When people use Masteron/Winny for "lean bulking" courses....

[John McLane]

Are these people on a calorie surplus or deficit? If a surplus then what use is Winstrol/Masteron when "lean bulking"? And surely a calorie surplus is always necessary when bulking even when using gear?

 

[Artigo]

I didnt think people used winny while bulking.. seems counter productive

 

[MrDribbles]

I didnt think people used winny while bulking.. seems counter productive

You can gain weight on winny. Not as much as dbol or anadrol, but you can get nice gains on winny.

 

[John McLane]

You can gain weight on winny. Not as much as dbol or anadrol, but you can get nice gains on winny.

I was always told that Winny was worthless for bulking purposes?

 

[gwilym]

I understood that winny mast cycle was used to maintain lean muscle when cutting I assume you could bulk on both but assumed people would have more suitable cycles I.e. Test / deca ?

 

[John McLane]

I understood that winny mast cycle was used to maintain lean muscle when cutting I assume you could bulk on both but assumed people would have more suitable cycles I.e. Test / deca ?

That's what I thought....

 

[C0LUMB0]

Diet dictates whether the cycle is a bulk or cut...not the compound.

 

[John McLane]

Diet dictates whether the cycle is a bulk or cut...not the compound.

So if I had a clean bulking diet, with, let's say a 500 calorie surplus, and took for example Sus/Winny (and maybe prop) your saying I should be able to gain muscle mass? (I will not be doing any cardio)

 

[ledhead]

Diet dictates whether the cycle is a bulk or cut...not the compound.

Exactly, the only difference is some compounds aromatize more than others.

 

[John McLane]

Exactly, the only difference is some compounds aromatize more than others.

So why don't more people ise Winny/Mast for bulking?

 

[ledhead]

So why don't more people ise Winny/Mast for bulking?

IMO, I believe the majority of people listen to what other people say instead of testing the waters themselves.

Trial and error is the best way to analyze what drugs work best for you. Bulking/cutting, but ultimately you can bulk and cut on any drug. Myself, I prefer low aromatizing drugs to avoid bloat as much as possible. I just tweek my diet here and there depending on what my goals are. IMO, there is nothing written in stone when it comes to using aas, it's all up to the user.

I cringe at the word bulk/ bulking because some people's definition of it is a huge contrast to mine. Both words bulking/cutting have a lot of connotations. Again, it is up to that person to decide what the meanings are and what drugs they think will work best for them in the phase of training they are in.

 

[John McLane]

IMO, I believe the majority of people listen to what other people say instead of testing the waters themselves.

Trial and error is the best way to analyze what drugs work best for you. Bulking/cutting, but ultimately you can bulk and cut on any drug. Myself, I prefer low aromatizing drugs to avoid bloat as much as possible. I just tweek my diet here and there depending on what my goals are. IMO, there is nothing written in stone when it comes to using aas, it's all up to the user.

I cringe at the word bulk/ bulking because some people's definition of it is a huge contrast to mine. Both words bulking/cutting have a lot of connotations. Again, it is up to that person to decide what the meanings are and what drugs they think will work best for them in the phase of training they are in.

Good answer, I will try my next course of Sus with Winny and see how I get on. I'll just go over 500 calories or so over maintenance and do my best and see what happens.

 

[Voijn]

the reason people run winstrol in cutting or maintaining cycles / diets is due to the effects of winstrol. Winstrol produces clean n nice gains, it burns alittle fat, makes you vascular. But if you where bulking, the layor of fat optained might dimmish some of the effects of winstrol.

So a guy with a BF on 30% will be gaining mass, but the other "nice effects" of winstrol might not be showing
A guy with a BF on 6% will get alot of the effects that winstrol produce

Yet agian, these are some of the reasons that some compounds are listed cutters or bulkers
Primo produces sameish gains as winstrol, masterone, anavar and therefor will be more visible with a maintaince of kcalories and high protein diet

All compounds should produce gains in matter of mass, but will the other effects show if used in a bulker? i think not.

 

[John McLane]

the reason people run winstrol in cutting or maintaining cycles / diets is due to the effects of winstrol. Winstrol produces clean n nice gains, it burns alittle fat, makes you vascular. But if you where bulking, the layor of fat optained might dimmish some of the effects of winstrol.

