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aspartame toxicity

Sigmund Roid

New member
Protein powders, some other supplements and diet drinks contain aspartame, and it is never stated how much aspartame is contained in these products. Are you worried about the toxicity of aspartame, or do you think it is a hoax? I included an article, which I found on the internet. Personally I try to avoid aspartame and other sweeteners (except stevia) as much as possible.





Aspartame... the BAD news!
Article courtesy of: Mark Gold [email protected]
(researcher for twenty years on such subjects)

Aspartame was not approved until 1981, in dry foods. For over eight years the FDA refused to approve it because of the seizures and brain tumors this drug produced in lab animals. The FDA continued to refuse to approve it until President Reagan took office (a friend of Searle) and fired the FDA Commissioner who wouldn't approve it. Dr. Arthur Hull Hayes was appointed as commissioner. Even then there was so much opposition to approval that a Board of Inquiry was set up. The Board said: "Do not approve aspartame". Dr. Hayes OVERRULED his own Board of Inquiry.
Shortly after Commissioner Arthur Hull Hayes, Jr., approved the use of aspartame in carbonated beverages, he left for a position with G.D. Searle's Public Relations firm.
Long-Term Damage. It appears to cause slow, silent damage in those unfortunate enough to not have immediate reactions and a reason to avoid it. It may take one year, five years, 10 years, or 40 years, but it seems to cause some reversible and some irreversible changes in health over long-term use.
METHANOL (AKA WOOD ALCOHOL/POISON) (10% OF ASPARTAME) Methanol/wood alcohol is a deadly poison. People may recall that methanol was the poison that has caused some "skid row" alcoholics to end up blind or dead. Methanol is gradually released in the small intestine when the methyl group of aspartame encounter the enzyme chymotrypsin.
The absorption of methanol into the body is sped up considerably when free methanol is ingested. Free methanol is created from aspartame when it is heated to above 86 Fahrenheit (30 Centigrade). This would occur when aspartame-containing product is improperly stored or when it is heated (e.g., as part of a "food" product such as Jello).
Methanol breaks down into formic acid and formaldehyde in the body. Formaldehyde is a deadly neurotoxin. An EPA assessment of methanol states that methanol "is considered a cumulative poison due to the low rate of excretion once it is absorbed. In the body, methanol is oxidized to formaldehyde and formic acid; both of these metabolites are toxic." The recommend a limit of consumption of 7.8 mg/day. A one-liter (approx. 1 quart) aspartame-sweetened beverage contains about 56 mg of methanol. Heavy users of aspartame-containing products consume as much as 250 mg of methanol daily or 32 times the EPA limit.
The most well known problems from methanol poisoning are vision problems. Formaldehyde is a known carcinogen, causes retinal damage, interferes with DNA replication, and causes birth defects. Due to the lack of a couple of key enzymes, humans are many times more sensitive to the toxic effects of methanol than animals. Therefore, tests of aspartame or methanol on animals do not accurately reflect the danger for humans. As pointed out by Dr Woodrow C. Monte, Director of the Food Science and Nutrition Laboratory at Arizona State University, "There are no human or mammalian studies to evaluate the possible mutagenic, teratogenic, or carcinogenic effects of chronic administration of methyl alcohol."
It has been pointed out that fruit juices and alcoholic beverages contain small amounts of methanol. It is important to remember, that the methanol in natural products never appears alone. In every case, ethanol is present, usually in much higher amounts. Ethanol is an antidote for methanol toxicity in humans. The troops of Desert Storm were "treated" to large amounts of aspartame-sweetened beverages which had been heated to over 86 degrees F. in the Saudi Arabian sun. Many of them returned home with numerous disorders similar to what has been seen in persons who have been chemically poisoned by formaldehyde. The free methanol in the beverages may have been a contributing factor in these illnesses. Other breakdown products of aspartame such as DKP, may also have been a factor.
In a 1993 act that can only be described as "unconscionable", the FDA approved aspartame as an ingredient in numerous food items that would always be heated to above 86°degrees F (30°Degrees C).
Much worse, on 27 June 1996, without public notice, the FDA removed all restrictions from aspartame allowing it to be used in everything, including all heated and baked goods.
The truth about aspartame's toxicity is far different than what the NutraSweet Company would have you readers believe. In February of 1994, the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services released the listing of adverse reactions reported to the FDA (DHHS 1994). Aspartame accounted for more than 75% of all adverse reactions reported to the FDA's Adverse Reaction Monitoring System (ARMS). By the FDA's own admission fewer then ONE PERCENT of those who have problems with something they consume ever report it to the FDA. This balloons the almost 10,000 complaints they once had to around a million. However, the FDA has a record keeping problem (they never did respond to the certified letter from the WEBMASTER of this site... a major victim!) and they tend to discourage or even misdirect complaints, at least on aspartame. The fact remains, though, that MOST victims don't have a clue that aspartame may be the cause of their many problems! Many reactions to aspartame were very serious including seizures and death. Those reactions included:
DORway documents now linked to SYMPTOM!


