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**The Anabolic Bible: Mastering The Art of Using Anabolic Steroids!**

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Ross

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The Anabolic Bible




Chapter 1


*The Three ESSENTIAL Phases of A Proper Steroid Therapy*




There are three essential stages of a Proper "Steroid Therapy":

1.) The Steroid Cycle: Anabolic steroids are utilized over the course of many weeks, sometimes many months, as the bodybuilder aquires as much muscle mass as possible, or while dieting to preserve muscle and aid in fatloss.

2.) Active Recovery(Pre-PCT): This is the period of time DIRECTLY AFTER YOUR CYCLE. DO NOT GO STRAIGHT INTO post cycle therapy! This is why you experience a POST-CYCLE CRASH! Utilizing an ACTIVE RECOVERY PERIOD, will allow the body to BEGIN producing testosterone once again, while still remaining in an ANABOLIC STATE!

3.) Post Cycle Therapy: Now that your HPTA has began recovering, and you have successfully transitioned out of your steroid cycle, it is now time to FULLY RESTORE THE HPTA. Now is the time for your FULL agressive post cycle therapy regimen, including HCG, Aromasin, and Nolvadex if desired.

4.) The Bridge:(*Optional) Now that you are FULLY RECOVERED and your PCT is complete, you can begin bridging while awaiting your FULL CYCLE. This will allow you to make GREATER THAN NATURAL GAINS, while still maintaining normal testosterone levels.

For a complete list of compounds that do NOT CAUSE HPTA SHUTDOWN, please see my current article "Using Anabolic Steroids WIthout HPTA SHUTDOWN".



Chapter 2

**The STANDARD Cycle**



A PERFECT CYCLE CONSISTS OF *BOTH*, SLOW AND FAST-ACTING STEROIDS!

In most cases, a LONG-esterfied injectable steroid such as Testosterone Enanthate would function as the BASE of the cycle, providing slow but consistent gains throughout the entire cycle's duration.

A SHORT-acting steroid is used in either the BEGINNING of a cycle or at the END of a cycle. Typically, Dianabol and Anadrol are used at the beginning of a cycle to provide STRENGTH and MASS gains BEFORE the base(and/or secondary injectable) "KICK IN". A FAST-ACTING stroid such as Anavar or Winstrol is used at the END of a cycle and RIGHT UP UNTIL post cycle therapy, while the LONG-acting steroid SLOWLY exits the system.


An optimal cycle contains several components:


1.) A Base: This is the usually the most powerful compound in the stack, and it is typically ran throughout the entire duration of the cycle. Most individuals will choose Testosterone for a base, but for those uncomfortable using testosterone; Trenbolone, Equipoise, Masteron, and even Primobolan can be used instead. In your case, the base will be testosterone Enanthate.


2.) The JUMPSTARTER: This compound must be FAST-ACTING, so as to generate muscle and strength gains BEFORE YOUR BASE AND YOUR ASSISTANT KICK IN. Jumpstarting usually applies to BULKING cycles, but they can be used effectively in CUTTING cycles as well. Dianabol and Anadrol are the most popular steroids for JUMPSTARTING a cycle, because they both induce incredible strength and mass in a very short period of time; but it important to note that there are MANY other drugs that can be used for this purpose that are usually overlooked. Halotestin at 30-40mgs will provide ENORMOUS strength at the beginning of your cycle, making it GREAT to jumpstart BULKING cycles AND CUTTING cycles. Injectable Winstrol can ALSO be used to jumpstart BULKING CYCLES and CUTTING CYCLES. The Oral is too weak to act as an effective JUMPSTARTER. I would say the same for Anavar and Turinabol. Trenbolone Acetate and Testosterone Propionate(or suspension) are also very popular choices used to jumpstart BULKING cycles. You will be using Dianabol as your JUMPSTARTER.


3.) The FINISHER: A FAST-acting steroid MUST BE UTILIZED at the end of your cycle's duration! You MUST remain ANABOLIC right up until post cycle therapy! If you FAIL to use a fast-acting steroid such as Winstrol or Oxandrolone during your FINAL weeks while your BASE and your ASSISTANT leave your system, you will LOSE GAINS BEFORE YOU EVEN BEGIN post cycle therapy. This is one of the BIGGEST mistakes people make. Test E will not leave your system for at LEAST 3 weeks after your FINAL SHOT. Therefore, you MUST remain anabolic during these 3 weeks when your adrogen levels PLUMMET! You will be using Winstrol Inject as your Finisher.


Failure to uitlize ANY of the 3 ESSENTIAL COMPONENTS will result in a cycle that is LESS THAN OPTIMAL.*

For an intermediate or advanced user, a SECONDARY ANABOLIC called the "assistant" should be added for OPTIMAL results.

*) The Assistant: This compound is ran alongside the BASE for the majority of the cycle, providing a synergistic effect throughout it's duration. Most people will choose either Deca or Equipoise, usually using testosterone as the base. Trenbolone, Masteron, and Primobolan also make great Assistants. You will be using Deca as your Assiatant.

Weeks 1-6: Dianabol, 30mgs ED
Weeks 1-10: Test E, 500mgs
Weeks 1-10: Deca, 400mg
Weeks 10-14: Winstrol Inject, 75mgs ED



The Standard Cycle is designed for OPTIMUM anabolism, utilizing precise strategies in order to gain and sustain the most muscle possible!



