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RESEARCHSARMSUGFREAKeudomestic
napsgeargenezapharmateuticals domestic-supplypuritysourcelabsRESEARCHSARMSUGFREAKeudomestic

how many of you train HIT

  • Thread starter Thread starter nclifter6feet6
  • Start date Start date
Rich_S said:


Indeed. And in my opinion, the HIT guys would get more respect if they didn't insult every other training method in every single article they write. I don't think I've ever read a HIT article that didn't waste half the page by talking about how every other training system is worthless, dangerous, and stupid, how there is only one right way to train and that right way is HIT, how everyone who disagrees is an indoctrinated moron, and then go on to talk about Ayn Rand and objectivist philosophy and how it proves that HIT is the only sound way to train.



You're the one who came on here attacking the HIT principles and saying Mentzer is flat out wrong, and his theories are flawed..blah blah blah. You were just spouting ignorance, not knowing anything about the whole principle behind it..
 
Rich_S said:
Indeed. And in my opinion, the HIT guys would get more respect if they didn't insult every other training method in every single article they write.

Rich,

I tend to be a bit defensive about Mike because he was a friend. I know a lot of his training recommendations were a bit whacked out, but you're right: he, or other HITers, did sometimes go out of their way to bash other training methods.

Lots of volume guys bashed Mentzer first, just as NC666 did in this thread ("one set guys are pussies," when in fact the OPPOSITE is true: if you can do one death set of 20 w/ your 10 rep squat max, for instance, a pussy you ain't).

But that's no reason for Michael and others to start indiscriminately bashing back...though he wasn't religious, figuratively turning the other cheek might've been better in some circumstances.

I don't think I've ever read a HIT article that didn't waste half the page by talking about how every other training system is worthless, dangerous, and stupid, how there is only one right way to train and that right way is HIT, how everyone who disagrees is an indoctrinated moron, and then go on to talk about Ayn Rand and objectivist philosophy and how it proves that HIT is the only sound way to train.

You have a point there.

Michael's objectivism was okay by me, but I got a bit annoyed when I read the same recycled articles again and again, all talking about the exaltation of man, heroism, and the evils of skeptics, mystics, Kant, et al. I didn't give a shit what the volume guys were doing...if they wanted to think they were so awesome, that's fine by me; I'd let my body set them straight, if for whatever reason it came to that.

I often think his role in "modernizing" training is somewhat underrated. But as I said, Mike's reasoning did start to veer off in odd directions, and I can't help but to confess I knew, from first-hand experience, he was very paranoid when it came to defending his theory.

And I think deep down he knew it was flawed, but he himself was too indoctrinated to see a way out. Perhaps worse, many of his more vocal critics were rather stupid in the way they went about picking at him; e.g., Dan Duchaine's ad hominemizing.

Still, Michael should've known better. Instead of recognizing all the holes in his take on training, he let himself believe that the extent of his detractors' arguments were strictly limited to his behavior prior to being committed (drinking piss, streaking, talking about Arthur Jones as a god who could turn men into whales). It didn't help that lots of idiots perpetuated this instead of addressing Heavy Duty's actual problems. But those who did were largely ignored...Michael but them in the same category with the retards who couldn't get beyond the piss-drinking jokes.

Anyway, sorry to jump on you; nothing you really said warranted that response. I suppose I lament what Mike represented, what he could've been, and stick up for that almost as much as I do the person, a good man with some rather curious notions about bodybuilding :)
 
vinylgroover said:
Anabolik,

Does it not stand to reason that someone who is on steroids has a far greater ability to recover from a given workout volume than a natural trainee, and hence, the natural trainee would be the one most likely to benefit from the HIT approach.

If the main premise of HIT is to minimise the risk of overtraining while maximising muscle gain, then it stands to reason that those who juice will have a better capacity to lift their 'overtraining threshold' as defined by the volume of work or number of sets performed.

Say you use 2 sets by 2 exercises as the minimum requirement to stimulate muscle growth......then that minimum requirement should be say 4 sets by 2 exercises for a bodybuilder who uses steroids to pick an arbitrary number of sets.

This is where the strict interpretation of HIT doesn't seem to make sense to me. Personally, i adhere to the low volume approach, but i couldn't imagine going as low as 2 x 2.


Great point. That's where the frequency of workouts factor in. Knowing your recovery is enhanced by AAS, you may therefore (as an example) train every bodypart 2 times a week instead on once. But still only doing the 1 working set per exercise. Training that way gives you more growth phases per week.
But it's up to you to determine how long it takes to recover from your workout.
Dogg Crapp's routine outlines it perfectly. Wish I had the link.
 
casualbb said:
How about this: I train all bodyparts 3.5 times a week. I know I'm not recovered because I had to take three days off recently to help avoid burnout. Yet in 3-4 weeks I've gained 4 or 5 pounds of mass. How can that be explained?