Abdominal Pain
Anxiety attacks
arthritis
asthma
Asthmatic Reactions
Bloating, Edema (Fluid Retention)
Blood Sugar Control Problems (Hypoglycemia or Hyperglycemia)
Brain Cancer (Pre-approval studies in animals)
Breathing difficulties
burning eyes or throat
Burning Urination
can't think straight
Chest Pains
chronic cough
Chronic Fatigue
Confusion
Death
Depression
Diarrhea
Dizziness
Excessive Thirst or Hunger
fatigue
feel unreal
flushing of face
Hair Loss (Baldness) or Thinning of Hair
Headaches/Migraines dizziness
Hearing Loss
Heart palpitations
Hives (Urticaria)
Hypertension (High Blood Pressure)
Impotency and Sexual Problems
inability to concentrate
Infection Susceptibility
Insomnia
Irritability
Itching
Joint Pains
laryngitis
"like thinking in a fog"
Marked Personality Changes
Memory loss
Menstrual Problems or Changes
Migraines and Severe Headaches (Trigger or Cause From Chronic Intake)
Muscle spasms
Nausea or Vomiting
Numbness or Tingling of Extremities
Other Allergic-Like Reactions
Panic Attacks
Phobias
poor memory
Rapid Heart Beat
Rashes
Seizures and Convulsions
Slurring of Speech
Swallowing Pain
Tachycardia
Tremors
Tinnitus
Vertigo
Vision Loss
Weight gain

Aspartame Disease Mimics Symptoms or Worsens the Following Diseases

Fibromyalgia
Arthritis
Multiple Sclerosis (MS)
Parkinson's Disease
Lupus
Multiple Chemical Sensitivities (MCS)
Diabetes and Diabetic Complications
Epilepsy
Alzheimer's Disease
Birth Defects
Chronic Fatigue Syndrome
Lymphoma
Lyme Disease
Attention Deficit Disorder (ADD)
Panic Disorder
Depression and other Psychological Disorders

