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Tatyana
Elite Mentor
You used a lot of old Russian papers to say that your main ingredient worked.
Here is a more recent paper.
Usually, when there are positive results, the research papers EXPLODE, for example with things like creatine, nitric oxide, and the most recent promising supp, beta-alanine.
A more recent study
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=2129166
Effects of Methoxyisoflavone, Ecdysterone, and Sulfo-Polysaccharide Supplementation on Training Adaptations in Resistance-Trained Males
Colin D Wilborn,1 Lemuel W Taylor,2 Bill I Campbell,3 Chad Kerksick,4 Chris J Rasmussen,3 Michael Greenwood,3 and Richard B Kreider3
1Human Performance Lab, University of Mary Hardin Baylor, Belton, TX
2Exercise Physiology Lab, University of West Florida, Pensacola, FL
3Exercise and Sport Nutrition Laboratory, Baylor University, Waco, TX
4Applied Biochemistry and Molecular Physiology Laboratory, University of Oklahoma, Norman, OK
Corresponding author.
Richard B Kreider: [email protected]
Received September 8, 2006; Accepted November 16, 2006.
Methoxyisoflavone (M), 20-hydroxyecdysone (E), and sulfo-polysaccharide (CSP3) have been marketed to athletes as dietary supplements that can increase strength and muscle mass during resistance-training. However, little is known about their potential ergogenic value. The purpose of this study was to determine whether these supplements affect training adaptations and/or markers of muscle anabolism/catabolism in resistance-trained athletes.
Methods
Forty-five resistance-trained males (20.5 ± 3 yrs; 179 ± 7 cm, 84 ± 16 kg, 17.3 ± 9% body fat) were matched according to FFM and randomly assigned to ingest in a double blind manner supplements containing either a placebo (P); 800 mg/day of M; 200 mg of E; or, 1,000 mg/day of CSP3 for 8-weeks during training. At 0, 4, and 8-weeks, subjects donated fasting blood samples and completed comprehensive muscular strength, muscular endurance, anaerobic capacity, and body composition analysis. Data were analyzed by repeated measures ANOVA.
Results
No significant differences (p > 0.05) were observed in training adaptations among groups in the variables FFM, percent body fat, bench press 1 RM, leg press 1 RM or sprint peak power. Anabolic/catabolic analysis revealed no significant differences among groups in active testosterone (AT), free testosterone (FT), cortisol, the AT to cortisol ratio, urea nitrogen, creatinine, the blood urea nitrogen to creatinine ratio. In addition, no significant differences were seen from pre to post supplementation and/or training in AT, FT, or cortisol.
Conclusion
Results indicate that M, E, and CSP3 supplementation do not affect body composition or training adaptations nor do they influence the anabolic/catabolic hormone status or general markers of catabolism in resistance-trained males.
They say it doesn't work, however it may have something to do with the dosing.
Also, you only have 75 mg of ecdysterone in your supp. You do say you need to take 5 tablets, twice daily, so 7500 mg/day, however it does seem for the dosing to be effective, it needs to be taken more frequently, and with protien.
It seems you need to take 100mg-200mg of 95% 20 beta ecdysterone every hour or 2, throughout the day, up to amounts of 750mg-1200mg each day to get the best results, depending upon your bodyweight.
The reason for taking 95% 20 beta ecdysterone every hour or 2 throughout the day is that once you have taken it orally it only has a short life in your system to do its work which is around 2 hours and because its job is to make muscle by protein synthesis it has to be taken with protein, thefore if you take protein every hour take 100mg 95% beta edysterone ( 1 tablet ) with it and if you take protein every 2 hours then double the amount of beta ecdysterone ( 2 tablets ).
A link on this site about ecdysterone
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/bodybuilding-supplements/finally-truth-about-ecdysterone-689.html
Here is a more recent paper.
Usually, when there are positive results, the research papers EXPLODE, for example with things like creatine, nitric oxide, and the most recent promising supp, beta-alanine.
A more recent study
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=2129166
Effects of Methoxyisoflavone, Ecdysterone, and Sulfo-Polysaccharide Supplementation on Training Adaptations in Resistance-Trained Males
Colin D Wilborn,1 Lemuel W Taylor,2 Bill I Campbell,3 Chad Kerksick,4 Chris J Rasmussen,3 Michael Greenwood,3 and Richard B Kreider3
1Human Performance Lab, University of Mary Hardin Baylor, Belton, TX
2Exercise Physiology Lab, University of West Florida, Pensacola, FL
3Exercise and Sport Nutrition Laboratory, Baylor University, Waco, TX
4Applied Biochemistry and Molecular Physiology Laboratory, University of Oklahoma, Norman, OK
Corresponding author.
