Not another Oil Thread...

[mountain muscle]

this thread is worthless without answers

The Democrats have atleast 3
1. Cellulose Ethanol
2. Fuel Cell
3. Biodeisel

Do the democrats have an answer for the cost of conversion to those fuel sources as well? What to do during the transition period?

 

[gjohnson5]

The democrats? What???

The democrats are the ones holding-up the construction of ethanol plants until union bosses are paid. Just try to get a minor source emissions permit ANYWHERE in the midwest until a PLA (Project Labor Agreement) is in place. You'll get one... sometime between 2015 and 2018.

Nonsense....
Companies such as ADM and Cargill build when they choose and how they choose. Democrats and Republicans have nothing to do with that. These companies already have the permits they need because they are already in operation

 

[gjohnson5]

Do the democrats have an answer for the cost of conversion to those fuel sources as well? What to do during the transition period?

2 of them are already in use...
Gasoline in many big cities is already mixed with 10% ethanol

The third is the fuel cell technology is still in the works technology wise

 

[mountain muscle]

Nonsense....
Companies such as ADM and Cargill build when they choose and how they choose. Democrats and Republicans have nothing to do with that. These companies already have the permits they need because they are already in operation

Who has held up the building of a new oil refinery since 1979? Who opposes building more nuclear power plants?

 

[gjohnson5]

This is the new technology. When we can create ethanol from cellulose which is the most abundant plant chemical on earth , then the supply issue is out the window

We need this in America
http://www.iogen.ca/

 

[mrplunkey]

Nonsense....
Companies such as ADM and Cargill build when they choose and how they choose. Democrats and Republicans have nothing to do with that. These companies already have the permits they need because they are already in operation

No, dry mill ethanol plants (the most efficient and cost-effective flavor we have now) are considered minor sources up to 100 Million gallons/year. At 150+M gallons a year they are considered major sources. You have to get an air permit to build one of these plants even if you are ADM, Cargill, Fagan, Lurgi PSI, Delta-T, etc. etc.

What the democrats across the midwest have done is attach a PLA to every air emissions permit. It works well because you have to agree to all-union labor, which jacks the price of a 100M gallon/year plant from about 140M to about 165M. Then they get you your air permit, point you toward between $5M and $10M of taxpayer money for grants, and try to lure you with other perks like enterprise zones.

The mainstream media will *never* report the damage democrats and all of their associated payoffs cost taxpayers and the nation in general.

 

[mrplunkey]

Oh, and back to your original comment -- expanding an existing plant still requires re-permitting. Any application will beg the democrat/union driven question -- "Do you have a PLA in place?".

Also... around 150M to 200M gallons, you experience some dis-economies of scale (even beyond sucking-up all the corn in the area). It's better to just build another plant somewhere else. There are lots of issues even beyond the air permit then -- a lot of normally shop-fabricated items like your DDGS dryer have to be field-erected instead and that *really* jacks-up the cost.

 

[gjohnson5]

No, dry mill ethanol plants (the most efficient and cost-effective flavor we have now) are considered minor sources up to 100 Million gallons/year. At 150+M gallons a year they are considered major sources. You have to get an air permit to build one of these plants even if you are ADM, Cargill, Fagan, Lurgi PSI, Delta-T, etc. etc.

What the democrats across the midwest have done is attach a PLA to every air emissions permit. It works well because you have to agree to all-union labor, which jacks the price of a 100M gallon/year plant from about 140M to about 165M. Then they get you your air permit, point you toward between $5M and $10M of taxpayer money for grants, and try to lure you with other perks like enterprise zones.

The mainstream media will *never* report the damage democrats and all of their associated payoffs cost taxpayers and the nation in general.

Not sure , but it sounds like blanket Replublican propoganda at best
Here are the permit rules in Nebraska and no such restriction is mentioned

http://www.deq.state.ne.us/Publica....3234ef46ff9e372a06256cef00743a18?OpenDocument

 

[gjohnson5]

PLA's are not limited to unions either. Any contractor qualifies

 

[mrplunkey]

PLA's are not limited to unions either. Any contractor qualifies

ROFL! And technically collective barganing isn't exclusive to unions either. Any group of employees can engage in "protected, concerted activity" -- but guess what percentage of this activity is union-sponsored or union-supervised?