How it happens:
Methanol, from aspartame, is released in the small intestine when the methyl group of aspartame encounters the enzyme chymotrypsin (Stegink 1984, page 143). Free methanol begins to form in liquid aspartame-containing products at temperatures above 86 degrees F.. also within the human body.
The methanol is then converted to formaldehyde. The formaldehyde converts to formic acid, ant sting poison. Toxic formic acid is used as an activator to strip epoxy and urethane coatings. Imagine what it does to your tissues!
Phenylalanine and aspartic acid, 90% of aspartame, are amino acids normally used in synthesis of protoplasm when supplied by the foods we eat. But when unaccompanied by other amino acids we use [there are 20], they are neurotoxic.
That is why a warning for Phenylketonurics is found on EQUAL and other aspartame products. Phenylketenurics are 2% of the population with extreme sensitivity to this chemical unless it's present in food. It gets you too, causing brain disorders and birth defects! Finally, the phenyalanine breaks down into DKP, a brain tumor agent.
In other words: Aspartame converts to dangerous byproducts that have no natural countermeasures. A dieter's empty stomach accelerates these conversions and amplifies the damage. Components of aspartame go straight to the brain, damage that causes headaches, mental confusion, seizures and faulty balance. Lab rats and other test animals died of brain tumors.
Despite the claims of Monsanto and bedfellows:
1. Methanol from alcohol and juices does not get converted to formaldehyde to any significant extent. There is very strong evidence to confirm this fact for alcoholic beverages and fairly strong evidence for juices.
2. Formaldehyde obtained from methanol is very toxic in *very small* doses as seen by recent research.
3. Aspartame causes chronic toxicity reactions/damage due to the methanol to formaldehyde and other break down products despite what is claimed otherwise by the very short, industry-funded experiments using a test substance that is chemically different and absorbed differently than what is available to the general public. "Strangely enough", almost all independent studies show that aspartame can cause health problems.
4. A common ploy from Monsanto is to claim that aspartame is "safe" yet a few select people may have "allergic" reactions to it. This is typical Monsanto nonsense, of course. Their own research shows that it does not cause "allergic" reactions. It is there way of trying to minimize and hide the huge numbers of toxicity reactions and damage that people are experiencing from the long-term use of aspartame.
Summary
Given the following points, it is definitely premature for researchers to discount the role of methanol in aspartame side effects:
1. The amount of methanol ingested from aspartame is unprecedented in human history. Methanol from fruit juice ingestion does not even approach the quantity of methanol ingested from aspartame, especially in persons who ingest one to three liters (or more) of diet beverages every day. Unlike methanol from aspartame, methanol from natural products is probably not absorbed or converted to its toxic metabolites in significant amounts as discussed earlier.
2. Lack of laboratory-detectable changes in plasma formic acid and formaldehyde levels do not preclude damage being caused by these toxic metabolites. Laboratory-detectable changes in formate levels are often not found in short exposures to methanol.
3. Aspartame-containing products often provide little or no nutrients which may protect against chronic methanol poisoning and are often consumed in between meals. Persons who ingest aspartame-containing products are often dieting and more likely to have nutritional deficiencies than persons who take the time to make fresh juices.
4. Persons with certain health conditions or on certain drugs may be much more susceptible to chronic methanol poisoning.
5. Chronic diseases and side effects from slow poisons often build silently over a long period of time. Many chronic diseases which seem to appear suddenly have actually been building in the body over many years.
6. An increasing body of research is showing that many people are highly sensitive to low doses of formaldehyde in the environment. Environmental exposure to formaldehyde and ingestion of methanol (which converts to formaldehyde) from aspartame likely has a cumulative deleterious effect.
7. Formic acid has been shown to slowly accumulate in various parts of the body. Formic acid has been shown to inhibit oxygen metabolism.
8. The are a very large and growing number of persons are experiencing chronic health problems similar to the side effects of chronic methanol poisoning when ingesting aspartame-containing products for a significant length of time. This includes many cases of eye damage similar to the type of eye damage seen in methanol poisoning cases.
Toxicity Effects of Aspartame Use Selection of Health Effects from Short-term and/or Long-Term Use Note: It often takes at least sixty days without any aspartame NutraSweet to see a significant improvement. Check all labels very carefully (including vitamins and pharmaceuticals). Look for the word "aspartame" on the label and avoid it. (Also, it is a good idea to avoid "acesulfame-k" or "sunette.") Finally, avoid getting nutrition information from junk food industry PR organizations such as IFIC or organizations that accept large sums of money from the junk and chemical food industry such as the American Dietetic Association.
If you are a user of any products with aspartame, and you have physical, visual, mental problems... take the 60-day no aspartame test. If, after two months with no aspartame your symptoms are either gone, or are much less severe, please get involved to get this neurotoxin off the market. Write a letter to the FDA, with a copy to Betty Martini (for proof of how the FDA doesn't keep proper records). Write your congressmen. Return products containing aspartame to the point of purchase... for a FULL refund. Make a big stink if they WON'T give you a full refund! Tell all your friends and family... and if they stop using aspartame and also "wake up well"... get them involved in the same way.
Aspartame is an "approved sweetener" because of a few greedy and dishonest people who place profits above human life and well-being. With the FDA and our Congress culpable, only an INFORMED and ACTIVE public will affects its reclassification from "food additive" to TOXIC DRUG, and removed from the human food chain.
Need to view some of the FDA original documentation?