Richard B Kreider: [email protected]
Received September 8, 2006; Accepted November 16, 2006.
Methoxyisoflavone (M), 20-hydroxyecdysone (E), and sulfo-polysaccharide (CSP3) have been marketed to athletes as dietary supplements that can increase strength and muscle mass during resistance-training. However, little is known about their potential ergogenic value. The purpose of this study was to determine whether these supplements affect training adaptations and/or markers of muscle anabolism/catabolism in resistance-trained athletes.
Methods
Forty-five resistance-trained males (20.5 ± 3 yrs; 179 ± 7 cm, 84 ± 16 kg, 17.3 ± 9% body fat) were matched according to FFM and randomly assigned to ingest in a double blind manner supplements containing either a placebo (P); 800 mg/day of M; 200 mg of E; or, 1,000 mg/day of CSP3 for 8-weeks during training. At 0, 4, and 8-weeks, subjects donated fasting blood samples and completed comprehensive muscular strength, muscular endurance, anaerobic capacity, and body composition analysis. Data were analyzed by repeated measures ANOVA.
Results
No significant differences (p > 0.05) were observed in training adaptations among groups in the variables FFM, percent body fat, bench press 1 RM, leg press 1 RM or sprint peak power. Anabolic/catabolic analysis revealed no significant differences among groups in active testosterone (AT), free testosterone (FT), cortisol, the AT to cortisol ratio, urea nitrogen, creatinine, the blood urea nitrogen to creatinine ratio. In addition, no significant differences were seen from pre to post supplementation and/or training in AT, FT, or cortisol.
Conclusion
Results indicate that M, E, and CSP3 supplementation do not affect body composition or training adaptations nor do they influence the anabolic/catabolic hormone status or general markers of catabolism in resistance-trained males.
They say it doesn't work, however it may have something to do with the dosing.
Also, you only have 75 mg of ecdysterone in your supp. You do say you need to take 5 tablets, twice daily, so 7500 mg/day, however it does seem for the dosing to be effective, it needs to be taken more frequently, and with protien.
It seems you need to take 100mg-200mg of 95% 20 beta ecdysterone every hour or 2, throughout the day, up to amounts of 750mg-1200mg each day to get the best results, depending upon your bodyweight.
The reason for taking 95% 20 beta ecdysterone every hour or 2 throughout the day is that once you have taken it orally it only has a short life in your system to do its work which is around 2 hours and because its job is to make muscle by protein synthesis it has to be taken with protein, thefore if you take protein every hour take 100mg 95% beta edysterone ( 1 tablet ) with it and if you take protein every 2 hours then double the amount of beta ecdysterone ( 2 tablets ).
A link on this site about ecdysterone
http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/bodybuilding-supplements/finally-truth-about-ecdysterone-689.html
Tatyana
Elite Mentor
Another exerpt from the first paper I posted the link to.
The full paper is there if anyone wants to read it.
I thought this bit was interesting.
Ecdysterones have also been recently purported to enhance training adaptations during resistance training. In support of this contention, research in animal models has suggested that ecdysterone supplementation can promote anabolic activity in skeletal muscle [5], as well as increase cell proliferation and growth, which can lead to an increase in muscle mass [6]. Russian scientists' have been evaluating the effects of ecdysterones for years. Oral administration of Leuza (herbal ecdysterone) in male albino mice caused a statistically significant increase in the time of running [19]. After 20 days of supplementation, there was a significant increase in work capacity.
The same researchers evaluated the effects of 20-day administration of ectisten-containing tincture of leuzea and leveton on humoral immunity of track and field runners for distances of 5,000 and 10,000 m. Intensive cyclic physical activity induced significant decrease of IgG and IgA in blood serum of the athletes. These researchers concluded that both supplements contributed to restoration of the lowered IgG and IgA, while the working capacity of the athletes grew by 10 to 15% [20]. Furthermore, Chermnykh et al [5] compared beta-ecdysterone with dianabol which is an extremely powerful anabolic steroid, suggesting both beta-ecdysterone and dianabol increased the size and strength of the muscles. These researchers concluded that ecdysterone had a greater anabolic action on the contractile proteins of the skeletal muscles than dianabol.
