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A special tribute to Matt from our Isreali friends
- Thread starter milo hobgoblin
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Re: Re: Re: well thats a start
No one will argue that Catholicism or Christinaity is dogmatic. The question then centers around Judaism.
The central belief of Judaism is the existence of God. All of the 613 laws flow from this. Jews consider God as indivisible - Christians don't agree.
Jews also believe that we are created in God's image, but that we cannot really know God - it is beyond the humanly knowable. The 613 laws are insight into God, but he cannot be "known".
Christians take another tack - Jesus is God, and since he appeared in human form, he is obviously knowable. Not only do Christians feel he is knowable, but they believe that he must be accepted as the singluar way to salvation.
Here again Chrsitianity diverges from Judaism. Jews do not believe in life after death in the traditional sense, so dogmatic behavior is worthless. The righteous - according to Jews - will be raised up at the end of the world - but (again another divergence) you DO NOT have to be Jew is to be righteous and therefore raised up.
Without this requirement of "strict adherence" that is present in Chrstianity, there is no dogma. Since a non-Jew can be considered righteous, and a non-Jew would not even have heard of the 613 laws, strict adherence, dogma - the heart of Christianty, is again absent in Judaism.
Lastly, because the 613 laws are guidleines, but not answers, about God, the laws are inherently designed to be studied and commented on. In this way, Judaism promotes rational thought.
Scholars such as Maimonides (and numerous others) have compiled these commentaries over time, and they have become part of the Jewish religion as the Talmud, the Zohar, etc. Can you imagine a contemtporary Christian scholar having his works added to the Bible? Of course not....
I'm giving you the basics. The differences are legion....and if you read more about Judaism you might see that rational thought has a firm place in it.
Lest we forget........
The idea of the "chosen people" does not mean Jews consider themselves "better". It means that they try to live their lives as an example to others. Jews do not seek converts, so they are not trying to grow the club. If someone does convert, then they are treated the same as if they were born Jewish. It isn't a closed club or "chosen" in the sense of the Protestant "elect". "Chosen" means that they have made a deicsion to follow certain laws and to act a certain way which they believe is correct in accordance with their religion.
atlantabiolab said:
No one will argue that Catholicism or Christinaity is dogmatic. The question then centers around Judaism.
The central belief of Judaism is the existence of God. All of the 613 laws flow from this. Jews consider God as indivisible - Christians don't agree.
Jews also believe that we are created in God's image, but that we cannot really know God - it is beyond the humanly knowable. The 613 laws are insight into God, but he cannot be "known".
Christians take another tack - Jesus is God, and since he appeared in human form, he is obviously knowable. Not only do Christians feel he is knowable, but they believe that he must be accepted as the singluar way to salvation.
Here again Chrsitianity diverges from Judaism. Jews do not believe in life after death in the traditional sense, so dogmatic behavior is worthless. The righteous - according to Jews - will be raised up at the end of the world - but (again another divergence) you DO NOT have to be Jew is to be righteous and therefore raised up.
Without this requirement of "strict adherence" that is present in Chrstianity, there is no dogma. Since a non-Jew can be considered righteous, and a non-Jew would not even have heard of the 613 laws, strict adherence, dogma - the heart of Christianty, is again absent in Judaism.
Lastly, because the 613 laws are guidleines, but not answers, about God, the laws are inherently designed to be studied and commented on. In this way, Judaism promotes rational thought.
Scholars such as Maimonides (and numerous others) have compiled these commentaries over time, and they have become part of the Jewish religion as the Talmud, the Zohar, etc. Can you imagine a contemtporary Christian scholar having his works added to the Bible? Of course not....
I'm giving you the basics. The differences are legion....and if you read more about Judaism you might see that rational thought has a firm place in it.
Lest we forget........
The idea of the "chosen people" does not mean Jews consider themselves "better". It means that they try to live their lives as an example to others. Jews do not seek converts, so they are not trying to grow the club. If someone does convert, then they are treated the same as if they were born Jewish. It isn't a closed club or "chosen" in the sense of the Protestant "elect". "Chosen" means that they have made a deicsion to follow certain laws and to act a certain way which they believe is correct in accordance with their religion.
milo hobgoblin
New member
...
