short cycles VS. long cycles

[Hahnb]

What is everyones view on shorter cycles(4-6 weeks) versus a 10+ week cycle of prop for example? It's easier to follow the time on =time off rule with shorter cycles, and possibly better/faster recovery of natural test. Most gains are usually made within the first 6 weeks, water included but majority of gains usually come in the first 6 weeks. opinions?

 

[Popeye1]

I've tried both long and short cycles. I like short cycles because they are easier to recover from. If you can string several short cycles together it may be a good way to go. I still do both long and short.

As I see it, there only seems to be two possible rational reasons for using steroids for a period of time greater than 4 weeks. First, during a diet, the concurrent use of steroids for up to 12 weeks will greatly help in to minimize any muscle loss during this time. Secondly, if your current goal is largely for increased strength then you’ll find a cycle of no longer than 6 or 8 weeks of heavy androgen usage will be more successful than a short cycle. The reason behind this is simple, on a short cycle you simply don’t have the time to complete all that many workouts & of course you can only gain a certain amount of strength each time you train each muscle.

The idea behind short cycles is to shock the body into an explosive burst of growth for a short time in order to gain as much as possible while completely avoiding post-cycle regression. There are basically two reasons why this is the best way to approach steroid usage & why it is so effective at maintaining your gains in the off periods.

Firstly, the body doesn’t really get a chance to down-regulate it’s own production of testosterone in such short periods of steroid usage. Now I know what you’re going to say - in the W.A.R Guide it says that studies have shown that just using 20mg dbol/day for 10 days reduces your own testosterone production by 30-40% . This may be true but doesn’t take into account the use of anti-aromatases which I believe are an essential ingredient during times of steroid usage (no matter what the length of cycle). The use of these products stops much of the body’s down regulation of it’s natural testosterone levels (along with stopping the estrogen induced side-effects of gyno etc.) & makes them continually rise to above normal levels when you are not on the juice anymore, which makes holding on to gains that much easier. Also, because you are only using for such a short period you will not experience the steroid low when you come off the juice.

Secondly, by having only a brief period of fast mass gain it becomes easier for the body to accept the newly acquired steroid induced mass & therefore these gains are more likely to be permanent. With this program you can effectively change your body’s muscle homeostasis point (for the better) on a regular basis. After all, what is the good of using high doses of androgens (which aren’t cheap) for extended periods in order to gain say 20 pounds if we are going to lose a good amount of it when we do finally come off.

Another excellent reason to use short cycles, is that when you’re using gear, after roughly four weeks your gains tend to slow considerably yet most people will carry on with the cycle (with some even increasing their dosages) in the vain hope of gaining some more lean tissue. Now I don’t know the exact reason for this, it may be due to androgen receptor downgrade or simply because the body finds it difficult to continually add new muscle mass for extended periods, it may be a combination of the two. The bottom line is I nor anyone else can say exactly why this happens but the fact is it does happen. During this time you are effectively throwing your money away & setting yourself up for an even greater loss of size & strength when you do finally come off the juice.

 

[Mythicalbeing]

Short fast acting esters are awesome, but I like long cycles myself....like what was stated above the faster you recover the more you'll enjoy your cycle...young guys can get away with long cycles...us old guys like short ones....unless we run all the time

 

[lilpumper]

i see where your comin from on the short cycle advise but what about when using something such as sust. I just dont see how you can gain that much in only 6 wks. If you do i want to know your secret

 

[MrRTTB]

I've always done long cycles but the time for recovery is frustrating and hard.
Now I'm doing a 12 day cycle with prop and tren low doses and I'm so pleased I've decided never to do long cycles again. I beleeve it's easier to recover with fast acting gear as you are on for a shorter period. The gains are fast and it allows me to eat pretty much what I like for 2 weeks without gaining too much fat. A bulk for 8 weeks makes me fat, 2 weeks bulk with short esters are awsome. Harder, more vascular, stronger, and bigger. +9lb so far, 2 more days TO GO.

 

[lilpumper]

wow gains that fast? well ive never used prop except in sust. maybe i will try a few short cycles like that ... how long do you do pct for? and how long do you wait to do another cycle ?

 

[Popeye1]

i see where your comin from on the short cycle advise but what about when using something such as sust. I just dont see how you can gain that much in only 6 wks. If you do i want to know your secret

You are absolutely correct! Sustanon, or any other long acting compounds, are not options for short cycles. Acetate, propionate, phenylpropionate, isocaproate, caproate, enanthate, and cypionate esters are all good though. You're looking for a quick release....get in and get out. The addition of a fast acting oral like dbol makes a great compliment to a short cycle. I consider a fast acting oral a necessity in a short cycle.

