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jondale123
New member
I was wanting to know if you think it is genetics or drugs that get you in Pro bodybuilding?
To be pro? Drugs or Genetics
- Thread starter jondale123
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Bulldog333
New member
Personally to me the compounds are the last factor in what it takes to be a pro. It takes genetics for a base. Countless years of hard work, dedication, discipline, education, execution, training, eating, dieting, refineing, sacrifice. To me all of this is what makes the pros a cut above. There bodies didn't just happen from having bad ass genetics(which they do) nor did their bodies come from slamming a few cycles together and then walking onstage. It took them years of hard work to achieve what they have and the drugs simply support their work ethic.
jondale123
New member
I agree 100% gear is the game breaker....... The more the better.
You need both great genetics and a lot of gear on top of spot on training and diet just to even have a shot at being a pro. It still would be a long shot even with all that. Bodybuilding pros are a rare breed.
If it were just a matter of taking more drugs, 90% of the guys on message boards would be pros.
Lighter Fighter
New member
Today's pro bb are all about drugs.. Back in arnold days it was all about hard work and dedication, now its about who can take the most drugs without dieing, with new technology we have acces to advanced drugs such as: growth hormone, very powerful steroid like tren which was not available in the 70s, powerful fat burners, insulin, igf-1, peptides and synthol.
With today's drugs aronld could beat almost anyone in competition and he would be over 300lb on stage since he's 6'2..
Today = 90% drugs 9% diet 1% training.
70s = 10% drugs 30% diet 60% HARD FUKING WORK
With today's drugs aronld could beat almost anyone in competition and he would be over 300lb on stage since he's 6'2..
Today = 90% drugs 9% diet 1% training.
70s = 10% drugs 30% diet 60% HARD FUKING WORK
Anotech
New member
But 98% of the guys on this board aren't running 3 grams of test, 1 gram of tren, T3, clen... And all sorts of concoctions.
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Genetics
this is where I agree 100% with nelson.
if you really believe that injecting 3 grams of juice in your body and sitting around watching tv and eating cheetos all day is all you need to do to be a pro is a slap in the face to those of us that live, sleep and eat this lifestyle.
and yes you need genetics too. i see dudes at my gym who bust their ass who go nowhere because their genetics suck. you need atleast good genetics to build muscle in the first place.. if you have bad genetics than you can still enjoy bodybuilding you just won't look as good as the other dude you train with. i was 16 and spent the entire summer training with a friend at the gym religiously.. our diets were pretty much the same.. but he went nowhere while i ended up being county champion in PLifting. now i don't have great genetics but they are good enough where i can train and get results.. he literally went nowhere, maybe a slight increase in strength but you couldn't tell he even worked out.
I would say YOU NEED training/diet... without that you will go nowhere and even if you don't use juice or have good genetics you will still improve, even if its like my friend and barely... combine that with genetics will determine how far up the ladder you go. and then finally steroids/compounds are the icing on the cake to boost you to the next level.. you need all 3.
and you want proof of what i say? just look at our transformation contest. look at the logs of what everyone did.. it was almost the same exact compounds being run with everyone. yet magically some guys did way better than others.. if it was all about the juice than why did PLJ improve so much better than everyone else? no its wasn't because the juice since everyone ran almost the exact same cycles.. he worked out twice a day and never put anything in his mouth that wasn't muscle building food.. plus his genetics were likely far superior than anyone else in the contest.. hence he blew everyone away..
what a wonderful display of evidence our own transformation contest. just like doing an experiment
if you really believe that injecting 3 grams of juice in your body and sitting around watching tv and eating cheetos all day is all you need to do to be a pro is a slap in the face to those of us that live, sleep and eat this lifestyle.
and yes you need genetics too. i see dudes at my gym who bust their ass who go nowhere because their genetics suck. you need atleast good genetics to build muscle in the first place.. if you have bad genetics than you can still enjoy bodybuilding you just won't look as good as the other dude you train with. i was 16 and spent the entire summer training with a friend at the gym religiously.. our diets were pretty much the same.. but he went nowhere while i ended up being county champion in PLifting. now i don't have great genetics but they are good enough where i can train and get results.. he literally went nowhere, maybe a slight increase in strength but you couldn't tell he even worked out.