Link to a printable report form:

http://www.dorway.com/reprtfrm.html

Addresses:

Commissioner
Food and Drug Administration
5600 Fishers Lane
Rockville, Maryland 20857

Mrs. Betty Martini
Mission Possible International
9270 River Club Parkway
Duluth, Georgia 30097
Internet E-mail: [email protected]

Links for additional information:

http://www.dorway.com Front door to everything!
http://www.dorway.com/possible.html Mission Possible Files
http://www.dorway.com/asprlink.html Links to more sites/source information
http://www.holisticmed.com/aspartame More in-depth Information
http://www.trufax.org/menu/chem.html More good articles

Links for books:

http://www.dorway.com/books.html
http://www.dorway.com/amazon.html DORway Amazon Bookshelf





NOW... that you are aware of the 92 FDA recognized symptoms (that required a Freedom Of Information Act request to pry from their reluctant hands) and HOW aspartame does its dirty work, change to my Official Dogma page. On this page Mark Gold has taken the IFIC "Official" aspartame safety myth and shot it full of holes using all of the smoking guns that were used by the FDA to approve this poison as a food additive, along with information they either ignored or discounted. This excellent debunking of the official FDA/Monsanto/Searle/Nutrasweet/Nutrasweet Kelco/AMA/ADA/IFIC/??? chain of lies and half truths includes a long history of this "product's" sordid trail to the marketplace and the sweet tooth.
 
Good post, when I'm cutting I consume alot of crystal light, protein powders and diet sodas. I've always wondered how dangerous aspartame is in the long run
 
Magnússon said:
Good post, when I'm cutting I consume alot of crystal light, protein powders and diet sodas. I've always wondered how dangerous aspartame is in the long run

I consume crystal lite too but it does not contain aspartame just splenda. As far as diet sodas, go for diet rite(no aspartame) and certain protein powders do not contain aspartame either like isopure, biotest and others.
 
Stevia has now been disapproved by the Dutch FDA. At the nature shops they claim that it was done under the pressure of the aspartame, saccharine etc. producers. What a nasty world we are living in! Stevia cannot be patented, so producers cannot make much money on it.
 
Bro, that is an awsome post. Here I was drinking pounds and pounds of optimum whey protein which contains aspartame. Shit man, after reading that I'm throwing it out. Can you post this on the anabolic section???? I bet ALOT of people there would be interested in hearing this.
 
TraxZBT said:
Bro, that is an awsome post. Here I was drinking pounds and pounds of optimum whey protein which contains aspartame. Shit man, after reading that I'm throwing it out. Can you post this on the anabolic section???? I bet ALOT of people there would be interested in hearing this.

This is not new, this is old internet garbage. Martini and Gold have been peddling this pseudo-scientific shit for years. They originally worked on many of the Deja newsgroups, like sci.med.nutrition and misc.health.alternative, but they were constantly destroyed by people who had an inkling of scientific background.

Look at this article, do they use any scientific references to support their claims? Look at the list of side effects. Fricken arsenic doesn't have the numbers of symptoms that they claim for aspartame.
 
Utter bullshit.

The dangers of aspartame are non-existant. This is just as ludicrous as the people who believe milk is toxic to humans. Keep up with the mindless conspiracy theories...
 
Good Post 'Sigmund Roid', it's a shame some people still won't believe the harmful effects of asparteme. Below is a link to articles supporting the ill-effects of aspartame. The link comes from Dr. Mercola's site, who I might add, is a very reputeable doctor and the site is full of healthy information. There's alot that one can learn here, from a Doctor who's not being bought off by the drug companies. I have changed many of my eating habits based on Dr. Mercola's information and am feeling much healthier these days. If people don't want to "work" at being healthy and want to listen to the "All Knowing Govt" - fine, suit yourself. http://www.mercola.com/article/aspartame/
:)
 