 

[MrRTTB]

wow gains that fast? well ive never used prop except in sust. maybe i will try a few short cycles like that ... how long do you do pct for? and how long do you wait to do another cycle ?

week 1-2: ON
week 3: nothing
week 4: Nothing

I've used clomid and nolv as HCG before for PCT but after my last long cycle I used tribulus, avena sativa and NAC for PCT with sucess

 

[Outtlaw]

I'll never do a short cycle again. Waste of gear for the amount of gains to be made. I can get much more out of 10+ wks.

 

[Güclü_oglan]

I would say the biggest difference you will notice practically is the recovery. I know a dude who ran tren-a for 47 weeks at moderate dosages

 

[WannaBeBig72]

I'll never do a short cycle again. Waste of gear for the amount of gains to be made. I can get much more out of 10+ wks.

I'm running dbol/EQ/Test now and debating on wether to run it for anywhere between 10-15 weeks. I have enough gear to run it for 15 weeks but heard that the gains taper off by week 10. Is there any truth to that. This is my second cycle. My frist cycle was test/eq and ran it for 10 weeks.

 

[kahbab]

You are absolutely correct! Sustanon, or any other long acting compounds, are not options for short cycles. Acetate, propionate, phenylpropionate, isocaproate, caproate, enanthate, and cypionate esters are all good though. You're looking for a quick release....get in and get out. The addition of a fast acting oral like dbol makes a great compliment to a short cycle. I consider a fast acting oral a necessity in a short cycle.

are you talking about test enanthate? everything i have read says it takes 4 weeks to kick in. it would be good news the hear though because i would be interested in a shorter cycle.

 

[azul]

are you talking about test enanthate? everything i have read says it takes 4 weeks to kick in. it would be good news the hear though because i would be interested in a shorter cycle.

Test enanthate or cypionate are definitely not useful for short cycles. They will not kick in until at least 4 weeks.

 

[jlewis1111]

oral turnabol would be a great choice for a short cycle

 

[Popeye1]

Test enanthate or cypionate are definitely not useful for short cycles. They will not kick in until at least 4 weeks.

I've used enanthate for short cycles before. It probably is not the best choice, but, it will work to some degree. Remember guys, short cycles involve quick acting esters AND much higher dosages to get the levels up fast. An example for me would be 750mg test, 100mg dbol/day for week 1 and 750mg test, 50 mg dbol/day for week 2....plus the anti-aromatase of course.

 

[ruggermu]

I've used enanthate for short cycles before. It probably is not the best choice, but, it will work to some degree. Remember guys, short cycles involve quick acting esters AND much higher dosages to get the levels up fast. An example for me would be 750mg test, 100mg dbol/day for week 1 and 750mg test, 50 mg dbol/day for week 2....plus the anti-aromatase of course.

Bro, I went a gram for the first two weeks of this cycle to get test cyp kicked in fast. I'm not sure but I can't see how you got anything from the test in those two weeks.

 

[Popeye1]

Bro, I went a gram for the first two weeks of this cycle to get test cyp kicked in fast. I'm not sure but I can't see how you got anything from the test in those two weeks.

RuggerMU - I actually ran the cycle for 4 weeks. I only listed the first 2 weeks above as an example....sorry for the confusion.

 

[azul]

I've used enanthate for short cycles before. It probably is not the best choice, but, it will work to some degree. Remember guys, short cycles involve quick acting esters AND much higher dosages to get the levels up fast. An example for me would be 750mg test, 100mg dbol/day for week 1 and 750mg test, 50 mg dbol/day for week 2....plus the anti-aromatase of course.

It doesn't matter if you run more. The ester won't release any quicker - just more of it will be released. I can frontload 1G of enanthate for 2 weeks, and by week 4 it'll barely have kicked in. Such cycles are useless, and the only gains you'll make are from the d-bol, and maybe a few pounds when the test finally kicks in during PCT.

 

[Popeye1]

It doesn't matter if you run more. The ester won't release any quicker - just more of it will be released. I can frontload 1G of enanthate for 2 weeks, and by week 4 it'll barely have kicked in. Such cycles are useless, and the only gains you'll make are from the d-bol, and maybe a few pounds when the test finally kicks in during PCT.

I agree. I wouldn't run a short cycle again with enanthate. When I listed it above I was thinking of esters that I had used....enanthate and cypionate really shouldn't be in that list. I have some 200mg/ml prop that would probably work well.

 

[Dieselgoku23]

I did a long cycle 13 weeks, so far been on PCT for 3 weeks so far so good. But short VS long depends on the compound your using. Some of us dont like to stick ourselves ED some prefer 2 shots a week say Test Ena I think depends on personal choice and goals. I personally next time I would do fast acting because Test ENA didnt quick in till like the 6 week and EQ same so ran it for 13 weeks.

