Strength rise but I dont get big!

[NOLOGY77]

Hello everyone. I have a slight problem, i have started training seriously lets say about 7 months ago. I have done 3 months 5x5 and this gave my strenght a real boost.

I can lift twice the weight i did before and i am performing now Deadlifts,squats, barbell rows chin ups etc. Week after week i can see i can lift a bit more and i love it. Now i gave it some rest the 5x5 and i am perfmorming a split programme but again it icludes bench press, squats ,deadlifts etc.

The problem is that even though my strenght gets wild lets say, my body does not show the significant size i wanted to show that i am training like a dog. I feel that for the level that my strength changed, my size remained the same.

What do you think? Its just my body type or its my nutrition, or training program etc?/ I eat large not always clean foods but even with junk food i should have seen some gains in size also not only in strenght. I am 5.8 and weig 190pounds

 

[moya]

list your average diet...
id bet you feel like you eat a lot, but it probably dosnt quite cut it...

 

[needtogetaas]

Exactly man. Lets see the fit day records on that diet friend?

 

[SaiBoT]

That's a diet problem most certainly, how much did you weight before, are you leaner at least?

 

[NOLOGY77]

in monings i eat 1 whole egg and 4 egg whites, oats with honey and 2 turkey sandwhiches. hit the gym around 12 o clock. have a 2-scoop protein shake, and after 1 hour i eat meat mostly either chicken or beef or pork to gther with rice or mushed potatoes. in afternoon i have 2 scoops of whey with something else maybe nuts or oats again and at night time sometimes i eat half a chicken or if i do not have anything to eat clean i eat 2 double whoopers and a big king from burger king.

 

[Developer]

The first thing i'd say to change is 2 double whoppers and a big king, anyone agree ? (unless its a cheat meal)
I'd say before bed eat whole eggs, feels good for me lol

Wheres the tuna and steak at ? Gotta get some steak and tuna in there

How much protein you taking in per day?

 

[obsessedwliftin]

The first thing i'd say to change is 2 double whoppers and a big king, anyone agree ? (unless its a cheat meal)
I'd say before bed eat whole eggs, feels good for me lol

Wheres the tuna and steak at ? Gotta get some steak and tuna in there

How much protein you taking in per day?

I agree bro! You cant expect clean muscle gaind eating two double whoppers and a Big king bro! Try this. Take your body weight and multiply that by 2.5. Thats your protein needs for gaining. Then Take your diet and spread it over 6 to 7 CLEAN meals a day. The breakfast doesnt sound bad but I personally would leave off the 2 turkey sandwiches and leave those for another meal. Eggs and oats w protein shake, then 2 hours later maybe throw in the turkey. Objective here is to spread out your needs over 6 to 7 meals a day and that does two things. Keeps your metabolism up and gives you the caloric and protein intake you need in order to grow.

 

[NOLOGY77]

Thanks a lot guys. I will try to put into action your avises.

 

[joe d]

the whole diet plan is bad not just the fast food. try this its a basic start to dieting to grow

divide 2g Protein, 3g carbs, .5g fat per lb of bw per day between 6-10 meals. you also need a few servings of green veggies and a good multi v.

1- oats with protein powder
2- turkey bacon, eggs, milk, oj, whole grain toast
3- chicken, sweat tater broccoli
4-workout followed by a high sinple carb whey shake
5- steak, whole grain pasta, asparagus
6- shake
7- right before whole eggs

a few important things are

pay attention to your body- if your not changing any or you are losing weight than you need more food, if you are gaining to much fat you are eating to much food (remove carbs).

if you ever feal hungry- drink milk and eat nuts between meals for this.

as you go you will learn by looking in the mirror and make adjustments as needed.

 

[skinsfan]

This doesn't sound like a problem at all to me. Your strength continues to go up but your size stays the same... where is the problem! If I could bench 315 at 150lbs I would be a lot happier than benching 350 at 230lbs.

IMO just stick with what your doing. You'll come to realize after training for a while that size doesn't matter. Being grossly overweight for your body does nothing but cause health problems, and yes thats true regardless of whether your fat overweight or muscular overweight. Either way your putting additional stress on an organ that WILL eventually wear out, so why wear it out sooner?

5'8" 190lbs is big man there is no need to get bigger than that. Just keep training to be stronger.

 

[Developer]

the whole diet plan is bad not just the fast food. try this its a basic start to dieting to grow

divide 2g Protein, 3g carbs, .5g fat per lb of bw per day between 6-10 meals. you also need a few servings of green veggies and a good multi v.

