Cutting For 2 Months Now, But Seems Like I'm Getting Nowhere!

[Tonkabosh]

I'm a 21 year old male with Insulin Dependent Diabetes & have been bodybuilding since I was 15 years old. I focused so much on just getting bigger, that I didn't stop to think how much fat I was putting on during this time. I'm 5,10" & got to 250lbs with around 24% bodyfat. My main concern was a slight fat belly which would "hang" over my jeans & tracksuit pants & to ME it felt/looked disgusting. If I was wearing a T-Shirt or anything like that, you wouldn't even be able to tell I had a belly, although because of this I'd have to decline when my friends invited me to go to the beach or to go swimming, because I felt so embarassed of taking off my top infront of people. My main goal was to get down to a bodyfat level where I'd have a FLAT stomach, which I heard is around 15%. I'm not concerned about having my abs showing whatsoever, I just want a flat stomach.

A couple of months ago I decided to start shedding the fat & came from 250lbs down to 220lbs, which is what I weigh at the moment. The annoying though is that my belly is STILL there. I've been going to the gym 5x a week along with cardio 5x a week also. My cardio is 30 mins on a stationary bike straight after weights. The fact that my belly is still there is making me extremely paranoid that I've been losing muscle this whole time as opposed to fat. I feel awful now thinking that I may have lost 30lbs of muscle when all along I thought I was losing fat. I made a diet (shown as attachment if you're interested) based on eating 6 times a day consisting of 2300 calories MAX. My protein was high, carbs were reduced & fat was also reduced. I absolutely 100% make sure I weigh everything on digital scales before I eat it, and I only have a cheat day once a week (Sunday).

Total Kcals - 2303
Total Protein - 278g
Total Carbs - 153g
Total Fat - 68g

I figured seeing as I kept protein high & I was training hard in the gym 5x a week, that my body would hold on to as much muscle as possible, but nowadays I actually feel as if I'm wasting away. It may sound like a bit of an exaggeration but to be honest it's really how I feel. Considering I still have this belly, and have lost 30lbs already, I'm paranoid about carrying on the cut incase I lose even MORE muscle, with minimal fat loss. I've even gone so far as to start blaming it on my Diabetes for the cause of me not losing fat. I'm honestly not sure where to turn now, as I thought I had everything figured out, but here I am 2 months down the line feeling as if the only thing I've accomplished is losing muscle. Due to this, I was going to forget about the cut & just focus on bulking once again in order to get back up to the weight I was before, but I know if I do this I'll end up feeling too fat again, therefore I really don't know where to turn now.

Any help/advice is appreciated, thanks.

 

[Tonkabosh]

The reason I didn't posted the diet is because people often see a really long post & think "screw that, I'm not reading all that". But I'll post it anyway if you want, so here it is:


Breakfast

Protein Shake (1.5 Scoops): 147 Kcals/31g Protein/2g Carbs/2g Fat
3/4 Scoop (31g) Ultra Fine Scottish Oats: 120 Kcals/3g Protein/22g Carbs/0g Fat
2 Teaspoons Chocolate Powder: 26 Kcals/2g Protein/0g Carbs/2g Fat
2 Medium Eggs: 130 Kcals/10g Protein/0g Carbs/8g Fat
1 Apple: 60 Kcals/0g Protein/16g Carbs/0g Fat

483 Kcals/46g Protein/40g Carbs/12g Fat


Mid Morning

193g Chicken Breast: 212 Kcals/45g Protein/0g Carbs/2g Fat
1/2 Tablespoon Olive Oil: 60 Kcals/0g Protein/0g Carbs/7g Fat

272 Kcals/46g Protein/0g Carbs/9g Fat


Lunch (Pre Workout)

34g Porridge (Oatmeal): 118 Kcals/4g Protein/25g Carbs/1g Fat
1/2 Apple: 30 Kcals/0g Protein/8g Carbs/0g Fat
250g Quark: 194 Kcals/35g Protein/13g Carbs/0g Fat
24g Peanuts: 136 Kcals/6g protein/4g Carbs/12g Fat

478 Kcals/45g Protein/50g Carbs/13g Fat


Post Workout

Protein Shake (2 Scoops): 197 Kcals/42g Protein/3g Carbs/3g Fat
2 Teaspoons Chocolate Powder: 26 Kcals/2g Protein/1g Carbs/2g Fat
2 Teaspoons Sugar: 30 Kcals/0g Protein/8g Carbs/0g Fat
1 Slice White Bread: 80 Kcals/2g Protein/15g Carbs/1g Fat
1 Banana (118g): 105 Kcals/1g Protein/27g Carbs/0g Fat

438 Kcals/47g Protein/54g Carbs/6g Fat


Dinner

Protein Shake (1 Scoop): 98 Kcals/21g Protein/1g Carbs/1g Fat
Tin of Tuna: 130 Kcals/30g Protein/0g Carbs/1g Fat
1/2 Tablespoon Olive Oil: 60 Kcals/0g Protein/0g Carbs/7g Fat

288 Kcals/51g Protein/1g Carbs/9g Fat


Before Bed

Casein Protein Shake (2 Scoops): 146 Kcals/34g Protein/2g Carbs/2g Fat
35g Peanuts: 198 Kcals/9g protein/6g Carbs/17g Fat

345 Kcals/43g Protein/8g Carbs/19g Fat



Total Kcals - 2303
Total Protein - 278g
Total Carbs - 153g
Total Fat - 68g

 

[thebigoz]

Do your cardio first thing in the morning on an empty stomach. If you still don't see any results, start dropping the calories down even more.