Big Arnold said:
Good Post 'Sigmund Roid', it's a shame some people still won't believe the harmful effects of asparteme. Below is a link to articles supporting the ill-effects of aspartame. The link comes from Dr. Mercola's site, who I might add, is a very reputeable doctor and the site is full of healthy information. There's alot that one can learn here, from a Doctor who's not being bought off by the drug companies. I have changed many of my eating habits based on Dr. Mercola's information and am feeling much healthier these days. If people don't want to "work" at being healthy and want to listen to the "All Knowing Govt" - fine, suit yourself. http://www.mercola.com/article/aspartame/
:)

Yes, Dr. Mercola is a very reputable source. Check this nugget of information:

Aspartame Dosing of the Military in the Gulf War
During the 1991 Gulf War, all military personnel were provided free supplies of aspartame-laced soft drinks together with experimental vaccines, nerve gas antidotes and personal insecticides. They were also treated to direct biochemical warfare compounds. The result is Gulf War Syndrome, which is communicable and deadly, and 50,000 military personnel and their dependents are wasting away before our eyes. Criminal negligence? Of course. Criminal conspiracy? Yes. Genocide? Probably - we’re waiting to see.

Note the word 'communicable', which means 'transmittable'. How in the hell is aspartame toxicity transmittable???

Also, here is some amazing references that Dr. Mercola uses:

Aspartame is made up of three chemicals: Aspartic acid, phenylalanine, and methanol. The book, Prescription for Nutritional Healing, by James and Phyllis Balch, lists aspartame under the category of "chemical poison." As you shall see, that is exactly what it is.

The Balchs' book referenced above is replete with false information and questionable advice. He probable also references Dr. Julian Whitaker, another hack physician.
 
cockdezl said:


This is not new, this is old internet garbage. Martini and Gold have been peddling this pseudo-scientific shit for years. They originally worked on many of the Deja newsgroups, like sci.med.nutrition and misc.health.alternative, but they were constantly destroyed by people who had an inkling of scientific background.

Look at this article, do they use any scientific references to support their claims? Look at the list of side effects. Fricken arsenic doesn't have the numbers of symptoms that they claim for aspartame.


Hmm your right, they don't use any references at all. I'm still pretty shaken up at the fact that equal packets have warnings on them though. But these days, everything causes cancer so I wouldn't be surprised if it did.
 
circusgirl said:
The aspartame thing is an urban legend. www.urbanlegends.com...

exactly !

there is neither methanol, nor brain cancer :rolleyes:

If it were true there would be millions of death around the world
 
Anthrax said:


exactly !

there is neither methanol, nor brain cancer :rolleyes:

If it were true there would be millions of death around the world

Methanol CAN BE liberated from aspartame, but the quantities are small enough that the human body can handle it. Martini and Gold have jumped on the fact of methanol's presence, the fact that it is a toxin, but conveniently disregarded the fact that the human body CAN deal with small amounts of various poisons.

They have no understanding of a tenet of pharmacology/toxicology, "a poison is defined by the dose".
 
the Swiss physician Paracelus set forth one of the basic tenets of modern toxicology when he wrote:

"What is it that is not poison? All things are poison and nothing is without poison.
It is the dose only that makes a thing not a poison."
 
Well, I'm not hear to twist anyone's arm one way or another. But I standby my personal research that Aspartame is BAD. Those who want to continue to use it, certainly can, - Happy Aspartame drinking!(not Sarcasm, just alittle humor) However, the FDA has been known more than once to not be truthful in dealing with the American people about health issues. Yes, you can go on the internet and find all kinds of information telling you that Aspartame is perfectly safe and the FDA not only approved it but also re-evaluted it in the past and they keep telling us it's fine. As for Good and Bad science claims, well, below is a link to a website full of many "Independent Sources" that have studied Aspartame and have conclude that 'Monsanto' and the FDA ARE NOT WORKING IN OUR BEST INTEREST! I will not spend the time to go through each and everyone of them but I'm just trying to get across to some people that there is Good Science out there that shows Aspartame is not something to be takenly lightly, in regards to your health. If people still want to ignore this that's okay with me, like I said above "I'm not hear to twist anyone's arm" At my age (44) I have learned much about "trusting" our Govt. with my health.........Don't!
P.S. Not trying to Piss-Off anyone, just trying to keep people Open-Minded, thank you.
http://aspartametruth.com/57reports.html
 
Mmmmm, the opinions on this subject seem to be widely spread.
Thanks for the replies, guys and girls.

