1st Cycle for Cyclist: Have conflicting advice!!!!!!

[BallzoutSprinter]

To all who respond with their knowledge and expertise:

a BIG thank you.....

Now.. heres my question... i am an endurance athlete that is going to do a cycle for the first time in my life... im 32 5'11" 178 at about 9-10% bf... ok heres the cycle, my questions, and at the end, the SERIOUSLY CONFLICTING OPINIONS of several people....

HGH- 20 weeks- no slin - 4 iu's per day split 2 morn 2 evening
Winny - 6 weeks - oral- 25mg per day split every morn/afternoon
Anavar - 8 weeks - 20 mg per day split morning afternoon

OK, heres the question... i have been advised to take milk thistle and ALA starting from day one.... then someone told me that milk thistle is worthless, and that i should take 1500-2000mg NAC and 900mg ALA daily.... so... can someone clear that up for me??

NEXT: L-dex or novaldex? is one better than the other? are they necessary considering the LOW doses im taking.... (by the way, my intention is NOT to get huge, but rather stronger, leaner, and faster....... putting on a bunch of weight is not what i want)...

LASTLY: Clomid dose that was recommended: "after var and winny, you'll need some clomid. Start out taking 300mg for 2 days then 100mg for 3 days then 50mg for 9 days"

Is there anything terribly wrong with this cycle the way i have it? any suggestions, and help is truly appreciated, as i have no desire to harm myself, i do thank you for being gracious enough to help.......

QUOTE #1:
it seems to me you have done your research. go with the liquadex, and defienetly use the clomid. try and get some profasi as well it helps kick start everything. as far as the milk thistle goes i have used it and dont really care for it. i think its a mental thing that you are guarding your liver.

QUOTE #2:
I wouldn't use gh since this is your first cycle. Take you milk thistle ala and mabey some tyler liver detox. I would through some test prop in there weeks weeks 1-8 instead of the gh. Weather you bulk up or cut down depends mostly on your diet. Start clomid week 9 and use as you mentioned

QUOTE #3:
Liquidex/anastrozole is not necessary with these compounds as neither of them aromatize into estrogen

QUOTE#4:
I don't like your cycle...winny for 8 weeks is too long if you want to be safe.

Good news is you will NOT need liquidex or nolvadex as the drugs you are using do not aromatize to estrogen.

You don't really need a full clomid recovery on this cycle(plus you are running HGH). After your cycle, if your nuts shrink take 100mg for a few days followed by 50mg for a couple of weeks...

Of course, all this advice has to be taken with the following in mind: it came from a bunch of musclebound BB's who have no interest in climbing a hill on a bike with that in mind.... do any of these guys make valid points? i sure could use a hand decipering what is truth and what is opinion..... Rider, Triguy, Fhg... thanks for taking a gander, and commenting if you can....

PEACE!

 

[rider]

alright, the milk thistle.. its like a multi-vitamin, do you really need it? does it really make a big difference? probably not, does it hurt to take it? definitly not, might as well use it on the chance it could help.

I reccomended taking the liquidex because although neither var nor winny aromatize into estrogen they will cause some water bloat, im not a fan of being all bloated so if i were you id take it. again, its probably something you dont need but taking it wont hurt. nolva is used in case you start to develop gyno (liquidex will prevent this too), i mentioned it because I thought you might be doing test prop. in which case youd want to have it on hand and start using it if you started to develop gyno. you dont need it for the cycle you are doing now.

clomid, good thing to have and taking it will give you some gains. i dont know what the guy is thinking who said "you dont really need it" bullshit, id rather keep every once of strength gain i got off a cycle, maybe you wouldnt lose anything w/out it but you might, id take it to make sure. take it how FHG and I outlined earlier.

