Another noobie looking for answers to his ignorance

[Anothergymrat]

The purpose of me creating this thread is to fill in the blank spaces I am finding as I look to finish creating my next full cycle. This thread will be broken down into 2 sections:

I. What my original plan is for my next cycle

II. Questions I still have about the completion of my cycle

I would also like to take the time out and share the fact that the last thing I want to do on a forum like this, is come across as lazy. I assure that the questions in section 3 are solely there due to the fact that I have found conflicting information that has left me still questioning things, so in order to do this correctly I am finally utilizing the option of creating a thread on what I believe to be a reputable message board to exhaust every option in pursuit of the end goal which is again to do things correctly and of course....be a beast

Short BIO:

Body Weight - 73kgs
Age - 27

1RM Bench - 250lbs (Just started lifting heavy again with chest for the first time after 11 months)

1RM Squat - 325lbs

1RM Dead - 410lbs

GOALS:

Body Weight - 84kgs

1RM Bench - 315lbs
1RM Squat - 405lbs
1RM Dead - 530lbs

Section I

1. Test Cypionate 500mgs/Week for 12 weeks
2. Deca 300mgs/Week for 10 weeks
3. AI of either Aromasin or Adex, Adex @ 0.5mgs EOD or 0.25mgs ED, Aromasin dosage unknown for now
4. Caber to take in conjunction with Deca, dosage also unknown for now
5. HCG @ 500ius per week in conjunction with at least the duration of my use with Deca (pending)

PCT:

1. Clomid - 50/50/25/25/12.5
2. Nolva - 40/40/20/20/12.5
3. HCG - 500-700ius per week for 5

Section II

1. Is the HCG during or post an absolute necessity for a cycle of Deca/Test C? I only ask because it is hard enough to find a trustworthy source of the test alone, that if I can cut having to find a source for HCG because it is not a necessity I will, however, if HCG is a deal breaker for this cycle I will find a way to obtain it

2. Aromasin, is this necessary to combine with Adex? Should I take it in place of Adex? I hate asking, but what is the recommended dosage? The only reason I am contemplating adding in Aromasin is because I have gathered empirically that it may or may not be a good idea to run with Deca

3. I am only adding Deca due to the collagen synthesis increase to aid in joint health, so I again have gathered from research that 300mgs is a fair dosage size if utilizing Deca solely for joint support, however, the nitrogen retention and IGF spikes would not be a bad thing. However, based off of what I am using Deca for, is 300mgs enough?

4. If Test C has a half life of 2.5 days, I am pinning twice a week for 500mgs per week, but if the half life of Deca is 15 days, does that mean I am pinning once every 2 weeks?

5. I have heard both sides of this argument, is there any merit to running both Nolva and Clomid at the same time for a PCT? Aside from those 2, should I be running anything in addition? The 2nd part of this question relies on whether or not HCG is again, a necessity

6. Is it worth it to test taper for 14 days after my last pin of Test C, if it is, how does that affect the tapering period from ending Deca 2 weeks before I end my Test C cycle, essentially if I taper 14 days after my last pin of Test C, than technically that would mean Deca would have been out of my system for a combined 4 weeks (roughly) this sounds like it may or may not yield some nasty side effects

7. Is Caber an actual necessity for use in the duration of my use of Deca? If so, what is the recommended dosage for Caber?

Thank you all for bearing with me at this moment, I do apologize if any part of this forum was just dumb ignorance. As the title reads I do consider myself a noob by all means. So in turn, any and all advice is greatly appreciated.

P.S. On the parts of section II where I am blatantly asking for dosage amounts, feel free to direct me to other articles that would answer my question that I may have missed, I will gladly do my own research over having to bother people

 

[STTM]

1. HCG is not hard to find, and it is pretty damn cheap. I would recommended it on cycle because it will help limit shutdown, keep the boys full, and help transition into PCT. Also, Deca can be a bitch to recovery from.. so you don't want to take any short cuts.

2. You can run either adex or aromasin. The amount depends on how much gear you are running. I personally prefer aromasin. I think you should start your dosing at 12.5mg every day, and the adjust from there. I don't know why you wouldn't run it with Deca..