Cockdezl, you said:

>>>Methanol CAN BE liberated from aspartame, but the quantities are small enough that the human body can handle it. Martini and Gold have jumped on the fact of methanol's presence, the fact that it is a toxin, but conveniently disregarded the fact that the human body CAN deal with small amounts of various poisons.

>>>They have no understanding of a tenet of pharmacology/toxicology, "a poison is defined by the dose".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

However, the toxicity of methanol is eliminated by ethanol, which is the main constituent of Martini and Gold. Even by MD's, methanol poisoning is treated by alcohol.


Big Arnold:

>>>At my age (44) I have learned much about "trusting" our Govt. with my health.........Don't!

I am 13 years younger, but I agree totally with you. The Govt. priority is filling their empty pockets caused by their poor policy making and money wasting.

Just look at stevia, a wonderful sweetener, no apparant toxicity, and in all aspects it seems much safer than aspartame and related compounds. And now it is forbidden here.


Anthrax:

>>>the Swiss physician Paracelus set forth one of the basic tenets of modern toxicology when he wrote:

>>>"What is it that is not poison? All things are poison and nothing is without poison.
It is the dose only that makes a thing not a poison."

True, but who knows how much aspartame is in our protein powders. It doesn't say on any of them!!!!
 
My experience

Forget scientific or FDA studies. I avoid artificial sweeteners because they make me feel horrible. Here is an example. I ordered 'Supreme Whey' from Peak Nutrition. It listed only fructose as the sweetener on the website. I received my 8lb bucket, and again, only fructose was listed. I tried some. First of all it tasted odd (artificial sweeteners taste a bit different from sugar). About 15 minutes later, I started getting a headache, which has happened before after eating such sweeteners. I contacted the company and after several days of arguing they finally admitted that the powder contained Acesulfame Potassium. At this point they suddenly becaume extremely cooperative and would do anything I said, because they had already broken the law for not revealing the full list of ingredients.

Unfortunately, there are extremely few products still available that have no artificial sweeteners. To my knowledge, the only major protein powder in this category is Prolab N-Large2, which uses fructose only.


Eric
BC, Canada
 
Sigmund Roid said:
Mmmmm, the opinions on this subject seem to be widely spread.
Thanks for the replies, guys and girls.

Cockdezl, you said:

>>>Methanol CAN BE liberated from aspartame, but the quantities are small enough that the human body can handle it. Martini and Gold have jumped on the fact of methanol's presence, the fact that it is a toxin, but conveniently disregarded the fact that the human body CAN deal with small amounts of various poisons.

>>>They have no understanding of a tenet of pharmacology/toxicology, "a poison is defined by the dose".

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

However, the toxicity of methanol is eliminated by ethanol, which is the main constituent of Martini and Gold. Even by MD's, methanol poisoning is treated by alcohol.

Again Martini and Gold have little understanding of human physiology. It has been shown that fruit juices often contain detectable levels of methanol from microbial fermentation. Anti-Nutrasweet advocates have countered by making the same statement that you make, which is that ethanol is present which is a competitor for alcohol dehydrogenase and is the treatment for methanol poisoning in the clinical setting.

The problem with their argument is that they are extrapolating from clinical cases, which are examples of considerable methanol ingestion, 1000's of times more than what is produced with aspartame. Also, they don't realise that alcohols (ethanol) are produced in the intestines from microbial metabolism of ingested carbohydrates. So there is usually a low basal level of simple alcohols being metabolized in the liver from microbial metabolism.
 
Everytime I see that dreadful aspertame warning, I can't believe the stupid fucks that believe it. Its all bullshit aspertame is nothing more than two amino acids that when combined are approx 200 times sweeter than suger. Cockdezl is totally correct in each and every one of his responses. I'm sure lyle Alzado(ck sp) used aspertame and that, not aids caused his brain cancer. Wake up people.:)
 
There is an unusually high number of people having apparent side effects related to aspartame consumption. I used to consume large amounts of aspartame and nothing is wrong with me. (except that I underwent multiple surgeries, chemotherapy and radiotherapy for a malignant cancer I had on one of my kidneys 4 years ago).

