Question for patrick arnold or pardeus on PH assay...

[Pityocamptes]

I was wondering if either of you could provide standard assay information (MP, purity, etc) on 4AD and 19-Nordiol when it "rolls off the assembly line." I've heard stories of kilosports selling "cut" PH's. Is this something that comes from the manufacturer or is the seller "cutting" the product or is the manufacturer doing it at the request of the seller? I would like to know what the assay information would be "uncut." I've seen some sites/sellers that show the assay on 4ad as being 99.08% pure. I assume that the .92% is glue/binders, correct? If not what then. Also, I've seen some sellers that show the assay on 19-nordiol as being 98.3% pure with an MP of 163 degrees. Does 19-nordiol have a different manufacturing process than 4ad and it thus has more binders/glues? Or is someone "stomping" on this. I assume its glues or binders if not what would make up the other 1.7% ? Thanks for your help!

 

[Par Deus]

PA is the chemist and manufacturer of PH's, so I will let him answer, but just so he has some background info, the "cutting" thing comes from Animal who claims that KiloSport's bulk 4-AD powder is being cut with cyclodextrin. I have heard it reported that he determined this solely by its melting point.

 

[pa1ad]

I was wondering if either of you could provide standard assay information (MP, purity, etc) on 4AD and 19-Nordiol when it "rolls off the assembly line." I've heard stories of kilosports selling "cut" PH's. Is this something that comes from the manufacturer or is the seller "cutting" the product or is the manufacturer doing it at the request of the seller? I would like to know what the assay information would be "uncut." I've seen some sites/sellers that show the assay on 4ad as being 99.08% pure. I assume that the .92% is glue/binders, correct? If not what then. Also, I've seen some sellers that show the assay on 19-nordiol as being 98.3% pure with an MP of 163 degrees. Does 19-nordiol have a different manufacturing process than 4ad and it thus has more binders/glues? Or is someone "stomping" on this. I assume its glues or binders if not what would make up the other 1.7% ? Thanks for your help!

Diol prohormones made in the US and made in china are both manufactured the same way - by hydride reduction of the corresponding diones.

The finished product from china and the US are quite similar and the 4-AD usually assays out around 95% purity while the nordiol assays out around 85-90% purity. As far as the C of A that the chinese give you with purchase of their diols, you can wipe your ass and flush it because it is a lie.

Both diol products are mixture of isomers (3alpha and 3beta) and as a result the melting points are completely fucked up (they melt over a very wide range). You cannot determine anything from doing a melting point on these products.

The other constituents that make up the 5-15% of the products are mostly 5alpha and 5beta reduced side products. Some inorganic material may also be present in the material along with traces of other unidentified organic compounds.

You cannot do a purity test on the diols without expensive equipment such as a GC or HPLC.

BTW, the thought that kilosports cuts their 4-AD with cyclodextrin sounds preposterous. Why would anyone suggest that they do? How are they testing for the presence of cyclodextrin?

 

[MIKERAZ]

Re: Re: Question for patrick arnold or pardeus on PH assay...

Diol prohormones made in the US and made in china are both manufactured the same way - by hydride reduction of the corresponding diones.

The finished product from china and the US are quite similar and the 4-AD usually assays out around 95% purity while the nordiol assays out around 85-90% purity. As far as the C of A that the chinese give you with purchase of their diols, you can wipe your ass and flush it because it is a lie.

Both diol products are mixture of isomers (3alpha and 3beta) and as a result the melting points are completely fucked up (they melt over a very wide range). You cannot determine anything from doing a melting point on these products.

The other constituents that make up the 5-15% of the products are mostly 5alpha and 5beta reduced side products. Some inorganic material may also be present in the material along with traces of other unidentified organic compounds.

You cannot do a purity test on the diols without expensive equipment such as a GC or HPLC.

BTW, the thought that kilosports cuts their 4-AD with cyclodextrin sounds preposterous. Why would anyone suggest that they do? How are they testing for the presence of cyclodextrin?

Is this like the time you said test cant be put into oil solution? and synovex cant be seperated without access to a lab?

 

[Pityocamptes]

Animals response:

Just wanted to post Animals comment on this subject since it seems to be affecting a lot of people who are trying to get "clean" PH's. Here it is:


Hehe, mikeraz fucked them good!

You can put this over there too as when I had some bad androstenedion, THEY TOLD ME THAT THEY PUT CYCLODEXTRIN IN THERE Which they admitted in the last email they sent me as well!

Now, if they have 5-15% of this that or the other thing, then they can't claim pure nor can they claim the melting point on the data sheet which is precisely what I busted them on.

And what kinda fucking idiot says the melting point means nothing. Sounds like they have a stake in this or are ripping people off in another way because if you don't meet the melting point in the Merck or on a stat sheet then you have shit!

And people are asking these fuck-ups for advice. GEEZUS!

Get a fucking education!

 

[cockdezl]

"Is this like the time you said test cant be put into oil solution? and synovex cant be seperated without access to a lab?"

No, its more like the time you stated that the Segaloff steroid was a myth.

 

[MIKERAZ]

"Is this like the time you said test cant be put into oil solution? and synovex cant be seperated without access to a lab?"

No, its more like the time you stated that the Segaloff steroid was a myth.

No i think its more like the time you said you injected 1test-ec ED
and there was no pain

 

[cockdezl]

"No i think its more like the time you said you injected 1test-ec ED
and there was no pain"

????? I stated this? Are you on crack? Please show us this mysterious quote of mine.

 

[MIKERAZ]

Ok maybe i had you mixed up with someoen else

I'm assuming by defending par and pa your stating animal is wrong?

 

[cockdezl]

"Ok maybe i had you mixed up with someoen else"

Yes, I understand how you might think that I am someone else, since Animal tried to make this same correlation, while I was participating (briefly) on his board.

"I'm assuming by defending par and pa your stating animal is wrong?"

I am not claiming Animal is wrong in his conversation with Kilosports, since I can't find any reason why he would lie about this.

As for any technical aspects of Animal's post, I wouldn't trust him to get the time of day correct.