The most often cited scientific study on ecdysterone was published in Scientific Sports Bulletin by Simakin [21]. This study sought to determine the effect of ecdysterone on muscle tissue mass and fat mass, while testing for hormonal changes in the subjects. Seventy-eight highly trained male and female athletes served as subjects in one of three experimental groups: protein, protein and ecdysterone, and placebo. Those consuming just protein, showed only a slight increase in muscle mass for the 10 day period of time, while the placebo group experienced a slight reduction in lean muscle. The addition of ecdysterone in conjunction with protein intake resulted in a 6–7% increase in lean muscle tissue with nearly a 10% reduction in fat. Finally, Gadzhieva and colleagues [22] reported that 3-weeks of Ekdisten, leveton, and Prime Plus (combination of Ekdisten and pure protein) supplementation during training increased skinfold determined muscle mass, decreased fat mass, and increased total work during training. Additionally, Ekdisten and Prime Plus supplementation appeared to promote the greatest gains during training. These studies found that ecdysterone might increase work capacity, decrease fat mass, and increase lean muscle mass.
Results of the present study contrast these reports. In this regard, ecdysterone supplementation had no significant effects on body mass, body composition, strength, or markers of anabolic and catabolic status. Since most of the previous studies reporting positive effects of ecdysterones have been reported in obscure journals with limited details available to evaluate the experimental design and quality of the research, it is difficult to compare results. Nevertheless, present findings do not support the purported ergogenic benefit of ecdysterone supplementation in resistance-trained males.
The full paper is there if anyone wants to read it.
I thought this bit was interesting.
Ecdysterones have also been recently purported to enhance training adaptations during resistance training. In support of this contention, research in animal models has suggested that ecdysterone supplementation can promote anabolic activity in skeletal muscle [5], as well as increase cell proliferation and growth, which can lead to an increase in muscle mass [6]. Russian scientists' have been evaluating the effects of ecdysterones for years. Oral administration of Leuza (herbal ecdysterone) in male albino mice caused a statistically significant increase in the time of running [19]. After 20 days of supplementation, there was a significant increase in work capacity.
The same researchers evaluated the effects of 20-day administration of ectisten-containing tincture of leuzea and leveton on humoral immunity of track and field runners for distances of 5,000 and 10,000 m. Intensive cyclic physical activity induced significant decrease of IgG and IgA in blood serum of the athletes. These researchers concluded that both supplements contributed to restoration of the lowered IgG and IgA, while the working capacity of the athletes grew by 10 to 15% [20]. Furthermore, Chermnykh et al [5] compared beta-ecdysterone with dianabol which is an extremely powerful anabolic steroid, suggesting both beta-ecdysterone and dianabol increased the size and strength of the muscles. These researchers concluded that ecdysterone had a greater anabolic action on the contractile proteins of the skeletal muscles than dianabol.
The most often cited scientific study on ecdysterone was published in Scientific Sports Bulletin by Simakin [21]. This study sought to determine the effect of ecdysterone on muscle tissue mass and fat mass, while testing for hormonal changes in the subjects. Seventy-eight highly trained male and female athletes served as subjects in one of three experimental groups: protein, protein and ecdysterone, and placebo. Those consuming just protein, showed only a slight increase in muscle mass for the 10 day period of time, while the placebo group experienced a slight reduction in lean muscle. The addition of ecdysterone in conjunction with protein intake resulted in a 6–7% increase in lean muscle tissue with nearly a 10% reduction in fat. Finally, Gadzhieva and colleagues [22] reported that 3-weeks of Ekdisten, leveton, and Prime Plus (combination of Ekdisten and pure protein) supplementation during training increased skinfold determined muscle mass, decreased fat mass, and increased total work during training. Additionally, Ekdisten and Prime Plus supplementation appeared to promote the greatest gains during training. These studies found that ecdysterone might increase work capacity, decrease fat mass, and increase lean muscle mass.
Results of the present study contrast these reports. In this regard, ecdysterone supplementation had no significant effects on body mass, body composition, strength, or markers of anabolic and catabolic status. Since most of the previous studies reporting positive effects of ecdysterones have been reported in obscure journals with limited details available to evaluate the experimental design and quality of the research, it is difficult to compare results. Nevertheless, present findings do not support the purported ergogenic benefit of ecdysterone supplementation in resistance-trained males.
Tatyana
Elite Mentor
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Citrulline malate: Does it work?
Citrulline malate is being promoted as a way to boost endurance and give you more energy to train harder and recover faster.