However, I have also noticed for the people I have supervised in weight loss programs that those who switched to diet soft drinks containing aspartame did not lose weight with much success compared to those who switched to other forms of low or no calorie drinks. Even those who continued to drink regular colas tend to lose weight more easily. I have heard that a recent study suggested that aspartame may interfere with insulin sensitivity. I don't need that.

I'm not really a conspiracy buff with aspartame, but it is interesting how it is mentioned with caution in pilot's flight manuals (in one of the armed services) regarding the link of aspartame to neurological problems.

My feeling is that it is not as dangerous as these groups make it out to be. However, as I have seen with the overweight, no need to take in something that has a central tendency in any study group to restrict or impair any weight loss efforts. So on that end I will avoid it.
 
My feeling is that it is not as dangerous as these groups make it out to be. However, as I have seen with the overweight, no need to take in something that has a central tendency in any study group to restrict or impair any weight loss efforts. So on that end I will avoid it.

There is a reason that these people are fat, its because they eat like pigs, not because they consume diet soft drinks. Its the dozen or so donuts that they gorge on before they wash everything down with diet coke. Think how often have you see a fat slob order two big macs a large order of fries, four macapple pies or what the ever the hell there called and a diet coke. Nine times out of ten they choose to blame the diet soft drink for making them fat. Another thing unless a fattie is being observed 24/7 they lie about how much they are actually eating, this is true of all lard asses.:elephant: :elephant: :elephant:
 
liftsiron said:
There is a reason that these people are fat, its because they eat like pigs, not because they consume diet soft drinks. Its the dozen or so donuts that they gorge on before they wash everything down with diet coke. Think how often have you see a fat slob order two big macs a large order of fries, four macapple pies or what the ever the hell there called and a diet coke. Nine times out of ten they choose to blame the diet soft drink for making them fat. Another thing unless a fattie is being observed 24/7 they lie about how much they are actually eating, this is true of all lard asses.



In general, I agree that obesity in the US is a disease of self-indulgence and opportunity. The persons you are describing above we can all normally agree follow virtually none of the principles of healthy living. That they would expect a diet drink to be a free pass to eat whatever they like without consequence is shameful. As Confucious might say, "fast food speed way to grave". If we outlawed fast food restaurants we could probably cut obesity rates severely. But then again, we would still have those who don't care to cut back or do what is necessary to achieve a better state of health. For those people, I would agree with the above description.

However, this is not the case with the majority of people whom I was describing. Usually they ask my opinion after many other methods have failed. While it is not absolute for all of them that they are or are not lying to me about intake, I do have certain requirements that make it harder for someone to cheat without being caught. When possible I like to involve loved ones who will support the individual in their attempts. When I set up the plan with a person, I do not initially espouse the negatives regarding diet sodas containing aspartame, so I have not given prejudice one way or the other. That is because I have not made my mind up about aspartame diet drinks or foods as of yet...even though I am beginning to see the trend. So I leave them to try and abide by some the principles set forth; not too many rules in the beginning, so they don't lose hope or willpower. I set up an example diet plan as well as recommend certain recipe books from which they can select foods to eat at home and occasionally when they eat out. But the most important aspect is exercise addition and increased cardiovascular activities. As they keep a journal of their progress, as a general rule, when they are not losing weight as they normally should, I question them further about their specific methods and make suggestions to support their endeavors. It's not impossible, but it is somewhat difficult to have both the patient and their supporting family member to have identical lies filled out on their questionnaires. When they show dismay at not having lost weight after a given amount of time, then I specifically question them as to their methods. This is often when I find out how much diet drinks containing aspartame they are consuming. Sometimes they fail to mention in their journals that they consume aspartame products in between meals. When they remove these products there is a central tendency for weight loss tends to occur more easily and as expected. I normally don't like to jump on the conspiracy bandwagon, nor do I believe 90% of the internet rumors about aspartame. However, it is an interesting finding to me that more than a few bariatric physicians have also outlined the same concerns in the absence of any real studies to find out if aspartame is a potential culprit. So my findings are not unique

Obese people who are going to lose weight must have the following criteria:

1) they are sick of being obese
2) they know they need help
3) they are really ready to do something about it
4) they are realistic about their weight loss goals

If they don't have these things, then they aren't ready for my help. I'm not a miracle worker so I can only work with a person as long as their willpower is not exceeded by either their expectations or their ability to see a goal and stick to the plan. So the people you described above really don't fit the type of clientele who I tend to try and help.