I would say YOU NEED training/diet... without that you will go nowhere and even if you don't use juice or have good genetics you will still improve, even if its like my friend and barely... combine that with genetics will determine how far up the ladder you go. and then finally steroids/compounds are the icing on the cake to boost you to the next level.. you need all 3.
and you want proof of what i say? just look at our transformation contest. look at the logs of what everyone did.. it was almost the same exact compounds being run with everyone. yet magically some guys did way better than others.. if it was all about the juice than why did PLJ improve so much better than everyone else? no its wasn't because the juice since everyone ran almost the exact same cycles.. he worked out twice a day and never put anything in his mouth that wasn't muscle building food.. plus his genetics were likely far superior than anyone else in the contest.. hence he blew everyone away..
what a wonderful display of evidence our own transformation contest. just like doing an experiment
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infraredline
Banned
It's all of the above, you can't take gear and get to be 230-270 on stage with proper diet and training, however you also can't have a proper diet and train your ass off and get to be 230-270 on stage without gear
So honestly you need it all
Not to mention that if your genetics aren't there then you can't look like these pros do either
Anotech
New member
Would you agree hardworking trumps genetics? You don't HAVE to be 290 to be a pro?... I'm GOING to go pro, I live the shit! But my genetics will only get me 65-70% of the way.. Training and diet is the only way I'll make it. I dont need the juice but it makes it much easier.
everyone no matter how bad their genetics is can enjoy any sport.. even someone who is absolutely horrible at golf for example can still go play.. but no they will never be as good as Tiger Woods no matter how hard they work at it. same thing in tennis or swimming or any other sport.. you won't be as good as Andre Agassi or Roger Federer no matter what you do.. but that doesn't mean you cannot have fun and try to get better.
i can't inject myself with 4 grams of juice a week and go play in the Masters or US open and get nowhere.. i hope this analogy makes sense to those on here who think that its all about juicing... there is skill and genetics involved which to me go hand in hand
curls4girls
New member
GENETICS >>>
A guy with great genetics can get a whole lot bigger than an average man on juice.
(that's if the guy is 100% clean like he says he is lol)
A guy with great genetics can get a whole lot bigger than an average man on juice.
(that's if the guy is 100% clean like he says he is lol)
Exactly! If it were all a matter of drugs, most of these idiots would be pros.
Look at all the guys that have been chasing pro cards for years and years who take boatloads of drugs and still can't turn pro.
And a lot of them are taking as much or more drugs than the pros.
Some are, but maybe most aren't here at EF. But I can point you to several other boards where the guys there are running those kinds of doses and multiple drug stacks...and those guys still aren't pros either.
Don't you think that if drugs were 90% of the equation that there would be a lot more than the 400 or so pros there are today?
This is what's wrong with the younger generations of "bodybuilders" today, they think it's all about the drugs. Go ahead then and prove it.
You guys think it's all a matter of drugs, go ahead and take the drugs and turn pro.
you'd better be more than 190, unless you're about 4'6".
So you're going to be pro and you've been training since you were 13? How old are you now? How long you been on AAS and how many cycles? How tall are you? When do you plan on turning pro? Got any pics to post?
Irrelevant. AFter a gram the difference in benefit is nominal. And lots of guys use tren, T3, clen etc. The guys in the 60's didn;t use any of that stuff and still look better than these guys.
You either get that or not.
Anotech
New member
If your 270lbs and natural and try to lift the way Ronnie or Jay train, it wouldn't matter how much you eat or how great your genetics are- your going to overtrain. Those guys depend on the drugs to MAINTAIN those gain..