And no carbs after training, excluding your PWO. I would have a relatively carb free dinner (Chicken, brocolli etc)

 

[Tonkabosh]

phate1

Harris Benedict Equation

According to the HB formula, my BMR is 2182. I multiplied this by 1.55 (option 3) as it was "moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/week". I train 5x a week along with cardio, although as I'm currently unemployed I spend the majority of my day at the PC and/or infront of the TV. The only supplementation I'm taking is a Multivitamin & Whey Protein at the moment. I stopped taking things such as Creatine, as it was confusing me when it came to checking how much weight I'd lost etc. I also have no known allergies, although I AM diabetic.

thebigozhttp://www.elitefitness.com/forum/members/thebigoz.html

As you can see from the diet I posted above, the only time carbs are included in my diet is Preworkout, Postworkout & Breakfast. Also, does doing cardio in the morning on an empty stomach REALLY matter? I've heard so many things about losing weight just being down to "Calories in Vs Calories out" that to me it just seems pointless, although it's just what I've read so I could be wrong.

 

[thebigoz]

Also, does doing cardio in the morning on an empty stomach REALLY matter? I've heard so many things about losing weight just being down to "Calories in Vs Calories out" that to me it just seems pointless, although it's just what I've read so I could be wrong.

Yes, of course it matters. You are going to be using more stored fats for fuel.

 

[iron_matt-CB]

Dude I weigh 220 and was eating 2600 cals a day and while i did see progress it slowed quickly... Hired a pro out of Florida who trains ifbb pros.. Well he's got me doing 45 mind of brisk walking ed.. Eating get this 3800 cals a day... Working out 5 days a week with some serious intense workouts..What I can tell you so far is I'm looking better and losing bf each an everyday... I think I was underfeeding myself!! This shuts down your metabolism big time!! Hence the gradual decline is results bro! I'm eating 8 times a day, virtually every 2 hours... And no carbs after 4 pm.. Only allowed 1 shake a day all else is whole foods... You got way to many shakes in there bro.. Eat a ton of chicken, and 1 portion of red meat ed... All he has me eating is oatmeal, whole wheat pasta, brown rice, chckeb, lean beaf, and veggies.... That's literally all I eat besides my 1 cheat meal a week ( love it!!) ... Anyway I hired a pro because I was sick of wasting time and guessing... Best move i ever made!! Good luck!

 

[Tonkabosh]

okay, i did a basic critique on what i would add in, this process can take a while(fine tuning the diet to you) but i'm willing to put in the time if you are

now let's talk cardio

when are you doing it during the day?

how long?

what intensity?

are you currently running any sympathomimetics(fat burners)? would you like too?

can i suggest some additional supplements?

Sorry for the late replies, I've been busy recently with a few things around the house & trying to get back into work etc, although I'll definitely reply whenever I get the chance. I appreciate the help you're giving me here & I'm definitely willing to put in the time along with you, if you don't mind.

- Quark is a slow digesting protein source, like cottage cheese with a high amount of protein. This is the exact Quark I eat - Meadow Churn Quark 250g product information - Tesco.com

- I'm doing cardio 5x a week straight after weights. I do weights for around 1 hour, then hop on the stationary bike for 30 mins. This is at a medium intensity.

- I'm not currently using any Fat Burners as I was told (by somebody on a different forum) that any over the counter fat burners are a complete waste of money & hardly work. I was a bit sceptical of this, but it seemed that this guy knew what he was talking about, so I followed his advice.

- The reason I've added chocolate powder to my whey shakes is that I buy bulk whey which is unflavoured, therefore I add the chocolate powder in order to make it taste better, although I could definitely drop it if need be.

- Please feel free to suggest any additional supplements if you wish.


Questions:

- You suggested taking out the oats & apple from the first meal & replacing it with cauliflower instead. I hope you don't mind if I ask WHY exactly you've suggested this. I heard that it was mandatory you eat some carbs first thing in the morning as your body has gone so long without any. You also suggested replacing the whey with chicken/tuna etc. Would extra eggs or egg whites be appropriate here instead?

