SARMS and Warfarin/Coumadin

[alex2678]

I haven't posted here in years but I had a question I was hoping someone could answer. About 3 years ago I had a blood clot in my heart and was put on blood thinners. Not knowing there was any interaction between testosterone and coumadin I went on a light prohormone cyle. My INR, which measures blood thinness/thickness, shot up to 10 (dangerously thin) and a minor muscle tear at the time put me in the hospital with internal bleeding throughout my entire leg. Probably one of the most painful injuries I've ever experienced.

My question is basically if anyone knows of any research or first hand experience as to whether SARMS has any effect on INR or interactions with coumadin. I can no longer do any type of prohormone/anabolic but I was considering using Ostarine for somewhat of a minor boost. Any help or thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

[jtmdell]

I'm sorry to hear about your situation, I don't have any help other than a bump. That is the problem with research chems, still a lot of unknowns.

 

[johnnyboy3689282]

I think anything that is going to mess with a natural body chenistry and hormone levels that are normally stable and that does have direct intlfluence with your INR is going to thin your blood dangerously low... I have experienced with several patients that were interested in trt, and were put on androgel or Test for IM injection.... all had similar problems including my father who was a bodybuilder as well... so if it's going to surpress you, you might be taking a risk.... I'm no expert on sarms, maybe a question dylan can answer for you....

 

[alex2678]

Thanks for the replies. I'll probably wait until I'm off the blood thinners to try any hormone related supplement unless I hear some type of first hand experience that SARMS do not increase INR. Coumadin is such an awful drug to be on. I've been reading up on Nattokinase which is suppose to be a natural preventative for blood clots.

I definitely think every bodybuilder/athlete should get blood work done regularly and don't forget to load up on natural supplements for blood pressure, blood clots and cholesterol during and after a cycle. At the time of my blood clot I was 230 pounds with sub 10% bodyfat, running 6 minute miles and eating the cleanest diet possible. In my head based on my physique and performance, my heart must be just as strong as my body. That couldn't have been farthest from the truth.

 

[jtmdell]

Very sound advice. I've heard of many good bros who have died way too young over the years

 

[crayne]

As a biochemist, I can't vouch for the validity of the following quoted perspective...but it is a perspective re: Warfarin and TRT. So does it relate to SARMS and which one? The most likely relationship is probably with LGD-4033 which is suppressive in a dose and time dependent fashion similar to Test. In my own personal experience with several clients on Warfarin, it is a potentially lethal drug...regardless of circumstances. As long as you are on it, I wouldn't risk TRT or any SARM, but that is just my opinion. However, if you experience severe muscle wasting, it becomes a different issue. You might want to take the risk and use something like MK-2866 (Ostarine) at 3 mgs. per day.

"...Replacement therapy with low doses of testosterone does not adversely affect blood coagulation status and does not appear to increase the risk of venous or arterial blood clots. Thrombosis is not listed as a potential side effect in a commonly used drug compendium. Furthermore, the 2006 “Clinical Practice Guideline” from the Endocrine Society also does not list blood clots as a side effect of testosterone replacement therapy, or a previous history of blood clots as a reason not to give testosterone replacement therapy [ref 2]. However, the Androgel® package insert (prescribing information) lists “blood clots in the legs” as a potential side effect, because one patient out of 163 patients on Androgel® developed a DVT over a 3 year period of time. However, whether the DVT was caused by Androgel® or conicidental, is not known..." I am required to delete the citations. Sorry.

 

[Muscle Juice]

Don't risk it

 

[muscle75]

Man, this is disappointing to read. I am also on Coumadin for a valve replacement from a childhood illness. I wanted to try something fairly mild to be on the safe side. Was hoping Ostarine was going to be it.

Hopefully, we can find some more info to see how much it can be affected. Coumadin can be countered with vitamin K.

 

[crayne]

It is highly unlikely that the effects of Warfarin can be countered by Vitamin K-2. Warfarin is a potent drug. Yes, it has its value in specific circumstances, but don't think vitamin K-2 will counteract its effects.
--- doing so could prove a serious mistake.

 

[crayne]

The primary purpose of SARMS is to halt the progression of significant catabolic wasting (muscle atrophy) in cancer and HIV/AIDS patients and elderly males (>70 years),
--- and in the case of Gw-501516 (Caradine) to provide additional energy and endurance due to the suppressed immune system impact in these classes of individuals.

None of the the SARMS are "mild" drugs. If they can reverse (or halt the progression of) muscle wasting in cancer of AIDS patients,
--- do you really think they are "mild" (i.e. benign)?

In the correct context, SARMS are or can be a miracle solution....
--- this is why they will be continued to be developed.