Jay was 220 and 6% at 19... How many f**king kids did you know in highschool that looked like that? I've been outta highschool for 4 years and at 165 and natural, I was one of most ripped kids...
Now you;re comparing 3 grams of test a week to being NATURAL? Dude, pick a point of view.
Anotech
New member
The question was can you be pro with just genetics or do drugs make the difference.. Nobody in the history of the world naturally has ever been 270lbs and 6%, nobody's genetic code allows for them to be 270lbs and 6%.. More steroids make you bigger, the more you take, the bigger you get. It's not even a point of view. It's science.
Silly argument. Of course you need drugs to be a pro. EVeryone in the world knows that. But it isn't the amount drugs that make a a pro. If all it took was more drugs to get bigger, believe me, there'd be guys 500 pounds with 5% bf and 30 inch arms. You got your "science" all wrong bro.
Discussion done.
Anotech
New member
Arnold.. The best genetics of all time!! Was what? 240?...
He couldn't even stand on stage next to phil, jay, or wolf at that size... He used the juice but not 3 grams of test per week.
Discussion done now
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Arnold didn't have the best genetics.. Lol. quit being a fanboy. Its genetics that determines how well you respond to gear as well. Saying gear is more important than genetics to makes a pro is just ignorant. Its all about genetics. For instance look at you and me. Im natural. Youve ran cycles. Youre stats still arent that great and your lifts arent either. Genetics+hard work>gear.
Anotech
New member
I bench 305 for reps.. Squat 3 plates and leg press 10 per side.. My lifts are fine sir
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Hey guys, I'm gathering a little information on my future cycle of the compounds listed above. I'm currently only using sust-500mg weekly, deca-250mg weekly, dbol-40 everyday.
I'm doing my first show next year and depending on how I fare my next bulking cycle will be (sust-deca-drol-hgh)
185lbs
11-12%
5'10
3 cycles
1.) How much HGH should I use to add mass with this cycle?
2.) How much of the other compounds should I use?
Earlier in the thread you said you have done 1 cycle. this post from early October says you have had 3, with the one you recently finished, so that is 4 cycles. You're caught in a lie. Do you expect me to believe you bench 305 for reps? Especially when you only squat 3 plates? Please dont post bullshit. Its clear you are full of it
Anotech
New member
I believe I said I ran half asses oral cycles when I was younger and one cycle without PCT.. So I have ran 1 REAL cycle.. Before you try to air somebody out, make sure you can outlift them
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Barbell B/O rows 185lbs 10 reps X 3
T-bar rows 185-215 X 3
Seated rows 80lbs X 5
Lat pulldowns 150 drop sets X 5
Assisted pull ups X 5 till failure
^Another post of yours from 2 months ago
I have a very hard time believing you bench 305 for reps when you are rowing 185.. The more posts of yours i read the more i don't believe anything you say. Lol
Anotech
New member
Dont really lift very heavy for back development.. Everybody trains different.. Too bad you just figured that out in this post
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Evan Tipps
Guest
I believe I said I ran half asses oral cycles when I was younger and one cycle without PCT.. So I have ran 1 REAL cycle.. Before you try to air somebody out, make sure you can outlift them
Hows that posture with benching 305 for reps and only rowing 185??? Lol.. Sorry bro but its easy to see the bullshit
Anotech
New member
For somebody who has such grand understanding of lifts and proper form.. You would know rows aren't exactly a great measure of strength. Have you been lifting for a year?
Anotech
New member
Abs can be trained daily? And calves? They are muscles.. Muscles need rest to grow.
Great question.. Rookie
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Lol bro.. Your squats/dl arent great.. And those are TRUE tests of strengths. Youre getting outsquated by a 17 year old. But lets not get off topic! You say no pro could get where they are without steroids.. But could they get their with average genetics? NO. There are tons of gym rats on juice but only 14 different Olympians? Why? Because of genetics.
