Also, look at the most muscular ronnie looks way freakier that jay does, chest is more striated, the rectus femoris looks more defined, and look at jays arms, no wherre as vascular as ronnies. then look at the front lat spread, right off the bat jays abs ruin it, also notice this (its genetic but it still takes away from jays physique) his abdomen is so long that it makes his chest and especially his legs look short, while ronnie has a fairly short abdomen and it makes his chest, arms and legs, most importantly , long which makes him look better and not looking stocky like jay. Arnold had the same thing, a short abdomen and that made his chest look even longr than it was. i could go on but i think thats enough to say that jay did not come as close as people made it out to be. sorry for the rant.