Chapter 3

*Using Anabolic Steroids Without HPTA SHUTDOWN!*



RESEARCH SHOWS THAT NOT ALL STEROIDS CAUSE SHUTDOWN!

  • No more "Post Cycle Crash"!
  • Use CERTAIN anabolic steroids DURING PCT! *(Pre-PCT)
  • Run a complete cycle WITHOUT HPTA SHUTDOWN!

Some steroids only REDUCE TESTOSTERONE PRODUCTION(to varying degrees), whereas other steroids will SHUTDOWN the HPTA resulting in a complete cessation of androgen production.


*NOT ALL ANDROGENS CAUSE SHUTDOWN*

"Shutdown", is defined by a COMPLETE inhibition of the Pituitary/Testes, resulting in a TOTAL cessation of endogenous androgen production.

SOME androgens will only SUPPRESS endogenous androgen production, resulting in a DECREASED testosterone level, but not a complete shutdown. (Turinabol, Anavar, Halotestin, Wistrol, Equipoise, Dianabol, Masteron, Primobolan)

Very Androgenic/Progestenic/Estrogenic steroids(Trenbolone, Nandrolone, Anadrol, Testosterone) cause a COMPLETE shutdown of endogenous hormone production.

Steroids that cause an OVERSATURATION(too many receptors activated) of these various hormone receptors, WILL CAUSE SHUTDOWN. Steroids that DO NOT CAUSE an OVERSATURATION of ANY of these various hormone receptors, will NOT cause SHUTDOWN!


The distinction between SUPRESSION and SHUTDOWN is utterly important, as steroids that cause LESS supression of endogenous hormones will allow for greater retention of gains upon ending the cycle, and a quicker, easier recovery!


The Following steroids will NOT SHUTDOWN THE HPTA:

Turinabol, Anavar, Proviron, Halotestin, Wistrol, Equipoise, Dianabol, Masteron, Primobolan, Clostebol, and 4-ADiol.


Pre-PCT: PRE-PCT allows the HPTA to begin LH/FSH output, while still receiving additional anabolic support. This is the peroid of time where we utilize a NON-inhibitory steroid while the endogenous testosterone level begins to recover. This occurs PRIOR TO FULL PCT, so that by the time we begin full PCT the HPTA has already began recovering.

Active RECOVERY: The HPTA BEGINS to restore endogenous testosterone production once it detects the body's androgen level beginning to decline(end of cycle).

Therefore, HPTA CAN BEGIN TO RECOVER WHILE STILL IN AN ANABOLIC STATE!


The following drugs can be used during Active Recovery:

Anavar/Proviron= 40mgs/25mgs
Anavar/Masteron= 40mgs/300mgs
Primobolan/Masteron= 300mgs/300mgs
Turinabol/Proviron= 40mgs/25mgs
Turinabol/Masteron= 40mgs/300mgs
Winstrol/Masteron= 50mgs/300mgs
Dianabol/Proviron= 15mgs/25mgs
Dianabol/Masteron= 15mgs/300mgs



Examples...


In a SHORT CYCLE:

Weeks 1-4: Testosterone Propionate, 100mgs ED
Weeks 1-4: Dianabol, 50mgs ED
Weeks 1-4: NPP, 400mgs
Weeks 4-8: **PRE-PCT(ACTIVE RECOVERY)**
Weeks 8-?: **POST CYCLE THERAPY**



A Standard Cycle:

Weeks 1-6: Dianabol, 30mgs ED
Weeks 1-10: Testosterone Enanthate, 500mgs
Weeks 8-12: Winstrol, 100mgs ED
Weeks 12-16: **PRE-PCT(ACTIVE RECOVERY) **
Weeks 16-26: **POST CYCLE THERAPY**



DO NOT end your cycle ABRUPTLY! Don't just END your cycle cold-turkey! If you are SHUTDOWN, full restoration can take weeks and even MONTHS. Therefore, one should REMAIN ON minimally-inhibitive STEROIDS(HPTA) in an attempt to MAINTAIN the gains they made while ON CYCLE, while STILL BEGINNING TO RECOVER TESTOSTERONE PRODUCTION. On top of that, one still continues to progess from the mild additional anabolic support.

NOT only does it mean that you can run a COMPLETE CYCLE with NO SHUTDOWN whatsoever(as long as the right compounds, dosages, and durations are used), it also means that if you ARE SHUTDOWN from your cycle, you do NOT HAVE TO COME RIGHT OFF CYCLE! Actually, it is BETTER TO STAY ON CYCLE WHILE YOUR ENDOGENOUS TESTOSTERONE LEVEL BEGINS TO INCREASE!


You may also run a cycle that COMPLETELY AVOIDS SHUTDOWN:

Weeks 1-6: Dianabol, 40mgs ED
Weeks 1-10: Anavar, 50mgs ED
Weeks 1-10: Masteron, 100mgs EOD


Or

Weeks 1-6: Dianabol, 40mgs ED
Weeks 1-10: Primobolan, 500mgs
Weeks 6-14: Turinabol, 60mgs ED



And many many more! There are tons of NON-inhibitory cycles that you can devise using my my list above for your guideline. Your days of HPTA suffering are over!


By understanding WHICH steroids cause SHUTDOWN and which steroids do NOT, we can formulate a perfect EXTENDED CYCLE.