Anotech
New member
What am I saying.. Why am I comparing myself to a Internet tough guy with a bad hair cut.
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Guess you dont want to go back to the post.. Im not gonna boast about my lifts on this thread. http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/m...r-old-workout-log-885073-68.html#post14585723 Go there if you want to see my lifts. But lets get back the the post! What do you have to say about there being thousands and thousands of juicers but only 14 different olympains?
Anotech
New member
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Rows are a huge compound lift. Pretty sure they are a measure of strength.
Anotech
New member
Dude.. You're small. Eat a sandwhich.
Focus on your own lifts tough guy.. I laugh at kids like you when I'm at the gym.
rustilldown
New member
Rows are definitely a compound lift. Involves lower back, core, lats rear delts biceps traps. Also you should be able to row within 20 lbs of your bench as a general rule of thumb. Strong lifts 5x5 style rows are my go to choice, deadlift stance touching plates to floor every rep. A certain measure of strength if you ask me.
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Evan Tipps
Guest
hm.. 6'0 218 at 17 years old.. Not that tiny bro! But hey my pics are all over the site.. Are yours?
Anotech
New member
hm.. 6'0 218 at 17 years old.. Not that tiny bro! But hey my pics are all over the site.. Are yours?
If I was 6'0 I'd be 220
Anotech
New member
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Evan Tipps
Guest
This dude is a tool bro no use
Anotech
New member
My girlfriend is LAUGHING at your pictures... Shes even chirping your workouts.
Cali72
New member
Really?
Better genetics than flex wheeler?
Arnold was gifted no doubt about that but he had poor legs and that wouldn't put him in the elite group of best genetics of all time.
SinisterUproar
New member
Dude we can all shoot 2 grams of test and a gram of Deca a week but it won't make us pros
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Hm? I outweigh you buy like 30 pounds bro. Im 17. Not sure how big you want a 17 year old to be lol. You have 4 cycles under your belt I have none. Again, where are your pictures?
Yes it takes great genetics, hard work, and a boat load of steroids. You cannot argue how much these guys use. Sure you don't get there by sitting on your ass but no one gets there without a lot of juice.
Massive amounts of test, HGH, insulin, and all sorts of others are basically required these days.
It's not about how good you look anymore. It's about how monsterously freakishly big you can make your body.
With that being the case, steroids will only become more and more important and it will stop being about who can be the most disciplined and more about who is willing to take the biggest risks with their bodies.
Sent from my PG86100 using EliteFitness
Massive amounts of test, HGH, insulin, and all sorts of others are basically required these days.
It's not about how good you look anymore. It's about how monsterously freakishly big you can make your body.
With that being the case, steroids will only become more and more important and it will stop being about who can be the most disciplined and more about who is willing to take the biggest risks with their bodies.
Sent from my PG86100 using EliteFitness
Anotech
New member
Lol I do this for myself bro.. Not to be judged by some 17yo huggeeeee guy.. And from your pics, you have very little to be bregging about buddy
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Evan Tipps
Guest
All the top notch bbers run the same shit. at the same doses pretty much. But its clear some look 10x better than others. Why? Genetics. Its all about genetics
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Anotech
New member
The average guy with good genetics, trains hard, diets properly will be blown away by the guy who shoots juice and lifts twice a week.
Anotech
New member
Why you so mad bro? Talk shit once you hit 200!quit stealing the ops thread.
Talk shit when you can bench 3 bills.. For such a BIG guy, you should be able to do that.
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Lol im not saying im big. My max is right at 300lbs. But who cares about maxing? Again, post up some pics soon to be pro bber!
Anotech
New member
You were the one who started talking about my lifts?!?! Good max... Try working in the 10-12 range.
way to avoid the first question. Are you pulling 585 for 2 or not? Let's get a video of that.
assuming they both have relatively the same genetics? Nope. Sorry.