Actually Zionist are capitialist... Nazi were National Socialists..
although they may practice Social Policy that is very reminescent (sp?) of that german National Socialst regime...
I think Isreal's treatment of Palestinians would even make Hitler proud. (that was for you Matt)
Actually Zionist are capitialist... Nazi were National Socialists..
although they may practice Social Policy that is very reminescent (sp?) of that german National Socialst regime...
I think Isreal's treatment of Palestinians would even make Hitler proud. (that was for you Matt)
Lao Tzu
New member
Re: ...
yeah almost 2000 have died in 3 years, a large sum of them enemy combatants. That blows the shit out of Hitlers murder of 11 million people for making bad slaves or belonging to the wrong religion/race/country/idealogy.
I think the Jordanians killed more palestinians in a few months of war in the 60s than the Israelis have in 50 years.
Milo Hobgoblin said:
I think Isreal's treatment of Palestinians would even make Hitler proud. (that was for you Matt)
yeah almost 2000 have died in 3 years, a large sum of them enemy combatants. That blows the shit out of Hitlers murder of 11 million people for making bad slaves or belonging to the wrong religion/race/country/idealogy.
I think the Jordanians killed more palestinians in a few months of war in the 60s than the Israelis have in 50 years.
primetime21
Banned
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: well thats a start
I was just proving your inexperienced interpretation of the old testament. If you think you can read the old testament and understand what the meaning of all the terms and phrases without at least a decade or two of hard study you are wrong. There are hundreds of experts going back thousands of years who have disagreed on almost every sentence of the old testament. It was not meant to be literally read. For example, the term an eye for an eye. Only a fool would think that that statement should be taken literally.
If you ever went out and bought a jewish bible. You willl normally see commentaries surrounding each and every paragraph. These are the interpretations of the meaning of EACH AND EVERY sentence in the bible by the top scholars of their era. And that is only the tip of the iceberg. Again, taking anything stated in the bible, the jewish talmud or many other ancient jewish texts is shortsided.
The bible was never meant to be read literally. In fact, when jews study the bible, they spend very little time studying the words of the bible, rather they spend 99 percent of the time studying the commentaries to see what the meaning of the bible really is.
atlantabiolab said:
I was just proving your inexperienced interpretation of the old testament. If you think you can read the old testament and understand what the meaning of all the terms and phrases without at least a decade or two of hard study you are wrong. There are hundreds of experts going back thousands of years who have disagreed on almost every sentence of the old testament. It was not meant to be literally read. For example, the term an eye for an eye. Only a fool would think that that statement should be taken literally.
If you ever went out and bought a jewish bible. You willl normally see commentaries surrounding each and every paragraph. These are the interpretations of the meaning of EACH AND EVERY sentence in the bible by the top scholars of their era. And that is only the tip of the iceberg. Again, taking anything stated in the bible, the jewish talmud or many other ancient jewish texts is shortsided.
The bible was never meant to be read literally. In fact, when jews study the bible, they spend very little time studying the words of the bible, rather they spend 99 percent of the time studying the commentaries to see what the meaning of the bible really is.
S
satchboogie
Guest
gefiltifish rules!
Re: ...
dude...your credibility as a rational thinker on this issue is dropping faster than FromZero on his skydiving adventure.
More Palestinians have been killed in car accidents the last 5 years than by Israelis.
Jordanians and Syrians have killed considerably more Palestinians than Israel has since its inception.
I was happy to discuss this with you rationally, but doesn't seem like you're up for it. Take your ax and grind it elsewhere. You've lost my ear on this topic.
Milo Hobgoblin said:
I think Isreal's treatment of Palestinians would even make Hitler proud. (that was for you Matt)
dude...your credibility as a rational thinker on this issue is dropping faster than FromZero on his skydiving adventure.
More Palestinians have been killed in car accidents the last 5 years than by Israelis.
Jordanians and Syrians have killed considerably more Palestinians than Israel has since its inception.
I was happy to discuss this with you rationally, but doesn't seem like you're up for it. Take your ax and grind it elsewhere. You've lost my ear on this topic.
BodyByFinaplix
Banned
Wow this stupid thread is still going???
milo hobgoblin
New member
...
I was kidding Matt... I stopped posting on this thread days ago.
I was kidding Matt... I stopped posting on this thread days ago.
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