3. If you are only using deca for the joints, then 300mg is too much. 100-200mg a week is all you need for that. But if you want to run it for the muscle building purposes.. then 300-400mg a week is good. If you only want it for joints.. think about NPP. Does the same thing, with quicker results, and easier to recover from.

4. Your Test C half life is a bit off.. it is more life 7-10 days. You should pin it at least twice a week, though some say you can get away with only one pin. Deca an be pinned once a week. I would not go bi-weekly.

5. Clomid and Nolva can be ran together. It is a good idea, especially if you are prone to gyno. You should not use HCG in the PCT phase, only before PCT. And a must have in PCT is aromasin. Nolva and Clomid will block estrogen, but it won't lower it in the body. The aromasin will keep E low, so you don't have to worry about it rebounding once you come off the serms.

6. You can taper down if you like, but I see no need. At 500mg a week, how much are you going to taper down too? Just keep it the same and then come off completely. Stopping the deca 2 weeks before the test is a good protocol.

7. You need caber. 1mg a week total. Split the dosing up.. just .5mg twice a week.

 

[EZ_E]

How tall are you?

 

[Anothergymrat]

5'9"

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[Anothergymrat]

STTM, your help is much appreciated, what does NPP stand for? Also is there a formula I can convert MGs to ML for dosing purposes?

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[Zyglamail]

Dude, upur 5'9 160lbs...whats your training history. My initial impression is you need to spend some more time under the bar naturally before you jump on AAS, especially as much as you plan on running.There is no reason someone who is serious about lifting cant put on at least 25lbs naturally in a year or 2 and maintain it. I have a hard time believing you started at 140lbs.

Jumping on gear without a base causes all sorts of problems and chronic injuries. you need to build a base first.

 

[stevesmi]

horrible cycle and horrible PCT for a newb.

please don't run this. see the other threads on here about guys who ran deca and can't recover, if you want to join that list then run your cycle and pct as you have listed

 

[EZ_E]

dude, upur 5'9 160lbs...whats your training history. My initial impression is you need to spend some more time under the bar naturally before you jump on aas, especially as much as you plan on running.there is no reason someone who is serious about lifting cant put on at least 25lbs naturally in a year or 2 and maintain it. I have a hard time believing you started at 140lbs.

Jumping on gear without a base causes all sorts of problems and chronic injuries. you need to build a base first.

+1

 

[Anothergymrat]

Dude, upur 5'9 160lbs...whats your training history. My initial impression is you need to spend some more time under the bar naturally before you jump on AAS, especially as much as you plan on running.There is no reason someone who is serious about lifting cant put on at least 25lbs naturally in a year or 2 and maintain it. I have a hard time believing you started at 140lbs.

Jumping on gear without a base causes all sorts of problems and chronic injuries. you need to build a base first.

I have spent time under the bar naturally for 10 years as well as a few local powerlifting comps, so I get it, I'm not a pro... I did my first beginner's cycle of Test Cyp at 500mgs a week roughly 2 years ago. I also never started at 140lbs. I am heavily considering changing my addition of Deca to the cycle and replacing it with something else..

 

[Zyglamail]

I have spent time under the bar naturally for 10 years as well as a few local powerlifting comps, so I get it, I'm not a pro... I did my first beginner's cycle of Test Cyp at 500mgs a week roughly 2 years ago. I also never started at 140lbs. I am heavily considering changing my addition of Deca to the cycle and replacing it with something else..

I suspected you didnt start at 140lbs and thats my whole point. Youve been lifting for 10 years AND you have previously cycled and your still only 160lbs at 5'9".

If you cant get near 200lbs without drugs then you really have no business using them because your game plan is seriously flawed. I dont know where your problem is, but 10 years of lifting and still 160lbs tells me somethings not right and you should get that address before jumping on AAS or your just wasting your time, money and energy. Do I expect you to listen? Of course not but you did ask for opinions.

And for reference I put on 45-50lbs naturally before I ever touched aas.