Winny for 8 weeks is along time and it will be tough on the liver, all oral steriods are. I think you will be fine but definitly stay away from any sort of alcohol or anything else that would be stressful on the liver. you are obviously a healthy active man in your peak years, i think you'll be fine.

as for the HGH, well from the research ive done its the best thing for a cyclist to take during the off season, and you mentioned using it in a previous cycle and at the low dose you will be doing I think its a good idea, BB's have this mind set that you should do a shit load of steriod cycles and when you stop gaining from those then use the GH, we are not BB's so i dont think this advice applies to us. I know the rep for DMT shoes and they have to send Laurent Jalabert a bigger pair 2x a year, hmmm hes over 30 and his feet are still growing? do you think jaja has done a shit load of hard steriod cycles before getting on GH? no.. so anyway, take the GH and enjoy it.

keep us posted and let us know how it goes, and i think itd only be fair to send FHG and I 10% of your 2003 winnings! haha jk. take care
rider

 

[BallzoutSprinter]

ok, so, lets say, i drop the Winny to 6 weeks... i start all three at the same time, right? or do i start the winny on week 3 of the var and hgh, so that i finish winny, and var at same time? that way i can start the clomid, etc... ???? never been on a cycle so the conventional wisdom that most have with regard to it, completely escapes me.... so, my question is... do i drink more water? eat more food? take more antioxidants? train longer than i would have? thanks!

 

[fhg43]

ok, so, lets say, i drop the Winny to 6 weeks... i start all three at the same time, right? or do i start the winny on week 3 of the var and hgh, so that i finish winny, and var at same time? that way i can start the clomid, etc... ???? never been on a cycle so the conventional wisdom that most have with regard to it, completely escapes me.... so, my question is... do i drink more water? eat more food? take more antioxidants? train longer than i would have? thanks!

What are you juicing for? Is there a particular event that you are looking to do well in?

FHG

 

[rider]

i would say to finish the var and winny at the same time so you can start the clomid (im not 100% sure on this though), start the hgh as soon as you want.. dont worry about the 16 weeks you have planned, if end up with extra take it, with HGH it doesnt really matter if you run it 16.5 weeks, 18 weeks or 2 years. I would definitly suggest drinking more water to flush out the liver as you are on 2 oral steriods and that will take its toll. experiment with the training, some guys swear they can train more while 'on' i wouldnt know as ive never done anything, but in theory it makes sense that you would be able to train more while on. i wouldnt eat more food because you will be prone to weight gain, stick to how you are eating now.. if you are really hungry, eat. its still early so dont sweat the weight too much but you dont want to end up like other guys that post here who put on 22lbs! take care
rider

 

[BallzoutSprinter]

What are you juicing for? Is there a particular event that you are looking to do well in?

FHG

I have been told continually that i have one of the most insane sprints that people have ever seen, yah, ok, great, but, i cant climb a hill to save my life, well, i can but dont like it, and i have trouble on LONG rides... so, i want to up my endurance, lighten my load... i could lose about 7lbs... get stronger, and if possible... faster... i mainly race crits but would enjoy being able to hang in for the sprint finishes in road races too..... i have decided that i wont ever be a strong climber, but theres soo much room for improvement that i want to be a much better climber than i currently am... anyway... thats where im at... thanks for all your help FHG!

 

[Bikeracer]

YOur situation is identical to mine. However, I am (was prior to cycle) 5'9 1/2" tall and 151.5 lbs. at 5.3 % hydrostatically tested.

Excellent sprint with death coming on hills 1/2 mile or longer. Power hills, killed em' every time. I get dropped on the long ones.

Anyway, IMHO, you should focus on lean! Strip the bf down to nothing. Get your bf around 5%. Be aware, though, that such low levels will increase your chances of colds, etc... Eat and recover well!

I was looking for some strength as well. Went on a decca/Sustanon/winny cycle and put on LOTS OF MUSCLE! Too much. I'm one month post cycle now and have dropped about 8 lbs., mainly bloat. GOtta get rid of the upper body growth that occurred without lifting any weights for the upper body...... When you blast the lower half, the upper half's gonna grow too.

My point: choose your gear wisely. I thought I could control the weight gain. WRONG! However, leg pressing 800 lbs. for reps was pretty cool, I must admit. Now I"m stuck on a mission of muscle catabolism and calorie counting to get back down to 150.


Conclusion: The answer we seek IMHO is the development of muscular endurance (high reps -lactic acid hell) in the gym and on the road. Also, we need to increase our ability to maintain high wattage output for 10 minutes or more to get over those blipping hills!

The light AAS should really help the strength and the on the bike workouts should dovetail it in to a great plan!

 

[triguy]

epo

someone forgot the magic word!


EEEEEEPPPPPPPOOOOOOOOO