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- Thread starter scoe25
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ego boner
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Ego Boner
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macrophage69alpha
New member
EC stack and thermorexin are both good choices.
there are some precautions that can be taken with clenbuterol
Alcar- specifically for cardiac protection
taurine
magnesium
Potassium
in truth at what doses apoptosis becomes an issue in humans is not known. All that exist at this moment are the animal models.
there are some precautions that can be taken with clenbuterol
Alcar- specifically for cardiac protection
taurine
magnesium
Potassium
in truth at what doses apoptosis becomes an issue in humans is not known. All that exist at this moment are the animal models.
M
Mr.X
Guest
scoe25 said:
There are things to take which prevent clen sides, macro listed most of them already. Potassium, taurine etc...
Some alternatives to clen are ECA stack, Trex, or Stimulant-X.
macrophage69alpha
New member
to protect your heart:
since that seems to be the primary concern
Acetyl-l-carnitine (ALCAR)
(you could also use IV carnitine- though thats a bit excessive and probably not a protective)
J Huazhong Univ Sci Technolog Med Sci. 2005;25(5):501-4. Related Articles, Links
Effect of L-carnitine on cardiomyocyte apoptosis and cardiac function in patients undergoing heart valve replacement operation.
Xiang D, Sun Z, Xia J, Dong N, Du X, Chen X.
Department of Cardiac Surgery, Union Hospital, Tongji Medical College, Huazhong University of Science and Technology, Wuhan 430022, China. [email protected]
The effects of L-carnitine, as an ingredient of cardioplegia solution, on cardiac function and cardiomyocyte apoptosis in patients undergoing heart valve replacement operation were investigated. Twenty-three cases undergoing heart valve replacement with cardiopulmonary bypass (CPB) were randomly allocated into two groups: L-carnitine group (n = 12, 12 g/L L-carnitine was put in the ST. Thomas cardioplegia) and control group (n = 11, identical to the L-carnitine group except that normal saline was administered instead of L-carnitine). Serum cardial troponin I (cTnI) levels, the left ventricular ejection fraction (LVEF), and cardiac index (CI) were measured perioperatively. A bit of myocardial tissue obtained from right atria was taken before CPB and by the end of intracardiac procedure to undergo electron microscopy examination and estimate apoptosis by terminal deoxynucleotidyl transferase-mediated dUTP nick end-labeling (TUNEL). From the end of CPB to 3 days after operation, the serum levels of cTnI in the L-carnitine group was significantly lower than that in the control group (P < 0.05). Heart color ultrasonogram showed that the CI index and LVEF at 7th day postoperatively in the L-carnitine group were significantly higher than in the control group (P < 0.05). Compared to the control group, L-carnitine significantly alleviated the morphologic changes of cardiac muscle cells (electron microscopy examination) and decreased the amounts of apoptotic cardiac muscle cells (TUNEL). Furthermore, the dosage of vasoactive drugs used after operation was significantly less in the L-carnitine group (P < 0.01). It was concluded that L-carnitine cardioplegia solution could improve cardiac function in patients undergoing heart valve replacement operation and alleviate CPB-mediated apoptosis of cardiac muscle cells.
since that seems to be the primary concern
Acetyl-l-carnitine (ALCAR)
(you could also use IV carnitine- though thats a bit excessive and probably not a protective)
J Huazhong Univ Sci Technolog Med Sci. 2005;25(5):501-4. Related Articles, Links
Effect of L-carnitine on cardiomyocyte apoptosis and cardiac function in patients undergoing heart valve replacement operation.
Xiang D, Sun Z, Xia J, Dong N, Du X, Chen X.
Department of Cardiac Surgery, Union Hospital, Tongji Medical College, Huazhong University of Science and Technology, Wuhan 430022, China. [email protected]
The effects of L-carnitine, as an ingredient of cardioplegia solution, on cardiac function and cardiomyocyte apoptosis in patients undergoing heart valve replacement operation were investigated. Twenty-three cases undergoing heart valve replacement with cardiopulmonary bypass (CPB) were randomly allocated into two groups: L-carnitine group (n = 12, 12 g/L L-carnitine was put in the ST. Thomas cardioplegia) and control group (n = 11, identical to the L-carnitine group except that normal saline was administered instead of L-carnitine). Serum cardial troponin I (cTnI) levels, the left ventricular ejection fraction (LVEF), and cardiac index (CI) were measured perioperatively. A bit of myocardial tissue obtained from right atria was taken before CPB and by the end of intracardiac procedure to undergo electron microscopy examination and estimate apoptosis by terminal deoxynucleotidyl transferase-mediated dUTP nick end-labeling (TUNEL). From the end of CPB to 3 days after operation, the serum levels of cTnI in the L-carnitine group was significantly lower than that in the control group (P < 0.05). Heart color ultrasonogram showed that the CI index and LVEF at 7th day postoperatively in the L-carnitine group were significantly higher than in the control group (P < 0.05). Compared to the control group, L-carnitine significantly alleviated the morphologic changes of cardiac muscle cells (electron microscopy examination) and decreased the amounts of apoptotic cardiac muscle cells (TUNEL). Furthermore, the dosage of vasoactive drugs used after operation was significantly less in the L-carnitine group (P < 0.01). It was concluded that L-carnitine cardioplegia solution could improve cardiac function in patients undergoing heart valve replacement operation and alleviate CPB-mediated apoptosis of cardiac muscle cells.
macrophage69alpha
New member
the magnesium, taurine and pottasium will help in that aspect as well. They are typically used more to avoid the other sides of clenbuterol (cramping in particular)
M
Mr.X
Guest
macrophage69alpha said:
Potassium is a great addition along with Magnesium, here is an article on Potassium by SYL that has helped a lot of people:
Potassium Article
Personally, since starting ED potassium use, everything about my energy levels and lifestyle has improved, so this is something all members should look into.
macrophage69alpha
New member
most people dont get enough pottasium (especially in relation to sodium intake)
M
Mr.X
Guest
I've been looking over your studies on ALCAR and reading some of my own material, and I think it's time we start putting ALCAR as a mandatory supplement with clen use - just like Taurine and potassium.
ALCAR $29 at the AF store - good deal
https://www.anabolicfitness.net/shop/product_info.php?id=106&cartID=4a4d4149bdc5495840d51e975fc68010
ALCAR $29 at the AF store - good deal
https://www.anabolicfitness.net/shop/product_info.php?id=106&cartID=4a4d4149bdc5495840d51e975fc68010
E
ego boner
Guest
damn i love this place, its like having a personal trainer/dietician/chemist to ask advice from,,, AND its dynamic--constantly growing and changing for better improvement..
macrophage69alpha
New member
I
immortalis
Guest
Mr.X said:
Still waitin on my damn Stim-X sample to arrive... grrrr
SgtSlaughter
New member
^^^ I know what u mean, i even filled out another form.immortalis said:Still waitin on my damn Stim-X sample to arrive... grrrr
oh well... i have 1/4 bottle T-rex left for now.
todoveritas
New member
macrophage69alpha said:
Very interesting reading macro. I don't know if ingestion would have the same effect vs. solution immersion, but I guess no one understands the mechanism of action. Personally, I've always thought L-carnitine somehow counters the beta-stimulation, but I've read it interacts synergistically with growth factors to stabilize the membranes. Anyway, it seems to me to be a good herbal alternative to Beta-blockers.