So a guy with a BF on 30% will be gaining mass, but the other "nice effects" of winstrol might not be showing
A guy with a BF on 6% will get alot of the effects that winstrol produce

Yet agian, these are some of the reasons that some compounds are listed cutters or bulkers
Primo produces sameish gains as winstrol, masterone, anavar and therefor will be more visible with a maintaince of kcalories and high protein diet

All compounds should produce gains in matter of mass, but will the other effects show if used in a bulker? i think not.

Ledhead, what is your opinion on what voijn has said in his last post??

 

[ledhead]

the reason people run winstrol in cutting or maintaining cycles / diets is due to the effects of winstrol. Winstrol produces clean n nice gains, it burns alittle fat, makes you vascular. But if you where bulking, the layor of fat optained might dimmish some of the effects of winstrol.

Winstrol doesn't have fat burning properties. It is a DHT derivitive, it has a low aromatizing effect, precisely my point. The question was a matter of can you bulk on winstrol and the answer is YES. Do you see the effects of it's low aromatizing effect better when BF is low YES. Why? because it drains the body from fluid giving you that grainy look. If your diet is on point, but can you put on 20 lbs using winstrol if you tweek your diet, YES.

So a guy with a BF on 30% will be gaining mass, but the other "nice effects" of winstrol might not be showing

If a guy is bulking with 30% bf he has problems period. If someone is bulking, why would they be trying to obtain that "hard look." That is why I said I cringe at the word "bulk."

A guy with a BF on 6% will get alot of the effects that winstrol produce

This person would see the effects of a low aromatizing drug, and eliminate some water retention. You are dismissing the fact you can bulk on Winstrol and make solid gains.

Yet agian, these are some of the reasons that some compounds are listed cutters or bulkers
Primo produces sameish gains as winstrol, masterone, anavar and therefor will be more visible with a maintaince of kcalories and high protein diet

My question is, why does almost everyone that cuts and bulks on TEST? Nothing aromatizes like test. According, to your logic test would be classified as a bulker, but yet you would be hard pressed to find anyone that diets without test.

All compounds should produce gains in matter of mass, but will the other effects show if used in a bulker? i think not.

Again, according to your logic you woudn't see the effects of deca, tren, anadrol in a cutter, I think not.. Even if your diet is spot on??? Again, the point is lost.

The whole objective in bulking is to produce mass, so you confirmed my point. Like I said, the word BULK everyone has their own defintion of it.

Go re-read my original post.

 

[Muscle Head257]

The reason why winny is referred to as being best for cutting is because you dont get very much bigger because the muscle you put on is very dense and rock hard but doesnt grow very large because of this, but a bulking AS puts on a lot of muscle but usually has a smooth look which is not usually desired by many people

 

[JBEXT81]

i'm with columbo.... its all about DIET

 

[C.K.]

Winny is very anabolic and great for strength I went from 170-190 lbs on it at 80 mgs ed

 

[Tux]

Winny is my favorite oral and top 3 all time favorite hormone. I gain more strength from 20mg/day of winny than from 50mg/day of dbol. So I never use dbol or tbol or anything but winny now, b/c at only 20mg/day it gives me huge strength increases, and if I'm in a caloric surpluse, bigger weights lifted=bigger muscles. So winny is almost always a kickstart to my "bulking" cycles, as well as used at the end of most any cycle to harden up while I lose any excess water/fat I gained on cycle. And at 20mg/day it doesn't affect my lipids or liver negatively. So yeah, you can use winny for anything you want, any compound can be used for various purposes, mostly depends on diet and on how that particular hormone affects you individually.

 

[joh]

my next clean lean muscle building cycle is test, mast and tbol. - it is all about diet. carbs and proteins during the day and after work out. proteins at night. clean gains.

 

[louisiana]

do masteron have to run higher than 500mg e/w and do you need test??? How do it stack with winny?

 

[Littleman784]

Diet dictates whether the cycle is a bulk or cut...not the compound.

Exactly im with Columbo! Diet is number one! The compounds aid in the distribution of the food and nutrients more quickly and efficiently throughout the body. I think alot of people depend on the AAS to do some magic. Im my humble opinion AAS were esentially made to put weight on people with wasting diseases, so the will put mass on but the diet dictates how much, how hard, how dense, how bloated, etc etc.

 

[Wilcox]

Diet dictates whether the cycle is a bulk or cut...not the compound.

Nailed it.

You could Cut on Dbol, so why couldn't you bulk on winny?