The Hypothalamus has Androgen, Estrogen, and Progesterone receptors.

Each and EVERY anabolic steroid affects these receptors DIFFERENTLY. Some steroids affect ALL receptors, while some only affect ONE type of receptor, while others have very little effect on ANY of these receptors.

UNDERSTANDING WHICH steroids affect which receptors, and to WHAT DEGREE, will FULLY enable the steroid user to COMPLETELY and systematically AVOID HPTA SHUTDOWN! By understanding WHICH steroids cause SHUTDOWN and which steroids do NOT, we can formulate a perfect EXTENDED CYCLE.

Steroids that cause an OVERSATURATION(too many receptors activated) of these various hormone receptors, WILL CAUSE SHUTDOWN.

Steroids that DO NOT CAUSE an OVERSATURATION of ANY of these various hormone receptors, will NOT cause SHUTDOWN!

The Following drugs either DIRECTLY or INDIRECTLY activate ESTROGEN receptors, to varying degrees:

Testosterone
Methandrostenolone
Mathandriol
Oxymetholone
Nandrolone
Boldenone

The Following drugs either DIRECTLY or INDIRECTLY activate PROGESTERONE receptors, to varying degrees:

Nandrolone
Trenbolone
Oxymetholone

The Following drugs activate Androgen receptors, to varying degrees:

Testosterone
Methandrostenolone
Mathandriol
Oxymetholone
Nandrolone
Boldenone
Trenbolone
Halotestin
Oxandrolone
Stanzolol
Chlorodehydromethltestosterone
Methyltestosterone
Methenolone...
(ALL AAS*)

As we can see, the steroids that cause HPTA SHUTDOWN either OVERSATURATE ONE SPECIFIC receptor, or they activate too many TOTAL receptors(Androgen/Estrogen/Progesterone)

For instance, Trenbolone causes HPTA SHUTDOWN because it OVERSATURATES BOTH, the ANDROGEN and the PROGESTERONE receptors. Testosterone causes SHUTDOWN because it converts to ESTROGEN and DHT, therefore, it oversaturates the Androgen/Estrogen receptors.

As we can ALSO SEE, the steroids that DO NOT cause SHUTDOWN of the HPTA, do NOT oversaturate ANY of the different hormone receptors, and thus, do NOT cause SHUTDOWN.

Methenolone(Primobolan) does not possess ANY Estrogenic or Progestational ACTIVITY WHATSOEVER. It does, by virtue of being an anabolic steroid, posses a SMALL Androgenic component. Because it lacks ANY ESTROGENIC/PROGESTATIONAL component, and it lacks a strong Androgenic component, it WILL NOT CAUSE SHUTDOWN! Oxandrolone(Anavar) posseses NO Estrogenic/Progestational component either. AND, it also lacks a strong androgenic component. Thus, Anavar will NOT cause shutdown.


By understanding WHICH steroids cause SHUTDOWN and which steroids do NOT, we can formulate a perfect EXTENDED CYCLE.

*It must also be noted, that ANY steroid in LARGE enough DOSAGES for long enough DURATIONS, can cause SHUTDOWN of the HPTA.


NOT ALL ANDROGENS CAUSE SHUTDOWN*

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Horm Metab Res. 1984 Sep;16(9):492-7.Related Articles, Links

Effect of non aromatizable androgens on LHRH and TRH responses in primary testicular failure.

Spitz IM, Margalioth EJ, Yeger Y, Livshin Y, Zylber-Haran E, Shilo S.

We have assessed the gonadotropin, TSH and PRL responses to the non aromatizable androgens, mesterolone and fluoxymestrone, in 27 patients with primary testicular failure. All patients were given a bolus of LHRH (100 micrograms) and TRH (200 micrograms) at zero time. Nine subjects received a further bolus of TRH at 30 mins. The latter were then given mesterolone 150 mg daily for 6 weeks. The remaining subjects received fluoxymesterone 5 mg daily for 4 weeks and 10 mg daily for 2 weeks. On the last day of the androgen administration, the subjects were re-challenged with LHRH and TRH according to the identical protocol. When compared to controls, the patients had normal circulating levels of testosterone, estradiol, PRL and thyroid hormones. However, basal LH, FSH and TSH levels, as well as gonadotropin responses to LHRH and TSH and PRL responses to TRH, were increased. Mesterolone administration produced no changes in steroids, thyroid hormones, gonadotropins nor PRL. There was, however, a reduction in the integrated and incremental TSH secretion after TRH. Fluoxymesterone administration was accompanied by a reduction in thyroid binding globulin (with associated decreases in T3 and increases in T3 resin uptake). The free T4 index was unaltered, which implies that thyroid function was unchanged. In addition, during fluoxymesterone administration, there was a reduction in testosterone, gonadotropins and LH response to LHRH. Basal TSH did not vary, but there was a reduction in the peak and integrated TSH response to TRH. PRL levels were unaltered during fluoxymesterone treatment.(ABSTRACT TRUNCATED AT 250 WORDS



[R]

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DO NOT end your cycle ABRUPTLY! Don't just END your cycle cold-turkey! If you are SHUTDOWN, full restoration can take weeks and even MONTHS. Therefore, one should REMAIN ON minimally-inhibitive STEROIDS(HPTA) in an attempt to MAINTAIN the gains they made while ON CYCLE, while STILL BEGINNING TO RECOVER TESTOSTERONE PRODUCTION. On top of that, one still continues to progess from the mild additional anabolic support.