Also, you can train pretty damn hard and still only lift twice a week. Hard training isn't measured by how often you lift. Read a book.
How old are you again? For a 17 year old evan has a pretty damn good base. I'd bet he could gain another 20 pounds or more naturally of lean mass over the next 2-4 years with the right diet, training and proper dedication.
Pretty ballsy, at 185, telling him to eat a sandwich?
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Evan Tipps
Guest
Lol holy shit dude have some respect for the mods. You weigh 180 bro fuck off seriously. Post up pics or gtfo
Evan's got a good point. Your claims don't add up. You say you pull 585 x 2, yet you only row 185?
You think becoming a pro takes a boatload of drug and average genetics. You're wrong.
By the way, Ronnie Coleman got his pro card as a natural bodybuilder. Can you say, "genetics"?
I'll put my foot in your ass too and you can ride it out the door. You talk a lot of shit for such a skinny little guy. Go ahead and turn pro dude. Statistically, you have at least a 4 times better chance at becoming a professional football player.
unfortunately that makes him pretty average for a steroid board member.
Ronnie is the same height and had 60 pounds on him naturally, before he started joosin.
I'm calling bs on this as well. No one with a 315 squat is pulling 585 for reps. I've never in my life seen anyone pull twice as much as they can squat. A 185 row is a newbie accomplishment, and a 305 bench for reps is not.
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Lighter Fighter
New member
wow, you two should get a room and talk trash to each other.. Saying i bench this i deadlift without proof is childish, who fuking cares.
The topic is about to be a pro which is more important and i say DRUGS, pick a natural guy with a genetic of god who bust his ass and eats correctly, with a guy whos got bad-medicore genetic but shoots gram of test 500mg tren, 100mg anavar, and 10iu of gh a week, eats corectly and train hard, i can guarantee you the dude whos shooting up will be 40 pound heavier with less bodyfat assuming they both are 6 foot.. Also, no shit you have to train and eat right for the drugs to work, some of these comments are ridiculous.
Just look at the difference between todays pro and 70s, the drugs are way more advanced some pros even shoot up synthol to bring up lagging body part and you're telling me that requires good genetic? No doubt about it genetics are importan in term of placing 1st or 2nd at Olympia, but drugs are more important in terms of sheer mass and low bf..
The topic is about to be a pro which is more important and i say DRUGS, pick a natural guy with a genetic of god who bust his ass and eats correctly, with a guy whos got bad-medicore genetic but shoots gram of test 500mg tren, 100mg anavar, and 10iu of gh a week, eats corectly and train hard, i can guarantee you the dude whos shooting up will be 40 pound heavier with less bodyfat assuming they both are 6 foot.. Also, no shit you have to train and eat right for the drugs to work, some of these comments are ridiculous.
Just look at the difference between todays pro and 70s, the drugs are way more advanced some pros even shoot up synthol to bring up lagging body part and you're telling me that requires good genetic? No doubt about it genetics are importan in term of placing 1st or 2nd at Olympia, but drugs are more important in terms of sheer mass and low bf..
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SinisterUproar
New member
Dude you are such a tool... All of your threads make you look so dumb
Again, take Ronnie Coleman as an example. He turned pro natty at 240 lbs. At the same time, I guarantee you there were thousands of bros with "bad-mediocre genetics" shooting grams of test and tren, anavar and loads of HGH with slin, eating and training hard...who never turned pro. Those guys are all over these boards bro.
How come Ronnie got his pro card and they didn't? Also, there are many BBers who get their pro cards who never amount to shit after that. Ronnie turned pro natty and went on to win more Sandow's than anyone else. How would you rate his genetics? Did drugs help him? Of course. The answer to the question of which if a bigger factor in becoming a pro bber is genetics over drugs. Again, if it were drugs, most of the bros on these boards would be pros.
Anotech
New member
Dude you're huge... Relax
Genetics make a world class BBer.