 

[Anothergymrat]

I suspected you didnt start at 140lbs and thats my whole point. Youve been lifting for 10 years AND you have previously cycled and your still only 160lbs at 5'9".

If you cant get near 200lbs without drugs then you really have no business using them because your game plan is seriously flawed. I dont know where your problem is, but 10 years of lifting and still 160lbs tells me somethings not right and you should get that address before jumping on AAS or your just wasting your time, money and energy. Do I expect you to listen? Of course not but you did ask for opinions.

And for reference I put on 45-50lbs naturally before I ever touched aas.

To be fair, why would you automatically assume that I'm not going to listen to someone who may have a more tenuous grasp on the use of gear than I do? Also, I can assure that the reason I have stayed at 160lbs body weight is nothing short of purposive. I have only been powerlifting for 2 years out of the 12 total I have been in the gym. Before those 2 years of powerlifting I was purposively keeping my bf at 5% after I had my fill of low bf percentages, I transitioned into powerlifting which I was roughly up to 180lbs due to the aforementioned cycle of Test C, however a bursa sac tear brought me down to what I am now and I am finally injury free for the first time in awhile and I also consequently have the time, money, etc. for a good 12 weeker. So in short, there is a reason I am at what I am at weight wise and numbers wise again, which I think contains at least some merit

 

[Zyglamail]

To be fair, why would you automatically assume that I'm not going to listen to someone who may have a more tenuous grasp on the use of gear than I do? Also, I can assure that the reason I have stayed at 160lbs body weight is nothing short of purposive. I have only been powerlifting for 2 years out of the 12 total I have been in the gym. Before those 2 years of powerlifting I was purposively keeping my bf at 5% after I had my fill of low bf percentages, I transitioned into powerlifting which I was roughly up to 180lbs due to the aforementioned cycle of Test C, however a bursa sac tear brought me down to what I am now and I am finally injury free for the first time in awhile and I also consequently have the time, money, etc. for a good 12 weeker. So in short, there is a reason I am at what I am at weight wise and numbers wise again, which I think contains at least some merit

Just one more reason not to jump on a cycle yet. Your down to 160 from 180 due to an injury. Why not work back up to 180 naturally and see if you remain injury free. Then run your cycle.

One of the biggest problems we see here is guys have no history lifting, they jump on a cycle as a shortcut, make great strength gains and blow a tendon or otherwise hurt themselves. Connective tissues strengthens MUCH slower than muscle gains strength, especially in the early stages of lifting. They succumb to injuries lose all their gains OR even worse simply fight through the pain keep lifting and cause long term, often permanent damage all because they were too impatient.

Now yes, you apparently have a history of lifting, but also an injury so the same common sense should apply and if you have legitimately been 180 then gaining it back should come rather fast.

The reason I assume your not going to listen is because every time you reply you have a rebuttal, like your trying to convince me. This generally means your mind is made up and your just looking for people to "take your side" and support your position.

At the end of the day its your life and your body, do what ya want but keep in mind the reason so many of us are telling you what we are is because we see similar scenarios almost daily and we know the odds of having a successful cycle, keeping gains and staying healthy are stacked against those that try and pack it on without having a solid base. That applies not only to new lifters but returning lifter and those coming off injuries.

 

[Anothergymrat]

Just one more reason not to jump on a cycle yet. Your down to 160 from 180 due to an injury. Why not work back up to 180 naturally and see if you remain injury free. Then run your cycle.

One of the biggest problems we see here is guys have no history lifting, they jump on a cycle as a shortcut, make great strength gains and blow a tendon or otherwise hurt themselves. Connective tissues strengthens MUCH slower than muscle gains strength, especially in the early stages of lifting. They succumb to injuries lose all their gains OR even worse simply fight through the pain keep lifting and cause long term, often permanent damage all because they were too impatient.

Now yes, you apparently have a history of lifting, but also an injury so the same common sense should apply and if you have legitimately been 180 then gaining it back should come rather fast.

The reason I assume your not going to listen is because every time you reply you have a rebuttal, like your trying to convince me. This generally means your mind is made up and your just looking for people to "take your side" and support your position.