He sounds like he's implying that you shouldn't go off, just use some type of bridge between cycles. If that's the case then there's no way that you will recover fully.
He also suggests to run the active recovery compounds such as primo, tbol,var,etc.... and that these will allow you to regain your HPTA.
I'd think it would be difficult to restore natural test production while using 300mg of primo and tbol.
Maybe I'm not comprehending this correctly though.
 
Mac173 said:
Can you repeat that?
Did hell just freeze over?


Satin is throwing snowballs as we speak.

There are far too many generalizations in that text. There's also way too much overthinking. And the fact that some steroids only supress and others cause shutdown -- that's just silly. There are too many factors, dosages being the main one. (Though he does mention this , which is a bit of a contradiction.

It actually takes a lot to completely shut you down cpmpletely. In this regard, duration is the biggest factor.

He also says dianabol will not shut you down. (???)

As for drugs activating receptors, that's highly suspect.

Halo safer than test? I think not.

I'm always up for a new perspective and it doesn't have to be etched in solid science, but it at least has to be consistant and make some sense.
 
I think he was also saying that as long as you are running compounds that are targeting differant receptors then that will also prevent shutdown.
I can't say that I agree w/ that either.
 
But he looks good, so how could he be wrong? Isn't that the main criteria around here?
 
Anthony Roberts said:
But he looks good, so how could he be wrong? Isn't that the main criteria around here?
lmao right....btw how long ago was that book written.I remember reading a book simaler to that and it was called the same thing back in 97 :worried:
 
Mac173 said:
DO NOT end your cycle ABRUPTLY! Don't just END your cycle cold-turkey! If you are SHUTDOWN, full restoration can take weeks and even MONTHS. Therefore, one should REMAIN ON minimally-inhibitive STEROIDS(HPTA) in an attempt to MAINTAIN the gains they made while ON CYCLE, while STILL BEGINNING TO RECOVER TESTOSTERONE PRODUCTION. On top of that, one still continues to progess from the mild additional anabolic support.

He sounds like he's implying that you shouldn't go off, just use some type of bridge between cycles. If that's the case then there's no way that you will recover fully.
He also suggests to run the active recovery compounds such as primo, tbol,var,etc.... and that these will allow you to regain your HPTA.
I'd think it would be difficult to restore natural test production while using 300mg of primo and tbol.
Maybe I'm not comprehending this correctly though.
think he was talking about the old cycling method of tapering off rather then just stoping then doing pct....in the old days cycles would look like a pyramid
starting out with a dose of say 250mg of test then working up to 800mg then working back down to 250mg before getting off again.

its really really old.
 
i agree, i think he meant pyramiding
and its not really that old, the concept was still being used around here in 2000
 
Nelson Montana said:
Satin is throwing snowballs as we speak.

There are far too many generalizations in that text. There's also way too much overthinking. And the fact that some steroids only supress and others cause shutdown -- that's just silly. There are too many factors, dosages being the main one. (Though he does mention this , which is a bit of a contradiction.

It actually takes a lot to completely shut you down cpmpletely. In this regard, duration is the biggest factor.

He also says dianabol will not shut you down. (???)

As for drugs activating receptors, that's highly suspect.

Halo safer than test? I think not.

I'm always up for a new perspective and it doesn't have to be etched in solid science, but it at least has to be consistant and make some sense.

Hiya Nelson, my name is Ross.

MOST of the information I have provided in the "Anabolic Bible" is FACT.

As for Dianabol not causing SHUTDOWN, let me quote our good friend Anthony:

"In this study, done in the early 80´s, a very high dose of Dbol (100mgs/day for 6 weeks) decreased plasma testosterone to about 40% of it´s normal value, plasma GH went up about a third, LH dropped to about 80% of it´s original value, and FSH went down about a third also (these are all approximate numbers, for the sake of brevity, but you get the idea). Body fat did not go up significantly and Fat Free Mass went up anywhere between 2-7kgs (3.3kgs average gain). The researchers concluded that Dbol increases Fat Free Mass as well as increasing strength and performance."

I enjoy the discourse.
 
Shutdown: None
Inhibition: Some

Dbol won't shut you down but it will inhibit the HPTA. Just thought I'd clear up the nomenclature we're using.

Hello Ross. Been awhile...
 
needtogetaas said:
lmao right....btw how long ago was that book written.I remember reading a book simaler to that and it was called the same thing back in 97 :worried:

You're thinking about the "Steroid Bible" ...the "Anabolic Bible" is just the name of this thread..it's not the book you're thinking of..it's original thought/research from Ross, I believe.
 
Anthony Roberts said:
Shutdown: None
Inhibition: Some

Dbol won't shut you down but it will inhibit the HPTA. Just thought I'd clear up the nomenclature we're using.

Hello Ross. Been awhile...

Hey Anthony, good to see ya old friend.

I'll be in touch.
 
solidspine said:
I think mr. ross is simply nelson and tony trying to sell there ideas as a third expert

Blah
Blah
Blah
Blah



Yawn

Good call. You saw straight through us on that one.
 
solidspine said:
I think mr. ross is simply nelson and tony trying to sell there ideas as a third expert

Blah
Blah
Blah
Blah



Yawn

LOL

Sorry my friend, I have NO AFFILIATION with any of the staff or members of this board.

