tell me about your sprints. I know there are different variations. You obvioulsy aren't talking about arpints on the elliptical.

 

[MR. BMJ]

Charles Poliquin has stated many times that athletes and bodybuilders should incoporate some form of sprints into their workouts for developing the hammies. If you look at most sprinters, they have decent sized thighs.

BMJ

 

[SofaGeorge]

HOLY HAMSTRINGS SOFAGEORGE...2 INCHES??!! ARE YOU FOR REAL?? Tell me about your sprints. I know there are different variations. You obvioulsy aren't talking about arpints on the elliptical.

My leg routne is posted on the training board... mostly designed by Night Fly and Spatts. They designed it when I asked for help on gaining leg size.

I do my Sprints on grass... five sets... top speed. I started out running for as fast as I could for 15 seconds... worked up to 23-27. (Sprints are just like weigth lifting sets. You have more speed/reps on your first one or two sets... then you start to drop.)

It takes about 15 minutes with rest (rest is walking around the park) and makes a great warm up into leg day. I walk to the gym after sprints.

Try to run on grass. It is harder at first but it definitely gives you a better sprint work out... and saves your shins.

 

[fitmedic]

sofageorge, when you say 2oo yards of 5 sets do you mean 2oo yards up and back is one set? how many days week do youdo sprints? or do you only do them on leg day? and you got hams with this routine not just quads??

 

[SteelWeaver]

Mmm, I gotta try this. Pity I hate sprints so much. But lucky my motivation for bigger legs is higher than any hate for anything, heh he.

FM - SF said he's going on holiday for a week, so he probably won't answer this right away. But I'm sure spatts will - sprint queen deluxe Damn, for a piece of her ham!

 

[SofaGeorge]

sofageorge, when you say 2oo yards of 5 sets do you mean 2oo yards up and back is one set? how many days week do youdo sprints? or do you only do them on leg day? and you got hams with this routine not just quads??

I run apx 200 meters...then walk leisurely around the park back to start... takes me about 3 minutes to walk back... that's my rest.

My advice is... don't think about distance... think about time. Figure out how long you can maintain top effort. I can maintain top effort for 23-27 seconds... in that range. I use the distance that I can cover in 23-27 seconds as the distance for my sprints.

Usually my breakdown looks like this:

1st sprint 23 sec
2nd sprint 23-24 sec
3rd sprint 25 sec
4th sprint 27 sec
5th sprint 27 sec

All sprints are the same distance with a 2-3 minute rest period in between. I could use a 60-90 second rest period just as easily... but the walk around my particular park takes about 3 minutes.

I've read many sprint training routines. Some have you run 10 sets of shorter sprints. Some go for 3 sets of longer sprints. For me... 5 sets seems best.

Right now I only sprint on leg day once a week... but I think I could easily sprint twice a week without over training. Many training routines I've read for sprint runners have them sprinting 3-5 days a week.

(I'd right more but I am on vacation and getting computer time is tough.)

 

[fitmedic]

SG, ok thanks for the advice. I won't worry with distance since I have no way to measure it anyway. I'll start with doing sprints on leg day since any more may be over training. Anyone else please feel free to post your ham workouts.