Not drugs.
The argument of 'average guy on a gallon of test vs natty guy with good genetics' is fucking irrelevant and all of you making that argument to enforce your point that drugs are best should be slapped into reality.
EVERYONE on the world stage is running high amounts of juice, but the only ones who got there had freak genetics to begin with.
The real argument here is guy with avg genetics on juice vs guy with freak genetics on juice, and the average joe doesn't stand a fucking chance.
And if I was still 180 and had to lie about all of my lifts after 4 cycles, and get out sized/lifted by a 16 year old highschool boy, I'd probably keep my big fucking mouth shut or take up a new hobby.
I heard golf was fun.
Not drugs.
The argument of 'average guy on a gallon of test vs natty guy with good genetics' is fucking irrelevant and all of you making that argument to enforce your point that drugs are best should be slapped into reality.
EVERYONE on the world stage is running high amounts of juice, but the only ones who got there had freak genetics to begin with.
The real argument here is guy with avg genetics on juice vs guy with freak genetics on juice, and the average joe doesn't stand a fucking chance.
And if I was still 180 and had to lie about all of my lifts after 4 cycles, and get out sized/lifted by a 16 year old highschool boy, I'd probably keep my big fucking mouth shut or take up a new hobby.
I heard golf was fun.
Anotech
New member
Lol I compete at midd weight.. If I was 218 I wouldn't compete.
Big Internet tough guy. Everybody is behind the screen.
I haven't once claimed to be tough, however I do know AAS like the back of my hand, and you seem to think it's some kind of miracle potion that will make you the hulk if you run enough.
Not true, not even close to true. More is not better. Those pro athletes use that much gear because they have been on so much the old doses stopped giving as much gains so they had to increase just to get the same results.
You've got delusions of grandeur and you're in for a rude awakening in the world of BBing.
And if I was 180, I wouldn't even fucking juice, not to mention compete.
Not true, not even close to true. More is not better. Those pro athletes use that much gear because they have been on so much the old doses stopped giving as much gains so they had to increase just to get the same results.
You've got delusions of grandeur and you're in for a rude awakening in the world of BBing.
And if I was 180, I wouldn't even fucking juice, not to mention compete.
He got his pro card in a tested comp. He claims to not have started juicing until after he turned pro. If you look at pics of him when he was younger you can see he always looked big. Looking at pics of him his first year as a pro versus following years you can see a noticeable change in his physique. He was a powerlifter before he started BBing too. So he lifted heavy and ate a lot. Add that to his genetics and the changes in his physique after turning pro and I believe he got his pro card as a natty.
It's the difference. A guy with great muscle building genetics like RC, and other top Olympians, will do far better than a guy with average muscle building genetics using the same amounts of drugs.
Both. But probably if i had to choose one it would be drugs.
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Evan Tipps
Guest
If it was drugs half the people on this site would be pro..
Here, read this article:
Ronnie Coleman – His Rise to the Top – and How He Stayed There! by Ron Harris
He placed last at his first Mr. O, at ~215lbs. You think he was roided up at 215? Really? A guy with his genetics?
CLEARLY
you must really know your shit.
Genetics all the way.
The majority of the people I have encountered in my 20 years of BBing look worse on roids than when they are natural because of a few reasons. CEO provided the primary document that cannot be refuted, and I would like to give my opinion through my experiences.
I remember when I shifted gears from boxing to BBing in my early 20s I trained at this rat hole. Anyway, there was this guy who trained there, he was probably in his late 30s at that time. He had perfect lines, everything tied in perfectly, striations from his neck down to his feet, full muscle bellies, and everything just popped at you. That dude ate once a day, smoked cigarettes between sets and drank like a fish. When we were done training he would walk over to the local club and drink beer all night while we were home eating chicken breasts every 2-3 hours, and he made everyone in the gym look like they never stepped foot in a gym. That guy was put together like a motherfucker. I'm not talking being between 5'7-6'0 tall and weighing between 160-225 lbs. @ 5% BF (that's small in my book), I'm talking 5'8 225 @ 5% BF. He was drug free; I know that because the only roid dealer in the 50 mile radius of where I lived was a guy who grew-up across the street from me and he said dude never bought a drop or a pill of roids off of him.