Furthermore, all of my content is original.

I have been around for a while, have taken LOTS of shit, and am still here.

The only person who has me beat soley on LONGEVITY in this game, is our good friend Anthony; or HOOKER, as I always knew him:)
 
medrep said:
hmmm AR seems to know who you are, but do we?!

I know Ross, yes. Basically anyone who frequents the major steroid sites would, I think.
 
medrep said:
hmmm AR seems to know who you are, but do we?!

Run a quick search for "Ross" over at A-R, I-T, Outlaw, Ology, IFL, BB4L...pretty much anywhere on the net, and you will quickly get to know me.

Unfortunately, I have been BANNED(and proud of it) from virtually every online bodybuilding forum. It's always political, you can decide for yourself.

I have taken shit for years, as has Anthony. My own forums will be running soon.

I hope you enjoy the information.
 
I actually like a lot of his concepts but I do agree that by bridging with a suppresive compound you will not fully recover but you wont be shut down either. Recently as a short inbetween cycle to my two cycles a year I did 6 weeks of dbol and masteron and it helped me make some gains and I recovered from it fast. Didn't seem to shut me down at all.
 
M Pwrd said:
I actually like a lot of his concepts but I do agree that by bridging with a suppresive compound you will not fully recover but you wont be shut down either. Recently as a short inbetween cycle to my two cycles a year I did 6 weeks of dbol and masteron and it helped me make some gains and I recovered from it fast. Didn't seem to shut me down at all.

FULL Post Cycle Therapy is executed AFTER THE ACTIVE RECOVER!(Pre-PCT)

The GOAL is not to fully restore testosterone while on the ACTIVE RECOVERY, but just to BEGIN RECOVERY.

By the time you DO begin your FULL, agressive PCT, it will be a BREEZE!

Again, "bridging with a supressive compound" allows you to remain anabolic while still BEGINNING to restore HPTA function. This allows us to systematically avoid a "Post Cycle Crash"!

Thank you, by the way..:)
 
medrep said:
so are you or are you not bringing back tapering?!

My Anabolic Bible is deliberately divided in to three seperate and distinct chapters.

The first chapter describes the THREE ESSENTIAL components to a proper "Steroid Therapy". The "Cycle" is only ONE PHASE during a proper Steroid Therapy. Active Recovery, or "Pre-PCT" is another phase. This is the phase BEFORE PCT, where we BEGIN to restore the HPTA while simultaneously remaining in an anabolic state. THEN we begin our PCT, after we have succesfully transitioned from the cycle to Pre-PCT, thus completely avoiding a POST CYCLE CRASH. After PCT we may begin a bridge, making GREATER than natural gains, while only affecting endoegnous testosterone production to a small degree.

The next chapter adresses the STANDARD CYCLE, which MUST contain a BASE, a JUMPSTART, and a FINISHER.

The FINISHER is used while the LONG-esters exit the system, in order to remain anabolic right up until the minute you begin PCT! Failure to utilize a FININSHER will result in muscle and strength LOSS before you even BEGIN PCT!

Please let me know if I can answer any questions.
 
blut wump said:
Is this book available for purchase, Ross?

The Anabolic Bible written in this thread, is just a TEASER. The rest of the book contains information that is going to BLOW YOUR MIND!

The actual book is not even close to being completed. For now, I suggest Anthony's book, it has alot of solid, fundamental information. Not to mention, LOTS OF SHIT NO ONE ELSE EVER MENTIONS.

But my website and forums should be up shortly. I will keep everyone updated.
 
interesting. so not tapering, but move to a short acting compound like winny or dbol while the long esters clear. that is your active recovery phase. but then you stop that and move to pct. so isn't that stopping abruptly? or are you saying the 2-3 weeks of winny you will be restoring hpta before moving to pct.

and what are your thoughts then on pct?
 
medrep said:
interesting. so not tapering, but move to a short acting compound like winny or dbol while the long esters clear. that is your active recovery phase. but then you stop that and move to pct. so isn't that stopping abruptly? or are you saying the 2-3 weeks of winny you will be restoring hpta before moving to pct.

and what are your thoughts then on pct?

Great questions medrep. You've got your thinking guns pumped..

The period that you just desrcibed above is THE FINISHER; NOT the ACTIVE RECOVERY.

ACTIVE RECOVERY(Pre-PCT) begins AFTER your FINISHER. Rather than beginning PCT, you begin Pre-PCT instead. This is where we utilize a NON-inhibitory compound such as Primobolan, Turinabol, or Dianabol to keep the body in an anabolic state, while simultaneously BEGINNING to restore HPTA function.

Then comes PCT. FULL HPTA restoration.

Then comes the BRIDGE. Greater than NATURAL gains, with MINIMAL HPTA interference.
 
- Ross - said:
Great questions medrep. You've got your thinking guns pumped..

The period that you just desrcibed above is THE FINISHER; NOT the ACTIVE RECOVERY.

ACTIVE RECOVERY(Pre-PCT) begins AFTER your FINISHER. Rather than beginning PCT, you begin Pre-PCT instead. This is where we utilize a NON-inhibitory compound such as Primobolan, Turinabol, or Dianabol to keep the body in an anabolic state, while simultaneously BEGINNING to restore HPTA function.

