TUF3 First Episode - Why Shamrock had bad Strat

[KD1]

Ok, Shamrock starts off with the hammer, he annouces that his plan is to every week match his top remaining fighter against Tito's weakest remaining fighter. Here is why that is a bad strat.

Lets say we have 10 fighters on each team, who were accurately ranked in skill and probability of advancing. Shamrock starts off matching his 1 vs Tito's 10, lets say it works, the next week its Shamrocks 9 vs Tito's 2. Well at some point they have an even match, then suddenly Shamrock is matching is lower skilled guys against Tito's better fighters until finally Shamrock is sending his 10 against Tito's 1. If things play out as expected ( they never do but for the sake of this arguement lets say they do ) then both Tito and Shamrock have the same number of fighters going into the 2nd round. i.e. hammer advantage nullified.

A better plan would be to match a figher he had that was marginally better than Tito's fighter. For instance, match his 8 against Tito's 10. Progress in this fashion until its his 1 against Tito's 3. Then the last 2 fights he would basically sacrifice his worst 2 guys, hope for a longshot win. In that situation, he would have a significant fighter # advantage going into the 2nd round assuming things played out according to his ranking system.

The fact that Shamrock didnt realize this leads me to believe he isnt too bright.

 

[Djimbe]

1) Stop with "The Hammer" it sounds stupid when he says it .

2) Youre a WHOLE lot smarter than Shamrock . Wich is , unfortunately , not much of a Compliment .

3) youre forgetting his other Mistake . He chose all the Meathead Fratboys . Pretty much every guy on his team is an Idiot .

 

[1392477]

How about chosing a bodybuilder instead of a sumbisstion or BJJ specialist when he admits he knows nothing about BJJ? That seems even more of a bonehead idea.

On the flip side, what was Titio doing working out his fighter the day before a match?

 

[Djimbe]

well , in Tito's Defense he DID think he was making him go light ... I really cant see how the kid even hurt himself ...

But with Ken ...

yeah dont REAL BBing changes take 12-15 weeks to happen ? Are they even IN the damned HOUSE that long ? I could see it for your REAL Fighters , but in such a short Timespan ... And Im not even saying he needed a Jits guy , bring a Sports Medicine Specialist so your guys stay Healthy , but SOMETHING Useful !

 

[Protobuilder]

kd1 -- I dont think you've got it right. He'll match his 10 against Tito's 1. Next week, I assume it'd be his 10, again, against Tito's 2. Right? Or am i wrong? LoL

Shamrock did look dumb, IMO, by taking the "110% all the freaking time!!" method, which will lead to burnout and injury. Being hardcore does not mean training like a moron.

 

[megamania500]

Ok, Shamrock starts off with the hammer, he annouces that his plan is to every week match his top remaining fighter against Tito's weakest remaining fighter. Here is why that is a bad strat.

Lets say we have 10 fighters on each team, who were accurately ranked in skill and probability of advancing. Shamrock starts off matching his 1 vs Tito's 10, lets say it works, the next week its Shamrocks 9 vs Tito's 2. Well at some point they have an even match, then suddenly Shamrock is matching is lower skilled guys against Tito's better fighters until finally Shamrock is sending his 10 against Tito's 1. If things play out as expected ( they never do but for the sake of this arguement lets say they do ) then both Tito and Shamrock have the same number of fighters going into the 2nd round. i.e. hammer advantage nullified.

A better plan would be to match a figher he had that was marginally better than Tito's fighter. For instance, match his 8 against Tito's 10. Progress in this fashion until its his 1 against Tito's 3. Then the last 2 fights he would basically sacrifice his worst 2 guys, hope for a longshot win. In that situation, he would have a significant fighter # advantage going into the 2nd round assuming things played out according to his ranking system.

The fact that Shamrock didnt realize this leads me to believe he isnt too bright.

I was thinking the same thing. But then I figured, despite anyone's team strategy, if everything else goes fair, the best fighters will end up at the end no matter what.

 

[KD1]

kd1 -- I dont think you've got it right. He'll match his 10 against Tito's 1. Next week, I assume it'd be his 10, again, against Tito's 2. Right? Or am i wrong? LoL

Sorry, but once a fighter wins, he advances to the 2nd round and doesent fight again until half of he fighters have been elliminated. New rules this season.

 

[Kane Fan]

kd1 that's why his idea is good
have your best guy save everything he's got by taking outthe other guys worst
after putting my #1 guys at Tito's benchwarmers I'd try to use guys just a little past like you where saying to eliminate the dangerous guys
or I'd use my second stringers to go after his great guys in a boring ass fight that goes to decission which I win
and a less skilled fighter who dilligiantly sticks to a superior game plan will often get the decission

 

[megamania500]

kd1 that's why his idea is good
have your best guy save everything he's got by taking outthe other guys worst
after putting my #1 guys at Tito's benchwarmers I'd try to use guys just a little past like you where saying to eliminate the dangerous guys
or I'd use my second stringers to go after his great guys in a boring ass fight that goes to decission which I win
and a less skilled fighter who dilligiantly sticks to a superior game plan will often get the decission

If shamrock puts his best fighters against tito's worst, then after a few fights shamrock just have his worst to match up against tito's best. Shamrock didn't think it through. In this plan, he would have a few (almost) sure wins, but sooner or later he would have to put someone less skilled against a superior fighter. As far as a fight being boring ass, you got to remember that these guys know that a KO will land them $5k. No one's going to let it go to decision if they can help it.
And a less skilled fighter is usually less skilled because the other guy has the superior game plan, since everything else is as equal as they can get it (weight-wise).

Come to think of it, its all irrelevent, since Tito's team already won the second fight.

 

[KD1]

If shamrock puts his best fighters against tito's worst, then after a few fights shamrock just have his worst to match up against tito's best. Shamrock didn't think it through. In this plan, he would have a few (almost) sure wins, but sooner or later he would have to put someone less skilled against a superior fighter.

Finally someone who understood my post lol!

 

[Kane Fan]

If shamrock puts his best fighters against tito's worst, then after a few fights shamrock just have his worst to match up against tito's best. Shamrock didn't think it through. In this plan, he would have a few (almost) sure wins, but sooner or later he would have to put someone less skilled against a superior fighter. As far as a fight being boring ass, you got to remember that these guys know that a KO will land them $5k. No one's going to let it go to decision if they can help it.
And a less skilled fighter is usually less skilled because the other guy has the superior game plan, since everything else is as equal as they can get it (weight-wise).

Come to think of it, its all irrelevent, since Tito's team already won the second fight.

ideally the best guys will go against each other anyway
this way he gets the most time with his guys training wise
I mean Tito does to but you have to assume your the better coach or you shouldn't take this job...
putting best against best first is just dumb
you didn't get any real training time with them
the fight between Noah and Jessie would have went pretty similarly if they had been at a small scale show somewhere there was no time for Tito or Ken to build up a real impact in the fighter in that time

 

[MikeMartial]

How about chosing a bodybuilder instead of a sumbisstion or BJJ specialist when he admits he knows nothing about BJJ? That seems even more of a bonehead idea.

Shamrock's days as a fighter are done---everyone can see that. I think he's now doing a fine-assed job of killing his future as a coach via his display of ignorance on TUF3

On the flip side, what was Titio doing working out his fighter the day before a match?

I was wondering the same thing---along with every other fighter on his team. I could see MAYBE skipping or light, LIGHT bag work, but for some, that's even pushing it. Damn good thing Noah won.