 

[bas4lizzife]

Been tossing around the idea of a shorter cycle. In a couple months i want to run a 6 weeker probably. I have enough prop and tren a to pull it off, but may opt for 6 weeks of prop with 4 weeks of dbol at the beginning, or i may even give npp a try since id like to run deca eventually (for my cycle 6-8 weeks after my proposed short cycle). The biggest key to me is time off. It gets boring and frustrating sittng around trying to maintain and recover and it may be easier to deal with 6-8 weeks off as opposed to 12-16 weeks off.

 

[Outtlaw]

I'm running dbol/EQ/Test now and debating on wether to run it for anywhere between 10-15 weeks. I have enough gear to run it for 15 weeks but heard that the gains taper off by week 10. Is there any truth to that. This is my second cycle. My frist cycle was test/eq and ran it for 10 weeks.

I guess everyone is different. But not for me that's not the case.

 

[silverbackn]

It doesn't matter if you run more. The ester won't release any quicker - just more of it will be released. I can frontload 1G of enanthate for 2 weeks, and by week 4 it'll barely have kicked in. Such cycles are useless, and the only gains you'll make are from the d-bol, and maybe a few pounds when the test finally kicks in during PCT.

This is off topic, but doesn't frontloading like that make you sick. Maybe I am just susceptible to serum sickness?

 

[azul]

This is off topic, but doesn't frontloading like that make you sick. Maybe I am just susceptible to serum sickness?

I suppose that with a high BA content, you might feel a little sick... but it depends on you as a person and how the stuff was made. I've done it and felt just fine.

 

[silverbackn]

I suppose that with a high BA content, you might feel a little sick... but it depends on you as a person and how the stuff was made. I've done it and felt just fine.

I'm using QV enanthate 250. I started this week. I did 1cc on Monday and 1cc on Thursday as always, I felt a little flu-ish last night. I tried to jump straight to a gram once, I was all sorts of fucked up from it. I was very sick for 2 or 3 days. I guess i am just prone.

 

[azul]

I'm using QV enanthate 250. I started this week. I did 1cc on Monday and 1cc on Thursday as always, I felt a little flu-ish last night. I tried to jump straight to a gram once, I was all sorts of fucked up from it. I was very sick for 2 or 3 days. I guess i am just prone.

I wouldn't quite say you're prone to it. I think it's 75% related to the gear you're taking, and the rest is up to you (genetics, sleep, where you inject, etc.). That's why I stick with what works for me

 

[silverbackn]

I wouldn't quite say you're prone to it. I think it's 75% related to the gear you're taking, and the rest is up to you (genetics, sleep, where you inject, etc.). That's why I stick with what works for me

Thats true! I think part of me feeling like hell has been a serious lack of sleep. My sleep schedule has been all jacked up. I got some sleep and I do feel better today. Thanks for the reply!

 

[Boston Strangler]

From my experience, I gain more but lose a lot on long cycles.....and I gain less but keep more on short cycles...IMO you could probably keep more by doing repetitive cycles than by staying on for longer periods of time. Everyone is differenct though

 

[silverbackn]

I have never done a long cycle but just speaking from my education an experiences of people around me. It seems like a longer cycle allows your body to grow more accustomed to holding more mass because of the time it is pounded into place. It seems that with a short cycle your body would only have held a relative mass for a very short period of time and therefore would probably not be able to support it as well. I realize you don't put on as much mass on a short cycle it just seems like it would be harder to hold if you only had it for two weeks. Just a theory.

 

[Zircon]

I've always done long cycles but the time for recovery is frustrating and hard.
Now I'm doing a 12 day cycle with prop and tren low doses and I'm so pleased I've decided never to do long cycles again. I beleeve it's easier to recover with fast acting gear as you are on for a shorter period. The gains are fast and it allows me to eat pretty much what I like for 2 weeks without gaining too much fat. A bulk for 8 weeks makes me fat, 2 weeks bulk with short esters are awsome. Harder, more vascular, stronger, and bigger. +9lb
so far, 2 more days TO GO.

Hey mate, can you tell me what dosages you were running? And you say you weren't using any pct?

thanks

 

[satchboogie]

12 weekers for me...

 

[galawman]

finished my first ever cycle at 6 weeks,not much gain on, deca 300mg and test entate 400mg,this time just started deca 400mg,test entate 500mg,eq 400mg wk,test prop 100mg every 3rd day and 30mg dbol ed,

 

[WannaBeBig72]

What's the defenition of short/long cycle?

Short 6 weeks and under?
Long anything over?

Doesn't seem to make much sense to me.

 

[sprinter86]

I personally like short cycles (6-8weeks)... It seems that I plateau after this and dont put on much weight even if I increase the dose.