Not all people who need to lose weight fit the description you speak of. A few of these people, believe it or not, may be able to do cardio longer than you or many other people can. Some of these few may even be in better cardiovascular shape than you and me both (since I don't do tons of cardio, this is not all that hard). Being in shape from a clinical standpoint is not just a function of bodyfat percent. It is defined partially by how fast your heart rate among other things returns to normal following some measure of exercise. I've even seen people with 40+ pounds of fat to lose who have better returns-to-normal rates than myself. That is usually both a confidence boost and a reality check for them when I tell them, "look you're cardiovascular system is in very good shape. Now it's time to make it even stronger by reducing the amount of tissue your heart is having to circulate blood through."

Not that that is of ultra importance, but the bottom line from my experience and observation is that if the diet contains either an average or above average amount of carbs (nearly regardless of quality) that addition of aspartame products has appeared to hamper efforts, nearly regardless of amount of cardio. So for those who go on CKD diets, or sustained low carb diets, addition of aspartame may inhibit weight loss for just a small percent. This is interesting. This may or may not be true in the long run for the rest of diet methods, but from appearances of 6 months to 1 year maintaining a few varied weight loss schedules it appears that aspartame might play a negative part in weight loss efforts.

Not the rule, just my observations.
 
Back Doc that was a very impressive response, and I'm sure that you have helped many obese people and continue to do so. The key to fat loss in the majority of the people that I have worked with is carb control not elimination of aspertame. I also direct my clients towards a lower fat intake as well. We shoot for approx 45% Kcals from prot, 40% Kcals from carbs and approx 15% Kcals from fat. I also have read many articles concerning aspertame and fat loss, many claim that it stimulates the appetite. I tend to believe that the appetite is stimulated by the reduction in Kcal intake by the person on the diet more than by aspertame. I've had extremely good luck utilizing aspertame as a tool in my work with the obese and bodybuilding competitors. As you point out more study on aspertame and fat loss needs to be done. My sarcasm was not directed at you or any members of the board, but at misinformation in general that so easily influences people either toward or against certain products, and issues without the necessary science to back it up. I encourage everyone to research and experiment so that you can make your own educated decisions.
 
No, no I didn't take it as personal at all. Just that the clients I get tend to be those resistant to most forms of weight loss. Not all of them, but many. I usually require that the person have a set amount of targeted weight to lose in addition to having tried several measures. I ask them on questionnaire interview how many diets they've tried and what specifically. If they only list a couple, or if they only have a few pounds to lose then I usually refer them to a personal trainer. I don't specifically seek out weight loss patients, but if they ask for my help I provide it on the condition that they have very few places left to turn.

It it certainly not unique with aspartame, so that leaves me to considering the possibility that it might affect an already improperly functioning digestive and endocrine system. This may explain why some people tend to lose weight easily with the addition of aspartame products while others it seems to add difficulty. So I'm absolutely not dead set against aspartame.

Actually I have found there are different weight loss techniques specific to different people. I have found that there is a reason explaining why some people are able to lose weight on a low carb diet and others have better success with low fat, and still others only need caloric deficit in general. So far I've got some interesting data and I'm expecting that in a few months I will have a measured way of determining how to tell what specific weight loss plan (of the above varieties) will likely work best.

Who knows. Some fantastically powerful weight loss pill may be discovered and marketed tomorrow and I'll be sitting on a mound of useless paperwork.
:)
 
Yep, and one key is to find the identifying signs for some of the possible categories for what method might serve a given individual best thus shortening the process with a few failures as possible.
 
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