Then comes PCT. FULL HPTA restoration.

Then comes the BRIDGE. Greater than NATURAL gains, with MINIMAL HPTA interference.



Has any one else on this board ever ran a mildly supressive steroid like some winny during the 2-3 week period it takes for the longer esters to clear? In theory it seems like a good concept, but then why isn't it preached? On the other hand I was thinking during the period it takes the esters to clear your test levels would still be above any natural level, so if you time the start of PCT correctly no muscle would be lost...correct?
 
Anthony Roberts said:
You're thinking about the "Steroid Bible" ...the "Anabolic Bible" is just the name of this thread..it's not the book you're thinking of..it's original thought/research from Ross, I believe.
ya came out back in 97 or some shit I read the book.lol its bin a long time.
 
M Pwrd said:
I swear to god as soon as I read that post I was about to type this till i scrolled down an inch.


Hi Ross,

It sounds like you've given things a lot of thought but I'd be willing to debate some issues.

Different gear hitting different receptors? I've always questioned that one, but I'll let the science guys chime in on that .

Up regulation of receptors? I remember Dan talking about that but even he was skeptical. Haven't heard much of that theory late and common sense makes me question it. What evidence do you have?

I've often spoke of using lower dosages because the body does continue to produce T and the less you use, the less suppression you have. Some guys think you're "shut down" no matter what. Not true. HOWEVER, I do think that if you're very suppressed and LH is next to nil, simply using a lower dose or a less androgenic compound won't be very helpful. You MAY get the HPTA to start fighting it's way back, but it's akin to tearing off a scab every time a wound heals. Yeah, maybe you'll heal eventually but it will take a VERY, VERY long time and may not happen at all. I think a little taper isn't a horrible idea but you're better off beginning full recovery sooner than prolonging the dependance on the gear.

Of course, a lot of this is contigent on the goals. Do you want to recover? Or just stay in an anabolic state?

How much of your gains have you maintained after being completely off everything for 2 months? What was your T level at that point? These are the real factors.
 
Are you saying I am also ross? If so you can ask for an IP check or you can go check on AR where I have a lot more posts under the name t3/t4 gsr and check my IP there where ross is perma banned and I wouldn't last to long.
 
There is no way AR wrote that. As much as I disagree with him and his methods only a complete idiot would post that. It's right out of a comic book. Not a science or medical journal. It's too bad everyone's left the board to goofy people like this. I was going to start in on it but I wouldn't know where to begin.
Good luck with magic receptors and non-suppressing cycles.
 
Nelson Montana said:
Hi Ross,

It sounds like you've given things a lot of thought but I'd be willing to debate some issues.

Different gear hitting different receptors? I've always questioned that one, but I'll let the science guys chime in on that .

Up regulation of receptors? I remember Dan talking about that but even he was skeptical. Haven't heard much of that theory late and common sense makes me question it. What evidence do you have?

I've often spoke of using lower dosages because the body does continue to produce T and the less you use, the less suppression you have. Some guys think you're "shut down" no matter what. Not true. HOWEVER, I do think that if you're very suppressed and LH is next to nil, simply using a lower dose or a less androgenic compound won't be very helpful. You MAY get the HPTA to start fighting it's way back, but it's akin to tearing off a scab every time a wound heals. Yeah, maybe you'll heal eventually but it will take a VERY, VERY long time and may not happen at all. I think a little taper isn't a horrible idea but you're better off beginning full recovery sooner than prolonging the dependance on the gear.

Of course, a lot of this is contigent on the goals. Do you want to recover? Or just stay in an anabolic state?

How much of your gains have you maintained after being completely off everything for 2 months? What was your T level at that point? These are the real factors.

As for "different gear hitting different receptors"...

The hypothalamus has ANDROGEN, ESTROGEN, and PROGESTERONE receptors.

SOME steriods activate the ESTROGEN receptor(Testosterone, Dianabol, Deca), while some steroids do NOT activate the estrogen receptor AT ALL(Primobolan, Anavar, Masteron).

Some steroids activate the PROGESTERONE receptor. (Trenbolone, Deca)

ALL steroids activate the ANDROGEN receptor to varying degrees.

This is why SOME steroids cause SHUTDOWN(by oversaturating the receptors), while others do NOT(do NOT activate enough receptors for the hypothalamus to respond by shutting down the HPTA).

It is difficult to QUANTIFY how quickly one will recover while running a Pre-PCT(Active Recovery), as it depends GREATLY on the individual. Having asid that, it is pretty safe to assume that just about ANYONE with a relatively healthy HPTA would recover 50% testosterone production using 300mgs Primobolan for 6 weeks. After the HPTA has 50% recovered, and you STILL continued to make gains, now you can start your AGRESSIVE PCT regimen.

EVEN a 25% recovery would be enough to COMPLETELY AVOID a POST CYCLE CRASH. This is the objective.

I enjoy your input Nelson.
 
rdel85 said:
Has any one else on this board ever ran a mildly supressive steroid like some winny during the 2-3 week period it takes for the longer esters to clear? In theory it seems like a good concept, but then why isn't it preached? On the other hand I was thinking during the period it takes the esters to clear your test levels would still be above any natural level, so if you time the start of PCT correctly no muscle would be lost...correct?


Anyone??
 