1- oats with protein powder
2- turkey bacon, eggs, milk, oj, whole grain toast
3- chicken, sweat tater broccoli
4-workout followed by a high sinple carb whey shake
5- steak, whole grain pasta, asparagus
6- shake
7- right before whole eggs

a few important things are

pay attention to your body- if your not changing any or you are losing weight than you need more food, if you are gaining to much fat you are eating to much food (remove carbs).

if you ever feal hungry- drink milk and eat nuts between meals for this.

as you go you will learn by looking in the mirror and make adjustments as needed.

Good advice! lol joe loves his sweet taters

 

[joe d]

This doesn't sound like a problem at all to me. Your strength continues to go up but your size stays the same... where is the problem! If I could bench 315 at 150lbs I would be a lot happier than benching 350 at 230lbs.

IMO just stick with what your doing. You'll come to realize after training for a while that size doesn't matter. Being grossly overweight for your body does nothing but cause health problems, and yes thats true regardless of whether your fat overweight or muscular overweight. Either way your putting additional stress on an organ that WILL eventually wear out, so why wear it out sooner?

5'8" 190lbs is big man there is no need to get bigger than that. Just keep training to be stronger.

maybe he is a bber.

 

[joe d]

Good advice! lol joe loves his sweet taters

i actually dont like them any more. i got tired of them a few years ago, but they are verry good for development and i still eat them every day.

 

[Jocques Straap]

That's a huge amount of food Joe. No doubt you'll put on mass eating that much. Huge mass.

I have this right? 2 g P, 3 g/ C, .5g F per pound of body weight?

So if he is 190 pounds,

380g Protein =1520 Calories (33%)
570g Carbs = 2280 Calories (49%)
95g Fat = 855 Calories (18%)

Total Calories = 4655 Calories

For a typical 190lb, 15% BF, active guy you would expect a total daily energy expenditure of approx. 2500-2750 Calories. This will give your body around a 14000 calorie surplus or the amount of energy in 4lbs of fat, per week.


If you want to get big, you have to eat big.

 

[moya]

fast food burgers will not stop you from growing... they will just add fat in the process...
i think you need to eat more bro, clean or not... and if you want to truly get big, then maybe just a little bit less clean imo...
you can always cut fat later on, rather than struggle with a diet where you barely gain anything...

 

[joe d]

That's a huge amount of food Joe. No doubt you'll put on mass eating that much. Huge mass.

I have this right? 2 g P, 3 g/ C, .5g F per pound of body weight?

So if he is 190 pounds,

380g Protein =1520 Calories (33%)
570g Carbs = 2280 Calories (49%)
95g Fat = 855 Calories (18%)

Total Calories = 4655 Calories

For a typical 190lb, 15% BF, active guy you would expect a total daily energy expenditure of approx. 2500-2750 Calories. This will give your body around a 14000 calorie surplus or the amount of energy in 4lbs of fat, per week.


If you want to get big, you have to eat big.

i dont get into all of those calculator things im kind of against them but i used those macro ratios natty and higher juiced and grew well.

 

[joe d]

fast food burgers will not stop you from growing... they will just add fat in the process...
i think you need to eat more bro, clean or not... and if you want to truly get big, then maybe just a little bit less clean imo...
you can always cut fat later on, rather than struggle with a diet where you barely gain anything...

moya you know your stuff and i agree here but there is one small thing that i never see talked about. fast foods, lunch meats, frozen dinners all are loaded with fillers/adatives and a lot of them slow digestion and clog you up. they have a negative effect on blood flow and more. these effects arent exactly drastic unless its all you eat but they do slow your progress. they actually limit the nutrient consumption for your body to some small digree. i trey like hell to avoid these foods. whole raw foods are what you need. the more you eat of any tipe of food the more you need of others. a good balance of a clean diet will produce more over all mass than any other diet. it will allow you to be able to eat more and get more out of it. unfortunately that balance is hard to find and it differs for everyone.

 

[Jocques Straap]

what calculator things?

3g Carbs per pound of bw. bw = 190, 190 x 3 = 570g carbs. There are 4 Calories in every gram of carb. 4 x 570 = 2280 Calories.


Same rules for the Protein, 4 cals per gram, Fat has 9 calories per gram. (Alcohol has 7).

This whole gaining weight, loosing weight thing is about as simple a concept as it gets. Energy in/Energy out. If more energy comes into the system, then leaves, there will be a surplus. It's that simple, Black and White.


Protein, Carbs, Fats. It's really not all that important, as long as your not neglecting one particular area. Typically, Carbs should be around 40-60%, Protein 15-35%, Fat 10-30%.