At the end of the day its your life and your body, do what ya want but keep in mind the reason so many of us are telling you what we are is because we see similar scenarios almost daily and we know the odds of having a successful cycle, keeping gains and staying healthy are stacked against those that try and pack it on without having a solid base. That applies not only to new lifters but returning lifter and those coming off injuries.

The reason I always have a rebuttal is because my undergrad was in Philosophy haha, so I guess old habits die hard. I gotta say though, it sucked reading what you had to say, not because I don't agree with it, but because what you had to say was plausible. I guess I just felt like a million bucks after hitting a couple numbers on squats and deads all natty which I only previously attained during my last cycle. So in essence, I am going to put this cycle on hold. I'm also after further research not going to run Deca with my next cycle. I am posturing a Tren E and Text C cycle instead when I can go injury free for awhile now.

 

[Anothergymrat]

I came here to be schooled, not whine when I hear something I don't like

 

[RADAR]

I came here to be schooled, not whine when I hear something I don't like

I applaud your open mindness, one suggestion i could offer you is why not just run a sarms cycle ? It will give you a slight boost and is mildly suppressive. I agree with Zyg you can't build rome on toothpicks, thats why a foundation is so important.

 

[Anothergymrat]

Might I inquire as to what a SARMS cycle is, (SARMS I am assuming stands for Selective Androgen Receptor Modules)

 

[RADAR]

Might I inquire as to what a SARMS cycle is, (SARMS I am assuming stands for Selective Androgen Receptor Modules)

Well you have 2 oprions Sarms-S-4
Or Ostra Which is a weaker version, however don't mistake it, you still need a constant supply of protein and nutrients to Grow.


S-4 at doses above 50mg a day will result in vision problems is some individuals ( Yellow hue in night time) this can be easily corrected by stopping a few days then resuming at a lower dose.


Ostra is a lite version of Sarms S-4 that has no sides but is slower in obtaining results.

 

[Anothergymrat]

Radar, your advice was a huge help I definitely appreciate it and will now start researching SARMS

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[EZ_E]

I came here to be schooled, not whine when I hear something I don't like

Well said bossman......listen to these guys Zyg & Radar are 2 of the best in the biz....

 

[dylangemelli]

okay bro... sorry i did not see this thread earlier but im glad i found it... i like the fact that you seem well educated and have done some of your own research... this is a good thing... some of the things you have said are flawed though and i can definitely help... deca is not a good choice for several reasons... one... its a temporary fix when it comes to joint and collagen issues... you will be worse off than before once your done... this should not be the purpose for it and you especially don't want to use it on a first cycle... even at a lower dose, which 300 really is not, most would go around 200 for just the joint and collagen wants, but 300 especially will bring along a lot of unwanted sides... your best bet is to use mk2866 for your healing purposes... read all of my sarms articles here... Selective Androgen Receptor Modulators (SARMS) - Evolutionary.org I would HIGHLY recommend starting off with sarms and a strong pro hormone before you move up to a test cycle... this will be an excellent way to get your body acclimated to new foreign substances and will provide the types of gains you are after... i have a full cycle layout for you with the links on where to get everything...

1-14 GW-501516 20 mg day SARMS1.COM - The best Selective androgen receptor modulators

1-12 s4 50 mg day SARMS1.COM - The best Selective androgen receptor modulators

1-12 lgd-4033 10 mg day SARMS1.COM - The best Selective androgen receptor modulators

1-12 “liquidex” Bodybuilding, Need to Build Muscle, Muscle Bodybuilding
1-12 n2guard n2bm.com
5-12 HCGenerate n2bm.com
7-12 oxandrovar 2 caps a day first 3 weeks then bump to 3 caps a day The #1 Supplier of Pro-Hormones - MyProH.com

PCT 13-16

clomid 50/50/25/25 AG-guys.com

nolva 40/20/20/20 ag-guys.com
aromasin 12..5 mg eod AG-guys.com
n2guard n2bm.com
ostarine 25 mg day SARMS1.COM - The best Selective androgen receptor modulators

 

[Anothergymrat]

Annnnd....it's reasons like above that I come to this site

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