Did it this time - 40mg Var/50mg Winny ED for 3 weeks after my last Test shot. Shed some water weight, got somewhat more vascular, strength went up slightly. Started PCT two days after last dose of orals - so far strength has gone up slightly (added creatine after cycle stopped).

I have done this before with good results - seems to harden and define the physique a little after a test cycle and allows me to transition to PCT a little more smoothly.
 
Anthony Roberts said:
But he looks good, so how could he be wrong? Isn't that the main criteria around here?

Its not the main crieteria, but it definatley helps. I mean, you never know if there is another 150lb Jeff Summers behind the keyboard.
 
hairlossguru said:
Its not the main crieteria, but it definatley helps. I mean, you never know if there is another 150lb Jeff Summers behind the keyboard.

He's behind the wheel of a Ferarri, last I heard. Bought in Cash, and driving it around Vegas.
 
tshoot said:
Did it this time - 40mg Var/50mg Winny ED for 3 weeks after my last Test shot. Shed some water weight, got somewhat more vascular, strength went up slightly. Started PCT two days after last dose of orals - so far strength has gone up slightly (added creatine after cycle stopped).

I have done this before with good results - seems to harden and define the physique a little after a test cycle and allows me to transition to PCT a little more smoothly.

Great post, thank you for sharing your experience.
 
Anthony Roberts said:
He's behind the wheel of a Ferarri, last I heard. Bought in Cash, and driving it around Vegas.

So what? Im behind the wheel of an 04' Gallardo and that doesnt make me an expert on steroids.
 
hairlossguru said:
So what? Im behind the wheel of an 04' Gallardo and that doesnt make me an expert on steroids.

I don't know what that is. I have a Ford pickup...

My point is that Summers (Bart Harcourt = Real name) got what he wanted and got out.
 
I would personally enjoy MORE discourse and LESS bullshit.

Can't we just leave Anthony alone? Let the man live. if you don't like him, don;t listen to him. Period.
 
Having said that, I would like to hear from some of the educated bro's of this great board.
 
tshoot said:
Did it this time - 40mg Var/50mg Winny ED for 3 weeks after my last Test shot. Shed some water weight, got somewhat more vascular, strength went up slightly. Started PCT two days after last dose of orals - so far strength has gone up slightly (added creatine after cycle stopped).

I have done this before with good results - seems to harden and define the physique a little after a test cycle and allows me to transition to PCT a little more smoothly.


What PCT did you use?
 
- Ross - said:
Having said that, I would like to hear from some of the educated bro's of this great board.

Your comparing the actions of 17aa and non-17aa’s again. They are totally different monsters with completely different pharmacokinetics. Mg per Mg 17aa orals are WAY more suppressive… no mater what hypothalamic receptor you think they are activating. A 40mg dose of ANY 17aa oral is way to suppressive to even mention in the same breath as "recovery".

Your pre-PCT plan would hold way more ground if you removed your recommendation of Dianabol, Winny and Avavar.

-Pp

FYI for others - I posted my thoughts on this in Ross's other thread.
 
Primordial Performance said:
Your comparing the actions of 17aa and non-17aa’s again. They are totally different monsters with completely different pharmacokinetics. Mg per Mg 17aa orals are WAY more suppressive… no mater what hypothalamic receptor you think they are activating. A 40mg dose of ANY 17aa oral is way to suppressive to even mention in the same breath as "recovery".

Your pre-PCT plan would hold way more ground if you removed your recommendation of Dianabol, Winny and Avavar.

-Pp

FYI for others - I posted my thoughts on this in Ross's other thread.

EVERY compound is DIFFERENT! Just because a compound is modifed at the 17aa does NOT mean it is highly supressive.

Please see the other thread for my full response.
 
errn247 said:
What PCT did you use?

Used nolvadex/clomid last time. This time, I am giving Dermacrine Sustain a run - with clomid on hand if I feel I need it.

I am only into week 1 of my PCT but so far I am happy with how I feel like I am recovering. Knee joints are a little more sore than normal but I am not sure if that is from runny Winny for the last couple of weeks or if it is from the anti-estrogens in the Dermacrine Sustain.
 
tshoot said:
Used nolvadex/clomid last time. This time, I am giving Dermacrine Sustain a run - with clomid on hand if I feel I need it.

I am only into week 1 of my PCT but so far I am happy with how I feel like I am recovering. Knee joints are a little more sore than normal but I am not sure if that is from runny Winny for the last couple of weeks or if it is from the anti-estrogens in the Dermacrine Sustain.

No aromatase inhibitors?

Cabergoline for Prolactin? B-6, anything?

Good review.
 
- Ross - said:
No aromatase inhibitors?

Cabergoline for Prolactin? B-6, anything?

Good review.

Derm Sustain supposed to have AI in it. Never used Cabergoline during PCT before although I do have Cabaser tabs on hand. Why do you think that it would be needed for Prolactin during PCT if it wasn't needed during a cycle? I take B6 (125mg) as part of my regular supplement regime. What benefit are you saying it has as part of PCT?
 
tshoot said:
Derm Sustain supposed to have AI in it. Never used Cabergoline during PCT before although I do have Cabaser tabs on hand. Why do you think that it would be needed for Prolactin during PCT if it wasn't needed during a cycle? I take B6 (125mg) as part of my regular supplement regime. What benefit are you saying it has as part of PCT?

Just about every steroid increases PROLACTIN.