Joes ratios puts you pretty close to the middle ground.

In other words, Training is not where you gain size, it's in the kitchen.

 

[NBAfan#21]

Calculating how many calories you got in the day is easy. The hard part is to know how many you burned and that isnt easy at all because you burn different amount of calories while you are seating, standing up, walking, laying down, etc. Plus if you add cardio and weight lifting. All that is almost impossible to count accurately. Thats why people use a calculator to know how many calories they burn in a day and how much they need to eat to gain weight

 

[joe d]

what calculator things?
all of them

3g Carbs per pound of bw. bw = 190, 190 x 3 = 570g carbs. There are 4 Calories in every gram of carb. 4 x 570 = 2280 Calories.
its not all about calories


Same rules for the Protein, 4 cals per gram, Fat has 9 calories per gram. (Alcohol has 7).

This whole gaining weight, loosing weight thing is about as simple a concept as it gets. Energy in/Energy out. If more energy comes into the system, then leaves, there will be a surplus. It's that simple, Black and White.

no its not that simple. the state your body is in when you consume these nutrients means more.


Protein, Carbs, Fats. It's really not all that important, as long as your not neglecting one particular area. Typically, Carbs should be around 40-60%, Protein 15-35%, Fat 10-30%.

yes it is. you need to know what your body needs and how much it need of each of these. this changes depending on the state your body is in.

Joes ratios puts you pretty close to the middle ground.
thats correct its a good place to start

In other words, Training is not where you gain size, it's in the kitchen.

^^

 

[Jocques Straap]

Those calculator things are basic math, 190bw x 3g carbs x 4 cal/g = 2280 Calories from Carbs.

I was speaking about mass gains, or scale weight. Not about muscle gain or body composition.

Timing/access, homones, genetics, training, ratios, all have an effect on body composition or muscle gains, but still will never trump thermodynamics. It's the law of the universe.

Energy in and Energy out.

In order to gain mass, you must be in a caloric surplus, regardless or when you eat, where you eat, or what you eat. This is step 1.

Your ratios, are fine. It would be very hard to find a body that doesn't fit well with it.

Again, if you want to get big you need to eat big.

 

[Foxxxy]

take creatine.. haha
whey protien and remember lower weights tone and make u stronger. heavier weights add mass

 

[moya]

moya you know your stuff and i agree here but there is one small thing that i never see talked about. fast foods, lunch meats, frozen dinners all are loaded with fillers/adatives and a lot of them slow digestion and clog you up. they have a negative effect on blood flow and more. these effects arent exactly drastic unless its all you eat but they do slow your progress. they actually limit the nutrient consumption for your body to some small digree. i trey like hell to avoid these foods. whole raw foods are what you need. the more you eat of any tipe of food the more you need of others. a good balance of a clean diet will produce more over all mass than any other diet. it will allow you to be able to eat more and get more out of it. unfortunately that balance is hard to find and it differs for everyone.

yes, i definately agree.. fast foods lunch meats and (ugh) tv dinners are definately not the best for you... i should have been more clear, as i would not want anyone here to go out and eat taco bell for every meal just because i said 'fast food isnt so bad'... the only thing i am trying to get at is that a cheat meal here and there wont kill, and imo, from my experiences, can definately help add in a LOT of extra calories...
in my case, i have been eating at farmer brothers, which is definately a lot better than mc donalds or taco bell, but definately not 'healthy'... but i can easily get 2500 calories out of one meal, and i get a noticable strength increase as well... since i am powerlifting this is a big plus...
i am an ectomorph and this has had some noticable effect on my bodyfat, since i have dirtied my diet a bit- but a gain in muscle as well... i have been breaking plateus... a deadlift plateau that i have been stuck at for over a year...
now i most likely could have done this getting in the same ammounts of calories clean.... its just easier for me to get those calories from dirtier food...
and instead of soda i order a chocolate milk shake... i know still sugar... but at least there is protein in it...
but imo mc donalds sucks, if youre going to cheat get a good burger from a good 'mom and pop' place... still not healthy but i just dont trust the corporate places at all as to what they are putting in their food to keep so many people addicted to eating it...

 

[ceo]

Those calculator things are basic math, 190bw x 3g carbs x 4 cal/g = 2280 Calories from Carbs.

I was speaking about mass gains, or scale weight. Not about muscle gain or body composition.

Timing/access, homones, genetics, training, ratios, all have an effect on body composition or muscle gains, but still will never trump thermodynamics. It's the law of the universe.

Energy in and Energy out.