- You suggested that I drop the sugar, white bread & banana from my PWO meal. Excuse me for asking (you probably know more than me) but during my years of going to the gym & researching bodybuilding etc, I thought it was absolutely ESSENTIAL that you eat some fast digesting carbs straight after your work out in order to replenish glycogen stores which you used up during the workout. If I was to add in sweet potatoes (these being a SLOW digesting carb source) wouldn't that go against what I'm trying to achieve at this point?

- You suggested I drop the shake from my PPWO meal. Should I replace it with something else or just drop it altogether?

- And finally, you said you would prefer that I had lean beef before bed instead of a casein shake & peanuts, but wouldn't this digest quicker than casein/peanuts, therefore leaving me in a catabolic state during the night?


As I said above, I very much appreciate this help & I hope to hear back from you. Thanks.

 

[elmarcouk]

Personally id leave the oats and whey for breakfast. The point of it is to bring the body out of a catabolic state as soon as possible. And as for PWO, you need high GI carbs to spike insulin so that the protein and carbs replenish the glycogen you've just used, so i wouldn't add a sweet potato there. As for your dinner meal. Maybe have a 200g of chicken, and some green veg ie. brocolli, spinach etc. or even a salad. Drop the shake though. Keep the casein and nuts before bed, no meat.

 

[iron_matt-CB]

many people do not use a high gi carb pwo when cutting...i personally think its better suited for bulking

 

[gstacker]

30lbs! Thats a lot of weight to drop good job whats making you think its all muscle? Seriously is your strength taking a big dive? I belive if your stomache is hanging over your belt that is more than 24% bf im thinking and 15% is actually pretty lean not a chiseled 6 pack but prolly start to see ur upper abs start to poke threw... Dont beat yourself up to bad it really seems like u did your homework and making some good progress....at 250lbs ur used to being a big guy and its natural to feel the way you do... What kinda weight are you working with, bench squat deads etc? Jus curious

P/s i like the posters reply best who hired a pro

 

[Will Goes Boing]

You have to understand that fat around the belly/love handles is usually the LAST place to go. I'm not sure what your BF is at right now, but the fat around your belly is probably going to linger around until you hit really low BF.

And if you feel like you are losing too much muscle you can always ease off on the cutting..... they say generally 1-2lbs a week is healthy. If you're dropping weight like a madman you're probably not eating enough to match your high volume workouts.

 

[sonicwaste]

You've made good progress my man. Cutting takes time, mostly because your body adapts fairly quickly. You've got to constantly change things up to incite your body to keep moving.

Sometimes it's lowering the calories, sometimes it's raising the calories. Sometimes it's changing the order of your melas, etc, etc, etc...

My body started to revolt against me as I reached towards 10% bf. So, I too, hired a pro. A great member of this forum, FUTURE.

He's got my back on track. I had cut a lot of the fruit out of my diet for a long time, I cut a lot of other different medium GI carbs from my diet... I had cut PWO carbs. I had cut a lot of things... And I upped my cardio. I was getting nowhere.

So I hired future... He brought back in fruits, whole wheat pasta, beans, etc... And he lowered my cardio down... Sure enough my body was shocked and started moving again... Now, after 2 weeks I've started to adapt again..> So we are going to re-evaluate things again.

Hiring a pro, was the best money I've ever spent.

I had tons of people evaluating my diet, making suggestions, etc... I was catering myself to things that worked for other people, but they didn't necessarily work for me.

Main point is to find out what works for you through trial and error. There is no one diet plan that will consistently work for everyone. You gotta listen to your body. Log your results in detail to see what really works for you.

If you aren't consistently dropping wieght or body fat every week, then it's time to do things differently. If you drop 3lbs one week, then 2lbs the next, then 1lbs the next, and then stagnate for 1 week... Then it's safe to say you need to change things up.

Hiring a good pro will most definitely make sure you stay on track. They will develop an overall plan for you. You can't go blindly and expect things to keep working. You need a full thought out plan. A pro that consistently gets down to 3-4%bf is the way to go... Because they've done it, they can tell you how to do it.

That's my take.

 

[Tonkabosh]

bold

Can I just ask why exactly you recommended these particular supplements? I bought them all anyway yesterday, but just wondered what several of them are used for (mainly Chromium, ALA & Vit C).

The creatine mono says to only take 5g per day on the side of the tub, but you're recommending that I take around 20g a day. Is this fine? Also, is a "loading phase" needed when cutting?

Thanks.

 

[Tonkabosh]

Excellent, thanks for that. Hopefully it'll make me feel a lot better & more able to cope with this cut.

I have another question though. Would you suggest I invest in some digital scales so that I can check my weight on a weekly basis to see exactly how much weight I'm losing? I thought this would be an optimal way of checking to see if I'm losing fat at the right pace, and if not I can further reduce calories or increase activity.

Although... You're suggesting that I take creatine, so this will most likely mess around with my weight due to water retention won't it? Therefore, checking the scales to make sure I'm losing weight won't exactly work.

What do you suggest?