PROLACTIN is EVIL. Even more EVIL than Estrogen.

Eliminating PROLACTIN during PCT will not only greatly enhance your libido and sex-drive, it will also facilitate a MUCH faster recovery, as PROLACTIN exerts a tremendous negative effect on the HPTA.
 
- Ross - said:
Just about every steroid increases PROLACTIN.

PROLACTIN is EVIL. Even more EVIL than Estrogen.

Eliminating PROLACTIN during PCT will not only greatly enhance your libido and sex-drive, it will also facilitate a MUCH faster recovery, as PROLACTIN exerts a tremendous negative effect on the HPTA.

The role of prolactin is controversial.

Besides having inhibitory effects it also has very positive effects on the leydig cells. Smashing prolactin to the ground for any significant length of time is a bad idea for sure – same deal with estrogen.

All hormones have a necessary purpose.

-Pp
 
Primordial Performance said:
The role of prolactin is controversial.

Besides having inhibitory effects it also has very positive effects on the leydig cells. Smashing prolactin to the ground for any significant length of time is a bad idea for sure – same deal with estrogen.

All hormones have a necessary purpose.

-Pp

Stop nitpicking... :p

Estrogen and Prolactin SUCK!

Of course, every hormone has it's function silly...:)
 
Primordial Performance said:
Your comparing the actions of 17aa and non-17aa’s again. They are totally different monsters with completely different pharmacokinetics. Mg per Mg 17aa orals are WAY more suppressive… no mater what hypothalamic receptor you think they are activating. A 40mg dose of ANY 17aa oral is way to suppressive to even mention in the same breath as "recovery".

Your pre-PCT plan would hold way more ground if you removed your recommendation of Dianabol, Winny and Avavar.

-Pp

FYI for others - I posted my thoughts on this in Ross's other thread.
good point
 
- Ross - said:
Stop nitpicking... :p

Estrogen and Prolactin SUCK!

Of course, every hormone has it's function silly...:)
I tend to like to nit pick when it comes to my body and what I do to it...derma works great for pct.... :)
 
ross are you a board sponsor or just a member...are you going to be a board sponsor
any time soon....just need to ask before.......................................
 
needtogetaas said:
I tend to like to nit pick when it comes to my body and what I do to it...derma works great for pct.... :)

Estrogen is BAD during PCT.

Prolactin is BAD during PCT.

:)
 
needtogetaas said:
ross are you a board sponsor or just a member...are you going to be a board sponsor
any time soon....just need to ask before.......................................

I am just a member.
 
- Ross - said:
I am just a member.
ya I heard you the first time..... :) derma has plenty to take care of estro and
there are 50 billion members that have bin on this board or are on this board that have bin recovering just fine with using hcg during cycle and some thing like derma or clomid for pct........there is no fucking way in hell I am going to use more aas to help me recover from aas its just retarded any way you look at it.sorry
 
Mac173 said:
Because you are arguing w/ his boyfreind Pp.
J/k needto I still like you :rainbow:
lmao ya stooge..... :) how you doing tonight bro...aas has much more fun then c@c now


ross its how i say welcome needto stile.its like you're not really a part of ef Intel you have got a red hit....now your good. :p
 
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needtogetaas said:
lmao ya stooge..... :) how you doing tonight bro...aas has much more fun then c@c now


ross its how i say welcome needto stile.its like you're not really a part of ef Intel you have got a red hit....now your good. :p

LOL...I am "initiated"...I have been Elitified...:)
 
needtogetaas said:
lmao ya stooge..... :) how you doing tonight bro...aas has much more fun then c@c now


ross its how i say welcome needto stile.its like you're not really a part of ef Intel you have got a red hit....now your good. :p

It's turned into c&c up in here.
 
ive done this with every one of my cycles, ive done it with var suspension prop tren winny and tbol just never dbol. however dbol is the only oral i run now. this is a highly preached practice and most of the greats do this. its certainly not new.
 
Bruce said:
ive done this with every one of my cycles, ive done it with var suspension prop tren winny and tbol just never dbol. however dbol is the only oral i run now. this is a highly preached practice and most of the greats do this. its certainly not new.
ya thats why i thought the book was old i was reading the same shit back in 97-98 and it sounded real familiar
 
Bruce said:
ive done this with every one of my cycles, ive done it with var suspension prop tren winny and tbol just never dbol. however dbol is the only oral i run now. this is a highly preached practice and most of the greats do this. its certainly not new.

Amen.
 
- Ross - said:
No aromatase inhibitors?

Cabergoline for Prolactin? B-6, anything?

Good review.

You certainly wouldn't want to use B6 on PCT or a cycle. That's a bad idea.
 
Anthony Roberts said:
You certainly wouldn't want to use B6 on PCT or a cycle. That's a bad idea.

Indeed, Cabergoline is the superior choice.
 
- Ross - said:
Indeed, Cabergoline is the superior choice.

B6 shouldn't be a choice though. It's a very bad thing to include in any kind of amount over the RDA...
 
- Ross - said:
LOL

Sorry my friend, I have NO AFFILIATION with any of the staff or members of this board.

Furthermore, all of my content is original.

I have been around for a while, have taken LOTS of shit, and am still here.

The only person who has me beat soley on LONGEVITY in this game, is our good friend Anthony; or HOOKER, as I always knew him:)
Am I sensing sarcasm?
 
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