Citrulline malate
Citrulline malate is a mixture of citrulline, which is involved in the urea cycle, and malate, a tricarboxylic acid cycle intermediate. It is usually prescribed as an antiasthenic treatment.
Previous studies in humans and rats show that citrulline malate improves muscle performance of subjects suffering from asthenia (a condition which describes the loss or lack of body strength).
There are very few studies on citrulline malate. Most of them involve rats. In one such study, resistance to fatigue improved after treatment with citrulline malate [2].
In one of the few human studies, researchers examined the effects of supplementation with six grams of citrulline malate daily for 15 days [1].
The results show that citrulline malate led to a significant reduction in the sensation of fatigue, a 34% increase in the rate of oxidative ATP production during exercise, and a 20% increase in the rate of phosphocreatine recovery after exercise. This indicates a larger contribution of oxidative ATP synthesis to energy production.
These results are interesting, but the study does have various weaknesses.
Firstly, the study was not double-blinded with a placebo and control group.
Studies involving food supplements, sports drinks, energy bars and other performance aids usually follow this format. A placebo is a "fake" supplement used to reduce the influence of faith and belief in a treatment on the results of a study.
Double-blinded means that neither the researcher nor the test subject knows which supplement or drug they are getting. If either person knows, it can have a big influence on the results.
"The absence of a placebo control group meant that we could not eliminate a placebo effect," say the researchers, "which would have to be addressed by a double blinded placebo versus control trial."
The exercise test used to measure performance involved finger flexions performed at 1.5 second intervals with a six-kilogram (12 pounds) weight. We don't know if the same improvements in performance would be seen during exercises such as the squat or bench press.
What's more, the subjects were 18 inactive men who complained of fatigue. They weren't regular exercisers.
In other words, the subjects were tired, inactive men who performed finger exercises before and after supplementation. Because of this, the results don't neccesarily apply to active people wanting to lose fat and build muscle.
The bottom line is that citrulline malate does have the potential to enhance performance, but more relevant human research is needed before we can conclude that it enhances strength, muscle growth or fat loss.
Reference
1. Bendahan, D., Mattei, J.P., Ghattas, B., Confort-Gouny, S., Le Guern, M.E., & Cozzone, P.J. (2002). Citrulline/malate promotes aerobic energy production in human exercising muscle. British Journal of Sports Medicine, 36, 282-289
2. Goubel F, Vanhoutte C, Allaf O, Verleye M, Gillardin JM. (1997). Citrulline malate limits increase in muscle fatigue induced by bacterial endotoxins. Canadian Journal of Physiology and Pharmacology, 75, 205-207
Citrulline malate: Does it work?
Citrulline malate is being promoted as a way to boost endurance and give you more energy to train harder and recover faster.
Citrulline malate
Citrulline malate is a mixture of citrulline, which is involved in the urea cycle, and malate, a tricarboxylic acid cycle intermediate. It is usually prescribed as an antiasthenic treatment.
Previous studies in humans and rats show that citrulline malate improves muscle performance of subjects suffering from asthenia (a condition which describes the loss or lack of body strength).
There are very few studies on citrulline malate. Most of them involve rats. In one such study, resistance to fatigue improved after treatment with citrulline malate [2].
In one of the few human studies, researchers examined the effects of supplementation with six grams of citrulline malate daily for 15 days [1].
The results show that citrulline malate led to a significant reduction in the sensation of fatigue, a 34% increase in the rate of oxidative ATP production during exercise, and a 20% increase in the rate of phosphocreatine recovery after exercise. This indicates a larger contribution of oxidative ATP synthesis to energy production.
These results are interesting, but the study does have various weaknesses.
Firstly, the study was not double-blinded with a placebo and control group.
Studies involving food supplements, sports drinks, energy bars and other performance aids usually follow this format. A placebo is a "fake" supplement used to reduce the influence of faith and belief in a treatment on the results of a study.
Double-blinded means that neither the researcher nor the test subject knows which supplement or drug they are getting. If either person knows, it can have a big influence on the results.
"The absence of a placebo control group meant that we could not eliminate a placebo effect," say the researchers, "which would have to be addressed by a double blinded placebo versus control trial."
The exercise test used to measure performance involved finger flexions performed at 1.5 second intervals with a six-kilogram (12 pounds) weight. We don't know if the same improvements in performance would be seen during exercises such as the squat or bench press.
What's more, the subjects were 18 inactive men who complained of fatigue. They weren't regular exercisers.