Please, I been back to the gym for a month after a two and half month layoff and I'm already the biggest and the hardest in the gym, and I train at a popular gym where there are some serious fuckin' people. It's almost like it's not even fair!
Yaahh for genetics..
The majority of the people I have encountered in my 20 years of BBing look worse on roids than when they are natural because of a few reasons. CEO provided the primary document that cannot be refuted, and I would like to give my opinion through my experiences.
I remember when I shifted gears from boxing to BBing in my early 20s I trained at this rat hole. Anyway, there was this guy who trained there, he was probably in his late 30s at that time. He had perfect lines, everything tied in perfectly, striations from his neck down to his feet, full muscle bellies, and everything just popped at you. That dude ate once a day, smoked cigarettes between sets and drank like a fish. When we were done training he would walk over to the local club and drink beer all night while we were home eating chicken breasts every 2-3 hours, and he made everyone in the gym look like they never stepped foot in a gym. That guy was put together like a motherfucker. I'm not talking being between 5'7-6'0 tall and weighing between 160-225 lbs. @ 5% BF (that's small in my book), I'm talking 5'8 225 @ 5% BF. He was drug free; I know that because the only roid dealer in the 50 mile radius of where I lived was a guy who grew-up across the street from me and he said dude never bought a drop or a pill of roids off of him.
Please, I been back to the gym for a month after a two and half month layoff and I'm already the biggest and the hardest in the gym, and I train at a popular gym where there are some serious fuckin' people. It's almost like it's not even fair!
Yaahh for genetics..
A
ALIN
Guest
In pro bodybuilding ranks you definitely need incredible genetics. All the drugs in the world wont help if you have
poor genetics.
Here, read this article:
Ronnie Coleman – His Rise to the Top – and How He Stayed There! by Ron Harris
He placed last at his first Mr. O, at ~215lbs. You think he was roided up at 215? Really? A guy with his genetics?
CLEARLY
Think about what you just said... "You think he was roiled up at 215?" You damn right he was... You must also think Lance Armstrong wasn't roided up either huh?
Weight is so inconsequential its not even funny. In the era of Arnold a lot of those guys barley broke 200 pounds and were they roided up? Yes. FACT.
Obviously he has extremely amazing genetics and amazing genetics to respond to the gear the way he did. You have a lot to learn if you think he stepped on the olympia stage without touching the needle.
needtogetaas
New member
Both+diet+training
Yeah, I'm really new to all this bro. Can you help me?
GangstaDogg
New member
Fact is most guys even the pros without roids, hard training and diet would look like absolute average people.
Pictures of Bodybuilders Before and After Steroids
Roids make the difference.
Pictures of Bodybuilders Before and After Steroids
Roids make the difference.
GangstaDogg
New member
Peter Molnar one of Hungary's best BBers (still not a pro) at just 210 lbs competition weight. He looks amazing.
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If you compare him to Markus Ruhl at 285 lbs I'm pretty sure Markus used alot more roids than Peter.
If you compare him to Markus Ruhl at 285 lbs I'm pretty sure Markus used alot more roids than Peter.
MattJS
New member
I'm with needto, it takes EVERYTHING to go pro, to pin it on one factor is ignorant, if it was all down to drugs how come every time I hit the gym there are at least a half dozen 130lb guys covered in bacne taking up space in the weights room.... Also I know guys who are genetic freaks but due to other factors have no intention of competing, it takes genetics, time, training that is both smart and hard, precision managed dieting and drugs as well plus constant years of bodybuilding being the main focus of your life....
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