17AA's and HDH/LDL

[Temple]

17AA's and HDL/LDL

I have read on a couple of different men's board where 17AA AAS are causing messed up HDL and LDL levels. Primarily seems to be winny they are talking about but they say that all 17AA do this and it seems they return to normal once the cycle is over. Do women see the changes in these numbers at the doses that we use or is it limited to the larger doses of men. Are there any risks in having these levels for a short period of time?

 

[MS]

It is mainly dose related, though you wouldn't want to start a winny cycle if you already have a poor triglyceride/cholesterol profile. 17 AA birth control pills can have the same effect.......I certainly wouldn't recommend taking winny AND BC pills at the same time.

 

[KEL]

I certainly wouldn't recommend taking winny AND BC pills at the same time.

I must have missed that information. I HAVE read girls should use something else other than BCP but I thought it was for bloating and female fat (hips). Care to elaborate?

 

[MS]

Well, yes, it's good to avoid estrogenic BCPs for all of those reasons (even if you're NOT taking oral AAS). It's just that the conjugated estrogens in BCPs are all 17-AA, and so are just as harsh on your liver as an equivalent dose of, say, winny. Mixing the two is a double burden on your liver (though still an overall small burden compared to some of the doses men take), and they are working at cross purposes in terms of muscle gain/fat loss. But getting pregnant is even harder on your BB goals..................

 

[Temple]

Vasectomy - best all around form of birth control from a woman't perspective

 

[wilson6]

The effects of C-17 AA oral androgens, even oxandrolone are not gender specific. Orals will decrease HDL and possibly raise LDL in women. The same will occur with oral contraceptives that contain 19-nor derived progesterones. Plenty in the literature to support this.

Is this a bad thing for otherwise healthy lean phsically active young women taking plenty of anti-oxidants in their diet? probably not.

For an obese middle-aged sedentary cigarette smoking mid-western type female, bad news.

W6

 

[Sassy69]

For an obese middle-aged sedentary cigarette smoking mid-western type female, bad news.

.... but if you're from the coast, don't sweat it!

 

[hardbdygrl]

The effects of C-17 AA oral androgens, even oxandrolone are not gender specific. Orals will decrease HDL and possibly raise LDL in women.
W6

wilson6, so im guessing thats not a good thing eh?

 

[MS]

"still an overall small burden compared to some of the doses men
take"

" for otherwise healthy lean phsically active young women taking plenty of anti-oxidants in their diet?".........

In other words it's not a major health concern if you're otherwise in good shape. It's a small risk, and since most BB women I know eat pretty clean, exercise and stay lean, don't smoke etc...it's not like there are other major dietary or lifestyle factors working against you.

 

[NY Muscle]

wilson6, so im guessing thats not a good thing eh?

HBG - HDL's is the "good" cholesterol while LDL's are the "bad"
think of HDL as "Healthy" then you can rememebr it better that way.

 

[hardbdygrl]

MS and NYM two smart cookies!!!

 

[Realgains]

All the 17 aa roids increase total serum cholesterol and reduce hdl as do larger doses of test or "safe" hormones like nandrolone. It is dose related so I doubt very much that the tiny doses have much affect with the ladies although there may be small changes with some.
The worst roid is Anandrol as this roid needs a large mg dose o be affective and as such has much more of the 17aa compound .Winny is noted to be quite bad too as it is 17 aa even in the injectable form.

The very worst thing a guy can do is to take an estrogen inhibitor like arimidex along with these roids(or testosterone or and other roid) There is no doubt that estrogen helps to prevent the cholesterol and hdl problems to a great extent and you ladies have some built in protection here

Steroid researchers Bill Roberts and Bill Llewellyn have noted a much better cholesterol profile with men that use novladex or clomid during a heavy cycle.

Ladies I wouldn't worry too much about the issue.

 

[wilson6]

"so I doubt very much that the tiny doses have much affect with the ladies"

For those ladies that use 10 - 15 mg/d of OX or Winny. Have your blood cholesterol checked when off (at least 10 weeks) then about 3/4 the way into a 10-12 week cycle of OX or Winny.

Post the results. You might be surprised.

W6

 

[Realgains]

"so I doubt very much that the tiny doses have much affect with the ladies"

For those ladies that use 10 - 15 mg/d of OX or Winny. Have your blood cholesterol checked when off (at least 10 weeks) then about 3/4 the way into a 10-12 week cycle of OX or Winny.

Post the results. You might be surprised.

W6

Never said NO change .....there will probably be some but nothing to worry about as long as your other risk factors for heart disease are in check.

Good idea though...get it checked before and after