-casualbb

This is really interesting. Care to elaborate on your routine?

I believe you posted somewhere that you had put on .0.5 inches on your thighs in two weeks by squatting 5x2@5RM every other day. How did you (would you) handle progression? Go to 5x3@5RM for another 2 weeks maybe?

I'd like to beg everyone out there to experiment a while with a routine like this one, if only for two weeks. At the end of my first freshman semester I was desperate on finding a way to make myself bigger and stronger. I searched the net and found some information on this guy named 'Paul Anderson' who was 'supposedly' extremely strong and big in the 60's or so. They said he got so strong by squatting all day every other day. Sound familiar?
Actually I think I'm gonna pull the actual text from the net...
There you go:
A typical Anderson workout usually required three to four hours to complete.
Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday
Full squat - 600 - 2x10
825 - 2 reps
845 - 2 reps
900 - 2 reps
Half squats - 1200 - 2 reps
Quarter squats - 1800 - 2 reps
Deadlift - 650 - 4x6-8 reps.[I/]

It said that he rested about 30 minutes between sets and he sipped milk between sets too.

Now, I only rested for 15-20 minutes (which I still felt was excessive) and had to slightly adjust the poundages :p (try 205 instead of 900; hey I was 150). I can tell you that my biggest obstacle in putting on size was extreme lack of appetite. I hated eating. The only increase in calories I had during that month was not in the form of food but in decrease of expenditure as I didn't have to walk all over the campus to get to classes. Maybe 350-400 calories a day. I can also tell you that I put on 12lbs. of which probably 7-8 were muscle put on 60-70 lbs. on my squat and I finally found out what it feels like to have to squeeze your thighs into the leg of your pants (w/o being a woman:) ).
I guess I stopped because as I increased poundages session to session I eventually felt drained and weak. This could have been easily avoided, I know now. Also, I was getting stretch marks on my upper thighs.

Eventually went on to WSB where I increased my lifts incredibly but put on a lot less muscle.
Thinking about trying it again this summer.
 
guldukat said:


Rich,

I tend to be a bit defensive about Mike because he was a friend. I know a lot of his training recommendations were a bit whacked out, but you're right: he, or other HITers, did sometimes go out of their way to bash other training methods.

Lots of volume guys bashed Mentzer first, just as NC666 did in this thread ("one set guys are pussies," when in fact the OPPOSITE is true: if you can do one death set of 20 w/ your 10 rep squat max, for instance, a pussy you ain't).

But that's no reason for Michael and others to start indiscriminately bashing back...though he wasn't religious, figuratively turning the other cheek might've been better in some circumstances.



You have a point there.

Michael's objectivism was okay by me, but I got a bit annoyed when I read the same recycled articles again and again, all talking about the exaltation of man, heroism, and the evils of skeptics, mystics, Kant, et al. I didn't give a shit what the volume guys were doing...if they wanted to think they were so awesome, that's fine by me; I'd let my body set them straight, if for whatever reason it came to that.

I often think his role in "modernizing" training is somewhat underrated. But as I said, Mike's reasoning did start to veer off in odd directions, and I can't help but to confess I knew, from first-hand experience, he was very paranoid when it came to defending his theory.

And I think deep down he knew it was flawed, but he himself was too indoctrinated to see a way out. Perhaps worse, many of his more vocal critics were rather stupid in the way they went about picking at him; e.g., Dan Duchaine's ad hominemizing.

Still, Michael should've known better. Instead of recognizing all the holes in his take on training, he let himself believe that the extent of his detractors' arguments were strictly limited to his behavior prior to being committed (drinking piss, streaking, talking about Arthur Jones as a god who could turn men into whales). It didn't help that lots of idiots perpetuated this instead of addressing Heavy Duty's actual problems. But those who did were largely ignored...Michael but them in the same category with the retards who couldn't get beyond the piss-drinking jokes.

Anyway, sorry to jump on you; nothing you really said warranted that response. I suppose I lament what Mike represented, what he could've been, and stick up for that almost as much as I do the person, a good man with some rather curious notions about bodybuilding :)


If I may inquire, what were Mike's holes in his take on training?
 
This is really interesting. Care to elaborate on your routine?

Nothing fancy, just straight-up HST. Actually, I didn't bring it up to extoll my gains. I brought it up because as it exists it violates a few main HIT principles (submaximal training, low frequency). Basically, I want to pose the question: how can a training philosophy be correct if doing the exact opposite produces awesome gains?

-casualbb
 
casualbb said:


Nothing fancy, just straight-up HST. Actually, I didn't bring it up to extoll my gains. I brought it up because as it exists it violates a few main HIT principles (submaximal training, low frequency). Basically, I want to pose the question: how can a training philosophy be correct if doing the exact opposite produces awesome gains?

-casualbb


A training phylosophy can be correct, but doesn't mean nothing else works.
 
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