In other words, the subjects were tired, inactive men who performed finger exercises before and after supplementation. Because of this, the results don't neccesarily apply to active people wanting to lose fat and build muscle.
The bottom line is that citrulline malate does have the potential to enhance performance, but more relevant human research is needed before we can conclude that it enhances strength, muscle growth or fat loss.
Reference
1. Bendahan, D., Mattei, J.P., Ghattas, B., Confort-Gouny, S., Le Guern, M.E., & Cozzone, P.J. (2002). Citrulline/malate promotes aerobic energy production in human exercising muscle. British Journal of Sports Medicine, 36, 282-289
2. Goubel F, Vanhoutte C, Allaf O, Verleye M, Gillardin JM. (1997). Citrulline malate limits increase in muscle fatigue induced by bacterial endotoxins. Canadian Journal of Physiology and Pharmacology, 75, 205-207
Tatyana
Elite Mentor
J Nutr. 2007 Jun;137(6):1621S-5S. Links
Citrulline: a new player in the control of nitrogen homeostasis.
Moinard C,
Cynober L.
Laboratoire de Biologie de la Nutrition, EA 2498, Faculte de Pharmacie, Universite Paris Descartes, France and 5Laboratoire Biochimie, Hotel-Dieu, AP-HP, Paris 75004, France.
Citrulline (CIT) is an amino acid that is not involved in protein synthesis but that is tightly linked to arginine (ARG) metabolism. CIT displays a very specific metabolism: In the 1980s, Windmuller demonstrated that the small intestine releases CIT, which is mainly taken up by the kidney and metabolized into ARG. Because CIT is not taken up by the liver, this ARG-CIT-ARG cycle can be seen as a means of protecting dietary ARG from liver degradation and of sustaining protein homeostasis. These observations have led to the concept that plasma CIT concentration would be a good marker of intestinal failure in short bowel syndrome. Hence, in massive intestinal resection, citrullinemia is greatly reduced, and this is proportional to the severity of the intestinal disease. This concept was then extended to other situations in which the intestinal function is compromised. The data strongly suggest that CIT may be a conditionally essential amino acid in situations where the intestinal function is compromised. Recent data support this idea. Thus, CIT supplementation is able to restore nitrogen balance, generate large amounts of ARG in rats with short bowel syndrome, and increase muscle protein content (+20%) as well as muscle protein synthesis (+90%) in elderly malnourished rats. Finally, recent data indicate that CIT per se could be able to stimulate muscle protein synthesis. Hence, CIT could play a pivotal role in maintaining protein homeostasis, and the determination of the underlying mechanisms involved in its action should be important for the development of new nutritional strategies in malnourished patients with compromised intestinal functions.
PMID: 17513438 [PubMed - in process]
Citrulline: a new player in the control of nitrogen homeostasis.
Moinard C,
Cynober L.
Laboratoire de Biologie de la Nutrition, EA 2498, Faculte de Pharmacie, Universite Paris Descartes, France and 5Laboratoire Biochimie, Hotel-Dieu, AP-HP, Paris 75004, France.
Citrulline (CIT) is an amino acid that is not involved in protein synthesis but that is tightly linked to arginine (ARG) metabolism. CIT displays a very specific metabolism: In the 1980s, Windmuller demonstrated that the small intestine releases CIT, which is mainly taken up by the kidney and metabolized into ARG. Because CIT is not taken up by the liver, this ARG-CIT-ARG cycle can be seen as a means of protecting dietary ARG from liver degradation and of sustaining protein homeostasis. These observations have led to the concept that plasma CIT concentration would be a good marker of intestinal failure in short bowel syndrome. Hence, in massive intestinal resection, citrullinemia is greatly reduced, and this is proportional to the severity of the intestinal disease. This concept was then extended to other situations in which the intestinal function is compromised. The data strongly suggest that CIT may be a conditionally essential amino acid in situations where the intestinal function is compromised. Recent data support this idea. Thus, CIT supplementation is able to restore nitrogen balance, generate large amounts of ARG in rats with short bowel syndrome, and increase muscle protein content (+20%) as well as muscle protein synthesis (+90%) in elderly malnourished rats. Finally, recent data indicate that CIT per se could be able to stimulate muscle protein synthesis. Hence, CIT could play a pivotal role in maintaining protein homeostasis, and the determination of the underlying mechanisms involved in its action should be important for the development of new nutritional strategies in malnourished patients with compromised intestinal functions.
PMID: 17513438 [PubMed - in process]
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