In order to gain mass, you must be in a caloric surplus, regardless or when you eat, where you eat, or what you eat. This is step 1.

Your ratios, are fine. It would be very hard to find a body that doesn't fit well with it.

Again, if you want to get big you need to eat big.

I think I understand what joe is saying. While the basics may be simple, dieting can beome very individualized.

Let me take just one example of that and expand. One person may be able to eat tons of carbs...rice, french fries, sugar, simple, complex, etc., and not gain much or even any weight. Another person might gain weight just looking at cup of rice or basket of fries.

Some people resond better to high protein, moderate fats and relatively low carbs. Some may respond better to moderate protein and carbs and lower fat.

There are times when it gets more involved than just being in a caloric surplus.

 

[Jocques Straap]

Do you really think someone will gain weight just by looking at a cup of rice? Lets be realistic hear.

Long run, it's physics that plays the biggest role in mass lost or gain. Again I'm not saying timing, hormones, ratios, etc don't play a role. Surplus is the major factor.

It's a difficult concept for most people to understand. I find a great analogy is to compare your body weight to a bank account. As you add money (energy) to the bank account. The account will grow, as we take energy out, the account shrinks. Now as long as more money is coming in, then we are spending. The account will continue to grow.

Where do things like timing, hormones, training, ratios, etc come in? these things will effect composition(muscle mass vs. fat mass). With hormones being the most important of the group.


I do agree that diet can be individualized. However I do feel that only the rare, advanced trainee who needs to be concerned with that. Get a well rounded diet(35-65%C, 15-35% P, 10-30% F). Lots of Carbs, Good Fats, and Protein. Eat the correct portions for your goals. Don't sweat the small stuff unless you are planing on going on stage, and are all ready doing everything else right.

 

[Developer]

Do you really think someone will gain weight just by looking at a cup of rice? Lets be realistic hear.

Long run, it's physics that plays the biggest role in mass lost or gain. Again I'm not saying timing, hormones, ratios, etc don't play a role. Surplus is the major factor.

It's a difficult concept for most people to understand. I find a great analogy is to compare your body weight to a bank account. As you add money (energy) to the bank account. The account will grow, as we take energy out, the account shrinks. Now as long as more money is coming in, then we are spending. The account will continue to grow.

Where do things like timing, hormones, training, ratios, etc come in? these things will effect composition(muscle mass vs. fat mass). With hormones being the most important of the group.


I do agree that diet can be individualized. However I do feel that only the rare, advanced trainee who needs to be concerned with that. Get a well rounded diet(35-65%C, 15-35% P, 10-30% F). Lots of Carbs, Good Fats, and Protein. Eat the correct portions for your goals. Don't sweat the small stuff unless you are planing on going on stage, and are all ready doing everything else right.

If you talking about how the body changes its biology, if your talkin about the force/weight lifted and how it is, your talking about physics, just thought i'd say that.

What i find works for me is, eat like hell, i go for 5-6 times a day, ALWAYS taking in 200g of protein a day, i dont really watch carbs too much, at the moment i dont feel i have to seeing im makings with what im doing, when im cutting i deffinatly will.

Best think i can say, is treat food as a routine, just as you do with weight lifting, lifting in a routine itself will get you strength, but without the food routine, you ain't doin shit

 

[ceo]

Do you really think someone will gain weight just by looking at a cup of rice? Lets be realistic hear.

Come on bro. I was being facetious. But some skinny fucker with a nascar metabolism might be fine on 2200 calories coming from carbs, while a fat prone fuck would get fat as hell no matter how much exercise he did.

I think you knew what I meant, you were just trying to argue semantics.

 

[Jocques Straap]

I was just giving you some shit CEO.

If that fat prone fuck is burning over 2200 calories, and only eating 2200 calories from Carbs(550g). What will happen is, his body will start to loose fat and muscle, until he has lost enough muscle and fat so that he is now burning 2200 calories to match his intake. How much muscle he loses, depends on his genetics, steroids, exercise, nutrient timing etc.

 

[moya]

fuck my body is a damn calorie-burnin' motherfuck-of-a-machine... id bet i just burned 100 calories typing this post...

 

[b fold the truth]

And it takes time...

 

[OMEGA]

there is a weak link / correlation between muscle size and strength

 

[future]

As much as 5x5 etc is all the range it really isnt something meant for getting big. It was a strength based routine. My suggestion is upping the carbs slightly. Protein about 1 gram per lb of bodyweight and also supplement BCAA's of 40-60 grams a day as well. Keep up the healthy fats.

If you want more size then I suggest making your rep scheme more like 3x12 or 4x10.